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MacOS Sierra: Please Tell me Why You Are Not Upgrading
- Thread starter bpran
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my mac pro 1,1 can't run it as of yet no hack and a good chance we won't get one. but n my other systems seirra is already installed probably will keep el cap on my 09 mbp instead of unofficiallyy installing it for a while but my spare mac mini should cope just fine with being my only sierra test mac
well i can say in 3 or 4 months they usually have a couple 10.x.x releases out i typically wait to moving all my machines over when they get to the .2 or .3 release depending on how it is on my test mac. witch is a 2014 core i 5 8gb ram mac mini
For El Cap, I waited until 10.11.3 to update. For macOS Sierra, I'll probably pul the trigger after 10.12.1. I'm just conservative and cautious and will wait to see if there are any major problems before diving in. I will probably not wait as long this time because it is a PITA to have to sign in every time I come back to my laptop after it goes into sleep mode. I like the automatic sign on tied to the Apple Watch feature.
I have only lost one app since using macOS Sierra final, a.k.a. 16A323.
I -- and a number of other people -- did have one major issue with our iSight camera failing to function, and not even appearing under the Hardware/Camera section in the System Report.
It turned out that some of the kexts that Oracle installs with VirtualBox were the source of the problem.
Personally, I deleted VirtualBox entirely, being as I don't need it at this current time, and my iSight camera was restored.
While I sometimes like to live on the edge and jump in the fire -- as I did this time with Sierra -- it is a wise decision to wait until one or more public point versions have been released by Apple. It gives Apple a chance to work out some of the early bugs following a mass release of a major update, and it can save the end user a lot of time, frustration and head-scratching as well.
I -- and a number of other people -- did have one major issue with our iSight camera failing to function, and not even appearing under the Hardware/Camera section in the System Report.
It turned out that some of the kexts that Oracle installs with VirtualBox were the source of the problem.
Personally, I deleted VirtualBox entirely, being as I don't need it at this current time, and my iSight camera was restored.
While I sometimes like to live on the edge and jump in the fire -- as I did this time with Sierra -- it is a wise decision to wait until one or more public point versions have been released by Apple. It gives Apple a chance to work out some of the early bugs following a mass release of a major update, and it can save the end user a lot of time, frustration and head-scratching as well.
1. Sierra is is absolutely useless for anyone that doesn't use iOS, as Apple ignored Android users like me (I understand why, makes sense);
2. If you don't use Apple's first party apps and services, and use apps like MSOffice, Endnote, Chrome, Spotify Sierra brings nothing, again.
3. El Cap will get the same security updates for many moons.
0 useful features for users like me. And let's be honest, it isn't any faster or stabler than El Cap .6 . Why update?
2. If you don't use Apple's first party apps and services, and use apps like MSOffice, Endnote, Chrome, Spotify Sierra brings nothing, again.
3. El Cap will get the same security updates for many moons.
0 useful features for users like me. And let's be honest, it isn't any faster or stabler than El Cap .6 . Why update?
While I can understand your frustration -- and you are obviously entitled to your opinion -- isn't that statement a bit extreme?
I don't use, and have never used, an iPod, iPad, iPhone or any other Apple product that begins with "i".
I have stated a number of times before that I am not one who is easily sold on the "Apple Coolness" factor alone, or on Apple eye candy.
I am interested more in functionality, stability and security. Even if I am not interested in any of an OS upgrade's new features, I will still upgrade if it in some way improves any of those three areas. After all, it is free, so why not?
I am curious though. On what basis do you make the following statement? Have you performed any kind of benchmark tests?:
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I too will do the "wait-and-see" approach before considering any OS upgrade. Last month my Mac Mini(Late 2012) (which I bought in August, 2013) and was still on OS "Mountain Lion" but running really slow, so, I finally pulled the trigger in upgrading to "El Cap" which seems to have corrected the problem.
I have another Mac Mini(Late 2014) which is still on OS "Yosemite" in which I may upgrade to OS "Sierra" around the six(6) month mark or beyond and only if I see a serious reason for doing so.
I have another Mac Mini(Late 2014) which is still on OS "Yosemite" in which I may upgrade to OS "Sierra" around the six(6) month mark or beyond and only if I see a serious reason for doing so.
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For me, there's nothing compelling about Sierra.
For the first time in 15 years of using OS X (since Cheetah), I don't have any reason to update to the newest OS. I hate Siri with a passion, and everything else Apple chose to implement for Sierra is not compelling enough for me to go through the hassle.
Apple Watch unlocking? No thanks... my Machine has sensitive data on it, I don't want just anyone being able to unlock the Mac, because they found my Apple Watch lying on the counter. WTF Apple?
Universal clipboard? My iPad and iPhone are both media consumption devices where I use the clipboard to copy/paste URLs to funny videos etc. Do I want the URLs to overwrite what I may have on my Mac's clipboard (usually code snippets)? No.
Yes, I know I can disable all this fluff, but Apple OS has gone from install and start using, to install, and spend 1 hour disabling stuff and customizing. Therein, is the hassle. Ugh. No wonder some of us old-timers are just sad with New Apple. We are not their target audience anymore. We still love Apple, but I wonder if it is because of comfort and that we are so used to it, that spending hours learning a new OS is more trouble than it is worth.
That said, I might revisit in January when APFS is released, that would be worth the hassle.
For the first time in 15 years of using OS X (since Cheetah), I don't have any reason to update to the newest OS. I hate Siri with a passion, and everything else Apple chose to implement for Sierra is not compelling enough for me to go through the hassle.
Apple Watch unlocking? No thanks... my Machine has sensitive data on it, I don't want just anyone being able to unlock the Mac, because they found my Apple Watch lying on the counter. WTF Apple?
Universal clipboard? My iPad and iPhone are both media consumption devices where I use the clipboard to copy/paste URLs to funny videos etc. Do I want the URLs to overwrite what I may have on my Mac's clipboard (usually code snippets)? No.
Yes, I know I can disable all this fluff, but Apple OS has gone from install and start using, to install, and spend 1 hour disabling stuff and customizing. Therein, is the hassle. Ugh. No wonder some of us old-timers are just sad with New Apple. We are not their target audience anymore. We still love Apple, but I wonder if it is because of comfort and that we are so used to it, that spending hours learning a new OS is more trouble than it is worth.
That said, I might revisit in January when APFS is released, that would be worth the hassle.
Because not a single headliner features appeals to me:
I'm not trying to be negative, but I was really disappointed. I look so forward to macOS updates. No mention of system performance, Safari 10 received no mention of improved rendering speed, etc. There are a few small things like folders on top in list view that I'd like, but not worth an entire OS update.
TL
R Sadly, this update doesn't bring anything of value to me in its advertised features and only a few "All the Little Things" benefits. It really seams like a superficial update tacked onto El Capitan.
- Universal clipboard - I don't use handoff
- Siri on Mac? Not for me personally
- Optimized storage? Let Apple offload my data for me? Nope.
- iCloud Documents and Desktop? I'm not sending 70GB of stuff to iCloud that includes personal info.
- Unlock with Apple Watch? No, that just bothers me from a security standpoint, I'll use my 30 character password.
- I don't use Photos.
- I don't save my credit card info into Safari for Apple pay.
- I don't like tabs outside of Safari when I have multiple displays to spread out windows.
I'm not trying to be negative, but I was really disappointed. I look so forward to macOS updates. No mention of system performance, Safari 10 received no mention of improved rendering speed, etc. There are a few small things like folders on top in list view that I'd like, but not worth an entire OS update.
TL
R Sadly, this update doesn't bring anything of value to me in its advertised features and only a few "All the Little Things" benefits. It really seams like a superficial update tacked onto El Capitan.Seriously? You really think that is how it works?
A.
(I mean really, I do not even own an Apple Watch and I know better. How could anyone who has been using Apple products for over a decade think that Apple would be so dumb?)
Sadly, that's how I feel too.
Your watch has to be worn and passcode protected. If they know your watch code then they can get in. It is just another point of security weakness to me. Touch ID would have been neat, but I won't even us that on a Mac.
This feature could be useful, but 9/10 times I don't want the contents of my clipboard overwritten. When I do need to copy and paste something between iOS and OS X, I just use Notes.
I don't use Safari -- I've been a longtime Firefox guy -- but is that a well-known issue with Safari in Sierra?
In other words, are you sure that the problem is Sierra?
Is it possible that you are simultaneously doing other CPU-intensive things on your machine which may be causing the choppiness?
Also, do you have anything on your machine to gauge your memory usage? For example, I use iStat Menus.
My point is, make sure that the problem is really Sierra, before you decide to downgrade.
No, I know that's not how it works. But I don't usually put a passcode on the watch.
Apple and dumb. Apple has done some EXTREMELY dumb things over the last 15 years. Credit where credit is due. Disk Utility, Aperture, Final Cut Pro, Maps, just a few from the last five years.
[doublepost=1474724083][/doublepost]again, I still count myself as an Apple Fanboi, as someone who believed in Apple at a time when using Apple products would subject ya to hours of relentless teasing from peers.
I still use their products and want people to keep buying them (drive the stock price up), but again, this here was my personal rant against a company I've loved and loathed over the last decade and a half. Apple disappoints and then Apple redeems. I just hope the trend of Apple disappointing is just that - a momentary trend.
The issue isn't wide spread, but there are other users who reported it. There is almost no background processes when it appears, it is consistent, no spotlight indexing, photos inndexing either. I have no extensio s installed, so i can rule that out too.
The issue is present with the 10.12.1 beta too. I'm staying with sierra to finish up the bug report and follow up, but downgrading after it. I get angry every time the scrolling stutters, even on text only sites, on a 1200€ worth of iMac.
And it is not because the page is still loading in Safari when you try to scroll? That would definitely cause something like that to occur?
Are you a hardcore Safari user, or would you consider switching to Firefox for the purposes of comparison?
The page is not loading, as i said the issue appears on short, text only pages, too, and appears when scrolling up, too. It appers when the page scrolling animation slows down, so i don't think it is a loading issue. And it appears with sierra only, same site scrolls buttery smooth in el cap.
I don't know if you are interested in it, but for many years now I have used an app called Paste Master. It still works well on Sierra. One of its nice features is that you can create what are called "clipboard sets". Basically, you can create a huge pile of clipboards under the main Paste Master icon in the menubar. Each clipboard set is its own clipboard in itself, and you can paste up to I think 99 items in each clipboard. You can likewise lock the contents of each individual entry, edit each individual entry in case it needs to be updated, change the format of the data, reorder the contents of each clipboard set, etc. Paste Master does not have a very modern, shiny GUI, but it does work very well.
That's a harsh statement. I am an Android user myself and I don't feel the same way you do. Apple has always cared more about iOS integration, and well, it is the right since it is their most valuable product, and Mac OS Sierra just worked on that. I hope they can add support to Android File Transfer natively rather than having to download 3rd party applications, however that doesn't exist on any previous Mac OS X either so it's not an issue. Sierra has been as stable and snappy, if not even more, than El Capitan for me and I am very satisfied with it so far.
Our first Mac was a Mac XL (AKA Lisa). Over the decades the list of new features with each OS update has become less and less compelling. For example the macOS Sierra features….
x Siri integration — Siri is usually more trouble than help
x Auto unlocking w/ Apple Watch — Don’t own an Apple Watch
x Apple Pay for web — Don’t use ApplePay on the iPhone
x Revamped Apple Music app — Rarely listen to music on our Macs
x New storage optimization — Don’t have enough ISP bandwidth to use iCloud drive
? New file system w/ native encryption — Not implemented yet
x "Memories" tab in Photos — Hopefully this can be turned off (unlike Faces)
• Cross-device copy and paste — May be useful if it supports my early 2011 MBP
So for us there is more risk of 3rd party app incompatibilities than reward for upgrading.
FWIW I downloaded macOs Sierra on day one and did a clean install on an external hard drive. I’ve had a look around. I’ll be keeping it up to date over the next few .xx releases and monitoring the forums for info on any glitches. I may, or may not, ever install it on the Macs we use every day. Maybe the next version of macOS will have something we can really use.
—GetRealBro
x Siri integration — Siri is usually more trouble than help
x Auto unlocking w/ Apple Watch — Don’t own an Apple Watch
x Apple Pay for web — Don’t use ApplePay on the iPhone
x Revamped Apple Music app — Rarely listen to music on our Macs
x New storage optimization — Don’t have enough ISP bandwidth to use iCloud drive
? New file system w/ native encryption — Not implemented yet
x "Memories" tab in Photos — Hopefully this can be turned off (unlike Faces)
• Cross-device copy and paste — May be useful if it supports my early 2011 MBP
So for us there is more risk of 3rd party app incompatibilities than reward for upgrading.
FWIW I downloaded macOs Sierra on day one and did a clean install on an external hard drive. I’ve had a look around. I’ll be keeping it up to date over the next few .xx releases and monitoring the forums for info on any glitches. I may, or may not, ever install it on the Macs we use every day. Maybe the next version of macOS will have something we can really use.
—GetRealBro
As somebody who jumped into the 10.12.0 release with no prior beta testing and kind of regretted it, here are a few key reasons to wait:
There's no harm in running El Capitan. You guys still running it have a very very long time before you'll begin seeing developers pull support for this. There's no reason to jump ship yet unless you really badly want Siri on the Mac or universal clipboard, which aren't that big of a deal.
- Remember that despite Apple's earnest attempts to find bugs during beta testing, the number of people who installed pre-release software is a very small fraction compared to those installing the final build. Now we have many more guinea pigs to report uncaught bugs.
- From a 3rd party app standpoint, there's no compelling reason to switch over just yet.
- A lot of developers are acting blind-sided by the release of Sierra and are warning people at the last second not to upgrade due to compatibility issues. Apparently they did not take advantage of the development program for w/e reason. Compare this to the iOS 10 release where it felt like every dev had an update ready to go on day 1.
- I don't believe there's a single app out there right now that leverages Sierra-specific APIs that actually requires this new OS to function.
- Despite people saying that this is one of the most stable initial releases of MacOS, of the few issues that do exist, some of these are actually pretty crippling. There are reported issues with USB devices due to some major changes made to Apple's USB drivers.
- Apple also tightened up their requirements on Bluetooth so devices need to communicate more strictly to the intended design spec, breaking compatibility with some devices that may have not used such a great implementation. This is particularly a pain in the butt because Apple obviously won't undo this change (and technically shouldn't), so its up to the manufacturers to somehow roll out firmware updates if possible and remedy this. Inevitably, some devices will simply never be compatible moving forward and will essentially be useless and will need to be replaced with a different model.
There's no harm in running El Capitan. You guys still running it have a very very long time before you'll begin seeing developers pull support for this. There's no reason to jump ship yet unless you really badly want Siri on the Mac or universal clipboard, which aren't that big of a deal.
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