What Camera?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Dark, Nov 1, 2005.

  1. macrumors regular

    Hey guys whats up? Im and im a sophmore in HS. Over the past year ive really been getting into photography. I am now thinking about becoming a photo journalist. For Christmas this year my parents said I could get a camera. Im currently just using a Sony Cybershot 5 m.p camera. However, I have my mind set on the Canon Digital Rebel XT, I read alot of positive reviews about this camera and after fooling around with it in the store, im in love. Has anyone had experience with this camera before? If so, how was it and would you recommend it? If not, why and what other camera in the same price range would you reccomend. Any input would really be appreciated.
  2. macrumors G3


    its a good camera, u should look into the nikon D70 and the D70s. having an SLR camera is good because you can swap lens but its pricey. You should look into a nikon coolpix 8800, 8mp, 10x optical zoom, good camera in all
  3. macrumors newbie

    In terms of dSLR and the price range, the Rebel XT is unparalleled in price. It is a great price, but consider the fact that sold as just a body or with a kit lens, it can be pricey to get a nicer lens in your hands.

    Also, if you are not familiar with custom functions and metering, a dSLR is a huge jump from a point-and-shoot. Even the high end point-and-shoot cameras offer SOME manual functions, but for the price of a SLR, utilizing and making the most of the camera's function would be a good idea, imho.

    Of course if you are experienced with the SLR, it is your destiny :p

    Otherwise, maybe try a 35mm film camera, get used to the manual functions and focusing. I'm not one to preach, but it does train the eye for something that cannot be fully replicated when one only experiences a digital SLR.

    Oh, and I won't go into the whole Nikon or Canon debate. Whichever you go with, you'll have to stick with it, because those lenses are dedicated to that brand, so if you invest, it'll be harder to just "switch".:(
  4. macrumors regular

    I have no experience with a dSLR, not gonna lie. However, I dont want my parents to waste their money on another point and shoot and then later down the line ill have to save up for a dSLR. Photography really interests me and if that means me studying the camera manual then so be it.
  5. macrumors 6502

    The Rebel XT takes amazing pictures..
    But at the same time... the lens come a long way..

    I used the Rebel XT w/17-85mm lens

    Don't cheap out on the lens for sure.
    If you get the Rebel XT, most of the lens work with the 20D and above..

    Another good place to look for deals and more info is..
  6. macrumors newbie

    Yeah, that's true. Although I meant you should get a manual camera, old school style, learn the metering.

    Oh, save up and get it yourself. Then you can baby it more. I remember when I saved up for the original Rebel, I basically coddled it until I moved on to the 20D....heheh.

    I was just saying that with a dSLR, with interchangable lenses, can be in the range of $1000 and up after costs, whereas with a hand me down 35mm camera, you can learn those SLR functions for a few hundred tops. But really you can find some film SLRs for really cheap and it can get you started to see if you like it.

    Obviously just a suggestion, as I jumped into the dSLR world with a splash as well. But I started with a Lomo LC-A, and that taught me a bit about film, manual exposure and metering and such.

  7. macrumors regular

    Thanks alot for all the advice guys. Yeah, if i was to get the Digital Rebel XT I would get it with the lens kit.
  8. macrumors 68020


    worthwhile considering thet D70s

    You might want to check out this thread for some views on the Rebel and D70s

    In the end you must go with whatever makes you feel good. But you would be doing yourself a great disservice to ignore the D70s

    The Rebel is a bit small and doesn't feel as good and solid to hold as the D70. Another very annoying thing about it is that the hot keys are just menu shortcuts which means you have to keep delving into menus to make changes. Whereas the on D70 you can change white balance, ISO, and Quality and size settings without going into the menu.

    In the thread I refer to above I there is some information on the very clever iTTL flash trickyness with the D70

    Have a look at thomas klieber's excellent work done on D70 and nikon coolpix4500!
  9. macrumors 68020


    The funny thing about "point and shoot" cameras is that they aren't point and shoot. But a camera like the D70s for example while not being a "point and shoot" camera, is in fact a real point and shoot because that is exactly what you can do with it.
  10. macrumors 6502a


    Definately go Canon. I have the 6.3MP Digital Rebel, love the crap out of it. Get the rebel XT!
  11. macrumors 601


    Sorry to ask a question in your thread, but along the lines of point and shoot not being ideal for learning photography, and an SLR being a big jump, what's in the middle? I'd like something in the middle if they make such a thing. Maybe like a point and shoot but with a manual focus lens, I have no idea.
  12. macrumors 68020



    See my post above regarding point and shoot. A dslr like the nikon D70s is actually a true point and shoot camera. You really can turn it on point and shoot and it will give you a fantastic result.

    With regards to what's in the middle keep in mind that what was considered a top of the range point and shoot camera about 4 years ago, the nikon 4500 cost the same price then as the dslr D70 nikon costs now! and the 4500 was sloooooow to use.
  13. macrumors regular

    Ok, well im pretty sure im going with the Canon. Now I had some money saved up so I just ordered a 1 gig crucial ram stick. I know ram is important especially when dealing with photography/photoshopping. What other things would you suggest. I was thinking about an external hardrive and maybe Adobe Elements. I was going to buy it but i dont want to get 3.0 and then all of a sudden 4.0 comes out.
  14. macrumors 68040


    Yea I would definitely recommend some extra storage space such as an external hard drive. Those Photoshop files can really add up fast.

    As far as software is concerned, I'm don't follow Photoshop Elements (as opposed to regular Photoshop) too much so I'm not sure of the versions there. You could wait for PE 4.0 and in the mean time use iPhoto. Then there's Aperture coming out this month from Apple. So there are plenty of apps for you to choose from.

  15. macrumors regular

    Ok, Now i was thinking about getting my parents to get it at Best-Buy so I can get a good warantee on it and know if i ever have a problem im fine. What is the kit lens that comes with it good for. I was looking at this website that has literally INSANE PACKAGE DEALS, i would order in a heartbeat but i have a big feeling i would get scammed. Just take a look

    Look at the Essential Package. Theres no way that can be possible.
  16. macrumors 68040


    i prefer nikons, due to their user interface, picture quality, and customer service.

    depending on your price range, d50 or d70 or d70s
  17. macrumors regular

    Yeah i was looking at the d70s but the RebelXT has amazing reviews. I race motocross, and most of the photographers at the track rock Canon stuff.

    Edit: Ahh way to go now you have me second guessing myself lol.
  18. macrumors Penryn


    No no, not THAT thread!! Mas as well recommend THIS thread while you're at it. :p

    Anyway, I'm in the same position as you. I love photography, have very little understanding of it (eg: when I look at the numbers on lenses, I have no clue what they're talking about :eek: ). It will either be the Canon Rebel XT (which I favoured because I have experience with 7 Canon P&S cameras, 4 of which were digital), or Nikon D70s.

    I'm on the verge of getting the D70s because the Rebel XT feels like it's "Dell laptop quality" (sorry Rebel owners ;) ), its not as comfortable in your hands, and because the settings are harder to change quickly on a Rebel since some of them are in the menus. In fact, you ALWAYS have to use the menus and LCD to change settings, although Canon provides 4 shortcut arrows to help you get there faster. With the D70s, the build and layout are much better, I think. The quality of the photos is almost the same as well although the Rebel XT has less noise.

    The Nikon is built much better AND has a much better kit lens (Canon's is crap). That's what I've learned through listening to the helpful people around here. ;)

    Anyway, the Canon is good too. It arguably takes better photos (only because of that little bit of extra noise reduction), but photo quality depends mainly on your skillz as a photographer and your ability to adjust your settings properly. :eek: It's not a significant difference anyway, nor is it that important as you're not getting a great camera anyway, only a starter DSLR. I say, become skilled and worry about it when you get a better DSLR.

    You'll end up a winner no matter which camera you get.
  19. macrumors regular

    Woah, thanks for that. How much of a difference is that 2 extra megapixels that the rebel has in comparison to the d70s?
  20. macrumors Penryn


    Practically zero difference between 8MP and 6MP, and anyone who says otherwise exaggerates a lot. ;) I've seen the proof at some website. To double the number of horizontal and vertical pixels, you'd need to QUADRUPLE the number of MP. So a top-of-the-line 16 MP Canon provides 2x the number pixels along length and width when compared to a 4MP camera. It's a big deal to pros who do large prints, but not for us. Instead of photos that are 3008 x 2000 pixels (D70s), you're gonna get 3423 x 2304 photos from a Rebel XT (numbers taken from sample images).

    Lets assume that MPixels is a non-factor. The Canon still provides photos that are less noisy because it uses a CMOS sensor instead of a CCD that every other company uses. It's a big deal when taking certain types of shots (eg: at night if I set the camera to ISO 1600, which is a setting to adjust the chips sensitivity to light), but the noise difference won't be massive.
    However, if you didn't notice by holding it, the Rebel feels like cheap plastic poo. It's even prone to fingernail scratches. I know, I know.....WTF!?! It's too light and too small. I'm a guy with average size hands and the Rebel isn't comfortable. :confused:

    The Nikon D70s produces more noise, but this is only a problem in certain situations, and the noise difference isn't ginormous because you'll have noise in both images. The kit lens of the D70s is better. The build is clearly better. It's more comfortable in most people's hands. You change the settings by turning those circular dials on the back of the camera and don't need the LCD to do so, and I MUCH prefer this method. The Nikons have a longer battery life.
    Too bad it only transfers photos to your computer at USB 1 type speeds, while the Rebel XT and similarly priced competition out there use USB 2.

    After thinking about it for a long time and holding both in my hands, I'm going to change my mind and buy the Nikon D70s instead. A camera is only a tool. You still need to USE the camera that you buy, and I'm guessing that the D70s will be better to use. Rebel XT photos will be less noisy at high ISO, but your photo quality will be poor with BOTH cameras if you don't learn about the settings, and that's what is going to make the difference. :)

    If you hold the Rebel XT and D70s, and think the Rebel XT is still good, then get the Rebel XT. Many people are happy with it.
  21. macrumors 6502a


    I love the Nikon D70, but it bugs me that people only discuss Canon nad nikon cameras. Pentax, Konica-Minolta and Olympus all make great cameras too. Pentax *ist series uses the exact same CCD sensor as the D70 and has numerous things better (or worse) that Nikon, usually at a lower price, and Pentax has a great lens-making history. Konica-Minolta has a great stabilization system built into their recent models too. so remember, consider all your options, and don't be blind-sided by the CN train
  22. macrumors 65816


    Canon digi-cams almost universally come closer to analog photo quality than virtually any other brand I've looked at.
    Not sure if it's the glass, the sensor or the firmware, but the color, sharpness, noise and detail are all very nicely balanced.
    BTW, the Canon 20D is almost certainly the ideal camera to be looking at if you're truly serious about becoming a pro, but can't yet afford a high-end DSLR.

    quickie comparison; the Canon trounces the Nikon quite noticeably and is actually comparable to the 20D in terms of image quality.
    Nikon D50 (left) Canon 350D (right)
  23. macrumors 68020



    The Nikons have a longer battery life.
    Too bad it only transfers photos to your computer at USB 1 type speeds, while the Rebel XT and similarly priced competition out there use USB 2.

    This is not an issue because you don't want to be transferring via the camera anyway only in an emergency. You can buy a flash reader for about $15 which will read faster than directly from the camera at usb2.
  24. macrumors regular


    Whoah, too bad im trying to compare it to the d70s. But that is a very good comparison you have there. I dont know, i really think im just going to get the Canon. Either way im going to be getting a great camera, and the Canon is smaller, better for me to carry around everywhere.
  25. macrumors Penryn


    It's a good camera! :)

    I went to around 7 camera stores yesterday (no big box stores, just photography stores) in Sydney, and it was pretty interesting.

    - 3 sales people recommended getting the D70s because the lenses were better.

    - 2 recommended getting the Rebel XT because the lenses were better, and Canon had more lense choices.

    - 1 said it doesn't matter which one I buy, but said the Rebel XT was better for me because it was cheaper. He also recommended a Panasonic of some sort with lots of manual controls.

    (So that's 3 Rebel XT recommendations, and 3 D70s recommendations total.)

    - 1 guy gave me a blind test and showed me 3 photographs taken with 3 different cameras (all cameras that I would be interested in, he said), and asked me to pick which one I liked the most. Coincidentally, I picked the photo taken with the D70s as being the best, the Rebel XT as 2nd, and a particular Olympus model was 3rd. The Rebel XT produced a photo with colours as dull and "washed out" as my rev B's PowerBook's LCD (which has a horrid LCD), and while that photo issue could be fixed using software later, I know I won't do that for every photo I take. I'm too lazy. ;) The OIympus did as well as the D70s in this regard, but I'm quite sure that the colour of the sky isn't the same shade of blue that I saw in the Olympus photo. :p :D

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