Microsoft Details Surface Pro Pricing Amidst Reports of Poor Sales of RT Version

[mjtomlin]

Not sure how its a fail.

It's not even for sale yet. Lets see how people respond to it before we start up with the usual partisan bashing.

Hmm... How people will respond to it? This has been on the market for more than 10 years now! How is this ANY different from previous Windows tablets? It's fairly expensive, has crappy battery life, is damn near a brick at almost 2 pounds, uses a freaken PEN, requires separate purchase of a keyboard, still running a desktop operating system (oh that's right, it has a new "app" layer that confusingly flip-flops users between it and the standard desktop UI).

This really has nothing to do with partisanship, but everything to do with Microsoft's inability to understand form factors and use cases. Microsoft's desire to push Windows everywhere to make sure they hold onto their monopoly will ironically be the reason why they eventually lose that monopoly.

Most consumers are going to want computers and devices that are easy to use. They don't want the same bullcrap with an added extra layer. The iPad isn't popular only because of its form factor, but also because it is dead simple to use and still allows them to accomplish most tasks they used a "regular" computer for.


Forgot to mention: I actually don't see a problem with the pricing for the specs. It's spec'ed and priced to match the MacBook Air.


Also wanted to add: If people really wanted/needed to run full Windows on a tablet all this time...
Archos Tablet 9

 

[IGregory]

I think the Touch Pad should be included at those price points, or price points should be -$100. The Type Pad could still be extra, but when I saw the price the only hesitation I had was missing a Touch/Type Pad.

I would love, love, love to buy one of these. A full blown laptop in tablet form? Perfect idea. I tend to avoid Rev.A products though. Bet Rev.B comes out by mid-2013 with 20-50% battery life. Or is Haswell going to be delayed since Ivy was? Would be a great chip in something like that.

Why the Touch Pad when you have a Touch Screen?

 

[NAG]

Why the Touch Pad when you have a Touch Screen?

Tried Excel on the Surface touch screen?

 

[gkarris]

Why the Touch Pad when you have a Touch Screen?

Hand never leaves the keyboard plus copying/pasting on a touchscreen is a pain...

 

[Renzatic]

Because Surface Pro shares little in common with Macbook Air other than the internal components. People love Macbook Air not mainly for its innards but for its trackpad, (for a ultrathin) long battery life, excellent trackpad and keyboard, rigid aluminum build quality, OSX, etc. Basically Surface Pro is Macbook Air without all of its the strengths but instead a touch screen and a stylus built-in on a better screen.

That's true if you ignore the strengths of the Pro.

About the same battery life.

No need for a trackpad, since you can use a stylus and/or touch the screen directly (downside: finger smoo)

Higher resolution IPS screen.

Excellent build quality. If there's one thing MS went all on with, it's making sure the Pro is a solidly built little machine.

Keyboard? Hell, use whatever you want. It's bluetooth enabled. Take your favorite one with you, use the click key cover keyboard thing, or the onscreen keyboard.

Hell, use a mouse with the thing if you feel like it. Multiple methods of input aren't necessarily a bad thing.

I'm not sure about the exact specs, but it might be a little lighter and thinner.

Admittedly, it's not a traditional laptop. I don't even know if it'll be that comfortable to use. But even at first glance, it is a much, much better machine that what most of you all are giving it credit for.

I do find it fascinating that nearly every single Macrumors poster who openly espouse a neutral position and objectivity do little else but to criticize Apple and take the side against Apple almost all the time. Somehow it's hard to believe the MO isn't to be a contrarian for the sake of being a contrarian.

Eh. I've got an iPad. Pretty sure I'm going to be getting either an rMBP or the new high end 27" iMac sometime in the near future. I generally like most everything Apple makes, though I don't always like the direction Apple takes as a company.

Thing is, I'm not a mouth breathing bandwagoner out to bash every new thing that comes out that doesn't have an Apple logo on the back. Moreso than Apple specifically, I like cool tech stuff. I dunno how good the Surface Pro is going to be exactly, haven't had a chance to put my hands on one yet, but I appreciate it for it's potential, and am willing to speak up for it due to that.

I think the biggest problem with most of the people in this thread is you all lack a good bit of imagination, and focus way too much on the negative.

 

[faroZ06]

The Surface has a 1366 x 768 screen. How is it a better screen than the iPad's 2048 x 1536? It's not even better than the MacBook Air 1440 x 900

I was talking about the 11" MacBook Air, which has a screen with less pixels than the Surface Pro even though it is slightly bigger.

 

[funkyfresh]

my two cents

i spent about a 1/2 hour at the ms kiosk at my local mall trying out the surface and my initial impression is that its a confused device. ms pushes the keyboard cover on you so that makes the surface feel like a traditional pc. yet, i'm supposed to touch the screen for initiating apps and such. it's a mixed experience at best.

the most frustrating thing about the surface is office. ms had an opportunity to redesign office with a touch interface and really set the world on fire. instead, you still see the old save dialogs which are not optimized for touch. excel is hobbled. ms missed an opportunity to make the surface a prime choice for the enterprise with a new paradigm for office.

in the end, i wish ms chose one philosophy - design the surface for the keyboard or design it for touch. the ipad has no ambiguity. unfortunately, i wouldn't recommend the surface to anyone until it has a clearer vision.

 

[435713]

I'd be curious to see if Apple released the same style tablet with a $999 starting price, how well it would take of. As in say the rumored OSX and iOS merger with a full blown OS tablet device from them.

Looking at the numbers between the surface and iPad 64GB; The iPad is $700 while the surface is $200 more. Surface would be quite a bit faster, the iPad better on battery. More expandability on the surface with a USB and SD card slot, higher res screen on the iPad. So both have advantages, and I can;t see how ANY Apple user calls any other electronic expensive.

I don't think it will take off since MS doesn't have that "it" factor. Far as the device goes the price seems good and the hardware is nice as well.

Least with MS $100 extra gets you 64 more gigs of storage instead of ....16..... yeah.

I will say win8 needs some work though. Ease of use obviously goes to Apple. Too many chefs in the kitchen for MS on design I think.

 

[mjtomlin]

Install a torrent client on your iPad, I dare you. Or any other Mac program.

That's the point of the iPad and why it's so popular... it doesn't run overly complicated applications. Each app is optimize for a specific task. It's quite simple.

You can't do it, I'll tell you why because everyone is confused :That's a big iPod touch !

Not even sure what you're trying to say... if it's just a big iPod touch, why are there so many iPad only(optimized) apps?

This is a full OS WITH ...( W I T H ) touch

"Touch" capabilities are a hardware feature. I can in fact buy a touch screen and still use OS X without any problems. In fact if OS X detects any touch-based screen or digitizer it even brings up Inkwell, which is their handwriting recognition system.

Look up ModBook; they take a MacBook and turn it into a tablet.

However, if you're referring to gestures... Yeah OS X has supported many touch gestures, for almost ten years now. Starting with two finger scrolling on the PowerBook's trackpad. In fact today, OS X supports almost all the same gestures as the iPad.

 

[NorCal Explorer]

Its just a laptop with a broken hinge for the screen so it has to have a cheap plastic stand to hold it up now. People might as well buy an Air from Apple. This thing will only drive up sales for Apple laptops and for the iPad mini.

 

[linuxcooldude]

While some people don't seem to like like the Surface with WinRT and favor the Pro version, I think the WinRT one is better for most of the average users.

I'm not as optimistic with the Win8 Pro version. I think it will have limitations that won't make it a good choice for the average users except for power, pro users.

 

[Renzatic]

Its just a laptop with a broken hinge for the screen so it has to have a cheap plastic stand to hold it up now. People might as well buy an Air from Apple. This thing will only drive up sales for Apple laptops and for the iPad mini.

The kickstand is made out of magnesium, just like the rest of the machine.

Damn, people, if you're gonna criticize something, at least get your facts straight.

 

[Liquorpuki]

may be a full blown OS, but how many people want to use this over a desktop experience that window users are used to.

Apple users have been through this when the ipad 1 came out.... Now is Microsoft's turn, and I don't think their ready.... People are already struggling over the Metro design, there used to a mouse, since they always used one.

Apple didn't put out a tablet with a desktop OS. So they didn't try. They put out a tablet with a mobile OS, told everyone that tablets are for content consumption only and everyone just took them on their word.

I'm buying a Pro. A lot of people here don't realize its value but it's software related and goes something like this.

After January I'll be using my tablet to run Studio One, a $400 desktop-grade recording DAW. Guys with iPads will be recording on a featureless mobile version of Garageband. I'll be able to use a tablet to program relationship databases using Microsoft Access. People with iPads are stuck with HanDbase or whatever $10 junky database app is hot right now. DJ's with Pro's will be able to run Serato on them and use tablets at gigs for the first time ever. Guys with iPads will be stuck with toy DJ apps that make people think they're DJ's. If I wanna play a game, I can play whatever PC game is hot at the moment at medium settings. People with iPads will be chucking birds into pigs for the 3rd year in a row.

I was in line to buy an iPad 1 on release and it's a great piece hardware, pristine engineering and industrial design. But software-wise Apple has really dropped the ball on mobile. They've essentially created a marketplace/ecosystem full of nothing but disposable budget apps. By allowing users to circumvent a commoditized app store to put stuff on their devices and by allowing desktop software to be installed on a tablet, Microsoft solves this problem and brings new value to the tablet market.

Far as the 4 hour battery life, an ASUS Transformer Book that uses a more power hungry i7, has a bigger screen, and a smaller capacity battery is rated for 5 hours. So either ASUS is lying or that 4 hour claim that's going around is wrong.

 

[0029937]

"Microsoft’s 40 million figure, in contrast, represents copies of Windows that Microsoft sells to all of its customers. That includes some consumers but more often it reflects sales to the hardware makers that install Windows on their machines, some of which have not yet been bought by consumers."

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/11/29/research-firm-says-windows-8-had-a-rocky-start/?gwh=064AD3AABC861C63C2F88AFBC5A9F1EE

Just found that interesting.

 

[fertilized-egg]

That's true if you ignore the strengths of the Pro.
...
Admittedly, it's not a traditional laptop. I don't even know if it'll be that comfortable to use. But even at first glance, it is a much, much better machine that what most of you all are giving it credit for.

The best thing about Macbook Air is how nice it is to use as a laptop coupled with that nice build quality as a laptop (i.e. nice hinge, little flex in the keyboard, etc) The Surface loses all of that. All of Surface Pro's strength basically comes down to its tablet-ness which I seriously question for a variety of reasons. But I've already said much about them in this thread.

Thing is, I'm not a mouth breathing bandwagoner out to bash every new thing that comes out that doesn't have an Apple logo on the back.
...
I think the biggest problem with most of the people in this thread is you all lack a good bit of imagination, and focus way too much on the negative.

It's exactly the opposite. I've used both Windows tablet PC and Asus Transformer. In fact I still own a tablet PC with Windows 8 on it. They all came from the same idea. I even used the good old Compaq TC1100 years ago, which was also a dockable Windows tablet PC. I'm pissed off at Microsoft because they lack "a good bit of imagination". They just cannot move away from their obsession with the traditional Windows. They've been trying this Windows tablet thing for more than a decade for crying out loud. And after all that failure, they try it yet again with Surface?

 

[AppleScruff1]

Apple didn't put out a tablet with a desktop OS. So they didn't try. They put out a tablet with a mobile OS, told everyone that tablets are for content consumption only and everyone just took them on their word.

I'm buying a Pro. A lot of people here don't realize its value but it's software related and goes something like this.

After January I'll be using my tablet to run Studio One, a $400 desktop-grade recording DAW. Guys with iPads will be recording on a featureless mobile version of Garageband. I'll be able to use a tablet to program relationship databases using Microsoft Access. People with iPads are stuck with HanDbase or whatever $10 junky database app is hot right now. DJ's with Pro's will be able to run Serato on them and use tablets at gigs for the first time ever. Guys with iPads will be stuck with toy DJ apps that make people think they're DJ's. If I wanna play a game, I can play whatever PC game is hot at the moment at medium settings. People with iPads will be chucking birds into pigs for the 3rd year in a row.

I was in line to buy an iPad 1 on release and it's a great piece hardware, pristine engineering and industrial design. But software-wise Apple has really dropped the ball on mobile. They've essentially created a marketplace/ecosystem full of nothing but disposable budget apps. By allowing users to circumvent a commoditized app store to put stuff on their devices and by allowing desktop software to be installed on a tablet, Microsoft solves this problem and brings new value to the tablet market.

Far as the 4 hour battery life, an ASUS Transformer Book that uses a more power hungry i7, has a bigger screen, and a smaller capacity battery is rated for 5 hours. So either ASUS is lying or that 4 hour claim that's going around is wrong.

Why bring logic into the discussion?

 

[linuxcooldude]

But software-wise Apple has really dropped the ball on mobile. They've essentially created a marketplace/ecosystem full of nothing but disposable budget apps. By allowing users to circumvent a commoditized app store to put stuff on their devices and by allowing desktop software to be installed on a tablet, Microsoft solves this problem and brings new value to the tablet market.

Dropped the ball on software? Not in the slightest. While Apples iOS does have its limitations so does putting a desktop on a tablet.

Microsoft solves this problem and brings new value to the tablet market.

If thats the case, they had it solved 10 years ago when they already had MS Windows on a tablet.

But the problem with that is it did not have mass market appeal. They were expensive, were not touch optimized for the desktop ( We will see how touch optimized it is when Surface Windows 8 Pro version comes out ) along with other limitations.

But it will have its strengths too. But its kind of rehashing what they already had before, but on more current hardware.

 

[G51989]

Really? That cheap. Sold.

 

[jaimeastin]

i dont think pwople are just confused...

First of all... I have bought two mac minis in the pas two years, have had 3 iPhones, have an ipod, my girlfriend has had all iPhones and a iPad, I just bought her a new ipod nam, and I stood in line to be #3 for the ipad2with 3g and smart cover...

So why did I buy a surface rt on launch and then there after sale my ipad2? Simple, I love technology. I will try all before bashing. I originally planned to keep my iPad, but within 3days it was clear that the iPad was inferior! Everything I wanted in the iPad, I did not get in the iPad... I now have it in the surface. As far as it being the RT version, what legacy app do you really need to take with you? Whatever those apps are, I will just use my ultrabook or so.

I am not saying that the iPad is bad. In fact I will still recommend it to people who want a simple device for entertainment and content consumption. For me, it was not enough... my surface does tones more stock that a stock iPad. You have to add apps to the iPad just to get it in its league.

Alto of people other than kids, usually try to work with there ipads... after trying a ton of random apps, most still are not satisfied with the outcome. Nothing is integrated and all is on a island on its own... they then buy a keyboard of some sort and try to print... all more of a hassle that it really should be. Did the iPad get me through, yes absolutely... I have just upgraded.

The arguments of windows 8are just as bad. It is more than easy to use touch or with a mouse and keyboard. It is the most flexible operating system out there. Nope, not perfect but for someone who is willing to try something new... honestly try... like you did when you learned how to use your favored device... you will have a better outcome... even then you may not like it, but at lease you gave it a full try.

Articles like these just feed the trolls. I am not getting paid by Microsoft, apple, Google or anyone else... so I have no reason to allow any of them to lock me on a pen like a sheep.

 

[NAG]

Why bring logic into the discussion?

Because the logic is flawed. Does anyone else who says that Apple tells you the iPad is for content consumption remember the iWork demo that took up a huge chunk of time during the iPad reveal? Granted, iWork for iOS needs a lot of work (Pages is approaching usable) but it still shows that Apple doesn't intend the iPad to be consumption only.

 

[throAU]

Here's a refreshing idea. Microsoft could've stopped with all the "no compromise" BS and make a really good laptop OS/hardware and a concentrated tablet. Right now they have a product that's neither here nor there.

100% this.

For work, I'm a windows guy, so apple is not part of the decision making process in that space. Well, we'll consider it, but its not really a major part of what we do yet.

The Surface Pro is a bad tablet and a bad laptop. It fails at both.

The selling point, being able to run office apps on it (unfortunately, at a massive cost to battery life) is a problem better solved with a cheaper, lower power, longer battery life tablet (be it android, ipad, ipad mini, whatever - hell, even surface RT), and a cluster back at HQ running VDI services.

The whole solution will likely work out cheaper per head above a certain head count, and the end user can get the exact same desktop on whatever end device they use. All their data is securely stored on the company server back at base.

Attempting to push the heavy lifting cpu work to the tablet clearly has too big an impact on battery life - and end device cost.

 

[G51989]

$1,000 for a keyboardless laptop? 100 dollar keyboard addons? I think I'll pass.

500 dollars for a giant iPhone? I'll pass.

But really, I think the Surface Pro is the one the majority of people were waiting for.

 

[neff2k]

I have been on the fence waiting for the details of the Surface Pro vs. the latest iPad. I am very familiar in the difference between the two products, but I expected a more similar price point. I was fortunate enough to work with the Surface RT for a whole day a couple weeks ago giving me time to disregard all the reviews and concentrate on what I personally felt about the product. I have also been using Windows 8 on my work laptop for the last couple months. After using Windows 8 as a primary machine, picking up a Surface just comes natural. Microsoft definitely spent a lot of time and resources on developing Windows 8 and the more I work with it the more I like it.

Now as for vs. the latest iPad. I am still going to have to go for the iPad. One of my favorite options the iPad offers that few other tablets do is built in cellular data. I know, I know... but you can use you phone as a hot spot. Well that is just a bit inconvenient for the way I would use the device. There are definitely features I am going to miss that you get with the Surface, but for my use the iPad is going to be enough.

 

[G51989]

900 dollars for a tablet? LOL what a joke.

700 bucks for an iPad? What a joke....

 

[jaimeastin]

Apple didn't put out a tablet with a desktop OS. So they didn't try. They put out a tablet with a mobile OS, told everyone that tablets are for content consumption only and everyone just took them on their word.

I'm buying a Pro. A lot of people here don't realize its value but it's software related and goes something like this.

After January I'll be using my tablet to run Studio One, a $400 desktop-grade recording DAW. Guys with iPads will be recording on a featureless mobile version of Garageband. I'll be able to use a tablet to program relationship databases using Microsoft Access. People with iPads are stuck with HanDbase or whatever $10 junky database app is hot right now. DJ's with Pro's will be able to run Serato on them and use tablets at gigs for the first time ever. Guys with iPads will be stuck with toy DJ apps that make people think they're DJ's. If I wanna play a game, I can play whatever PC game is hot at the moment at medium settings. People with iPads will be chucking birds into pigs for the 3rd year in a row.

I was in line to buy an iPad 1 on release and it's a great piece hardware, pristine engineering and industrial design. But software-wise Apple has really dropped the ball on mobile. They've essentially created a marketplace/ecosystem full of nothing but disposable budget apps. By allowing users to circumvent a commoditized app store to put stuff on their devices and by allowing desktop software to be installed on a tablet, Microsoft solves this problem and brings new value to the tablet market.

Far as the 4 hour battery life, an ASUS Transformer Book that uses a more power hungry i7, has a bigger screen, and a smaller capacity battery is rated for 5 hours. So either ASUS is lying or that 4 hour claim that's going around is wrong.

I agree. People who do not see the beauty, flexibility, power, and value don't need one of these in the first place. To put it nicely, they need something simple... as quiet as it is kept, apple will be bringing more desktop features to ios...

When I mean value, I paid more for my iPad than my surface... when you add the accessories, it was even more then. People, my computers/tables cost just as much as apples... it is not like I chose Microsoft because I am limited in resources, lol. Even priced relatively the same, there is just more value in the surface... but of you just want games, to browse the internet, and email, well. The surface is just too much for you... shoot, most people buy too much computer... they need limited devices that lack true flexibility.