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Thirteenva

macrumors 6502a
Jul 18, 2002
679
0
Re: Clarification

Originally posted by jayscheuerle

Beware of Microsoft, but not of their ideas...

- my apologies for my arrogant tone.:)

I agree. Microsoft's ideas are all regurgitated. They wait for someone elses good idea to catch on, then jump on the band wagon with there own proprietary iteration and market it down peoples throats. Unfortunately people just don't get it. When I go on an anti microsoft rant people just can't understand. All they know is windows. "Macs don't run windows????well what do they run then?" <sigh>

People just aren't aware of the alternative.

P.S.
I didn't find you arrogant, and hell, as mac users we're quite elite and are allowed some arrogance ;) :D
 

lmalave

macrumors 68000
Nov 8, 2002
1,614
0
Chinatown NYC
I don't think the release of this software will make much of a difference. MovieMaker just can't compare to iMovie, and anyway most "multimedia" PCs (i.e. those that come with FireWire port for DV editing) already ship with MovieMaker anyway. And isn't Windows Media Player 9 already a free download? Personally, I like having separate DVD Player and iTunes apps - I don't think all multimedia playback functionality has to be rolled up into one monolithic, unwieldy app, as Microsoft and Real Networks are trying to do.

But the significant thing here is not the software itself, but rather the marketing push. What Microsoft is trying to do is give people less reason to switch to the Mac. Already, 95% of consumers are trying to justify to themselves any reason to stay with the PC. That's why Apple has to do things like only offer the iPod for the Mac for a few months - because Apple needs to have major things that the PC doesn't. Rendezvous will probably be the next thing Apple tries to leverage. True, it's an open standard, but OS X supports it now, whereas it probably won't become standard in Windows until their next major release. Thankfully, iMovie is still in the class of things that the Mac has that Windows doesn't. There is comparable software for the PC, but Movie Maker is not it (you'd have to shell out at least $100).

Still, Microsoft's new Multimedia push (including its new Media Center variant of Windows) means Apple has to work that much harder to differentiate itself. That's why I think Apple has to come out with Rendezvous-enabled Digital Hub products immediately, since it's one of the few advantages it still has (besides the best product design team in the biz). Since other companies like Phillips will probably be slower to adopt Rendezvous, Apple has to move aggressively. Set-top boxes, Phone/PDAs, you name it. Apple has to start coming out with razzle-dazzle products to stay ahead of the curve. The iPod proved that there is a market for groundbreaking products, even in the middle of a recession.
 

digitalbiker

macrumors 65816
Apr 24, 2002
1,374
0
The Road
What Digital Hub Anyway?

I never have understood what was so special about this idea anyway. Long before Steve Jobs ever coined the marketing term digital hub, many people were already using their pc's (generic term both Apple & windows) for video editting, audio editting, PDA syncing, file syncing, printing, email sending, photo editing, etc. etc.

So Steve Jobs coins the phrase, provides a few applications that do pretty much what others have done before but made them little easier to use. He bundles them with the OS and tells everyone they are free when actually they are paid for out of OS development costs. What's so revolutionary?

Where is the hub, anyway? I see Apple users constantly writing into the various mailing lists being told; Apple doesn't support Windows CE devices, Apple doesn't support Divx, Sorry that new Sony Clie is not supported, Oh you wanted to use that new Bluetooth phone sorry not quite there yet for that model, Apple's sorry but we only support our own internal DVD burner with iDvd, I bet you would like to use that new scanner you got for Christmas, Sorry.

How can anyone seriously take Apple as being a hub for digital devices. Sure they integrate a handfull of devices well but Apple is al ong long way from making their computers digital hubs for a majority of popular products. What does iSync even currently support; address book, palm desktop, itunes, mail? That's about it isn't it. That doesn't quite live up to the hub I was envisioning when Steve Jobs coined the phrase at MacWorld!
 

PretendPCuser

macrumors regular
Nov 8, 2001
163
0
Northern, NJ
The Japanese are extremely good at taking an idea and then making it better and cheaper. They are leading and are also copying, so if we look at the business world of computing, it's fair to say that Microsoft will copy Apple and Apple will also copy Microsoft. But to say that Microsoft will never find a formula for discovering what people will use and like is just false.

That they are imitating the digital hub is flattering...and scary. Apple is a big corp. M$ is HUGE!

Many people see Apple as a friend and not as a business, and that leads to "we got to the digital hub strategy first" and now "M$ copies Apple!" which leads to "so it must be no good!" I agree with Mr. Grundke, you must understand the other side and it's capabilities if you wish to defend your own. I'm sure Sun Tzu said something about that.

In response to Mr. Grundke when he wished Apple was as aggressive as Dell and those other companies...well, they are trying to be! .mac is a perfect example. Much to the chagrin of some users, Apple is making inroads in trying to become more competitive.

Do what you gotta do Apple!
 

bbyrdhouse

macrumors 6502
Oct 2, 2002
300
0
Elm Grove, LA
Originally posted by lmalave
What Microsoft is trying to do is give people less reason to switch to the Mac. Already, 95% of consumers are trying to justify to themselves any reason to stay with the PC. That's why Apple has to do things like only offer the iPod for the Mac...

Thats all I am trying to say. There are a number of people who are almost ready to switch. They have finally gotten to a point where they are looking at all the great software that comes with a Mac and have almost decided to go ahead and get an iMac or eMac or iBook, but now that Microsft has these applications though not as good, (remember that potential switchers dont know how much better iDVD is than MovieMaker) then why switch.?

Apple has got to do 2 things (imo)

1. Decrease the Speed gap. (To Joe Computerbuyer it matters, and if it matters to the consumer then it matters)

2. Continue their recent aggressive pricing strategy.
 
Re: What Digital Hub Anyway?

Originally posted by digitalbiker


Where is the hub, anyway? I see Apple users constantly writing into the various mailing lists being told; Apple doesn't support Windows CE devices, Apple doesn't support Divx, Sorry that new Sony Clie is not supported, Oh you wanted to use that new Bluetooth phone sorry not quite there yet for that model, Apple's sorry but we only support our own internal DVD burner with iDvd, I bet you would like to use that new scanner you got for Christmas, Sorry.

How can anyone seriously take Apple as being a hub for digital devices. Sure they integrate a handfull of devices well but Apple is al ong long way from making their computers digital hubs for a majority of popular products. What does iSync even currently support; address book, palm desktop, itunes, mail? That's about it isn't it. That doesn't quite live up to the hub I was envisioning when Steve Jobs coined the phrase at MacWorld!

Very good points! What good is having a great sandbox if nobody brings their toys along? For the iMac to be considered a "digital hub", it really needs RCA in and out jacks as well as video (RCA, S-video, Component), just to start. I'd also have a contraption to turn lights and appliances on and off via program.

There is no hub yet.

drivers, drivers, drivers, drivers.....
 
Originally posted by PretendPCuser
.mac is a perfect example. Much to the chagrin of some users, Apple is making inroads in trying to become more competitive.

Do what you gotta do Apple!

From what I understand, .mac is pretty much considered a failed venture so far. After getting the initial group (half as many as they'd hoped) to sign up for half the price, there's been little interest from new users.

Apple's doing fine & they do not need to increase their market share. They serve a niche that cares about things differently than 95% of the users out there. As long as they don't do too much irreperable damage to their image, a small but steady flow will continue to come their way. Their image and the trust of their core group has taken some hits in the past year or so. This is more problematic than any device that Microsoft can put out....
 

Thirteenva

macrumors 6502a
Jul 18, 2002
679
0
Originally posted by jayscheuerle


From what I understand, .mac is pretty much considered a failed venture so far. After getting the initial group (half as many as they'd hoped) to sign up for half the price, there's been little interest from new users.

It would help if it didnt seem like development for .mac has virtually halted. I'm hoping they come out with some new .mac features in january. I like having quick access to my idisk to share files but i'll want a whole lot more when it comes time to renew for full price...
 

cubist

macrumors 68020
Jul 4, 2002
2,075
0
Muncie, Indiana
Originally posted by adamcoop


Perhaps you can only share songs for which you have a receipt, a 16 digit serial number (generated by Microsoft), and a letter from the band.

And your social security number and MC/Visa on file at Microsoft. (Like MSN, they will gradually force everyone to use Passport whether anyone wants to or not):mad:
 

SonnyCA

macrumors newbie
Jul 23, 2002
4
0
Apple does NOT know what consumers want

I know I may get a lot of grief for saying this, but the market has obviously spoken and shown us that Apple does *NOT* offer the market what it wants.

The market obviously wants inexpensive and powerful computers, and couldn't care less about design and integration -- if this wasn't the case, PCs and Windows would not be as popular as they are. Windows must offer decent enough hardware integration for it to work enough for it to be popular among the masses.

While Apple focuses on industrial design and the integration of its applications, Windows will claim to have even more features on hardware that is even more powerful, and all for a lot less money. This is what the market wants, and this is *NOT* what Apple is focusing on.

I was shopping for a laptop the other day, comparing iBooks to Dells to Compaqs to IBMs. Why would anybody in his right mind buy an iBook?? You get so much more on the PC side, and the difference in software quality and case construction is trivial to consumers.

Apple is running its Switch marketing campaign, but I find it interesting that they offer no real compelling reasons for anyone to actually make the switch. They are telling me that I should switch to a platform that is slower and more expensive -- yah, that makes a lot of sense. I wonder how many switchers they've actually gotten, and how many Mac users have actually switched in the opposite direction.

Apple is marketing to its existing customer base. It's not going to switch anybody, I think it's a big joke. The only advantage Apple has is that MS sees it as a fly and doesn't bother squashing it.

Somebody please tell me what are the compelling advantages to having a Mac, besides slick industrial design that very few people care about? What can I get on the Mac that I can't get on the PC for less money???
 

MacKenzie999

macrumors regular
Jan 24, 2002
249
21
Boston
Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Somebody please tell me what are the compelling advantages to having a Mac, besides slick industrial design that very few people care about? What can I get on the Mac that I can't get on the PC for less money??? [/B][/QUOTE]


I hate to say it but I agree with him, and have been (and likely remain) a loyal macuser since about 1988. For me the elegant design is reason enough. What % of the market do I represent? Likely a % of a %.

$.02
-Mike
 

QuiteSure

macrumors 6502a
Jun 20, 2002
539
117
Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by SonnyCA
Somebody please tell me what are the compelling advantages to having a Mac, besides slick industrial design that very few people care about? What can I get on the Mac that I can't get on the PC for less money???

I no longer care about the PC vs. Mac debate. I have 15 years of training and software invested in my Mac. I like OSX. It works. I haven't tried doing any of the things I do on the Mac on a PC, although I imagine I could do them. I suppose I'm a Mac version of the mindless PC hordes.

But I like very much my iBook, my Mirror Dual 867 and my Dual 500. I like my Airport cards and my iPod. I like the easy network that I've set up in my small law firm. I like the products.

I don't know, do many PC users like their products? Maybe that's all the difference we need.
 

GabrielX

macrumors newbie
May 30, 2002
28
0
Omaha
Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by SonnyCA
While Apple focuses on industrial design and the integration of its applications, Windows will claim to have even more features on hardware that is even more powerful, and all for a lot less money. This is what the market wants, and this is *NOT* what Apple is focusing on.

I was shopping for a laptop the other day, comparing iBooks to Dells to Compaqs to IBMs. Why would anybody in his right mind buy an iBook?? You get so much more on the PC side, and the difference in software quality and case construction is trivial to consumers.

Apple in its Switch ad is marketing perception. Right now, Apple cannot market speed or power very well. It may or may not be competitive, and we can argue that for years, but it cannot MARKET that, because of the numbers.

What Apple is marketing is the perception that using a Mac is better and easier than using a PC.

Apparently, its working to a degree. Does Apple need to step up the campaign by providing some better hardware? Absolutely, but for now, this is working.


Apple is running its Switch marketing campaign, but I find it interesting that they offer no real compelling reasons for anyone to actually make the switch. They are telling me that I should switch to a platform that is slower and more expensive -- yah, that makes a lot of sense. I wonder how many switchers they've actually gotten, and how many Mac users have actually switched in the opposite direction.

Certainly Apple's reasons are compelling. Just not to you or I. Have you seen the Sony ads in which the kid tells his dad to take the Memory Stick out of the camera and put it in the TV? Thats what Apple is marketing. They are marketing to the dad who wants a one step process to do things. Apple wants people to think that doing things is easier with the Mac.

Apple is marketing to its existing customer base. It's not going to switch anybody, I think it's a big joke. The only advantage Apple has is that MS sees it as a fly and doesn't bother squashing it.

I don't think that MS is the company Apple has to worry about. It is in MS's best interest to continue to support Apple and get the revenue streams from that market.

If I were Apple, I would only spare a little worry about MS.

What Apple does have to worry about is the Switch campaign succeeding. If it does, but slowly, as some point Apple will become big enough for companies like HP and Dell to decide that Apple computers are a threat to THEM. HP will squash Apple, for it has no reason not to. The only reason it hasn't yet is that Apple is not yet big enough to worry about.

Apple has to quickly get big enough, or otherwise strong enough, for HP or Dell to decide that the cost/benefit ratio of taking on Apple cuts more in Apple's favor. Right now, Apple is too small, at some point it will be too big. The middle ground is where Apple has to worry. HP does not get a revenue stream from Apple. (No, not even for printers, because if Apple didn't exist, we'd all have PCs and HP would sell us printers.)

Somebody please tell me what are the compelling advantages to having a Mac, besides slick industrial design that very few people care about? What can I get on the Mac that I can't get on the PC for less money???

In my case? I like the Mac OS X far better than I like Windows, and my personal satisfaction with my computer is worth the premium on the product.

Gabriel

Edited to fix some formatting problems.
 

mykuki

macrumors newbie
Jul 23, 2002
22
0
berlin
Re: Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by QuiteSure




I don't know, do many PC users like their products? Maybe that's all the difference we need.
!
 

dricci

macrumors 6502a
Dec 15, 2001
540
157
Re: What Digital Hub Anyway?

Originally posted by digitalbiker
I see Apple users constantly writing into the various mailing lists being told; Apple doesn't support Windows CE devices,
Who's fault do you think this is? I doubt Microsoft would LET Apple support their PDA OS without paying MAJOR licencing fees.

Apple doesn't support Divx,
DivX is not a *real* standard, so it's impossible to "support" easily. 3rd parties have made many plugins that seem to handle many DivX files just fine.

Sorry that new Sony Clie is not supported,
This has more to do with Palm and their Palm Desktop/Hot Sync software than Apple.

Oh you wanted to use that new Bluetooth phone sorry not quite there yet for that model,
iSync is still in beta. Expect to see more phones supported when it goes into final.

Apple's sorry but we only support our own internal DVD burner with iDvd,
And what's wrong with this? Apple created iDVD to help sell their SuperDrive machines. It's their product, so they can choose to make it work with their internal burners only. If somebody like, say Roxio, wanted to make their own consumer DVD mastering software for Mac OS X, they could and make it support all the DVD burners Toast does. Write Roxio!

How can anyone seriously take Apple as being a hub for digital devices. Sure they integrate a handfull of devices well but Apple is al ong long way from making their computers digital hubs for a majority of popular products.
They seem to have a very good start right now. Many Digital Cameras and Firewire Video cameras are supported, there are a good selection of MP3 players supported, but this has more to do with the Manufactuers writing an iTunes plugin than anything else (Apple can't write everything for everybody else!)
Most major brands of scanners work, even integrate into things like Image Capture.

What does iSync even currently support; address book, palm desktop, itunes, mail? That's about it isn't it. That doesn't quite live up to the hub I was envisioning when Steve Jobs coined the phrase at MacWorld!
Do you not understand the concept of beta? If there's something you don't like about it, send in feedback to Apple! If there are popular feature requests, it WILL get added. Just like why we have an Apple menu in the top-left again. We weren't until Apple got enough demand via the feedback form from Public Beta.
 

thecure

macrumors newbie
Dec 17, 2002
5
0
As for me I've used Windows and Macs, and I can truly say that I don't feel as happy with Windows as I do with my Mac, but I do admit Windows is a Good OS but my OS X is better for me. Windows doesn't work as good for me as my Mac does, it's not just because I hate microsoft, that's a whole different story.
Microsoft's "digital hub" is definetly an attempt to copy what Apple is doing, yes these fuçkers go after all good stuff apple comes up with, because they know it's a working idea, and it's not just microsoft, look at the iPod clone, the gray one with the green screen. And it will always be like that, the reason why microsoft owns 95% of the market is not because they are better, no way Jose, but because somehow they started getting bigger than apple and were better than them at some point, but not now. I'm sure the coin will flip one day before I die. We should approach the windows-macs thing with an open mind and instead of acting the way we do, help apple, spread the word, tell a friend, a teacher, a neighbor about apple, offer them your help if they buy a new mac, explain why it would be a good investment, and maybe one day most people will be in our side.

~
 

lmalave

macrumors 68000
Nov 8, 2002
1,614
0
Chinatown NYC
Re: What Digital Hub Anyway?

Originally posted by digitalbiker
I never have understood what was so special about this idea anyway. Long before Steve Jobs ever coined the marketing term digital hub, many people were already using their pc's (generic term both Apple & windows) for video editting, audio editting, PDA syncing, file syncing, printing, email sending, photo editing, etc. etc.

So Steve Jobs coins the phrase, provides a few applications that do pretty much what others have done before but made them little easier to use. He bundles them with the OS and tells everyone they are free when actually they are paid for out of OS development costs. What's so revolutionary?

Where is the hub, anyway? I see Apple users constantly writing into the various mailing lists being told; Apple doesn't support Windows CE devices, Apple doesn't support Divx, Sorry that new Sony Clie is not supported, Oh you wanted to use that new Bluetooth phone sorry not quite there yet for that model, Apple's sorry but we only support our own internal DVD burner with iDvd, I bet you would like to use that new scanner you got for Christmas, Sorry.

How can anyone seriously take Apple as being a hub for digital devices. Sure they integrate a handfull of devices well but Apple is al ong long way from making their computers digital hubs for a majority of popular products. What does iSync even currently support; address book, palm desktop, itunes, mail? That's about it isn't it. That doesn't quite live up to the hub I was envisioning when Steve Jobs coined the phrase at MacWorld!

Sure, that stuff existed before. But what's different is that it wasn't mass market - it was for the dedicated, determined enthusiast. Only in the past two or three years have digital photography, digital music (on portable MP3 players, not just on the desktop), digital video (both recording - Digital8 and MiniDV handycams - and playback - DVD), and digital organizers become truly mass-market. And that happens to coincide with the time that Apple has been pushing its "digital hub" strategy. Apple and Sony are the only two computer makers that I know of that are offering the connectivity (e.g. Firewire) and complete software suite to act as a true digital hub for the mass-market consumer that values ease of use above almost anything else when it comes to consumer electronics. And with Rendezvous, the connectivity and ease of use of the Apple digital hub will be even better.
 

Thirteenva

macrumors 6502a
Jul 18, 2002
679
0
Re: Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by QuiteSure


I no longer care about the PC vs. Mac debate. I have 15 years of training and software invested in my Mac. I like OSX. It works. I haven't tried doing any of the things I do on the Mac on a PC, although I imagine I could do them. I suppose I'm a Mac version of the mindless PC hordes.

But I like very much my iBook, my Mirror Dual 867 and my Dual 500. I like my Airport cards and my iPod. I like the easy network that I've set up in my small law firm. I like the products.

I don't know, do many PC users like their products? Maybe that's all the difference we need.

AMEN!!!!!!:cool:
 

lmalave

macrumors 68000
Nov 8, 2002
1,614
0
Chinatown NYC
Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by SonnyCA
I was shopping for a laptop the other day, comparing iBooks to Dells to Compaqs to IBMs. Why would anybody in his right mind buy an iBook?? You get so much more on the PC side, and the difference in software quality and case construction is trivial to consumers.

I hereby challenge you to find me a 12.1" laptop with a combo drive, 30GB hard drive, 384MB of RAM, 32MB ATI Radeon 7500 or equivalent, and 5 hours battery life, all for $1300 (what this iBook configuration costs when buying from any Apple reseller). Similar offerings from Dell, Sony, and Fujitsu cost anywhere from $1500 to $2000. The iBook is all about mobility, as reflected in its smaller size and battery life. If you want an 8 to 10 pound "desktop replacement monster, then that's your choice, but don't mock us iBook buyers because we want to *gasp* actually carry around our laptops to work, school, airplanes, etc.

There IS a market for portable laptops, and actually I think Dell, Sony and Fujitsu are selling quite a few of their ultra-portables to consumers who unfortunately did not even consider the iBook, which is a much better value. To give you an idea of what these iBook competitors offer, they normally have an 800MHz to 1.2 GHz Pentium III (in the case of Dell and Sony), or a 933MHz Transmeta Crusoe (in the case of the Fujitsu). So it's not even like they have faster CPUs. Instead, they chose to (correctly, in my opinion), use a slower CPU that consumes much less power, so they can get a battery life of 4+ hours. And the cost of these computers? Hundreds more than my iBook! This has already been rehashed to death in other threads, but there is just no reason I need a Pentium 4 that will get a 2 hour battery life and burn my unmentionables like that sorry scientist in the U.K. I use my iBook for web browsing, MP3 listening, DVD viewing, the occasional game (like Baldur's Gate or Civ III), and yes, even development (granted, I'm a database developer, so the code actually runs on high-powered servers, and I just use my iBook for CVS, Ant, BBEdit, FTP, and JDBC/SQL connectivity).

Even when comparing the 14" iBook (which is less competitive in my opinion), you have to make sure you're comparing similar machines. For example, the 14" only weighs 6 pounds and has a 6 hour battery life. So this would be comparable to the Dell "Thin and Light" models. I think you'll find the price differential is much smaller than you might think, probably from $100-$200 dollars, but normally won't have a battery life longer than 2 Hours anyway, so you'd have to get an extra high-capacity battery for at least another $100.

Sure, Apple does not compete at the very low end, but so what? Apple will never make a computer that will sell for $200 at Wal-Mart. Is BMW a lesser company just because they don't sell as many cars Toyota or Honda? Ah, but a low-end BMW will still outperform and have more style than an Acura or Lexus that is aiming for the same target market.

There will always be room in any market for a higher-end product. I think Apple is wise not to aim for the mass market - those products just become commodities, profits fall to zero, and all but a handful of companies get weeded out. By staying out of the low-end price wars, they ensured that they would not be one of those companies weeded out. Apple cannot and should not compete with Dell at the low end (though as I mentioned above, they compete quite well in the mid to high end with Dell, offering an even better value than the supposed value leader in the PC market). Realistically, the best Apple can ever hope for is to gain 20% to 30% market share - and that's if they capture the bulk of the people that are willing to spend a little more than the minimum so that they can get a higher quality product and/or more features. And that's just fine with me.
 
Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by SonnyCA
I know I may get a lot of grief for saying this, but the market has obviously spoken and shown us that Apple does *NOT* offer the market what it wants.

The market obviously wants inexpensive and powerful computers, and couldn't care less about design and integration -- if this wasn't the case, PCs and Windows would not be as popular as they are. Windows must offer decent enough hardware integration for it to work enough for it to be popular among the masses.

History Lesson!!

Before there were PC's in every household, they were in every office. Power was not important (and still isn't in many offices), but price was. Software offerings were pretty much the same on the IBM's and the Macs, but the IBM's were liscensed for cloning, which led to a lot of inexpensive and often cheap, unreliable machines. Steve Jobs did not want to relinquish such control and has been losing market-share ever since. The beancounters spoke & IBM clones took over the marketplace. People learned to use these at work and were familiar to them when it came time to buy one at home. With the number of machines came number of programs to run. This battle was decided before anyone now in high-school was born and as most businesses will follow their short-term wallets, this isn't likely to change. Windows is a standard like lug-nuts are a standard for fastening wheels to a car. Too much would need to change to institute even a better alternative. That is why Windows and PC's are popular.

Personally, I'm happy as beans that I can do everything I want to with a modern OS on a 5 year old machine. Do you know any PC users that can say the same? :D

- j
 

lmalave

macrumors 68000
Nov 8, 2002
1,614
0
Chinatown NYC
Re: Re: Apple does NOT know what consumers want

Originally posted by lmalave

...those products just become commodities, profits fall to zero, and all but a handful of companies get weeded out.

An addendum: my prediction is that Dell will be getting its ass royally thrashed by a Chinese PC maker within 10 years. That's what happens when your business model is based on competing on price alone. Unlike HP and Gateway that had a hard time adapting to Dell's business model, a Chinese company could start from scratch and copy Dell's business model exactly, instilling a culture of efficiency and cost-cutting that is a key ingredient of companies that compete at the low end like Dell and Wal-Mart. Plus by that time every single component that goes into a PC will be manufactured in China, and a Chinese company will have the local connections and know-how to get its components as cheaply and efficiently as possible. Sound far fetched? Check back with me in 10 years ;)
 

shadowfax

macrumors 603
Sep 6, 2002
5,849
0
Houston, TX
I think i have to say that MS just plain sucks at this. they won't ever come out with something better than apple's. apple will respond, for one, and furthermore, MS is BAD BAD BAD at copying. of course it will get more market and press than apple, but that doesn't make it better, and i for one don't care if they are more popular. i've always said people are stupid, and M$ is my personal best example.

they will screw this up somehow, some way they aren't talking about. it will crash like a lewd man on a voluptuous whore, or perhaps they really will throw the book at you on DRM, or something. XP was just like that with that ßullsh1t activation stuff.

if it makes you feel any better, microsoft has quality agents checking everything they market other than office. just like apple does. the only difference is that MS's agents make sure it sucks completely before they let it pass, because god forbid they give us something good. that wouldn't be profitable!
 

User X

macrumors member
Jul 17, 2002
85
0
I think thats what it comes down to for most of us....we love our Mac's. I would like to do a poll and get the percentage of Mac users that are happy with there computer experience vs PC users. I love my 867 quicksilver, it might not be the fastest one on the block but everytime I use it, I am happy I bought it. Not to mention it's a looks great. I use a Dell latitude at work everyday and I simply tolerate it. It has crashed on me once already today, not to mention I have had to ctrl-alt-del 4 times today for unresponsive programs. Since I have owned my g4 with osx I have not had a single crash...not one. That is what it's all about. Performance is an issue, don't get me wrong, but I have yet to find anything my computer can't handle nicely. The great thing about Apple is that they take something like making a movie or listening to music and make it easy to used and better than anything else out there. I would never use anything but iTunes for music...why would I? It is the best mp3 player IMO. Everyone knows that microsofts media center (RIP OFF) will not hold a candle to any of the iApps. But enough bitching....you know what, I kind of like being one of the select few using a Mac, if you are not smart enough to realize what they have to offer.....you don't deserve to own one. I for one am glad to be a part of the Mac community, there is a sense of pride that comes along with it. If osx were the standard, we might take for granted how good we have it. Despite the hardware setbacks I can't think of a better time to own a Mac.


Once you go Mac, you never go back!
 

jettredmont

macrumors 68030
Jul 25, 2002
2,731
328
Re: Microsoft Digital Hub

Originally posted by Macrumors
News.com reports that Microsoft is taking cues from Apple's digital hub strategy with its own "Microsoft Plus Digital Media Edition" to be introduced on Tuesday.



The software package, which will sell for $19.95 contains added features beyond Apple's current offerings.

Added features?

1) "Special photo-editing tools" Okay, iPhoto probably doesn't do what these will do, but I'll wait and see on that one.

2) "a tool for making CD labels" ... well, as I've found none of the commercial CD labeling tools out there worth my time (I'd much rather use a real drawing/painting tool to do the job, although it's a pain having to retype the playlist from iTunes or Nero to put into the drawing program), I won't comment on this one. Sounds like just more useless crap to uninstall.

2) "The Plus Photo Story" allowing people to add audio to a still photo and send it in Media Player 9 encoded video. Only good if your recipient uses XP and foolishly installed Media Player 9 despite the EULA that now gives Microsoft permission to disable any and all of the software on your computer at its descretion.

3) "password-protected area for people to mix music and visual effects" ... Okay, sounds like a playlist. With a password on it? Seems odd. Judgement reserved.

4) "analog converter" ... to WMA format audio only. In other words, useless.

5) "Plus Sync and Go" ... might be useful to some, but it seems there's already a service that does this for free ...

The other five features remain unnamed.

I presume this will contain WMM 2.0, which will need to be an exponential improvement over the substandard Windows Movie Maker 1.2 software out there currently if it is to even be mentioned in the same breath as iMovie. I also presume this will contain WMP 9.0, which as I said above has a horrendously drastic EULA ... which EULA would probably be thrown out in court if it came down to it, but that would be after MS freely disabled all manner of software on your computer (most likely means being Windows Update, but there's no reason WMP itself couldn't be updated to do the damage directly). Not mentioned is Microsoft's DVD-creation tool (that is also de-emphasized on the Media Center PCs as it writes DVDs only the creating machine can read back ...), and the "10-foot interface" remote-control based control mechanism.

I've played with a Media Center PC. It's no iMac. No amount of Windows XP patching and glossing over can make Windows "bring them a lot closer to the ease of use of, say, the iMac." The OS is fundamentally not user-friendly.

Need I mention, of course, that previous "Plus Packs" for Windows have ranged from interesting (Win 95's Plus Pack) to buggy and useless (XP's Plus Pack)?
 
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