The Car Thread ... !

[A.Goldberg]

Part of me is really getting an itch to buy a cheap older car just to have something fun to tinker around with and drive for fun.

I'm going back and forth on a couple of options-basically I'm stopping my search at the late '80s/early '90s(depending on the model) as I want something with a carburetor(no electronics=easy shade tree mechanic repairs).

From a practical aspect I'm looking at an older half ton pickup-preferably with 4 wheel drive and a manual transmission(although an automatic isn't a deal killer). I have a frequent enough need for a pickup that it would be handy to have one, and after getting stuck a few times this past winter I'd really like to have 4 wheel drive. If I go that route, I'm pretty much sold on a Chevy 1500 with a small-block 350. I've looked at F-150s also, but just have a really strong preference for a Chevy at least in the time frame I'm talking about. I also love the small block 350-remember this isn't a daily driver so gas mileage is not some much of a concern and I love small block 350s.

A Ranger or S10 also isn't out of consideration. I actually like the size a little bit better, and the '91 Ranger my dad has was a blast to drive. The gas mileage is certainly better, although I'd again want 4 wheel drive for the winter.

The other thing I'm considering is an older GM B body or a Ford Panther. An Impala or Police Package Caprice would be top on the list on the Chevy front-again with a small block 350. On the Ford end of things, an LTD, Towncar, or Mark V/VI would be top on the list. I actually like the Mark V best of all of those, although it's older than the other things I'm considering. I love the retractible headlight covers and the Opera windows, though . As much as this is probably a stupid consideration, B bodies get a nod for the gas cap under the license plate-something that I've always thought was a good idea. Unfortunately, I'm not exactly the typical demographic buying these cars these days(my skin is a few shades too light). I'd also want to keep them stock, with small steel wheels and big tires(whitewalls-narrow of course-where appropriate)-it's surprisingly hard to find one these days that hasn't been lifted and otherwise "pimped out." I just like big old American cars, which is my attraction to these.

You'll need a truck to haul around all the PPC macs you pick up every day

My dad completed a restore of a Triumph GT6 coupe about 8 years ago and it took him 2 years roughly.I had the opportunity to get my hands dirty and learn a lot about cars. Since then can change oil, I've done an alternator, water pump, and helped rebuild a couple engines. Tinkering with a car is a fun experience for sure and really makes you appreciate the engineering behind them.

He has always wanted a pickup truck but says that my mom won't let him. I am sure he could afford a pickup truck if he really wanted, especially considering he doesn't like 4-door luxury trucks that are popular. All he wants is a 2dr or extended cab and 4WD. Maybe once I finish my residency and get settled in life I'll buy him a Tacoma as minor consolation for paying for my education.

My favorite option for the small pickups is the Tacoma. Interestingly a lot of the companies have stopped producing small pickups (Ford, Dodge, Honda). The other options are the Nissan Frontier, and GMC/Chevy Canyon/Colorado. VW has a cool pickup called the Amarok, but it's not available in the US. For a midsize I'd like to say GMC for the sake of reliability historically speaking and I like their look better than Chevy. I think I'd actually go with Ford because of the better styling, aluminum body, and better finish quality. I don't think I'd choose the EcoBoost Turbo V6 even though it's more powerful than their V8 option. I would never buy a Dodge and I never heard good things about the Tundra (plus it's fugly).

It is cool how Dodge (*ehemm RAM, sorry) is offering a 6-cyl diesel and air suspension in their RAM 1500, two handy features you can't get anywhere else. You mentioned diesel trucks being the norm 3/4 ton and up. This seems to be the norm, but I believe it has to do with the taxes/environmental restrictions being based on the class of vehicle. Bigger trucks have less restriction than cars. Chevy is supposedly putting a diesel in their small Colorado pickup (derived the Chevy Cruze diesel I believe).

A few years ago my Grandfather got rid of this 1986 Ford F-100 he bought new as a spare truck. The thing literally had 30,000 miles on it in 2012 and he sold it for $700. That would have been the car for you, except it was 2WD. He said it had a lot of issues from age and spending most of its life sitting. Historically speaking, I think GM products are the way to go. It seems they have the yes overall reliability/longevity in the truck segment.

The Chevy 350 short-block is a great engine. My parents owned an early 90's 30' Grady-White Sportfish up until a couple years ago. It had dual Chevy 350 small block engines and they were fantastic. For an I/O, it had lots of power/preformance, great reliability, cheap to fix, and usually easy to work on, especially maintenance. They bought a newer boat with twin Yamaha 200 outboards, but we miss the cheap parts and simple, old school design.

A Mark V? Are you a pimp on the side? The gigantic, boxy, land yachts of the 1980's and early 1990's are the worst. To me they just scream "there is something off about the person driving this car". Stick with the pickup. Boston is switching over to the new Chevy Caprice police cars (actually a Aussie Holden). I always wonder if any of them have the 6.0L V8 option.

 

[quagmire]

My family loves our Suburban. We had a 1996 Suburban and we currently have a 2002 Suburban. The thing is a tank. The 2002 Suburban is currently 13 years old and the only major thing to happen is the brake lines corroded last year after being outside constantly being exposed to the snow/elements for its 13 year life( I was the one driving it when the brakes went out, but nursed it back home. Scary ). The 5.3L V8 has been a trooper though. It has the famous knocking issue for that era of the 5.3L, but goes away once warmed up and has been very reliable.

The thing is used to tow a horse trailer, haul sailboat equipment, etc. Without it, we would have been in a tough situation a few times.

People here can bash American cars all they want, but our GM products( two Equinox's, two Suburbans, my Saturn Aura, and dads Cadillac ATS) have been the best vehicles my family has ever owned. Beating out BMW, Chrysler( I won't be defending them, they suck. Worst vehicles out of the bunch), and Toyota.

 

[bunnspecial]

A Mark V? Are you a pimp on the side? The gigantic, boxy, land yachts of the 1980's and early 1990's are the worst. To me they just scream "there is something off about the person driving this car". Stick with the pickup. Boston is switching over to the new Chevy Caprice police cars (actually a Aussie Holden). I always wonder if any of them have the 6.0L V8 option.

I actually went and looked at a '78 Mark V last night.

The thing was absolutely gorgeous-white exterior with white leather, and 35,000 original miles. It also had the 7.5L option . It had the Turbine wheels and a nice set of(probably original) narrow white walls. "Grandma drove it to the grocery store once a week and to church on Sunday" but in this case I'd actually believe it. I drove it and it was tight all around-or at least as tight as floaty-boaty 3-ton 1970s cars can be . The thing even had a factory installed CB Radio!

In all serious, though, I do think just a good old pick-up is a solid option. My dad had a '91 Ranger that I drove a lot. I loved that little truck, but if I'm going to buy one for myself I'm pretty full size half ton. It wouldn't be a daily driver by any means, so gas mileage isn't so much of a concern.

I'm also ruling out pretty much anything made after 1990, as I want a carburetor so that I can work on it myself without a degree in electronics. My dad(briefly) owned a '94 1500 with a small-block 350. It had throttle body injection, which is fine but beyond my ability to work on other than basic stuff(and good luck finding a mechanic who can).

There's a semi-local 1990 4x4 1500 with a small block 350. It's a bit rough looking-which I can deal with(remember, not a daily driver, just something for occasional hauling and driving in the winter). It also does at least have A/C, and is an automatic. I'd prefer a manual, but can live with an auto. I might have to venture over and look at it, as the price is in line with where it should be.

My dad had a recent bad experience with a '07 Frontier, which has sort of turned me off of Nissan pick-ups. I know one experience doesn't define the brand, but it can still leave you sour. Jf Tacomas the same size they were in the '90s, I'd consider one, but now that they've grown to mid-sized I'm not so interested. I either want compact or full size-not the in-between. There's also the frame rot problem. I know two people who have had their Tacomas bought back from it. It's actually not that bad of a deal-Toyota pays you 1.5x the book value-but still leaves you without a truck. From what I understand, pretty much all '90s Tacomas are a ticking time bomb in this regard, and I don't know how long Toyota is going to continue the buy-back(I'm sure not indefinitely).

BTW, I would have bought your Grandfather's F-100 in a second, even if it was 2WD!

 

[silentownage001]

I was at a restaurant with valet about a month ago. In front, there was a McLaren 570S. When I was leaving, I was looking at the car, thinking "I wonder who drives this?". Out walks two girls in their mid to late twenties. They get in the car, can't figure out how to start it, finally do, and drive away.

Image

It can't have been a 570S. Production hasn't started yet.

 

[AustinIllini]

It can't have been a 570S. Production hasn't started yet.

That should inform you how shocked I was. I actually do not know which one it was

 

[silentownage001]

That should inform you how shocked I was. I actually do not know which one it was

Orange 650S?

 

[AustinIllini]

Orange 650S?



Image

Nailed it

 

[MatthewLTL]

hey all, sorry for not being on the forums in awhile. I figured I'd let things die down before i frequented them again. Anyways here is the topic on-hand:

My Daewoo has suspension and Power Steering noise heres the deets:

The suspension will make thumping and thudding sounds and on severe cases it will make popping and cracking sounds (as if plastic is breaking)

While on the outside of the car i can push down rather vigerously on the suspension and it makes a squishy-like sound on both sides. Doing the same thing to the rear i hear nothing. This tells me the shocks are possible shot (I think?) but i cannot seem to duplicate the thudding, popping, thumping or cracking sounds. So can all of these noises be the shocks that **** the bucket or could it be other parts as well?

As far as the PS goes:

while turning the wheel to the right it will make a grinding sound when it reaches the end of the lock (turning as far right as it will go) and about 1/4 turn counterclockwise from the rightmost position it will go a Grind-thunk grind-thunk sound. what could this be? I eventually plan to flush the PS system in a few months.

 

[MatthewLTL]

The US only has the 2.5L I4 option and I believe a hybrid is being offered soon. The 2.0L gas and diesel options are only available abroad.

They really should offer the V6. The 2.5 4cyl is spunky enough to get around, but a V6 would give it a competitive edge versus most of the competition. Subaru offers a 2.0T upgrade over their 2.5L 4cyl. If the V6 Toyota used in the previous generation Rav-4 is anything like the 3.5L used in my mom's old Lexus ES350, it would have been an impressive feature to offer.

My grandpa's old S10 had a 2.1L I4 engine the S10 had a v6 option too. You would think for a SUV or a Truck they wouldn't be putting 4 bangers in them can't tell me a 4 banger can handle hauling a trailer vary well.

 

[MatthewLTL]

I took my 535 (2009, 90k miles) in yesterday to have the starter replaced, TPMS sensor fixed, as well as an oil change. Recently, on cold mornings, I would push to ignition button but the starter would just "click". All other electrical functions worked fine. When this occurred, after a couple attempts I could always get her fired up. I figured I'd get it replaced before I get stranded.

So it got an oil change, TMPS sensor, new starter motor. The quote was astronomical but I needed fixed. Upon further inspection, apparently it needs front new ball joints (apparently were dangerously worn out), control arms, some bushings, rear brake pads and calipers, and something to do with the parking brake mechanism. The bill is now absolutely astronomical and they say the tie rods will need work soon. Thankfully in that the car is still in my Dad's name (the original owner), the fact he is a very generous man, and I'm a resident and get paid as one, he is covering the bill this time.

This is exactly why once I get my board certification and full salary I plan on buying a new car. It may happen sooner than that... the amount of money dumped into this car today was almost 1/3 of it's market value.

I am interested in the price..... Hell i was quoted $400 for a Timing belt, and a Cam sensor, I will HATE to see the bill for the drag and suspension it's always around $300 to get the brakes done on my car, so the Timing Belt, CPS, Suspension and the Power Steering noices i hate to see the bill.... cost around $1000 in brake work back in 2013......

EDIT: techincally you didnt "need" a TPMS sensor..... its not too hard to check your tyre pressure ones a month. Also.... Unless you have one of those dumbass beemers with no oil dipstick..... you can change the oil yourself for a fraction of the cost.

 

[A.Goldberg]

I am interested in the price..... Hell i was quoted $400 for a Timing belt, and a Cam sensor, I will HATE to see the bill for the drag and suspension it's always around $300 to get the brakes done on my car, so the Timing Belt, CPS, Suspension and the Power Steering noices i hate to see the bill.... cost around $1000 in brake work back in 2013......

EDIT: techincally you didnt "need" a TPMS sensor..... its not too hard to check your tyre pressure ones a month. Also.... Unless you have one of those dumbass beemers with no oil dipstick..... you can change the oil yourself for a fraction of the cost.

I sent you a PM regarding the cost. I have the bill in my glovebox if you want a specific break down (no pun intended).

No, I didn't need a TMPS sensor, but I did need the incessant light on the dashboard, warning message, and beeping to stop. In some states you actually do need it to pass inspection like RI. My car is registered in CT where it is not required, I don't believe it is in Mass either. It is illegal to deactivate the system though… if even possible. In some cars it's really not possible, like my Grand Cherokee. The only way to do it was to replace the message center computer ($$$) with a model that did not support the feature. Now all cars now require TPMS by law in the US as of 2008.

You don't need a dipstick to change the oil. I unfortunately do have one of those "dumbass beemers" with no dipstick (there is an electronic one that can be found somewhere hidden deep in the depths of iDrive). I'd prefer a real one myself. If I'm at my parents house I will do it myself. I currently live in the city so there isn't much space store tools or do the job safely. My car has little ground clearance so ramps, jack stands, or a lift are necessary- none of which I have anywhere to stow. Aside from that, it's very easy job and my BMW is one of the easiest cars I've ever done, much more so than my mom's Lexus (something I thought would be simple). The oil filter is right on the topside of the engine, next to the radiator - not underneath or on the side. Doing it myself costs less than 1/2 than what the dealer charges.

My grandpa's old S10 had a 2.1L I4 engine the S10 had a v6 option too. You would think for a SUV or a Truck they wouldn't be putting 4 bangers in them can't tell me a 4 banger can handle hauling a trailer vary well.

4 Cylinder engines have come a long way. Most 4 cylinder engines today beat out their 6 cylinder predecessors from 10 years ago even without turbo or supercharging. You'll notice many of the European cars have replaced their 6-cylinder engines with 4-cylinder turbos over the past couple years.

Diesel 4 cylinders are common in smaller trucks everywhere outside of America, and they have more torque which is useful in a truck. 99% of gas 4cyl SUVs is car based and not designed for towing. A 4 cyl S10 isn't really a towing vehicle, I imagine it's 2wd, and that was likely a cost cutting function.

 

[bunnspecial]

I am interested in the price..... Hell i was quoted $400 for a Timing belt, and a Cam sensor, I will HATE to see the bill for the drag and suspension it's always around $300 to get the brakes done on my car, so the Timing Belt, CPS, Suspension and the Power Steering noices i hate to see the bill.... cost around $1000 in brake work back in 2013......

EDIT: techincally you didnt "need" a TPMS sensor..... its not too hard to check your tyre pressure ones a month. Also.... Unless you have one of those dumbass beemers with no oil dipstick..... you can change the oil yourself for a fraction of the cost.

$400 for a timing belt plus the other work actually sounds pretty fair to me. Without looking up the cost for your car, the belts can run $30-40 by themselves plus sometimes there's a tension pulley that needs to be replaced.

It's pretty major surgery, and the labor's a real killer on it. I think it was around $300 on my old '94 Maxima with parts I supplied. The last one was on the '91 Ranger my dad had, although it was done because the truck was getting a complete engine head replacement($50 junkyard head+$50 machine shop work rather than a couple hundred for a head rebuilt). I insisted on one then, as the timing belt had to come off anyway and I didn't see any point in taking a known wear part of without installing a replacement. We also did a water pump, new headgasket and new head bolts at my insistence(the gasket was probably a necessity, but knowing the mechanic who did the work he probably would have reused the old bolts if I hadn't bought a new set of them).

BTW-as a word to the wise, change the water pump when you have the timing belt changed. It's about an extra 15-30 minutes of labor with the timing belt off and is usually a cheap part. It's a MAJOR repair if it goes bad at any other time. I'd go so far as to say it's foolish to not change the water pump when changing the timing belt.

 

[A.Goldberg]

$400 for a timing belt plus the other work actually sounds pretty fair to me. Without looking up the cost for your car, the belts can run $30-40 by themselves plus sometimes there's a tension pulley that needs to be replaced.

It's pretty major surgery, and the labor's a real killer on it. I think it was around $300 on my old '94 Maxima with parts I supplied. The last one was on the '91 Ranger my dad has, although it was done because the truck was getting a complete engine head replacement($50 junkyard head+$50 machine shop work rather than a couple hundred for a head rebuilt). I insisted on one then, as the timing belt had to come off anyway and I didn't see any point in taking a known wear part of without installing a replacement. We also did a water pump, new headgasket and new head bolts at my insistence(the gasket was probably a necessity, but knowing the mechanic who did the work he probably would have reused the old bolts if I hadn't bought a new set of them).

BTW-as a word to the wise, change the water pump when you have the water pump changed. It's about an extra 15-30 minutes of labor with the timing belt off and is usually a cheap part. It's a MAJOR repair if it goes bad at any other time. I'd go so far as to say it's foolish to not change the water pump when changing the timing belt.

I agree with this. If you have the entire car taken apart you might as well spend the few extra bucks and get some preventative maintenance done while it's open and easy.

 

[MatthewLTL]

99% of gas 4cyl SUVs is car based and not designed for towing. A 4 cyl S10 isn't really a towing vehicle, I imagine it's 2wd, and that was likely a cost cutting function.

Correct me if i am wrong but isnt one of the MAIN points in the existance of pickup trucks and SUVs IS for hauling either in the bed (pickup) or a trailer?

And yes the S10 was 2WD only it was a 98 LS version it was also an automatic and had 66k miles on it at the time it was sold in 2012, and had 64K miles on it when it was bought in 2006. My grandpa got it for the SOLE reason of hauling things in the bed. sometime in 2010 (give or take a year) he had to take it into the shop for work, The check engine light came one and they replaced the plugs (cant do plugs on a S10 without ALOT of work), they replaced 2 Ignition Coils and a couple other things that i cannot remember and it cost him a bit over 600 bucks

 

[takao]

Correct me if i am wrong but isnt one of the MAIN points in the existance of pickup trucks and SUVs IS for hauling either in the bed (pickup) or a trailer?

sales numbers obviously speak otherwise...

i don't understand the big US market for gasoline powered pick ups either. A commercial vehicle without a diesel engine makes little sense to me.

I4/I6 turbodiesels are the absolute king for commercial vehicles

 

[turtle777]

Correct me if i am wrong but isnt one of the MAIN points in the existance of pickup trucks and SUVs IS for hauling either in the bed (pickup) or a trailer?

No really.

Just start counting the number of empty trucks beds on the roads.

Very few use them for serious hauling.

-t

 

[MatthewLTL]

No really.

Just start counting the number of empty trucks beds on the roads.

Very few use them for serious hauling.

-t

I know that by TODAYS standards they are not used for hauling but they were ORIGINALLY designed for farm use and hauling farm equipment. You have pickups like the Chevry Avalanche, Ford Explorer SportTrac, Cadillac Esculade pickup and some others have beds so short you could fit AT MOST as 37 inch CRT TV inside em? not to mention trucks like that are SUPER hidious looking so what is the point? they call them SUTs --- Pickup trucks with a open trunk instead of the enclosed one on SUVs

 

[D.T.]

$400 for a timing belt plus the other work actually sounds pretty fair to me. Without looking up the cost for your car, the belts can run $30-40 by themselves plus sometimes there's a tension pulley that needs to be replaced.

It's pretty major surgery, and the labor's a real killer on it. I think it was around $300 on my old '94 Maxima with parts I supplied. The last one was on the '91 Ranger my dad has, although it was done because the truck was getting a complete engine head replacement($50 junkyard head+$50 machine shop work rather than a couple hundred for a head rebuilt). I insisted on one then, as the timing belt had to come off anyway and I didn't see any point in taking a known wear part of without installing a replacement. We also did a water pump, new headgasket and new head bolts at my insistence(the gasket was probably a necessity, but knowing the mechanic who did the work he probably would have reused the old bolts if I hadn't bought a new set of them).

BTW-as a word to the wise, change the water pump when you have the water pump changed. It's about an extra 15-30 minutes of labor with the timing belt off and is usually a cheap part. It's a MAJOR repair if it goes bad at any other time. I'd go so far as to say it's foolish to not change the water pump when changing the timing belt.

Yep, we just did the timing belt, both tensioners, water pump (misc gaskets, full flush/refill) on our '08 T4R, and it was over $1000 at the dealer/stealer. Actually, given all involved, and going ahead with both tensioners (one was starting to fail), that's a "deal". I also just factor it into to the TCO, which has been oil and gas for almost 6 years (we also just did our first set of tires!). FWIW, the V8s use a belt, the V6s use a chain, so until you get way into six digits, the timing system isn't a concern (even in retrospect, I'd still opt for the V8).

 

[bunnspecial]

My grandpa's old S10 had a 2.1L I4 engine the S10 had a v6 option too. You would think for a SUV or a Truck they wouldn't be putting 4 bangers in them can't tell me a 4 banger can handle hauling a trailer vary well.

My dad's 91 Ranger had a 2.3L I4 that was rated for 95HP when new.

With a burnt valve, it was pretty sluggish but was plenty peppy once we fixed that issue. It could easily cruise at 75mph on the interstate.

It had a full length bed(standard cab), and I hauled a LOT of furniture in it. When I was moving into my apartment in Louisville, I tore up I-64 hauling furniture in that truck and it had no trouble with what I threw in it. When I bought out my watchmaker friend here in town, I filled the truck two times(not only the bed, but also the passenger seat) and had no issues(I also filled my car up three times, but that's another story).

I wouldn't want to pull a trailer with it, but had no problem throwing a piece of furniture or some boxes in the bed. It was a DD for me for a while between Frankfort and Louisville, but once I had an apartment it mostly got used for hauling.

I wouldn't dream of pulling a trailer with it(that's what the 1/2 with a small block 350 I'm currently shopping for would do) or even hauling "bulk" stuff like sand or gravel, but I never worried about anything else I threw at it.

I remember one time when my church was working on a float for for the annual Christmas parade. Fully assembled, the thing was too tall and the top part of it was too insecure to haul it from our building site to downtown where the parade line-up was. I got assigned the job of transporting the angels downtown, which were about 5' tall and were intended to sit on the very top(all assembled, we barely cleared a few stoplights along the parade route). In any case, despite tying them down, they were still unsteady. I drove about 20mph the whole way(on roads with a 45-55mph limit) and had a friend hanging out the back window holding them in place(it's a wonder he was still my friend after that). Good times

The truck was also beat up enough that I drove it out to a friends farm many times, climbed up in the bed, and used the sides as a rifle or handgun rest. It made clean-up easy all the brass went into the bed and I could just sweep it out when I got home.

BTW, half tons around here are a usually fashion statement. It's hard to argue that an F-150 or Silverado with leather seats, a full 4-door cab, and a 5' bed is in any way a work truck. 3/4 ton and up are a different story.

----------

FWIW, the V8s use a belt, the V6s use a chain, so until you get way into six digits, the timing system isn't a concern (even in retrospect, I'd still opt for the V8).

Funny enough, with my beloved LS the V6 uses a belt(I think) and the V8 a chain. I've been told that the chain is effectively a lifetime part. I don't think I've ever seen anyone on the LS owners club talk about changing the chain.

Although it's not the same engine, I did once see someone replacing one on a Towncar. The engine had 450,000 original miles on it, and the chain was still serviceable but showing wear.

 

[Hieveryone]

Welcome.

There are a few car related threads on MR, but I noticed there’s always a good amount of [car related] side discussions. Combine that with that seems like a pretty decent number of car enthusiasts here on MR, and it seemed like an ongoing, “open topic” car thread would be fun. Of course there will be some overlap with existing car related threads, but I’d still encourage folks to post pictures, discuss your current ride (even with those existing threads) ... and while it’s a “car” thread, truck owners are also welcome

Figured these are some great topics for discussion:

• New & Future models
• Classics
• Recent Purchase
• Maintenance (help, tips, Q&A)
• Tuning/Modifications/Builds
• Care (wax/polish)
• Shows/Cruises
• Racing/Driving events (HPDE, AutoX, drag)
• Media (photos, video, audio clips)

I drive a Mercedes SUV.

My analysis having driven Hondas before is that you are paying to show off. You can get a nice Toyota for less money but equally comfortable if not more.

It boils down to a lifestyle choice. If you are social and are part of a wealthy community your car is important. You will need to get a Benz or Audi or better.

But otherwise just get a toyota. Seriously. The cost of these luxury cars aren't justifiable.

 

[A.Goldberg]

Correct me if i am wrong but isnt one of the MAIN points in the existance of pickup trucks and SUVs IS for hauling either in the bed (pickup) or a trailer?

And yes the S10 was 2WD only it was a 98 LS version it was also an automatic and had 66k miles on it at the time it was sold in 2012, and had 64K miles on it when it was bought in 2006. My grandpa got it for the SOLE reason of hauling things in the bed. sometime in 2010 (give or take a year) he had to take it into the shop for work, The check engine light came one and they replaced the plugs (cant do plugs on a S10 without ALOT of work), they replaced 2 Ignition Coils and a couple other things that i cannot remember and it cost him a bit over 600 bucks

No, the main point of an SUV is you can fit you and your family/and or stuff in, possibly have all/four wheel drive (previously not really available in most sedans), and for show/status.
For towing you want:
- A trailer hitch (most SUV's now don't have these anymore and many of them are 1.25" rather than 2")
- A powerful, rugged engine for towing - a V8 most commonly, though Ford has a turbo V6 they recently released
- Automatic or manual transmission (not a CVT)
- Long wheel-base.
- Low range transfer case may be desired

Most SUV's on the market for consumers have none of of these functions.

Most pickup trucks today are considered "show trucks", where they are not actually used for their intended function and trimmed with leather and wood to make them fancy. Most people that actually buy a work truck do not by a $60,000 pickup truck because it will get ruined from actual use.

An S10 is a truck designed to be throw stuff in the bed (to a limited capacity) with a low price tag. It's not designed for substantial towing.

----------

Funny enough, with my beloved LS the V6 uses a belt(I think) and the V8 a chain. I've been told that the chain is effectively a lifetime part. I don't think I've ever seen anyone on the LS owners club talk about changing the chain.

Although it's not the same engine, I did once see someone replacing one on a Towncar. The engine had 450,000 original miles on it, and the chain was still serviceable but showing wear.

Typically timing chains are not considered something to have to be replaced, though it's not unheard of doing so. If you're in there for some other reason, it may not be a bad idea.

I know that by TODAYS standards they are not used for hauling but they were ORIGINALLY designed for farm use and hauling farm equipment.

I think you already know the answer to this question, so I'm not sure why you're asking it, but it's still quite evident that pickups are still used for non-consumer business such as farming, construction, etc. The SUV for the most part has always been a consumer oriented vehicle.

The first true "SUV" was the Jeep Grand Wagoneer. While the Willy's Jeep and Land Rover Series vehicles predated it, they weren't considered SUV's at the time. Looking at Land Rover though, originally they were designed to be a military/farm vehicle- basically a tractor with 4 wheels. Then the Range Rover came out in the 1970's soon after the Wagoneer. The goal was for it to be an everyday family vehicle that was also functional. Today it is a $100,000+ luxury machine.

 

[MatthewLTL]

My dad's 91 Ranger had a 2.3L I4 that was rated for 95HP when new.

With a burnt valve, it was pretty sluggish but was plenty peppy once we fixed that issue. It could easily cruise at 75mph on the interstate.

It had a full length bed(standard cab), and I hauled a LOT of furniture in it. When I was moving into my apartment in Louisville, I tore up I-64 hauling furniture in that truck and it had no trouble with what I threw in it. When I bought out my watchmaker friend here in town, I filled the truck two times(not only the bed, but also the passenger seat) and had no issues(I also filled my car up three times, but that's another story).

I wouldn't want to pull a trailer with it, but had no problem throwing a piece of furniture or some boxes in the bed. It was a DD for me for a while between Frankfort and Louisville, but once I had an apartment it mostly got used for hauling.

I wouldn't dream of pulling a trailer with it(that's what the 1/2 with a small block 350 I'm currently shopping for would do) or even hauling "bulk" stuff like sand or gravel, but I never worried about anything else I threw at it.

I remember one time when my church was working on a float for for the annual Christmas parade. Fully assembled, the thing was too tall and the top part of it was too insecure to haul it from our building site to downtown where the parade line-up was. I got assigned the job of transporting the angels downtown, which were about 5' tall and were intended to sit on the very top(all assembled, we barely cleared a few stoplights along the parade route). In any case, despite tying them down, they were still unsteady. I drove about 20mph the whole way(on roads with a 45-55mph limit) and had a friend hanging out the back window holding them in place(it's a wonder he was still my friend after that). Good times

The truck was also beat up enough that I drove it out to a friends farm many times, climbed up in the bed, and used the sides as a rifle or handgun rest. It made clean-up easy all the brass went into the bed and I could just sweep it out when I got home.

BTW, half tons around here are a usually fashion statement. It's hard to argue that an F-150 or Silverado with leather seats, a full 4-door cab, and a 5' bed is in any way a work truck. 3/4 ton and up are a different story.

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Funny enough, with my beloved LS the V6 uses a belt(I think) and the V8 a chain. I've been told that the chain is effectively a lifetime part. I don't think I've ever seen anyone on the LS owners club talk about changing the chain.

Although it's not the same engine, I did once see someone replacing one on a Towncar. The engine had 450,000 original miles on it, and the chain was still serviceable but showing wear.

My grandpa bought his pickup for the SOLE intention to use it to haul old TVs, Microwaves, Lawn Mowers, Appliances and stacks of old VCRS and boxes of various TV and VCR circuit boards and parts to the local recycling center. Me and him always went on garage sales and his truck worked great for that too. I which he never sold it..... It was originally going to be mine once i got my license but a change in events landed me my Daewoo instead. Other than the random GM Dead battery, and a slow leak in the driver rear tire, it was a solid truck. It was full of dents and dings from hail (truck came from the south origionally) and the bed was all beat up on the bed sides from hauling. Obviousally the previous owner did ALOT Of hauling in it. On a side note Burnouts in a S10 were AWESOME!

$400 for a timing belt plus the other work actually sounds pretty fair to me. Without looking up the cost for your car, the belts can run $30-40 by themselves plus sometimes there's a tension pulley that needs to be replaced.

It's pretty major surgery, and the labor's a real killer on it. I think it was around $300 on my old '94 Maxima with parts I supplied. The last one was on the '91 Ranger my dad had, although it was done because the truck was getting a complete engine head replacement($50 junkyard head+$50 machine shop work rather than a couple hundred for a head rebuilt). I insisted on one then, as the timing belt had to come off anyway and I didn't see any point in taking a known wear part of without installing a replacement. We also did a water pump, new headgasket and new head bolts at my insistence(the gasket was probably a necessity, but knowing the mechanic who did the work he probably would have reused the old bolts if I hadn't bought a new set of them).

BTW-as a word to the wise, change the water pump when you have the timing belt changed. It's about an extra 15-30 minutes of labor with the timing belt off and is usually a cheap part. It's a MAJOR repair if it goes bad at any other time. I'd go so far as to say it's foolish to not change the water pump when changing the timing belt.

I assume the quote for the timing belt includes a water pump, however, with the fact the water pump's only got 45k miles on it and it doesn't leak and shows no signs of being bad, it would probably run another 10 years before needing changed. Chances are it'll be another 15 years before the timing belt gets changed again. The timing belt looks to be in perfect shape (i peaked at it today) I suggested since he would be in there replacing the CPS (which looks like its BEHIND the timing belt) he inspect the belt he recommended it to be changed for the fact it's 15 years old even though the car hasn't hit 60K miles, I say go for it hes gonna be in there anyway and its prevenitive maintenance.

No, the main point of an SUV is you can fit you and your family/and or stuff in, possibly have all/four wheel drive (previously not really available in most sedans), and for show/status.
For towing you want:
- A trailer hitch (most SUV's now don't have these anymore and many of them are 1.25" rather than 2")
- A powerful, rugged engine for towing - a V8 most commonly, though Ford has a turbo V6 they recently released
- Automatic or manual transmission (not a CVT)
- Long wheel-base.
- Low range transfer case may be desired

Most SUV's on the market for consumers have none of of these functions.

Most pickup trucks today are considered "show trucks", where they are not actually used for their intended function and trimmed with leather and wood to make them fancy. Most people that actually buy a work truck do not by a $60,000 pickup truck because it will get ruined from actual use.

An S10 is a truck designed to be throw stuff in the bed (to a limited capacity) with a low price tag. It's not designed for substantial towing.

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Typically timing chains are not considered something to have to be replaced, though it's not unheard of doing so. If you're in there for some other reason, it may not be a bad idea.


I think you already know the answer to this question, so I'm not sure why you're asking it, but it's still quite evident that pickups are still used for non-consumer business such as farming, construction, etc. The SUV for the most part has always been a consumer oriented vehicle.

The first true "SUV" was the Jeep Grand Wagoneer. While the Willy's Jeep and Land Rover Series vehicles predated it, they weren't considered SUV's at the time. Looking at Land Rover though, originally they were designed to be a military/farm vehicle- basically a tractor with 4 wheels. Then the Range Rover came out in the 1970's soon after the Wagoneer. The goal was for it to be an everyday family vehicle that was also functional. Today it is a $100,000+ luxury machine.

I thought the Grand Wagoneer was a station wagon?
also i thought minivans where the "family" vehicle with their space and most all minivans since the beginning of minivan (and even on a few models of station wagons) had 3rd row seating.

 

[turtle777]

I know that by TODAYS standards they are not used for hauling but they were ORIGINALLY designed for farm use and hauling farm equipment. You have pickups like the Chevry Avalanche, Ford Explorer SportTrac, Cadillac Esculade pickup and some others have beds so short you could fit AT MOST as 37 inch CRT TV inside em? not to mention trucks like that are SUPER hidious looking so what is the point? they call them SUTs --- Pickup trucks with a open trunk instead of the enclosed one on SUVs

You went down this road talking about the S10.

The S10 was never "ORIGINALLY designed for farm use and hauling farm equipment".

-t

 

[MatthewLTL]

You went down this road talking about the S10.

The S10 was never "ORIGINALLY designed for farm use and hauling farm equipment".

-t

VARY TRUE, however, as what most pickups were designed for, it WAS used for hauling.

 

[A.Goldberg]

VARY TRUE, however, as what most pickups were designed for, it WAS used for hauling.

Define hauling? Throwing some crap in the back- sure. The towing capacity on those 4cyl is like 2000lbs and probably won't make it up a hill. That's 1/3 less my mom's Volvo Wagon. A 2015 Chevy will tow up to 12000lbs depending on the drivetrain.

I thought the Grand Wagoneer was a station wagon? also i thought minivans where the "family" vehicle with their space and most all minivans since the beginning of minivan (and even on a few models of station wagons) had 3rd row seating.

Well, at the time they considered all "SUVs" station wagons, though the term was not developed until much later. The Wagoneer began in the 60's is generally considered the original SUV because it was the first luxury 4wd vehicle. Anything prior was a utilitarian piece of equipment. The Range Rover and Land Cruiser followed suit and created the SUV market we have today. It's actually a fairly recent development that SUV's have become general consumer vehicles. In the 80's and 90's they were primarily premium vehicles until the mass release of car-based SUV's that brought the cost and cost of ownership way down in the early thousands.