iMac AL 24" graphics freeze with 1.1

[HLdan]

Ummm... because I don't really expect that to solve the problem given the fact that Apple acknowledged the problem and many others report it under a variety of circumstances. And I don't like pain.

Oh, and also because I also had the problem with 1.0 when running Aperture.

Thanks for the suggestions though...

As Dr. Cheesesteak mentioned (which by the way sounds good right now as it's lunch time) give the reformat a try. It's not going to do you any good to come on the forum and tell us your issue, we offer a viable solution and you decide to go against it which leaves you in the same predicament you were in before you posted.
Yes Apple has acknowledged the issue and is working on a fix but who knows when that will be as they have to work with ATI for the solution. Now this issue is not happening with everyone as I have had no freezing issues and I use my iMac's GPU to it's fullest and I'm updated with 1.1.
At this point try a restore or stay inconvenienced.

 

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

Thanks Doctor..... Question, did you do a full drive re-format and rebuild, or just the OS rebuild from the OSX disks? Seems like it'd be rather painful to do the disk reformat....

Thanks again...

I did not do a full format, but I did do a full re-install. I've read other people state that an 'Archive + Install' worked just as well.

I just had so little on the machine at that point that I figured I'd just go all out - didn't need to archive anything at that point.

 

[kbleicher]

It's not going to do you any good to come on the forum and tell us your issue, we offer a viable solution and you decide to go against it which leaves you in the same predicament you were in before you posted.

Wow, you have to have a tough skin to be in these forums.. ;-) Just looking for some more background before I take the plunge (which I have now). Apparently a full reformat may not be necessary per Dr. Cheesesteak, so that saved hours of potentially wasted effort in a reformat recovery... It'll be okay.. everyone take a deep breath...

 

[craig1410]

Hi,

As someone mentioned, this issue seems to affect us all to a greater or lesser extent which leads me to believe there is some other dependency going on. Maybe it is a combination of software or a combination of certain types of hardware or hardware event which triggers the issue.

My machine has been up for nearly 7 days without a restart even though prior to the last restart I was having a lockup more or less once a day. I am running update 1.1 too having reapplied it after attempting a rollback to 1.0 (which didn't prevent lockups btw). The only other thing to report is the fact that I have disconnected all my USB peripherals (Scanner and LaCie HDD) but I don't know it that is relevant or not. I have also done PRAM and SMC cleansing and verified my permissions.

I don't know what the magic bullet was for me but I hope my machine continues to act this stable until Apple can sort out a long term fix.

Cheers,
Craig.

 

[HLdan]

Wow, you have to have a tough skin to be in these forums.. ;-) Just looking for some more background before I take the plunge (which I have now). Apparently a full reformat may not be necessary per Dr. Cheesesteak, so that saved hours of potentially wasted effort in a reformat recovery... It'll be okay.. everyone take a deep breath...

No, don't misunderstand, we are only here to help, not get on your case for not accepting advice. I mentioned reformat to you first but you declined it until Dr. C mentioned it. I don't know if you are thinking in the ways of Windows but reformat and install on a Mac is quite easy and it shouldn't be anything different than what Dr. C did. You just shove in the install discs and hit Erase which wipes the drive clean and then install Mac OS X again. You can further clean it by using Disk Utility but it's not quite necessary.
Good luck and let us know how it works out.

 

[pesos]

I guess apple won't be running the PC guy/Mac guy reboot ad again anytime soon

 

[HLdan]

I guess apple won't be running the PC guy/Mac guy reboot ad again anytime soon

Well let's be fair, it's only an issue with the iMac's GPU. The rest of the Macintosh line doesn't have this freezing problem.
Besides how many times has Microsoft promised a secure OS? Hasn't happened yet.

 

[pesos]

Well let's be fair, it's only an issue with the iMac's GPU. The rest of the Macintosh line doesn't have this freezing problem.
Besides how many times has Microsoft promised a secure OS? Hasn't happened yet.

Exactly my point. The ad completely generalizes and implies that windoze has an inherent flaw that I have personally never experienced on any of my windoze machines (including my macbook pro). I'm not trying to defend Micro$oft (puhleez), just pointing out that Apple has gone too far with their advertising and it's going to bite them in the ass as they get more aggressive with drivers/gaming/etc...

 

[kbleicher]

You just shove in the install discs and hit Erase which wipes the drive clean and then install Mac OS X again.

Thanks HLdan,

Doesn't that imply a full loss of data files and installed applications? That's not trivial to bring back from backup. Or am I missing it?

Thanks again...

 

[pesos]

Thanks HLdan,

Doesn't that imply a full loss of data files and installed applications? That's not trivial to bring back from backup. Or am I missing it?

Thanks again...

Yes. I always recommend keeping data and OS/programs on separate partitions. That way you can wipe and reinstall the OS without giving a thought to losing your data.

On the windoze side you can use imaging utilities to save yourself quite a bit of time (restore a ready-to-go partition with major updates/apps already applied) -- I imagine you could do something similar on the Mac side by using a USB disk.

 

[HLdan]

Thanks HLdan,

Doesn't that imply a full loss of data files and installed applications? That's not trivial to bring back from backup. Or am I missing it?

Thanks again...

Yes, however I was assuming that you have a back up drive such as an iPod. If not you can use Archive and Install.

 

[HLdan]

Exactly my point. The ad completely generalizes and implies that windoze has an inherent flaw that I have personally never experienced on any of my windoze machines (including my macbook pro). I'm not trying to defend Micro$oft (puhleez), just pointing out that Apple has gone too far with their advertising and it's going to bite them in the ass as they get more aggressive with drivers/gaming/etc...

Actually Apple's ads have never mentioned anything about their computers. It's always been about the benefits using OS X vs. having a Windows machine. The iMac freezing has nothing to do with actual OS X system.

 

[pesos]

Actually Apple's ads have never mentioned anything about their computers. It's always been about the benefits using OS X vs. having a Windows machine. The iMac freezing has nothing to do with actual OS X system.

A driver is a piece of software written specifically to interact with the OS. So the way the OS handles its interaction with drivers is absolutely at issue here. What do you think caused 95% of the BSODs on windoze back in the day? If micro$oft had a closed hardware system and dealt with a gamut of 3rd party drivers that I could count on two hands the way apple does...

 

[ascender]

It really is a screwy software bug this one. I bought a 24" 2.8GHz machine at launch and usually just leave it on 24*7.

Anyway, I had no problems at all until I installed the update, which lead to the random freezing.

I used the method on here to roll back the update. No joy, I still got freezing.

Then the following day, the freezes stopped and my iMac has been back to 24*7 use without any freezes. But I changed nothing to get it to work, it just suddenly resolved itself. I'm still using the same applications in the same way, but the problem has gone. I'm almost tempted to install the update again to see what happens, but I'm not stupid

And yes, as an IT Consultant who used to work in support, I know exactly how ridiculous the above description of events sounds!

 

[psonice]

All of you getting the issues, are you using OSX as it originally came installed?

Just curious, as I've had mine (a 2.8) for a couple of months now, with not a single crash or freeze. It's actually run much better since installing 1.1, and I've been using it pretty heavily (aperture, vmware with a few VMs running at the same time, odd bits of fairly 3d intensive stuff, etc.). I've also used it for a bit of gaming under windows with only one crash (and I think that's about standard for windows.. not bad really!)

I did a full erase and install when I first got it (I like a clean fresh install - no point in having trials of office, iwork etc. that i'll never use and that probably leave all kinds of clutter on the disk!)

 

[Tonerl]

Mac Partitioning

Yes. I always recommend keeping data and OS/programs on separate partitions. That way you can wipe and reinstall the OS without giving a thought to losing your data.

I'm considering a new iMac at present. I run Linux and Windows on my current machine and, like you, always keep my OS, programs, and data on separate partitions. What HDD size and partitioning would you recommend? I intend to run Windows XP under VMware Fusion but not to use BootCamp. If you can't give a recommendation, perhaps you could point me in the direction of relevant info. TIA.

 

[psonice]

I'm considering a new iMac at present. I run Linux and Windows on my current machine and, like you, always keep my OS, programs, and data on separate partitions. What HDD size and partitioning would you recommend? I intend to run Windows XP under VMware Fusion but not to use BootCamp. If you can't give a recommendation, perhaps you could point me in the direction of relevant info. TIA.

VMware can actually use the bootcamp partition, so if you'll ever run anything that needs a bit more performance or 3d/games/whatever, it's worth doing that. Then again, you lose the snapshot function, which can be more than a little useful in windows. I use that for windows, for my linux boxes I just use hard files on an external disk - that keeps performance up as they're not all fighting for access to the same disk, and with the hardfiles you're free to use whatever partitions you want and change them at will.

 

[pesos]

I'm considering a new iMac at present. I run Linux and Windows on my current machine and, like you, always keep my OS, programs, and data on separate partitions. What HDD size and partitioning would you recommend? I intend to run Windows XP under VMware Fusion but not to use BootCamp. If you can't give a recommendation, perhaps you could point me in the direction of relevant info. TIA.

Depending on what apps you plan to install/run, I recommend at least 30 GB for OS X. If you're just going to use Fusion for the windoze side, you don't necessarily need another partition for that - you can just store those files on the data partition...

 

[HLdan]

A driver is a piece of software written specifically to interact with the OS. So the way the OS handles its interaction with drivers is absolutely at issue here. What do you think caused 95% of the BSODs on windoze back in the day? If micro$oft had a closed hardware system and dealt with a gamut of 3rd party drivers that I could count on two hands the way apple does...

You're blowing this all out of proportion. We were just talking about the Apple ads for goodness sake. Most of the ads concentrated on Windows having Virus and Macs not experiencing that, all true.
Other ads talked about confusing customers with multiple versions of Windows and one version of Mac OS X, all true.

One ad focused on the freezing of the OS which is the norm (BSOD) on Windows and it's not the norm on the Mac. Most people leave Windows because of the never ending Registry maintenance and BSOD's. If anyone leaves the Mac OS to go to Windows it's not because of excessive Kernel Panics.

This is a driver issue with the GPU on the iMac and when Apple sends out the update this discussion will be long gone.
One thing the ads have never mentioned is that "Macs are perfect".
Sounds more like you have a beef with Apple.

 

[pesos]

You're blowing this all out of proportion. We were just talking about the Apple ads for goodness sake. Most of the ads concentrated on Windows having Virus and Macs not experiencing that, all true.
Other ads talked about confusing customers with multiple versions of Windows and one version of Mac OS X, all true.

One ad focused on the freezing of the OS which is the norm (BSOD) on Windows and it's not the norm on the Mac. Most people leave Windows because of the never ending Registry maintenance and BSOD's. If anyone leaves the Mac OS to go to Windows it's not because of excessive Kernel Panics.

This is a driver issue with the GPU on the iMac and when Apple sends out the update this discussion will be long gone.

Sounds more like you have a beef with Apple.

Actually we were talking about one ad in particular. There are other ads which are misleading/exaggeration, but this one in particular is pretty ridiculous and harks back to older verisons of windoze (remember the lovely "bomb" error from OS 9?). As I said, most BSOD's (and to call them the norm is a pretty ridiculous statement on your part) are caused by drivers as well - so once they update their drivers the BSOD is "long gone."

The bottom line is Apple is changing their focus - not a bad thing - just something to be aware of. As they continue to push into the gaming side of things and be more aggressive with drivers, this kind of thing is bound to happen. Their increased market share will also continue to create a rise in the number of exploits targeted at OS X -- it will no longer be in the little 5% market share bubble it has enjoyed. Again, not a bad thing - I'm glad to see their market share increase and there isn't another laptop I would pit against my MBP.

I do have a particular disdain for the contempt OS X has for the user, but there's plenty of things I don't like about Windoze as well. But BSODs certainly aren't one of them - I haven't seen a BSOD since NT 4.0 actually lol.

 

[HLdan]

A

The bottom line is Apple is changing their focus - not a bad thing - just something to be aware of. As they continue to push into the gaming side of things and be more aggressive with drivers, this kind of thing is bound to happen. Their increased market share will also continue to create a rise in the number of exploits targeted at OS X -- it will no longer be in the little 5% market share bubble it has enjoyed. Again, not a bad thing - I'm glad to see their market share increase and there isn't another laptop I would pit against my MBP.

Well one thing you need to keep in my friend is that Mac OS X is not DOS based as Windows is. The reason for the inherently secure OS on the Mac is because it's UNIX based and please drop the ignorance that it's because of the 5% market share that there's no attacks, that argument is getting old.

Now to answer your question from the previous post. "What do I think caused 95% if the BSOD's in Windows"? Answer dumb programers!
Apple was smart enough and brave enough to build the Mac OS on top of the very secure Unix core which is why it runs so well.
BSOD's are not going away in Windows since MS loves DOS so much.
Again, the iMac is one product from Apple and you are just looking for any avenue to trash talk Apple.

I came from the Windows world and left it for a more solemn and enjoyable computing experience on the Mac so don't tell me that those ads were exaggerated, I experienced all of them and that Registry is the monster behind it all.

 

[pesos]

Well one thing you need to keep in my friend is that Mac OS X is not DOS based as Windows is. The reason for the inherently secure OS on the Mac is because it's UNIX based and please drop the ignorance that it's because of the 5% market share that there's no attacks, that argument is getting old.

Now to answer your question from the previous post. "What do I think caused 95% if the BSOD's in Windows"? Answer dumb programers!
Apple was smart enough and brave enough to build the Mac OS on top of the very secure Unix core which is why it runs so well.
BSOD's are not going away in Windows since MS loves DOS so much.
Again, the iMac is one product from Apple and you are just looking for any avenue to trash talk Apple.

I came from the Windows world and left it for a more solemn and enjoyable computing experience on the Mac so don't tell me that those ads were exaggerated, I experienced all of them and that Registry is the monster behind it all.

Windows is Dos-based? Haha, you mean you were running windoze 98? You are truly an idiot. BSODs have absolutely nothing to do with DOS. Please continue posting as you reveal more of your ignorance with every statement you make. If you had a bad experience with windoze you didn't know what you were doing (which doesn't surprise me). You were probably running your machine daily with admin rights, among other things.

Enjoy your mac! I know I'm enjoying mine. Stop putting words in my mouth and thinking I'm an apple-basher. I am an OS-basher ;-)

 

[bongabonga]

Thanks Doctor..... Question, did you do a full drive re-format and rebuild, or just the OS rebuild from the OSX disks? Seems like it'd be rather painful to do the disk reformat....

I did the former (complete erase & install) and decided to only download an update to iTunes - nothing else. Since Sunday night my iMac has been running smooth without any glitches what-so-ever. I haven't even seen the beach ball.

This is my 2nd iMac, a replacement for the first one which kept freezing. But the new one didn't behave any better: after numerous freezes the hard drive died, but I think it was only file damage (fingers crossed, it's still running fine since the erase & install).

(my more detailed posts are here)

Oh, and btw: I wish people would stop blaming hardcore gaming or CPU/graphic intensive programs for the freezes. I have no games installed, nothing connected but the mouse and keyboard, and both my iMacs have been freezing while I'm writing emails (slowly), opening a tab in Safari or Firefox, double-clicking a folder, emptying the trash, or lowering the volume in iTunes.

 

[snickelfritz]

My friend and I both have the same iMac; 24" aluminum.
His gets very hot along the back/left side and has the freezing problem with the GPU. It also suffers from random graphics corruption.(definitely hardware related)

Mine gets warm to the touch, but definitely not "hot", and does not have the random freezing or graphics curruption issues with the GPU.
Both computers have the iMac 1.1 update installed.

Personally, I think it's an issue with the heatsinks on the GPU/VRAM, and/or the path to the fan port on the back of the iMac.
Whatever the cause, it seems related to overheating.
Update 1.1 driver might be causing the GPU/VRAM to run at a higher frequency or with new registers, which causes it to run hotter.

 

[Bolteh]

My 24" iMac 2,8GHz that arrived this morning has been having freezing issues as well. Doesn't matter when, or what I'm doing at that time, the graphics just freeze but I can still move my cursor and I can hear the sounds when I'm increase/decrease the volume.

I tried updating to 1.1, didn't fix
I tried downgrading back to 1.0, didn't fix
Installed smcFanControl 2.1.2, upped it with 50% (iMac ain't that silent anymore), still not fixed

I'm crying my heart out here.. Over 8 weeks of waiting, just to get a faulty iMac.. I installed WoW, tried to play, but I didn't even get to update WoW because when I log in, it freezes. Same goes for iTunes, or about any other application (even froze when I opened the Mac Help window a minute ago).

I sure hope as hell this isn't a hardware error, else I have to send it back and wait for my new one to arrive (that will most likely have these issues too)..


Hmm, typing this post is the first time in an hour that my computer didn't freeze after 1 minute..