What does "PCI Express flash storage" mean?

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by Retoucher, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. macrumors newbie

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    Jun 10, 2013
    #1
    Apparently it will be in the new Mac Pro. Think it will it be replaceable?

    Does anyone have a comparison with SSDs? SSDs have a life expectancy because after a while you can only read, but no longer write on them, what about this new PCI Express flash storage, does it also have this crucial flaw?

    Thanks!
     
  2. macrumors regular

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    #2
    http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/SSD/PCIe/OWC/Mercury_Accelsior/RAID
     
  3. macrumors P6

    Intell

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    #3
    Modern SSDs' write amounts far exceed what you'd be able to do to kill them. You'd have to write at maximum speed non-stop for about 8 years before the cell would start to degrade.
     
  4. thread starter macrumors newbie

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    Jun 10, 2013
    #4
    I would? Why are HDDs still the standard then? Sorry, my knowledge is a bit limited when it comes to storage technology. To maximize the life of my Mac Mini should I just replace the HDD with an SSD? I want it to last as long as possible and run as safely as possible from failure.
     
  5. macrumors regular

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    #5
    Cost. HDDs are MUCH cheaper than Flash drives. For $350, you can get either one 512GB SSD, or three 2TB drives.
     
  6. thread starter macrumors newbie

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    #6
    Any disadvantages?
     
  7. macrumors regular

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    #7
    Assuming Flash memory cards operate like SSD's, after so many sustained writes the drives will fail. At least thats what I read.. But SSHD's are a mixture of mechanical and chip memory which will last longer with sustained writes.



     
  8. macrumors 601

    Mr. Retrofire

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    #8
  9. macrumors G3

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    #9
    From the picture, it looks like it should be replaceable. All disks will wear out from use over time. Under normal use an SSD should last several years.
     
  10. macrumors 603

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    #10
    There is a decent chance that Apple was really talking about SATA Expresss and not really the more general PCI-e (PCI express). Technically SATA Express is a specialized superset but.....


    http://www.anandtech.com/show/6294/breaking-the-sata-barrier-sata-express-and-sff8639-connectors

    Even the PCI-e cards that folks put into current Mac Pros have a SATA controller on them. Typically what have is a small RAID (i.e., mutliple SATA lanes ) that talks to one or more bare implementatons of a SSD drive.

    SATA Express gets rid of the RAID/SATA controller so that the Flash memory controller talks directly over PCI-e like connection at PCI-e speeds. There are some basic conventions to be able to send SATA metadata.


    But with Apple's general use of hyperbole in all dog-and-pony shows.... it could just very well be a custom PCI-e card with a RAID controller on it (e.g., a build in RAID 0 what is two SSDs on the single card.)


    Disks wear out. Both HDD and SSD ones. The Flash storage controllers do lots of tap-dancing to make those two very roughly the same amounts of time. If you were freaked out about storing your data on HDDs then you probably should be freaked out about SSDs. If don't bother you on HDDs then probably should bother you on a decently implemented SSD ( older stuff from a several years ago probably should avoided, but there isn't a huge difference now. )
     
  11. macrumors 68040

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    #11
    There are already card based PCIe SSD options like Fusion-io or intel 910, it's basically getting rid of the current SATA limitation in terms of throughput. It's the same thing, but with a different (faster) interface.
     
  12. Tesselator, Jun 10, 2013
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2013

    macrumors 601

    Tesselator

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    #12
    SATA Express is a protocol interface.
    What they showed in their images is either an mSATA or an NGFF drive. I think they're about the same. One is a little wider and used card edge while NGFF is pretty new using a BGA instead. NGFF is also known as embedded micro SSD, µSSD, or uSSD.
     
  13. macrumors P6

    Peace

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    #13
    It's a PCI-Express Flash controller based Flash storage.
     

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  14. macrumors 601

    Tesselator

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    #14
    OK, I see. Yeah, from Wiki:

     
  15. macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #15
    So it could be a lot like miniSata, or not at all. That clears it up.
     
  16. macrumors 68020

    crjackson2134

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    #16
    That sounds really great. If they can offer a 1TB option for reasonable cost (Reasonable considering the technology), that would be a major plus in my book. I can't wait to play with one.
     
  17. macrumors regular

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    ar the moment on the Death Star
    #17
    Fusion's ioDrive dramatically improves application response times with a persistent,

    http://www.fusionio.com/products/iodrive/


    It's been used in severs for a few years now.



    Unparalleled Performance Density
    Fusion's ioDrive dramatically improves application response times with a persistent, high-performance, high-capacity ioMemory tier. It enables data decentralized architectures that move terabytes of process-critical data into servers. This minimizes application latency to deliver groundbreaking improvements to computing performance, while greatly reducing hardware infrastructure, maintenance, floor space, and energy costs. Minimizes latency and eliminates I/O bottlenecks by integrating with host servers as a memory tier extension.

    Accelerating Your Data
    Easily outperforms dozens of SSDs on a single server
    Accelerates applications, improves response times, and boosts efficiency
    Delivers the performance of thousands of disk drives in a single server
    From 160GB - 640GB of enterprise solid-state flash
    Easy installation and comprehensive data center management supported by the ioSphere™ Management Solution
    Approved for enterprise use by Fusion-io partners, including HP, IBM, Dell, and Supermicro
     
  18. macrumors regular

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    #18
    https://www.google.com/search?q=SSD...61,d.eWU&fp=d50b67752972a2a8&biw=1024&bih=672


    I'm willing to bet you you like in the country vs Austin or LA, your break will last much longer.

    Dude HDD break ask Drive Savers, guess what so do SSD mtf is closing.

    Really does not matter much was one day buying a drive with platters, will require going to the Goodwill. Just a matter of time and my vote is sooner tham later.
     
  19. macrumors 6502

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  20. macrumors 68000

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    #20
    But the point it makes is still valid.

    Either way, I've had numerous SSDs the oldest of which is 4 years old and the wear indicators are still 90%+ so your unlikely to run your SSD out of writes.
     
  21. macrumors 68030

    MattInOz

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    #21
  22. macrumors 6502a

    comatory

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    #22
    im using SECOND HAND 128GB SSD in my Mac Pro, its still going strong. i wouldn't worry about failure. hdd are just as prone to fail, servers get platter HDDs replaced every 4 years as a precaution in most enterprises.
     
  23. macrumors 604

    theSeb

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    #23
    From Anandtech.com:

    Regarding M.2

     
  24. macrumors P6

    Intell

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  25. Loa
    macrumors 65816

    Loa

    Joined:
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    #25
    Nope.

    There are over 200 pages in that thread, and the OP updated drives up to newer models in 2013. They're not in the original graphs, but read on.

    Loa
     

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