Thinking of buying an Intel iMac

[redneon]

Hi,

I went to the Apple store in my local shopping centre (Sheffield, UK) yesterday to have a look at the new Intel iMacs. As a result, I'm thinking about getting one

I've been doing a bit of reading but a lot of it is very subjective and I'm hoping that I can get an unbiased objective opinion on some things from the people on this forum. I'm sure a lot of these questions are asked a lot and coming from a Linux background I'm expecting quite a few RTFMs etc. but I'd appreciate any help.

1) Does Rosetta do a decent job at emulating PPC? Considering how bad PearPC was I'm a little worried as the speed of PPC software on the Intel Macs? I'm especially bothered about the PPC games (I play a lot of WoW) but I could just use Bootcamp for those.

2) I'm planning to get the 20" iMac. What upgrades would you suggest getting? I can upgrade the memory at any time but would 512mb be enough? It certainly isn't on Wintel PCs nowadays! Also, is it worth getting the 256mb ATI card? I'm also thinking of going for the wireless keyboard and mouse.

3) What is the performance like on the ATI card? Does it support the latest vertex shaders or anything?

4) How well does XP run using Bootcamp? Can it run ALL Windows software? I'll be using Bootcamp to run Windows games, I reckon.

5) I hear that Apple have a fairly short release schedule? Would I be best off waiting for the new iMacs maybe or perhaps 10.5?

6) Can OS X run BSD and Linux software? As I said before, I'm primarily a Linux user so this would be a nice additive. Especially if I could run X applications.

7) How elegant is Cocoa and Objective C? I'm a developer (primarily games) and one of the reasons I want to get a Mac is because it's an environment I haven't programmed in before.

8) What are the best websites to read about news and community stuff about Macs? Currently I read Slashdot, The Register and OSNews quite a bit.

Sorry for the long list of questions, I just want to make sure it's a worthy purchase. Now it's your job to convert me

Thanks a lot,

Darrell

 

[PatrickF]

I have a MBP so I won't be able to answer some of your questions, but I'll do my best.

1) Does Rosetta do a decent job at emulating PPC? Considering how bad PearPC was I'm a little worried as the speed of PPC software on the Intel Macs? I'm especially bothered about the PPC games (I play a lot of WoW) but I could just use Bootcamp for those.

I've had no problem with Rosetta at all. It's a bit of a RAM hog but all the apps I've tried have run just fine. Even Call of Duty runs perfectly fine under Rosetta.

2) I'm planning to get the 20" iMac. What upgrades would you suggest getting? I can upgrade the memory at any time but would 512mb be enough? It certainly isn't on Wintel PCs nowadays! Also, is it worth getting the 256mb ATI card? I'm also thinking of going for the wireless keyboard and mouse.

I would recommend at least 1GB of RAM although that's usually cheaper bought directly from Crucial. I opted for the 128MB graphics card and don't have any problems.

3) What is the performance like on the ATI card? Does it support the latest vertex shaders or anything?

It's well known that the X1600 is very underclocked but it still performs well. I'm able to play Battlefield 2 on Windows perfectly fine.

4) How well does XP run using Bootcamp? Can it run ALL Windows software? I'll be using Bootcamp to run Windows games, I reckon.

It runs just great. Feels a little strange at first but it does run perfectly. All hardware I've tried works and so far all of the software just works. Not all of the hardware built in to the MBP/iMac will work yet though (iSight, etc.)

5) I hear that Apple have a fairly short release schedule? Would I be best off waiting for the new iMacs maybe or perhaps 10.5?

The new iMacs have just been released so I'd say it'll be a while before they release new revisions. 10.5 should be out later this year/early next year.

6) Can OS X run BSD and Linux software? As I said before, I'm primarily a Linux user so this would be a nice additive. Especially if I could run X applications.

Yes and that's what I love. Look into DarwinPorts and Fink. You also get X11 with OS X, although you'll have to install that separately (comes on the DVD).

Hope that helps you some way.

 

[hvfsl]

I will just point out that a few Mac OS games have been ported to OS X Intel now, including WOW.

 

[yoak]

I have the 20". I´m very pleased with it´s performance. I opted for the 256 graphic card, just because you can´t do it later.
I also ordered mine with 1gig of RAM, as it wasn´t much cheaper to get 3rd party.
This way you have a 1gig stick and can add another from 3rd party later.
If you get the standard from Apple you either lare only able to max out the machin at 1,5 gig of RAM, or you have a 512 stick you need to replace.
I haven´t played any games yet so I can´t help you there.
I say get it now

 

[student_trap]

1) Does Rosetta do a decent job at emulating PPC? Considering how bad PearPC was I'm a little worried as the speed of PPC software on the Intel Macs? I'm especially bothered about the PPC games (I play a lot of WoW) but I could just use Bootcamp for those.

2) I'm also thinking of going for the wireless keyboard and mouse.

5) I hear that Apple have a fairly short release schedule? Would I be best off waiting for the new iMacs maybe or perhaps 10.5?

8) What are the best websites to read about news and community stuff about Macs? Currently I read Slashdot, The Register and OSNews quite a bit

1. for most apps, rosetta runs unnoticable, with pro apps, there will be a difference, however the pro apps are all slowly changing over to universal anyway so i wouldn't worry about it.

2. good idea, i just picked these up and they are excellent, the mouse has only one button and no scroll wheel though if that bothers you....it doesn't bother me

5. apple release new macs every 6-9 months, and the last update was in january.

8. your posting on the best one!

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

5) I hear that Apple have a fairly short release schedule? Would I be best off waiting for the new iMacs maybe or perhaps 10.5?
Darrell

Well PatrickF has answered most of your questions and I wud be convinced if I were you. As far as waiting for newer iMacs or OS10.5 is concerned, I dont think this will be any time soon. Apple has yet to show even a demo of Leopard to developers. They are supposed to show a demo in WWDC. So I dont really expect leopard in this year. iMacs will also not see a major Rev any time soon.

So IMO you are safe to buy the iMac now. I`d have bought it. But I need a portable and waiting for MacBooks. Please Apple atleast anounce it. I dont mind waiting another 2 months if I know what I`ll be getting. Atleast if I dont like the new MB then I might just buy a refurb MBP today.

 

[yoak]

I also have the wireless keyboard and mouse, they work really well. (I have heard that the mouse might not be very precise if you are working in illustrater etc.)
To me, it just adds to the beauty of the system; One power cord out of the back of the iMac, that´s it.

 

[redneon]

Great. Thanks for the help. I think I'll end up getting a wired keyboard and mouse, though as I really want the two buttons and wheel for when I'm using Windows software.

Are there any pieces of software that I should get immediately to make the whole experience more enjoyable?

 

[crazycat]

I dont like the apple mouse and keyboard very much, i would recomend you buy from another vendor such as Logitech.

 

[AviationFan]

7) How elegant is Cocoa and Objective C? I'm a developer (primarily games) and one of the reasons I want to get a Mac is because it's an environment I haven't programmed in before.

Different people have different opinions about what is elegant and what is not. I find Cocoa and Objective C very elegant and powerful, but I haven't used it to create any games. You may want to ask this question over in the "Programming" forum to get some better responses.

- Martin

 

[mac000]

I know the graphics card is underclocked in the MBP to give battery life, AND the intel iMac has the same card... QUESTION IS, the card in the imac ISNT underclocked, CORRECT?

 

[balamw]

Great. Thanks for the help. I think I'll end up getting a wired keyboard and mouse, though as I really want the two buttons and wheel for when I'm using Windows software.

FWIW I bought my 17" with wired mouse & keyboard, but also picked up an Apple wireless keyboard, which turned out to be $10 cheaper than the all wireless version, but I get two keyboards. I am also using Logitech mouse from the PC the iMac replaced.

B

 

[redneon]

Ok, I'm going to get a 20" iMac with 1GB RAM and stick with the wired keyboard and mouse.

I still have one decision to make, though? Should I go for the 128mb or 256mb ATI? Is 256mb really going to make that much of a difference? I know graphics cards have been pretty stuck at 128mb for a while and I did have a Radeon 9600 256mb card for my PC which was utterly terrible. If I got for a higher VRAM card will there be any difference in performance? If not, I just have to battle with my conscience as to whether it's worth the extra £50.

I know that currently, 128mb is fine. It's the future I'm bothered about

 

[PatrickF]

I know the graphics card is underclocked in the MBP to give battery life, AND the intel iMac has the same card... QUESTION IS, the card in the imac ISNT underclocked, CORRECT?

The X1600 in the iMac is said to be underclocked just as with the MBP. The reason probably being that the iMac is essentially a laptop and they underclocked it to reduce heat. That's my guess anyway.

There's a thread over in the Windows forum https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/192064/.

 

[PatrickF]

Ok, I'm going to get a 20" iMac with 1GB RAM and stick with the wired keyboard and mouse.

I still have one decision to make, though? Should I go for the 128mb or 256mb ATI? Is 256mb really going to make that much of a difference? I know graphics cards have been pretty stuck at 128mb for a while and I did have a Radeon 9600 256mb card for my PC which was utterly terrible. If I got for a higher VRAM card will there be any difference in performance? If not, I just have to battle with my conscience as to whether it's worth the extra £50.

I know that currently, 128mb is fine. It's the future I'm bothered about

I opted for the 128MB version on my MBP and don't have any issues with it. For £50 more though you might want to opt for the 256MB one just for the future. You know you'll probably kick yourself if you don't.

 

[mac000]

The X1600 in the iMac is said to be underclocked just as with the MBP. The reason probably being that the iMac is essentially a laptop and they underclocked it to reduce heat. That's my guess anyway.

There's a thread over in the Windows forum https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/192064/.

wow that makes no sense for the iMac, but oh well ya know