Apple Stock Options Fallout Continues

[xPismo]

Only a complete idiot and moron would not get himself a lawyer in this situation, especially when innocent.

Only a complete idiot or moron? Thank you. You are commenting on a concept no one was talking about.

Dang, xPismo, you're getting railed on by people not reading the entire thread, and all because your wording isn't interpreted the way you meant it to be by a few people. If I were you I'd go back and reword it before the thread is consumed by those that don't understand you

If someone just asked what I meant instead of flaming away I might have.

Not really, no. You said a person doesn't get legal representation unless they needed it. I said they would if they thought they might need it, which is not the same thing.

yourself!

Lets not be silly here. Steve Jobs has a Lawyer. He is adding additional independent representation due to this situation. This would not happen unless he, his lawyer, and/or Apple Legal believed it was required.

The time when any Executive Officer of any large company not having a Lawyer is long gone.

This is the second time you have told me what I meant in one thread IJ Reilly, when did you become the expert on xPismo's thoughts?

[edit]

Just to push this along:

Since authorities and police are now ALLOWED to LIE about facts and allegations, any person questioned at any time for any reason should take the fifth and hire an attorney forthwith. ESPECIALLY if innocent.

Rocketman

What do you mean, I dont understand. What is the change which allows this?

 

[theheadguy]

I find it a little difficult to believe that Steve Jobs is a greedy man, considering his salary is $1.

I believe Jobs cares too much about Apple to intentionally do something to it that would cause it harm. Apple is the outlet for his artistic vision.

/sigh.

His salary is $1. This is what you base his level of greed on? He received MILLIONS of dollars in stock options from Apple just within the past year. Apple in part helps Pixar and Disney, both of which he owns massive amounts of shares of. He contributes very little in proportion to his income compared to similar income high profile figures. You've just been an example of a fan in fairy tale land when it comes to the reality that Jobs is a real person and his actions may be catching up with him and/or others if these allegations prove to be justified. At least I can stop wondering why M$ users call some Mac users zealots.

 

[iMeowbot]

They volunteered information about falsified documents? I think you are referencing simple accounting irregularities.

The "accounting irregularities" were the falsified documents. These aren't two separate issues, they are both about the same backdated options.

This is what companies pay internal auditors to find, and it's definitely in the company's self-interest to come forward with this stuff because the auditor is required to disclose it. Remember what happened to Arthur Andersen when they didn't disclose what they found in their clients' records?

 

[kuzma]

Jobs doesn't understand accounting implications???

You have got to be kidding ...

As to Jobs's involvement, the statement said its CEO "was aware that favorable grant dates had been selected, but he did not receive or otherwise benefit from these grants and was unaware of the accounting implications."

Let's see, you build a couple of billion dollar businesses and yet do not understand the accounting implications of backdating options. Give me a break!

And does he actually mean that he understands the implications of falsifying legal documents, which option grants are, and that we should forgive him for this?

 

[Rocketman]

What do you mean, I dont understand. What is the change which allows this?

The supreme court RULED police are allowed to LIE to identified folks about facts and claims in cases (NO I DO NOT HAVE a cite, perhaps 2 years ago or less).

This is a really concerning ruling since police/authorities can now, without repercussion, claim things during investigations and "plea bargaining", that further their goals while mis-stating the risks of the "perp", especially if innocent, to further the goals of the prosecutor.

After all, the system is about the prosecutor first, right?

Why?

To assure the legality of imbedded undercover agents. Reasonable. So, why, I ask you, does it apply generally to police and prosecutors and to detectives??????

Reasonable question. Considering their disproportionate power over standard citizens and defendants.

Rocketman

 

[mrl14]

FYI Apple's stock has moved downwards 3% in After Hours because something was leaked from the actual report given to the SEC. I know it was mentioned earlier (7.5 million shares) but no one pointed out the stock drop.

IMO, I'd be weary to buy anything more than a half position until Friday. We all know that Apple's stock is moving up on ipod sales, mac sales and rumors, and the first 2 are not going to change. So I see Apple's restatement of earnings doing nothing more than maybe a short term drop of a couple points (buying opp.) OR a relief rally sending this stock on its way up for the pre macworld rally.

MY only fear is a resignation of Jobs before MW....this could be bad.

Note: Somehow I caught the top of the recent rally and sold 25% of my current position.

 

[calyxman]

Someone get some marshmallows so we can roast them over this fire....

 

[joeboy_45101]

No, I'm not saying ignore the bad things in life. But by golly, try and find some proof of bad things instead of grouping everyone in the evil pot. Those leaders and corporate execs are human beings, someones fathers and mothers, and actually have the possibility for integrity

~Tyler

Oh boo-hoo! Life isn't fair! Let's all feel sorry for the executives. I mean what a tragedy if they get caught and have to go to jail, then they can't buy that new platinum Bentley they've been wanting.

IMHO I don't believe Steve Jobs did anything with the intent of misleading or swindling the stockholders. I believe the man when he says that somebody handed him some papers and told him to sign there while telling him not to worry this is all just normal business stuff. Jobs is not your run of the mill business man, he doesn't strike me as a business man at all. He's a guy that knows what he wants the company to strive for and how products should work. "Business" is somebody else's department.

I don't blame people for their problems, but their problems are their problems and they have to take responsibility.

 

[whatever]

Its the same old story with any American company, give all the money to the boardroom class & CEO's, then close your american factories, pay your chineese workforce pennys a hour, work em 15 hours a day. Apple is no different then most american companys these days. This just goes to show that Apple isnt thinking different. Apple is guilty and they know it. They should share the wealth with the whole company not just those boardroom brown nosers.

SHUT THE FU#K UP!

Having been employeed by a very large (over 10,000 employees world wide) Dutch company, I have to say two things:
1. I'm with Dr.Evil, I too hate the Dutch!
2. There are just as many companies from Europe who pursue cheap labor at least we don't do it with Cuba.

Oh yeah, Job's annual pay at Apple is only $1.00.

 

[whatever]

Remember Jobs is a drop out so he may not really have known what the legal ramifications were.

I'd hire a lawyer too.Especially if I'd signed off on one of the documents but didnt really know it was illegal until a few months ago.

Jobs will get out of this.

AAPL might not though.

Have you people been following Apple's stock the past couple of months!

Back in October it dropped down to the $70s. This is actually a common trend for Apple's stock.

 

[whatever]

So lets say this gets really bad, What happens to MWSF then.

Nothing!

For years and years, Apple was a great company, with good to great products, with crappy stock. I remember when I first started buying up Apple stock back in 2001, the stock feel from $30 something to $21.00 in one day and then dropped further down to 14.50 a month later. They weren't doing anything wrong, just Wallstreet hated the stock.

 

[GoCubsGo]

Nonsense, Apple volunteered the information to the SEC.

They gave what they wanted. Unfortunately, it was just enough to raise eyebrows. Oh well, it's not like they're Enron!

 

[Rytr23]

We get it

7.5 million shares with no board approval? I wonder how many shares Apples workers were given? Oh thats right they gave em shuffles. Nothing new here its the same old story the CEO class are raping these companys and the workers are lucky for minimum wage that was set a decade ago unless they are pod makers in China then they get 50 cents a day. Jesus said its easier to thread a camel through the eye of a needle then for these types to make it in heaven.

Wow..we get it.. you're a super lefty!! You're for the common man!! Enough already.. I would bet the house that the last time anyone working in cupertino saw minimum wage it was on thier kids paycheck from thier summer job..maybe..

Furthermore.. its not that difficult to thread a camel through a needle.. you just need the right tools.. or a large needle.. So its a win for everyone!

 

[whatever]

Im not saying its Jobs, but someone gave him 7.5 million shares without accounting for them? Ive never understood these greedy CEO's how they can make millions only to want more millions and millions. When is enough enough for these guys? Enron,Tyco, now Apple.

It's called business not charity.

Do you know what's involved with being a CEO?

Do you know what many of these people do with their undeserved millions?

Let's see Jobs, started another company from scratch, using a lot of his own money. Paying people's benefits and salaries. That company is NeXT and most likely the OS you're using wouldn't be around (or Apple for that matter) if Jobs didn't spend his money on NeXT. Let's see then he invested heavily in another small company called Pixar. A company that Lucas Films was dumping. If he didn't buy it, most likely Pixar would never been able to maintain there staff and would have just disappeared.

Now how did this all happen, because a CEO used the money he earned to invest in other companies. This is very common. So please get your head out of your ass.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Absolute worst? Steve Jobs gets led off stage in handcuffs. G5 PowerBooks Tuesday have a better chance though.

Fixed that for you.

 

[SiliconAddict]

It's called business not charity.

Do you know what's involved with being a CEO?

Yah sitting on your fat butt making poor decisions and letting the grunts in the company take the brunt of the fallout in the end. In the case of Jobs though he's made some good ones so *shrugs*.
I've never met a CEO from a moderate to large company, I've met about 6 over the years the biggest being Michael Dell 3 years ago at a reception in Irving TX, that I didn't hate intensely. Their perception of reality vs. everyone else's is pretty much inverted. Guess who's is generally right?

 

[IJ Reilly]

You don't spend the cash for a team of reps unless you need the protection.

This is the second time you have told me what I meant in one thread IJ Reilly, when did you become the expert on xPismo's thoughts?

Somebody has to do it.

 

[bobber205]

I say Jobs should be above the law and does whatever he wants. I love jobs.

Go jobs.

 

[Earendil]

Im not saying its Jobs, but someone gave him 7.5 million shares without accounting for them? Ive never understood these greedy CEO's how they can make millions only to want more millions and millions. When is enough enough for these guys? Enron,Tyco, now Apple.

Could you back that statement up please? Everything I've read has said two things, A: Steve Jobs did not benefit from the falsified documents, and that B: He did not know that someone else did. No where but these boards has anyone directly accused Steve Jobs of anything, and by these boards, I suppose I mean you. Others are just willing to jump on your band wagon as soon as someone actually does make claims against Jobs directly, but you seem to be doing that all on your own... Perhaps you are on the prosecuting team?

Personally I'm holding the middle ground. I'm neither going to defend Jobs and say he's a saint, nor am I going to call him the devil and believe blindly that he did anything wrong until someone proves it or shows a strong evidence.

Did a CEO kill your cat or something as a kid?

 

[solvs]

Wow..we get it.. you're a super lefty!!

DHM a lefty!?! HA! You must be new here.

Appleinsider is covering this right now. Still reserving judgment. I've worked with some rich executives, some seem perfectly normal to me, some complete asses who are oblivious to everything. Same with politicians. But I'm more than willing to criticize any of them when they screw up. Even Jobs.

Just saying what most of us are though and giving them the benefit of the doubt... for now.

 

[Apple Corps]

Could you back that statement up please? Everything I've read has said two things, A: Steve Jobs did not benefit from the falsified documents, and that B: He did not know that someone else did. No where but these boards has anyone directly accused Steve Jobs of anything, and by these boards, I suppose I mean you. Others are just willing to jump on your band wagon as soon as someone actually does make claims against Jobs directly, but you seem to be doing that all on your own... Perhaps you are on the prosecuting team?

Personally I'm holding the middle ground. I'm neither going to defend Jobs and say he's a saint, nor am I going to call him the devil and believe blindly that he did anything wrong until someone proves it or shows a strong evidence.

Did a CEO kill your cat or something as a kid?

You should read this: ttp://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aCED2MspivRw&refer=us

 

[Apple Corps]

Another perspective which suggests that Steve DID NOT benefit - he surrendered that grant w/o exercising it:

http://today.reuters.com/news/artic..._RTRIDST_0_APPLE-OPTIONS.XML&rpc=66&type=qcna

 

[Aniej]

this is getting worse than guessing about what will be released at mwsf, on that note back to that thread.

 

[swingerofbirch]

I just read this article:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/801e1b82-9605-11db-9976-0000779e2340.html

and came here to make sense of it and found this thread already going.

According to the article Jobs was given 7.5 million options at 18.30 a share. So, does that mean at any time he could sell the stock without really having bought it to begin with? An option is essentially the option to sell a stock if the price is favorable?

If that understanding is correct, do you at the point you sell it gain the profit of the value of those shares, or the difference between the current price and what the shares were given to you at?

And if it is the latter, is that why they backdate to give the employees the lowest possible price?

If Jobs really has committed a crime, it would be rather ironic given his comments about karma and purchasing legally, and that every iPod says "Don't steal music."

 

[tmornini]

looks like its time to buy some more stock soon.

Looks like Jay is the first one to give the right advice!

Buy on bad news, sell on good news.

Just be ready to buy some more if it keeps going down.