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balamw

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
19,366
979
New England
Apple NEVER makes products for clients that seek affordable solutions, they might offer older models at better prices but that's it, they are still expensive compared to their competition.

I don't think you understand Apple's business model. Apple is not a Maybach, Rolls Royce or Bentley. It's a BMW, Acura, Lexus ... Slightly better than average performance at slightly higher than average prices.

The iOS platform remains dominant in where it matters to Apple's shareholders in the profitability of the space. Cheap, barely more than feature-phone Android handsets do not make their individual manufacturers, or Google, much in the way of profit. Just like selling zero margin commodity PC hardware, it's hard to make a real profit in that space. Just ask HP (who tried to ditch their PC hardware business) and Dell (who now defines themselves as a services company).

The majority of Apple's clients are much more "traditional" in reality.

That's because Apple designs their products for "the everyman", they do not target spec geeks. Apple actively wants the iPad to be your grandma and your toddler's computer.

You may not be in the target market if specs rather than how those specs perform in the real world matter to you.

P.S. I don't mean to sound as if I'm not giving credit to Apple for their contribution to technology but it seems pretty often that they are not able to tell the difference between inventing new technologies and putting existing technologies together in order to make a good product (and sometimes leaving important technologies out).

Apocryphally the head of the patent office claimed that everything had already been invented and wanted to shut down the patent office. Every invention builds on those of the past.

Sometimes figuring out what features or technology are important or not is hard to determine. (e.g. see the infamous Thread 500 or Slashdot's No wireless. Less space than a nomad. Lame..

For the vast majority of folks who bought an iPod, the fact that it did not support FLAC or Ogg Vorbis was completely irrelevant.

Apple has been on the leading edge of eliminating features like:
  • Legacy ADB and peripheral ports in favor of USB only.
  • Eliminating the Optical Disk Drive as a standard feature in the MBA and Mac mini.
  • Replacing the "boxy" HDD in the MBA with a blade like SDD
  • Trading replaceable batteries for larger, longer life embedded ones.
  • Skipping USB3 (for now at least) in favor of Thunderbolt.

These all lead to simpler, easier to use, smaller, lighter products. This is innovation in the truest sense of the word.

Apple subscribes to simple, minimalist design principles. The best component is no component, the best feature is no feature.

B
 

No5tromo

macrumors 6502
Feb 17, 2012
393
1,021
I don't think you understand Apple's business model. Apple is not a Maybach, Rolls Royce or Bentley. It's a BMW, Acura, Lexus ... Slightly better than average performance at slightly higher than average prices.

I don't quite agree with this, I would compare Apple to designer clothes. Yes, they are usually of good quality but you know that you pay a good amount for the brand stamp as well. I definitely do not agree with the "slightly better performance", while the "higher than average prices" part is true. You can get devices better than iPhone 3Gs for much less at the moment. (It's around $350 if I'm not mistaken)

Apple has been on the leading edge of eliminating features

They also seem to hate Flash and anything open source and I still think it's a joke that they were so proud they managed to add 3G on the iPhone that they named a model after it, while 3G was widely used for years! (the first model should be named "iPhone phonecalls" then). And it also took them quite a few models to add a decent camera with a a led flash and video calls (that work only over wi-fi? lol, I had a mobile phone that supported 3G video calls since 2004...). Who can forget the first iPod that connected only to Macs via firewire...? And what I frankly find annoying is that they get up on keynotes to inform us about a feature they added that it's already widely used by other brands and they expect the world to be filled with awe.

What can I say, I'm just not that easily impressed. I love thechnology and I appreciate companies that release good tech products, but unless Apple comes up with the anti-gravity car, I tihnk they should tone down the patents just a bit.
 

balamw

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
19,366
979
New England
You can get devices better than iPhone 3Gs for much less at the moment. (It's around $350 if I'm not mistaken)

More evidence that you are not the typical consumer that is Apple's market.

The 3GS is only available now as Apple's "free (on contract) phone." No one considering a phone off contract would buy one.

Do you think that part of the cost differential between Honda and Acura isn't just the name plate? At the time of a refresh, Apple computer products really tend to be quite competitively priced with their direct competition from Lenovo and the like. You can't compare an MBA to a Netbook they are just different classes of device.

They also seem to hate Flash and anything open source

That's just plain wrong. Apple is fully committed to several Open Source projects that form the basis of many of their products. Darwin is the foundation of both OS X and iOS, Webkit the foundation of Safari is also used on most Android phones and clang which is the foundation of Xcode.

Flash is related to the next point.

and I still think it's a joke that they were so proud they managed to add 3G on the iPhone that they named a model after it, while 3G was widely used for years! (the first model should be named "iPhone phonecalls" then). And it also took them quite a few models to add a decent camera with a a led flash and video calls (that work only over wi-fi? lol, I had a mobile phone that supported 3G video calls since 2004...). Who can forget the first iPod that connected only to Macs via firewire...? And what I frankly find annoying is that they get up on keynotes to inform us about a feature they added that it's already widely used by other brands and they expect the world to be filled with awe.

In most cases the features you are talking about are exactly the kind of features that aren't worth much when implemented poorly. The iPod is actually a bad example. In 2001 when the iPod was first released, USB 2.0 was not prevalent, where as FireWire was on every Mac. Which would you choose to implement. I had a Rio 256MB MP3 player at the time which was USB 1.1 and was a royal pain to sync.

I still have yet to see a really good and useful implementation of Flash on a mobile platform that is truly worth anything.

w.r.t. LED flashes and cameras I have little experience with what exists in other hardware these days. I still tend to use my real P&S over any camera phone...

What can I say, I'm just not that easily impressed.

Clearly not. Nor were the folks in Thread 500 or on Slashdot when the iPod was released. In hindsight, were they right?

B
 

No5tromo

macrumors 6502
Feb 17, 2012
393
1,021
More evidence that you are not the typical consumer that is Apple's market.

The 3GS is only available now as Apple's "free (on contract) phone." No one considering a phone off contract would buy one.

I'm definitely not the typical Apple customer in the sense that I am currently on a low budget, and even though I'm lucky enough to own a few credit cards, I can really resist the temptation.

And also I did recently buy an iPhone 3Gs off contract as I do not live in America and the carrier programmes over here are less tempting. I own the craft of living on prepaid cards and making the best out of them, I get away with 10€/month and have all the communication I need (messaging apps and wi-fi usage help a lot). So it comes way cheaper than getting an iPhone on contract.

I decided to get an iPhone 3Gs for reasons that don't have to do with performance criteria, one being that I wanted to use my phone as an iPod as well since I keep a very organised iTunes library and I'm very used to the iTunes/iPod interface. I was also able to sell my 6th gen ipod nano (had got it as a replacement for my 1st gen ipod nano), so that made it a cheaper choice for me.

If I got an iPhone 4 instead, the only extra feature that I really care about would be the camera (the back camera, I don't give a **** about video calls over wi-fi), but I wouldn't spend an extra 200€ just for a better camera. (The Retina display is also very welcome but I can live without it for now)

Clearly not. Nor were the folks in Thread 500 or on Slashdot when the iPod was released. In hindsight, were they right?

I never argued against Apple's capability to make hit products (history says that they can also mess it up quite easily as well). They gave smartphones a fresh perspective but they didn't invent smartphones. What is exactly that we couldn't do before iPhones came along? Why should I be so impressed? Alright, they gave it a slick design, a well designed operating system and they used their power as Apple to make it mainstream and get app developers to work like crazy. If anything I am more impressed by their marketing power rather than their "revolutionary" ideas. You don't take something that already exists, make it a tad better, patent the hell out of it and sue everyone, if you want to do that you need to create a technology from scratch and not implement other people's ideas and take credit for them.

As for Apple being afraid that they would implement 3G poorly, they should wait and release the first iPhone when they were ready then. You just don't make an "internet mobile device" (Steve Job's words) on GPRS and EDGE when 3G has been around for years. I know that Mac Fanboys will always defend whatever Apple does but come on, you gotta admit that this one was stupid.

On the camera now, I am one of those that won't be arsed to carry a bunch of gadgets with them and since nowadays you can have everything in one device including a very decent camera and an HD video recorder... I couldn't ask for anything more and that's the once thing I'm missing as 3Gs' camera is a joke.
 

balamw

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
19,366
979
New England
I never argued against Apple's capability to make hit products (history says that they can also mess it up quite easily as well).

Yeah, but their record since 1997 is really quite good.

Certainly doesn't mean they are infallible. The third generation iPod Shuffle is clearly one case where they oversimplified too far too soon.

They gave smartphones a fresh perspective but they didn't invent smartphones.

No question. Getting there first is one thing, however getting it right is another.

A big part of that is figuring out what features are essential and which ones are not and should be omitted. I skipped the first iPhone myself and have so far resisted the urge to get a 4S or iPad 2 or 3. So it's not like I am a fanboy that has to have the latest and greatest, just because.

Back in 2007, the closest thing to the iPhone at the time was the LG Prada. Take a look at its specs. Notice anything? No 3G. No WiFi. The 2007 iPhone at least included WiFi and also included the US 850 MHz bands. These things aren't free. Do you think those might have been reasonable and well thought out engineering/design trade offs? Do you think that maybe Apple's conscious decision to omit the microSD slot and removable battery & cover might actually have resulted in a better feature set (longer battery life, faster speeds while at home or free WiFi) over something like the LG?

What is exactly that we couldn't do before iPhones came along? Why should I be so impressed? Alright, they gave it a slick design, a well designed operating system and they used their power as Apple to make it mainstream and get app developers to work like crazy.

And that's exactly why specs and feature lists don't really matter. It's the integrated hardware/software/OS/user experience that differentiates the Apple product from the rest. The iPod would not have been a success without iTunes or its "slick design and well designed operating system". You yourself bought a 3GS, because it fit your workflow better than the cheaper alternatives.

If I design a feature others think is essential out of an invention or come up with a different combination of features I am certainly entitled to a patent and am entitled to use that to keep others from implementing my invention. The iPod's click wheel is one such invention. Was it essential to MP3 players? Clearly no, but it was essential to Apple's vision of a clean intuitive UI which made the MP3 player ubiquitous.

Again, Apple's vision isn't always 20/20. The original iPhone was designed around web rather than native apps. The native app vision won out and took things up to another level.

B
 

Abazigal

Contributor
Jul 18, 2011
19,586
22,043
Singapore
So am I the only one who felt like sleeping through 80% of the keynote? It sure is different without Steve's trademark charisma to carry it through...:p
 
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