Psystar Winding Down Business as Web Site Goes Dark

[zacman]

Different laws, and U.S. precedent is not applicable.

Having looked at German law, I don't think PearPC could win, but they have a better shot than did Psystar.

1) EULAs in standard boxed software are not applicable by German law. That's why Microsoft lost its OEM law suit in Germany. Same goes to so called "hardware clauses" like Apple has them in their EULA. HP lost such a case in the 90s.

2) Psystar and PearC is a complete different story.

Psystar sold modified MacOS X discs.

PearC does sell two completely seperate products:

1) A standard PC with support for all EFI operating systems
2) The iLife/Snow Leopard set (also known as the 'Hackintosh starter kit') which they get from a German distributor (Ingram)

You can either buy one of these products or both of them. But they are compeletly different products and not connected together.

Of course the user can always choose to Install the EFI OS MacOS

3) Who says Apple hasn't already tried and lost? Court decisions don't get published in Germany...

 

[Norco]

My wife was a dean of admissions at a college, and she told me all about those studies. They also discuss it at various conferences. She was in charge of career counseling, and she found that in the last 5 or 6 years, there is a trend where the students think they're entitled to a job, and, once employed, entitled to come and go as they please, etc. She had to give presentations to the students teaching them that their future bosses have a different view on how things work.

As a representative of the 20-somethings (24), I can at least explain partially for this view.

From an employers point of view, they want employees who will be lifers, since turn over is costly for them in training. But what's in it for an employee to stay at one company their whole life? So they can get laid off? Have their jobs shipped overseas?

Living through this difficult economic situation has only solidified this viewpoint, as most of us probably have had a tough time getting a job after graduating, or had a baby-boomer family member lose a job. Of course I think its ridiculous to think anyone is 'entitled' to a job after graduation, but growing up your entire life you are constantly told by parents, teachers, elders... that if you want to get anywhere and live comfortably, you need to get a college education. Then once you've earned the education/racked up the loans, *poof* no jobs. Obviously things will eventually turn around... just my 2 cents.

 

[KnightWRX]

i absolutely agree with you, but we could ask ourselves: "how did this entitlement generation come to be?" - they are after all "our" children, so i guess we did something wrong when teaching them values etc... just a thought.

Do you really have to ask this question ? Seriously, you don't need to look very far for the answer. Look at the families of the 50s, 60s and 70s. A working dad, mom at home taking care of the kids. Kids would do chores around the house, go to school, get help with their homework.

It wasn't perfect (balance of the sexes) but as far as creating a solid generation (Generation X), it worked out fine.

The problem came from fast inflation. Somehow, 1 salary wasn't good enough anymore (especially a factory worker salary). Both parents now had to work. Flash forward to the late 80s, early 90s, with both parents at work, children got bought into submission. New nintendo, new toys were fast ways to make the brats shut up when no parent had enough rest to take care of them. Homework is done alone, supper is usually some kind of fast tv dinner or at least eaten in front of the tv.

Do you really wonder where they got the sense of entitlement from ?

As a representative of the 20-somethings (24), I can at least explain partially for this view.

From an employers point of view, they want employees who will be lifers, since turn over is costly for them in training. But what's in it for an employee to stay at one company their whole life? So they can get laid off? Have their jobs shipped overseas?

But that's not a reason to do your job half assed or not take responsibility for your acts. I've seen guys come in to my work place, and not care at all if they perform or get fired. It's not just about being there for life, these guys want to be there and get the promotions now, get the big salary now.

When you train them on how to do simple tasks (like follow operations procedure), they always go "Yeah but...". Usually, the suggestion is just a way for them to have less work with no better results for the company. Then when they have to do the work, they don't follow the procedure, forget things and this results in extra work for everyone else. Again, they go "Yeah but..." instead of just admitting they were wrong.

Heck, when you start questionning them further and telling them they made a mistake, they go "It's not like you don't make mistakes either...". They don't accept blame, they don't take responsibility and they don't seem to want to better themselves. They want to change the things to benefit themselves.

Obviously, the entire generation is not like that, but I'm seeing it more and more as time progresses. The last 3 operators we had straight out of college are walking stereotypes for this behavior. And the 3 interns after them never made operator after their intership. It's downhill year after year.

 

[mdriftmeyer]

It has nothing to do with computing and everything to do with the current generation's strong sense of entitlement. The world owes them, they don't owe anything to the world.

If a 20 something today was to make the JFK speech, it would go like this : "Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you".

Spot on!

 

[Berio]

<FlameBait>
I personally would like to see Apple license Mac OS X to other PC-manufacturers. I don't thank Apple will ever be able to truly compete with Windows (in terms of computer market-share) until that happens.
</FlameBait>

why do you think they will want to compete for market share? they seem to be doing fantastically well in terms of $$$ in their chosen corner of the market.

that's like saying Cartier Diamonds have to change their business model, else they'll never be able to truly compete with Woolworths in terms of jewelry market share.

 

[benpatient]

That's the problem with the current generation of Mac users, they don't remember Apple's history. There's a reason the first thing Steve Jobs did when he returned as temporary CEO of Apple in 1998 was to cut out the clone market.

This same reason still applies today as Apple's market strategy hasn't changed, nor as the market.

um...apple's market strategy in 1998 was to sell imacs and cubes.

Now their primary focus is on iphone and itunes music/video store.

the mac is playing for third right now.

 

[coolfactor]

The real "problem" is that Apples competition are bunch of bungling idiots that have collectively decided it's a good idea to race to the bottom. All of them have the resources to compete on a quality / whole experience level with Apple. None of them have the leadership of vision. And that is what is sad.

Eggs-xactly!!

Lower prices would only lead to lower quality and less innovation, in my eyes. Apple is what it is because of their decent margins. It gives them the revenue to do what they do.

 

[joe.pelayo]

I think that people forget an extremely basic fact. The fact that the agreement that you are not going to install the OS into a non-Apple computer is KNOW before you buy the software (at least for everybody here on this forum and for everyone on the hackintosh community). So, if you don't agree with it, it's very simple. DON'T BUY IT!

If I really like a new shirt from Ralph Lauren, but when I go to buy it I learn that it can't be worn on the sun because it will melt down or something like this, then I have the option of either
1) Buy it and not use under the sun
or
2) Not buy it
But if I buy it and start complaining that it's absurd that I can't use it under the sun, that basically makes me a fool of myself, because I knew it before I bought it.

If you don't like the conditions that are imposed on you, then don't buy the product. If for you MacOS is worth the extra money for the Apple hardware, go ahead and buy it. If it's not, then there are plenty of PCs that are much cheaper. Do you think that if everybody thought that Apple was not worth the extra money and went to buy PCs wouldn't Apple either close the doors or cut their prices (and probably deliver a worse product)? The reason they are still in business is because it's worth the extra money.

If you want a Ferrari, you pay the price of a Ferrari. If you want a Kia, you pay the price of a Kia. But then you get a Kia and not a Ferrari.

Couldn't agree more!

Why people are so complicated? Is it to difficult to get straight something so damn simple?

Thanks,
Joe.

 

[BubbleRaptor]

At the end of the day, it's always really the same baseless thing. "I want it bad, but I don't want to pay for it. I acknowledge there are alternatives, but they are sufficiently sucky that even at their cheaper prices, I don't want them. Instead of rightfully lamenting that Apple's competition sucks and is locked a pointless race to the bottom, I will instead choose to complain that Apple is wrong, because I want it cheaper. And after all, it's all about me in today's world."

That's a fundamental law about economics; consumers will always choose the cheapest possible option (where it meets the consumer's demands). Capitalism is all about selling to the consumer. I am the consumer. I purchase the final consumer good. So in that sense, it is all about me.

I have a Gateway laptop with Windows 7 on it and I have an iMac with Snow Leopard. I purchased both computers and obtained the OS's legally as well. I like both and use them for different activities. I'm not interested in stealing things I value. But, I like to get the most value for my dollar.

 

[coolfactor]

um...apple's market strategy in 1998 was to sell imacs and cubes.

Now their primary focus is on iphone and itunes music/video store.

the mac is playing for third right now.

I don't agree. Could you see Apple running its business using Windows computers? Can you see Ives designing the next iPhone on a Windows machine?

Their Macs are a core part of their product line, not third.

I just wish they would focus on innovation with the Finder throughout the year. Other than the Snow Leopard rebuild, the Finder hasn't changed all that much in 10+ years, except for some whiz-bang features like QuickLook. I just want to be able to control-click to create a sub-folder within a sub-folder, darn it!

 

[lightpeak]

Onward and upward guess.

Now Apple can work to flex their legal muscles to prove Microsoft is illegally selling computers just because they aren't Apple and squeeeeze them out of the business, too. After that, next domino, Linux.

RIP, Psystar. You sure gave it your college try! The little fishie trying to nip at the fins of a big shark that was once the same.

 

[cmaier]

. I don't thank Apple will ever be able to truly compete with Windows (in terms of computer market-share) until that happens.
</FlameBait>

you can't pay bills with market share. Apple and it's shareholders prefer profit.

 

[KnightWRX]

um...apple's market strategy in 1998 was to sell imacs and cubes.

Now their primary focus is on iphone and itunes music/video store.

the mac is playing for third right now.

It is ? All Mac business accounts for 60% of Apple's revenue, the iPhone and iPod/Music sharing the other 40%. Remove software from the equation and computer hardware still accounts for 50% of Apple's revenue.

The Mac is third how exactly ?

Your comment was just ignorant.

Now Apple can work to flex their legal muscles to prove Microsoft is illegally selling computers just because they aren't Apple and squeeeeze them out of the business, too. After that, next domino, Linux.

Microsoft would need to first start selling computers before they could do it illegally. Care to explain your thoughts a little better ? I don't quite get the gist of your post.

 

[Berio]

Do you really have to ask this question ?

Do you really wonder where they got the sense of entitlement from ?

thanks for your analysis - again, i agree with you.

however i would think that there is much more to it than that, i'd contend that is the result of, or rather: part of a process of individualism that has been going on for a very long time. it's been a important, liberating process, but it delivers some strange fruit too.

as wikipedia defines: "Individualists promote the exercise of one's goals and desires, while opposing most external interference upon one's choices, whether by society, or any other group or institution."

our grandparents complained about our parents, our parents complained about us, and we complain about the next generation. maybe we can write a 'history of the lack of respect and the sense of entitlement'

take care
-B

 

[cjmillsnun]

Where does this leave PearC in Germany?

Next in line for Apple's lawyers....

 

[SeattleMoose]

Innocent Criminals?

The post by Ferrous is scary. This type of person cannot differentiate right from wrong and slips easily into criminal activity in either complete ignorance or willfully so with complete disregard.

The concept of "rights" and "ownership" seem lost on a lot of people and would appear to be eroding away at an exponential rate.

 

[Slarti Bartfast]

.

 

[*LTD*]

um...apple's market strategy in 1998 was to sell imacs and cubes.

Now their primary focus is on iphone and itunes music/video store.

the mac is playing for third right now.

Mac sales account for fully half of Apple's revenue. Apple is pushing Macs and handhelds in equal measure, and with the upcoming tablet, gradually transitioning toward a different computing paradigm. By all accounts, Apple is giving love to iPhones, Macs, services, everything. Apple developes its entire ecosystem. The iPhone gets news because it's the iPhone. The Desktop computers and notebook computer paradigms are old hat, no matter how well Apple does with them.

 

[VTMac]

That's a fundamental law about economics; consumers will always choose the cheapest possible option (where it meets the consumer's demands). Capitalism is all about selling to the consumer. I am the consumer. I purchase the final consumer good. So in that sense, it is all about me.

I have a Gateway laptop with Windows 7 on it and I have an iMac with Snow Leopard. I purchased both computers and obtained the OS's legally as well. I like both and use them for different activities. I'm not interested in stealing things I value. But, I like to get the most value for my dollar.

Except that your response has absolutely nothing to do with my post, it's great. The point is that OP I was responding to was (typically) moaning because he doesn't want to pay the Apple price and doesn't like the cheaper options. So in this case, the "consumer" as you put it, has the option to pay up, cheap out, or buy nothing. Three entirely good options. So I'm not sure why you responded to me.

 

[Berio]

um...apple's market strategy in 1998 was to sell imacs and cubes.

Now their primary focus is on iphone and itunes music/video store.

the mac is playing for third right now.

i think the argument by the original poster was meant a little less precisely than you interpret it. apple are still selling integrated hardware and software, whether in an imac, a cube, an iphone and ipod etc etc. and after the clone experience they will not want to allow their OSs to run on other hardware. and i would not be interested in using the iphoneOS on a third party handset.

 

[j-traxx]

It has nothing to do with computing and everything to do with the current generation's strong sense of entitlement. The world owes them, they don't owe anything to the world.

If a 20 something today was to make the JFK speech, it would go like this : "Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you".

BRILLIANT!!!

 

[ccdan]

Where does this leave PearC in Germany?

The german law states that EULA's are not valid if they are read after purchase (it makes a lot of sense - but many people elsewhere in the world don't seem to understand the current abusive practice of selling software with "legal" provisions that are not known at the time of purchase)


That is, for any EULA to be valid, it must be read and agreed to before purchase...

Apple had better be careful what it does in the EU bacause many practices that are extremely abusive and (strangely) legal in the US are not legal in the EU... and the fines are pretty hefty, just ask Intel or Microsoft...

 

[*LTD*]

I'm interested, what did Ives use ? I work in Automotive Engineering, and all the design, CFD and maths software is Windows based. I have never seen an engineer use anything but Windows software.

just bought a new power adapter for my MBP, they used a Windows based handheld computer to charge me.

I'm guessing CNC equipment running Mazatrol or whatever the stadard is now (water jet?) Or did you mean something else?

http://www.iaacblog.com/2008term01/course05/?p=2006

Perhaps you meant CAD? Perhaps SolidWorks and Adobe products like Illustrator?

http://www.solidsmack.com/solidworks-surfacing-tutorial-3g-iphone-model/2009-05-13/

 

[Berio]

Onward and upward guess.

Now Apple can work to flex their legal muscles to prove Microsoft is illegally selling computers just because they aren't Apple

??? interesting grasp on reality.

RIP, Psystar. You sure gave it your college try! The little fishie trying to nip at the fins of a big shark that was once the same.

apple were once the same as psystar? i didn't know that they used to take other people's software, and instal it on cheap software and sell it? you certainly have an interesting grasp on history too. i must not have been paying attention all those years ago.

 

[cmaier]

The german law states that EULA's are not valid if they are read after purchase (it makes a lot of sense - but many people elsewhere in the world don't seem to understand the current abusive practice of selling software with "legal" provisions that are not known at the time of purchase)


That is, for any EULA to be valid, it must be read and agreed to before purchase...

Apple had better be careful what it does in the EU bacause many practices that are extremely abusive and (strangely) legal in the US are not legal in the EU... and the fines are pretty hefty, just ask Intel or Microsoft...

In the U.S., for the EULA to be valid, there must be a meeting of the minds (i.e., at least the appearance of agreement). So if you don't like the EULA, the contract is void. Of course, then you don't get to keep the software...