Register FAQ / Rules Forum Spy Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Go Back   MacRumors Forums > Mac Community > Community Discussion > Politics, Religion, Social Issues

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:08 AM   #626
steve-p
macrumors 68000
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Newbury, UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by GREEN4U View Post
Wow, about 99% of you need to read the Bible...

I'd start with Romans 1.
If the people who place some credence in it stopped doing so, stopped hiding behind it as an excuse for bigotry and discrimination, and started using their own judgement for a change, maybe the world would be a better place.
steve-p is offline   6
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:09 AM   #627
phillipduran
macrumors 6502a
 
phillipduran's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Iowa
Quote:
Originally Posted by likemyorbs View Post
Why should I? You are under the false impression that we give a crap about your book of fairytales when in actuality we put zero credence in it.
You are under the false impression that you speak for us. Some of the "we" you refer to do understand the bible.

I was in the military and I was taught to understand my enemies. To understand the other sides point of view. How about you pick up a bible and understand what is in there. Once you do that, please rejoin the conversation.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve-p View Post
If the people who place some credence in it stopped doing so, stopped hiding behind it as an excuse for bigotry and discrimination, and started using their own judgement for a change, maybe the world would be a better place.
Or it might be far, far worse.
__________________
That's "Geniuses," not Genii, genius.
To err, is PC.
phillipduran is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:12 AM   #628
yg17
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: St. Louis, MO
Quote:
Originally Posted by melendezest View Post
I feel Apple (or any company, for that matter) should not be getting involved in a moral issue. Especially a moral issue related to sex, the most intimate of all the things we do as a species!!! It is not necessary.

Someone here said no one should care about another person's morality. That we should "live and let live". I disagree; that morality is being taught to others as the truth, like an elementary school teacher would do, for example. Now an individual would have to pick and choose where to send their kids to school, fragmenting our society.

Unfortunately, as we live together we will encounter situations where the definition of what is or isn't immoral becomes relevant, especially in the establishment of laws and the like.

I feel that what people do (consensually) in the privacy of their home is their business. But when it is brought into the public eye the it could, and should, be met with scrutiny and discussion.

Homosexual behavior is sexual deviance. Although it is primarily consensual and relatively harmless, it is still deviance. It is not necessary to ascribe to a religious or even moral point of view to realize this. And as is expected, there may be unpleasant consequences to sexual deviance, should they be made public. In the past, the consequences have been severe, even violent, and without compassion, which brought about a push towards tolerance and acceptance that ignores the "condition" that homosexuals are subject to. Let me explain what I mean:

The purpose and design of the sexual organs is reproduction. They generate pleasure to facilitate and encourage procreation and the generation of human beings. When individuals choose to generate pleasure without procreation then they are deviating from the primary purpose of the organs. Obviously, human procreation requires male and female. As such, homosexual behavior is in direct contravention to the purpose and design of the very organs utilized in the act. Individuals with homosexual tendencies have a severe disconnect of the mind and the body: they feel that they we're born in "the wrong body", so to speak. With this in mind, it seems oxymoronic to say that homosexual behavior is "right" or "acceptable" or "normal", when there is an obvious psychological discrepancy in individuals subject to such behavior.

For me this begs the questions: Just because we can do something, should we do it? What other types of sexual deviance are we going to allow to become acceptable? What consequences, psychological or otherwise are they going to bring upon others?

Our country is going through a time of great change, and this debate will go on for a while. But I feel that the issue is not related to civil rights, as determined by race. The issue is sexual preference; the very word indicates choice. It is impossible for a man to change his race. It is possible to not engage in homosexual behavior. The two are now linked in the general public's perception (or at least the media), but they are nowhere near the same thing. And as a society, this issue can, and does, cause great division. Morality is integrated into societal living, but the society has to agree in what is right and wrong. When societies don't agree, war ensues.

"Live and let live" is just too simplistic a concept, especially for this issue. And companies should not be "taking a position" on issues such as this.

So if the purpose of sex is reproduction, I assume you are against allowing marriage of a male and a female where one of the partners is physically incapable of conceiving a child due to medical reasons? I also assume you have never used contraception, had sex that did not result in a pregnancy, or have a wank on a boring, lonely night where the only thing worth watching on TV was the softcore porn on Cinemax?

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by GREEN4U View Post
Wow, about 99% of you need to read the Bible...

I'd start with Romans 1.
I disagree, I think about 1% of you need to stop reading the Bible and join the rest of us in the 21st century.
__________________
Barack Obama is not a foreign born, brown skinned, anti-war socialist who gives away healthcare. You're thinking of Jesus.
yg17 is offline   8
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:12 AM   #629
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillipduran View Post
You are under the false impression that you speak for us. Some of the "we" you refer to do understand the bible.

I was in the military and I was taught to understand my enemies. To understand the other sides point of view. How about you pick up a bible and understand what is in there. Once you do that, please rejoin the conversation.
My "enemies" as you refer to them, put their faith in a 2000 year old book of fairytales and use it to justify their bigotry. What more is there to understand? I get it, the bible says homosexuality is evil. But since the bible is fictional, it's irrelevant. The bible would be worth reading if there were a word of truth in it. Let go of your little book and rejoin us in 2013.
likemyorbs is offline   4
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:15 AM   #630
bdavis89
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftLives View Post
Can you provide an example of this? Has "something else" happened in Canada? Spain? Any other country that's legalized gay marriage?
Are you saying that after we have gay rights, all will be right with the world? There will be no more fighting for rights, privileges, etc? That the human race, the most advanced species on the planet, will be complacent? Hasn't happened yet and I don't see it happening anytime soon. Gay rights is reaching its peak 40 years after Black rights. Time is everything.
bdavis89 is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:18 AM   #631
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
Are you saying that after we have gay rights, all will be right with the world? There will be no more fighting for rights, privileges, etc?
Who the hell is saying that? It won't fix the world, so because of that we shouldn't legalize it? Where is your logic?
likemyorbs is offline   1
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:23 AM   #632
Nunyabinez
macrumors 6502a
 
Nunyabinez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Provo, UT
Quote:
Originally Posted by yg17 View Post
I disagree, I think about 1% of you need to stop reading the Bible and join the rest of us in the 21st century.
From what I can gather about you, you are a liberal atheist. And my guess is that you therefore mostly associate with liberals and/or atheists. So, you may not realize that the majority of Americans are actually religious and read the Bible.

I have a Ph.D. and associate with lots of people who have doctorates, and I am amazed when I hear about how many people still don't graduate from high school. But, don't confuse the fact that most bloggers are liberal and atheist with that representing the majority, because it is not. You can tell people you don't think the Bible is relevant, but it's not the 1% that you're taking to.
__________________
27" iMac, 3.4 GHz i7; 15" MBP, 2.53 GHz Core 2 Duo; 13" MBA 1.7 GHz i5; iPad (3rd Gen), 16 GB; iPhone 5S; Hackintosh, 3.4 GHz i7 (2600k)
Nunyabinez is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:24 AM   #633
bdavis89
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by likemyorbs View Post
Who the hell is saying that? It won't fix the world, so because of that we shouldn't legalize it? Where is your logic?
Wow. No.

I was stating that once Gay marriage is legalized, there will be another issue in the future.

Class rights in the middle ages, slaves, women, blacks, now homosexuals. Its the progression.

Swiftlives was asking questions as if I was from the future, implying that everything would be hunky-dory once we have gay rights.
bdavis89 is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:32 AM   #634
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
From what I can gather about you, you are a liberal atheist. And my guess is that you therefore mostly associate with liberals and/or atheists. So, you may not realize that the majority of Americans are actually religious and read the Bible.

I have a Ph.D. and associate with lots of people who have doctorates, and I am amazed when I hear about how many people still don't graduate from high school. But, don't confuse the fact that most bloggers are liberal and atheist with that representing the majority, because it is not. You can tell people you don't think the Bible is relevant, but it's not the 1% that you're taking to.
The bible and US law have no connection to one another. And no, the majority of americans are not religious. Where do you get your surveys from? Atheism is the fastest growing non-belief in the country right now. Society as a whole is becoming less religious. The US is a secular nation. Just because a portion of our society chooses to cling on to old superstitions, does that mean we should acknowledge those superstitions as truth?
likemyorbs is offline   2
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:33 AM   #635
yg17
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: St. Louis, MO
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
From what I can gather about you, you are a liberal atheist. And my guess is that you therefore mostly associate with liberals and/or atheists. So, you may not realize that the majority of Americans are actually religious and read the Bible.

I have a Ph.D. and associate with lots of people who have doctorates, and I am amazed when I hear about how many people still don't graduate from high school. But, don't confuse the fact that most bloggers are liberal and atheist with that representing the majority, because it is not. You can tell people you don't think the Bible is relevant, but it's not the 1% that you're taking to.
I do realize the majority of Americans still read the bible, which is disturbing to me. The 1% was referencing the few people in this thread who still use their religion as an excuse to hate and discriminate.
__________________
Barack Obama is not a foreign born, brown skinned, anti-war socialist who gives away healthcare. You're thinking of Jesus.
yg17 is offline   2
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:34 AM   #636
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by yg17 View Post
I do realize the majority of Americans still read the bible, which is disturbing to me.
To read and to take literally are two very different things. A small minority of Americans actually take the bible word for word.
likemyorbs is offline   1
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:36 AM   #637
Nunyabinez
macrumors 6502a
 
Nunyabinez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Provo, UT
Quote:
Originally Posted by likemyorbs View Post
The bible and US law have no connection to one another. And no, the majority of americans are not religious. Where do you get your surveys from? Atheism is the fastest growing non-belief in the country right now. Society as a whole is becoming less religious. The US is a secular nation. Just because a portion of our society chooses to cling on to old superstitions, does that mean we should acknowledge those superstitions as truth?
The 2012 religion in America survey found that 19% of Americans have no religious affiliation, which is growing, but still a minority.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/...ion/56344976/1
__________________
27" iMac, 3.4 GHz i7; 15" MBP, 2.53 GHz Core 2 Duo; 13" MBA 1.7 GHz i5; iPad (3rd Gen), 16 GB; iPhone 5S; Hackintosh, 3.4 GHz i7 (2600k)
Nunyabinez is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:37 AM   #638
Happybunny
macrumors 65816
 
Happybunny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: 's-Hertogenbosch Netherlands
I'm surprised that there are still so many "People full of hate, bitterness and spitefulness" in the 21st Century.

Some of you sound as if you would be more at home in the "Middle Ages" or with the Taliban.

Love is a very beautiful thing, why deny that to anyone?
__________________
'You cannot undo history, but you can learn from it'
Happybunny is offline   5
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:43 AM   #639
bdavis89
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
The 2012 religion in America survey found that 19% of Americans have no religious affiliation, which is growing, but still a minority.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/...ion/56344976/1
You do realize this is the US? The minorities have the power.
bdavis89 is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:44 AM   #640
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
The 2012 religion in America survey found that 19% of Americans have no religious affiliation, which is growing, but still a minority.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/...ion/56344976/1
Even if the country was made up of 99% church going Christians, it still wouldn't matter because the US is not a Christian nation according to our constitution.
likemyorbs is offline   2
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:44 AM   #641
CalWizrd
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: NYC/Raleigh, NC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
The 2012 religion in America survey found that 19% of Americans have no religious affiliation, which is growing, but still a minority...
This is going to become a semantics issue.

There is a very large difference between people having a religious affiliation and those that consider themselves 'religious'

I'm Jewish by birth, so yes, I have a religious affiliation in referring to myself as Jewish. Am I a religious individual? Not by a very, very long shot.
__________________
"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." -- H.L.Mencken
CalWizrd is offline   1
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:44 AM   #642
Oletros
macrumors 603
 
Oletros's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: PremiÓ de Mar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
You do realize this is the US? The minorities have the power.
How so?
__________________
There are four kinds of lies: Lies, damned lies, statistics, and analyst projections.
Oletros is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:45 AM   #643
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
You do realize this is the US? The minorities have the power.
No, the minorities are protected from the mob mentality of the majority by the courts. There's a huge difference.
likemyorbs is offline   7
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:45 AM   #644
GREEN4U
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Romans is written by the apostle Paul who visits Rome and addresses the worsening state of society, which embraces lust, greed, homosexuality, etc. This is the exact same direction our present world is headed, where the majority of people think this immoral behavior is normal. Our society promotes tolerance and intolerance of those who aren't tolerant; this is completely backwards according to the Word of God. But then skip to chapter 5 of Romans. Even though we fall short of God in our immoral behavior we can be saved and have eternal life by accepting the Kingdom of God and Jesus Christ to change our hearts and actions.

Thus, the true Christian attitude towards homosexuality is not of hate or intolerance, but of love. The truth is that if we recognize our sin (whether its homosexuality or whatever you deal with) and accept Jesus Christ into our heart we may have everlasting life.
GREEN4U is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:47 AM   #645
SwiftLives
macrumors Demi-God
 
SwiftLives's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Charleston, SC
Send a message via AIM to SwiftLives
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
Wow. No.

I was stating that once Gay marriage is legalized, there will be another issue in the future.

Class rights in the middle ages, slaves, women, blacks, now homosexuals. Its the progression.

Swiftlives was asking questions as if I was from the future, implying that everything would be hunky-dory once we have gay rights.
No, I was just attempting to see if your comment below had any basis in reality or any historical context. So far, you haven't been able to support your supposition that the "next step is polygamy"

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
Next step is polygamy.

Anyone who thinks it will stop at gay rights is naive.
SwiftLives is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:49 AM   #646
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by GREEN4U View Post
Romans is written by the apostle Paul who visits Rome and addresses the worsening state of society, which embraces lust, greed, homosexuality, etc. This is the exact same direction our present world is headed, where the majority of people think this immoral behavior is normal. Our society promotes tolerance and intolerance of those who aren't tolerant; this is completely backwards according to the Word of God. But then skip to chapter 5 of Romans. Even though we fall short of God in our immoral behavior we can be saved and have eternal life by accepting the Kingdom of God and Jesus Christ to change our hearts and actions.

Thus, the true Christian attitude towards homosexuality is not of hate or intolerance, but of love. The truth is that if we recognize our sin (whether its homosexuality or whatever you deal with) and accept Jesus Christ into our heart we may have everlasting life.
You still don't get it do you? You are referencing your religion as if it is a fact. It is not. It's a myth, and most of us don't accept it as truth. So why do you keep quoting it as if its relevant to our thought process regarding same sex marriage?
likemyorbs is offline   2
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:49 AM   #647
bdavis89
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oletros View Post
How so?
They are the swing votes.
bdavis89 is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:51 AM   #648
likemyorbs
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Send a message via AIM to likemyorbs
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
Wow. No.

I was stating that once Gay marriage is legalized, there will be another issue in the future.
So?

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
They are the swing votes.
Then the other two groups wouldn't be considered majorities then would they?
likemyorbs is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:51 AM   #649
Oletros
macrumors 603
 
Oletros's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: PremiÓ de Mar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdavis89 View Post
They are the swing votes.
They they have ex actly the same power that the others voting
__________________
There are four kinds of lies: Lies, damned lies, statistics, and analyst projections.
Oletros is offline   0
Old Feb 27, 2013, 10:54 AM   #650
bdavis89
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by likemyorbs View Post
So?

----------



Then the other two groups wouldn't be considered majorities then would they?
Exactly. Don't see what the big deal was.

The majority can be split, but the minority unified. This gives the real power to the minority.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oletros View Post
They they have ex actly the same power that the others voting
bdavis89 is offline   0

Closed Thread
MacRumors Forums > Mac Community > Community Discussion > Politics, Religion, Social Issues

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pa. gov: Gay marriage is like marriage of siblings likemyorbs Politics, Religion, Social Issues 4 Oct 5, 2013 01:54 AM
Apple Wins Patent Dispute Against Mirror Worlds After U.S. Supreme Court Refuses to Hear Case MacRumors Mac Blog Discussion 30 Jul 1, 2013 05:21 PM
Apple Issues Statement in Support of Supreme Court Gay Marriage Rulings MacRumors Politics, Religion, Social Issues 366 Jun 26, 2013 04:04 PM
Nevada Assemblyman Comes Out as Gay During Gay Marriage Debate bradl Politics, Religion, Social Issues 1 Apr 24, 2013 07:06 PM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:16 PM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC