Mac Pro Now Unavailable for Purchase from European Apple Online Stores

[MacsRgr8]

Face it:

TOTAL = 100%
i.e. Apple hardware Users: 100%

Of whom are:
a) Apple iOS-only users: 60%
.. are left 40% Apple CPU Users

Of whom are
b) Apple Mobile-CPU users: 25%
.. are left: 15% Apple Desktop CPU Users

Of whom are
c) Apple Home- Desktop CPU Users: 22%
.. are left: 3% Apple Pro-Desktop Users

Of whom are
d) Pro-sumers 2%
.. are left 1% Power Users

Of whom are
e) Enthousiasts and hobbyists: 0.9%
.. are left: 0.1% Pro-power Users

Of whom simply WANT > 12 Cores & > 64 GB RAM for bragging rights: 0.09%
.. are left 0.01% REAL NEEDY PRO POWER USERS

All of these people are active here @ MacRumors....



I'd say: RIP Mac Pro.

 

[neversink]

My wife and I truly need Mac Pros for our work.....
Tons of scientific number crunching for my wife who does tropical disease epidemiology...
Tons of graphic editing for my freelance photo and video business...
For us, iMacs don't really cut it....

 

[GermanyChris]

My wife and I truly need Mac Pros for our work.....
Tons of scientific number crunching for my wife who does tropical disease epidemiology...
Tons of graphic editing for my freelance photo and video business...
For us, iMacs don't really cut it....

Don't worry about it, most just don't understand..

 

[i make movies]

When is Intel next release of new server chips due?

I *really* hope the MacPro doesn't die. What pisses me off is this: a new Mac Pro doesn't need to change in form factor...heck, it doesn't even need that many new internals. It really just needs an updated motherboard that replaces all the PCIe slots from v2 to v3, USB 2 to USB 3, and FW800 to Thunderbolt.

That update only would be fantastic. If I were to go further, I would want the ability to add any current video I want. And boost the power supply to support 2 GPUs.

I get that the Mac Pro is Apple's worst seller...in Mac Pro's defense, it hasn't been updated in 3 years and the chips are almost 4 years old. But, it's not like it would cost Apple hundreds of millions in R&D and design changes to make this happen, or Apple's margins would wouldn't make up for whatever it costs to develop a new MacPro. Apple isn't hurting.

 

[Badagri]

I cringed yesterday when I saw Photoshop on smartphones.

 

[flat five]

I *really* hope the MacPro doesn't die.

it will eventually i imagine.. not yet though.. at least another iteration worth (8years?) before it's no longer necessary..

as of now though, there would definitely be a void if it were dropped.. apple knows this and i highly doubt they would just drop it anyway.. even if apple actually lost money by keeping them around, they would (should) still do so.

i mean, there are even people working at apple itself who need mac pros.. and i can't imagine tc walking in to that department tomorrow saying "oh, hey.. it's imacs from here on out "

 

[Essenar]

At this point, there's not a whole lot you have to do on a desktop that can't be done with some kind of thunderbolt adapters and dongles and ding dongs and accessory hubs.

Sorry folks... The desktop is dying and you can bet Apple will be the first to nail the coffin. I don't even see the iMac lasting long when the MacBook can easily match it in power paired with a 24" monitor.

 

[GermanyChris]

At this point, there's not a whole lot you have to do on a desktop that can't be done with some kind of thunderbolt adapters and dongles and ding dongs and accessory hubs.

Sorry folks... The desktop is dying and you can bet Apple will be the first to nail the coffin. I don't even see the iMac lasting long when the MacBook can easily match it in power paired with a 24" monitor.

It's only a desktop in form..

 

[milo]

...FW800 to Thunderbolt.

Hopefully adding TB along with FW, there are still plenty of users with FW peripherals.

 

[flat five]

At this point, there's not a whole lot you have to do on a desktop that can't be done with some kind of thunderbolt adapters and dongles and ding dongs and accessory hubs.

Sorry folks... The desktop is dying and you can bet Apple will be the first to nail the coffin. I don't even see the iMac lasting long when the MacBook can easily match it in power paired with a 24" monitor.

[hmm.. so my one-liner 'lol' comment has been moderated out (and rightfully so ]

so another way to say it:

you do realize 1 off the shelf macPro generally = 2+ Mbps in terms of sheer computing power alone, right?

and i doubt you're suggesting people should just donglebolt 2 mbps together then link them to a monitor as their desktop solution.. plus a few extra peripheral drives for storage etc... or are you?


[EDIT] ha.. actually.. my last scenario is sort of a setup i use now except it can be an old macPro linked to a macbookpro linked to yet another old macPro.. and yes, it works to an extent and gives me the necessary power for certain situations but believe me when i say it's way less than optimal.. and certainly not very 'professional'..

and that's in a home office type situation.. you certainly can't be doing that in a 'real' office setting..

 

[i make movies]

you do realize 1 off the shelf macPro generally = 2+ Mbps in terms of sheer computing power alone, right?

That's only partially true. Yes, the CPUs are not far off, but the HUGE benefit of a tower, new and current, is the PCIe slots and throughput. GPUs nowadays are mini-computers and the new one out now are MUCH more powerful than any mobile device, ever.

And regarding Thunderbolt, GPUs aren't supportted yet...peope have gotten them to work, but it's not that fast in it's current form. 10 Gb/s = PCIe v2 at 4 lanes. Old GPUs need PCIe v2 x16 (4 times faster) and the new GPUs out now are PCIe v3 x16, or 8 times faster. And most Pros (editors, colorists, 3D artists) could benefit from 2 or more GPUs.

When thunderbolt updates to 100 Gb/s, then we might have something.

The tower still serves an important purpose that no laptop or iMac can replace. The iMac comes the closest, but everything about it is still too far away to be a real MacPro replacement.

 

[i make movies]

Hopefully adding TB along with FW, there are still plenty of users with FW peripherals.

There are plenty of thunderbolt to FW800 adapters and they're not expensive and ,in my experience, will work better and faster than a true FW800 port. I think it would be difficult to implement such old tech into new tech.

 

[Essenar]

[hmm.. so my one-liner 'lol' comment has been moderated out (and rightfully so ]

so another way to say it:

you do realize 1 off the shelf macPro generally = 2+ Mbps in terms of sheer computing power alone, right?

and i doubt you're suggesting people should just donglebolt 2 mbps together then link them to a monitor as their desktop solution.. plus a few extra peripheral drives for storage etc... or are you?


[EDIT] ha.. actually.. my last scenario is sort of a setup i use now except it can be an old macPro linked to a macbookpro linked to yet another old macPro.. and yes, it works to an extent and gives me the necessary power for certain situations but believe me when i say it's way less than optimal.. and certainly not very 'professional'..

and that's in a home office type situation.. you certainly can't be doing that in a 'real' office setting..

Justify the investment to me.

I'm an Apple shareholder and you have to convince me to build it.

The arguments against you:
Not enough people buy it to generate a profit.
It costs hundreds of thousands, up to maybe low seven digits of investment into development, production and testing.
It costs another hundreds of thousands, again up to maybe low seven digits of investment, to cover the faults, failures and problems that occur.

You know what, I've already decided. Please leave my office and design another iDevice.

 

[flat five]

Justify the investment to me.

i can't.. i tried two times now and had to delete them..
i'm no good at your game. you win

 

[damir00]

Apple already has dropped the MacPro. The internals are already a full generation behind, which in the top end market may as well be forever. There is also no rack mount version, which disappeared years ago.

The number of Apple users willing to buy systems where each CPU alone costs $2500-$3500 is vanishingly small. I've given up waiting and moved to Linux on non-Apple hardware for the stuff that needs to go really fast, very reliably.

It just ain't happening, folks....

 

[i make movies]

Justify the investment to me.

I'm an Apple shareholder and you have to convince me to build it.

You know who uses Mac Pro towers?

iOS (and Andriod) app coders...apps for iphone and ipad, which is 56% and 20% of your revenue, respectively. If you take away the tower, you take away apps, which *is* the main reason you use an iPhone and iPad.

3D designers....the same designer who draw mockups and prototypes of the iPad and iPhone and iWhatever.

Movie, TV, and commercial editors.
Movie, TV, and commercial finishers
Movie, TV, and commercial compositors
Movie, TV, and commercial VFX artist
Movie, TV, and commercial animators (3D and 2D).


Let's put it this way. All Apple computer sales (tower, iMac, mini, and all laptops) are only 10% of Apple's revenue. If you're a shareholder, you could *easily* just drop all cpu sales and only be iPhone and iPad and apps and iTunes and still make hundreds of billions of revenue each quarter. So, where's your loyalty now?

 

[damir00]

If you take away the tower, you take away apps, which *is* the main reason you use an iPhone and iPad.

99.999% of iOS apps are coded on iMacs, Minis and laptops, not on MacPros.

 

[flat five]

It just ain't happening, folks....

what's not happening? i don't even get what you all are saying..

the current macPro is the last one?
there is no need for a macPro?
there will be more macPros but they will never have the newest components in them compared to other manufacturers?

if it's one or two.. those are your opinions and irrelevant to me personally..
if it's three.. again. so what..

 

[Okiyah]

No new Mac pro would make a dent in the developpement and sales of Final Cut X. I cannot see post-production companies equipping themselves with iMac to support an HD (and more 4k to come) workflow of movies and TV shows.

 

[milo]

Not enough people buy it to generate a profit.

You don't know that.

It costs hundreds of thousands, up to maybe low seven digits of investment into development, production and testing.

You don't know that.

It costs another hundreds of thousands, again up to maybe low seven digits of investment, to cover the faults, failures and problems that occur.

You don't know that.

What we do know is that compared to other mac models and mobile devices, the market for MP is comparatively small. And we know that compared to those others, the development costs for MP are relatively low. But no, we just don't know how those two sides of the equation compare.

My personal opinion is that the costs and resources required for an MP upgrade are low enough that it wouldn't be hard to get enough sales to cover them (particularly if they continue to use the same case and just replace the minimum necessary to get the specs up to date). And that there's value to having a complete product line beyond sheer profits. Heck, even if the MP is just break even, as a shareholder I'd support Apple continuing to offer it just for the sake of continued sales of apps like FCX and Logic.

 

[i make movies]

No new Mac pro would make a dent in the developpement and sales of Final Cut X. I cannot see post-production companies equipping themselves with iMac to support an HD (and more 4k to come) workflow of movies and TV shows.

Tangent below.

They wouldn't use iMacs for theatrical or TV (well, the AE might, but that's just logging), but you should know that practically every Post house and editorial here in LA use Avid...for the projects I've worked on, out of 80 total jobs in 2 years, about 2 or 3 used FCP7 (not even FCPx). Everything else was Avid.

----------

99.999% of iOS apps are coded on iMacs, Minis and laptops, not on MacPros.

Prove it.

 

[FluJunkie]

At this point, there's not a whole lot you have to do on a desktop that can't be done with some kind of thunderbolt adapters and dongles and ding dongs and accessory hubs.

RAM.

RAM RAM RAM.

Some of us use memory. I love my rMBP, but 16 GB just doesn't cut it.

 

[Okiyah]

Tangent below.

They wouldn't use iMacs for theatrical or TV (well, the AE might, but that's just logging), but you should know that practically every Post house and editorial here in LA use Avid...for the projects I've worked on, out of 80 total jobs in 2 years, about 2 or 3 used FCP7 (not even FCPx). Everything else was Avid.

I guess I cannot do anything more than speculation on how it is really, statistically, right now. But I've seen a lot of schools running on FCPX/iMacs. If it is an indication of the near future, it probably means 1 or 2 things :

- Apple will provide hardware for advanced use of their software.
or
- They want to capitalize the "niche" of small budget/independant/web based/corporate video making (wich is looking like it, at first glance).

 

[i make movies]

I guess I cannot do anything more than speculation on how it is really, statistically, right now. But I've seen a lot of schools running on FCPX/iMacs. If it is an indication of the near future, it probably means 1 or 2 things :

- Apple will provide hardware for advanced use of their software.
or
- They want to capitalize the "niche" of small budget/independant/web based/corporate video making (wich is looking like it, at first glance).

That was true at my film school as well (my school had FCP 4 and FCP 5 was just released).

As you said, they want to (and will) capitalize on the 'niche' market of small budget/indie/web projects. If you're a one-man band (own a DSLR or other prosumer camera, you shoot and edit, etc.) FCPx is great (and Resolve Lite for finishing, which is FREE!). The education sector also loves FCP for its low cost.

But, if you want to *be* an editor, start learning Avid. It's the professional standard, and that's NOT a dig at FCPx. Avid just plays much better with lots of machines connected to multiple SANs going through different finishing workflows and juggling multiple projects. FCPx can't do that.

BUt I fear we're veering too far from the original post.

 

[champ01]

Face it:

TOTAL = 100%
i.e. Apple hardware Users: 100%

Of whom are:
a) Apple iOS-only users: 60%
.. are left 40% Apple CPU Users

Of whom are
b) Apple Mobile-CPU users: 25%
.. are left: 15% Apple Desktop CPU Users

Of whom are
c) Apple Home- Desktop CPU Users: 22%
.. are left: 3% Apple Pro-Desktop Users

Of whom are
d) Pro-sumers 2%
.. are left 1% Power Users

Of whom are
e) Enthousiasts and hobbyists: 0.9%
.. are left: 0.1% Pro-power Users

Of whom simply WANT > 12 Cores & > 64 GB RAM for bragging rights: 0.09%
.. are left 0.01% REAL NEEDY PRO POWER USERS

All of these people are active here @ MacRumors....



I'd say: RIP Mac Pro.

Let me add that people who bought Mac Pro's were the ones that supported Apple in hard times back in the days before the ipod/iphones/ipads etc.
They were the most loyal costumers Apple could ask for.

More of those people are walking away from Apple because they feel Apple doesn't give a ..... anymore.

FCP was a disaster because at launch the program didn't have any of the features pro's need to create film. (there is no excuse for this)
Aperture is dropped in price and doesn't get any real updates other then social crap that the pro's don't care about.
Logic hasn't been updates for years and the pro's are sick of the secrecy.

As this continues the pro's will use what they have but won't buy anymore new Apple hardware and go a different route. Apple will loose his biggest loyal community base that were buying Apple's hardware for decades.