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ZFS Read/Write Developer Beta for Leopard
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"While we don't generally subscribe to conspiracy theories behind Apple's motivations, this constant back-and-forth about ZFS's inclusion in Leopard is suggestive of some behind-the-scenes drama with Sun's CEO's premature announcement."
No.... No conspiracy, no drama with Sun's CEO's premature announcement or anything like this.
The ZFS developer preview 1.0 is available for all ADC members, and from the ReadMe file we can read:
"ZFS is a new filesystem from Sun Microsystems which has been ported by Apple to Mac OS X. The initial (10.5.0) release of Leopard will
restrict ZFS to read-only, so no ZFS pools or filesystems can be modified or created. This Developer Preview will enable full read/write
capability, which includes the creation/destruction of ZFS pools and filesystems."
So it is clear that the initial release 10.5.0 of Leopard won't have read/write ZFS capability as officially stated by Apple. However it seems that Apple is really committed to ZFS as this developer build shows, they plan to bring the read/write capability to further updates of Leopard.
Wow, it's going to be a huge pain in the ass to wipe and reformat my system and backups when 10.5.x +1[1] (whichever includes ZFS) comes out...
[1]if you think I'm jumping on board with this one immediately... this is the file system we're talking about here, normally I install updates as soon as they come out, but I'll wait to change my filesystem until it's proven
I think Apple is getting more and more like this - denying and then all of a sudden it's out there. Creating confusion and "hype". Is it really a "confidentiality thing" with ZFS?! Can't they just say - "hey guys...we will implement ZFS...bla bla".
Give me the new iMac btw
Give me the new iMac btw
So we should expect ZFS in like, say, version 10.5.4? Funky. I've never heard of a new filesystem format introduced in the middle of an OS cycle.
Then again, wasn't that what Microsoft was going to do with WinFS? (Oops. Checked Wikipedia. They canned that idea, too.)
Then again, wasn't that what Microsoft was going to do with WinFS? (Oops. Checked Wikipedia. They canned that idea, too.)
Journaled HFS+ was introduced (at a command-line level) in the middle of an OS cycle, and was made default on the next big release. Although Journaled HFS+ doesn't require a firmware update in order to boot off of it, ZFS would (if they choose to go that route).
Peace said:
No, it isn't. ZFS is a filesystem that replaces HFS+ or NTFS, it can't wrap it. Nor can it do the magic needed to hibernate an OS. Quick OS switching was (by the description) really just putting Windows/OSX into hibernation, and restarting into the other. No different than if you hibernate Windows, and reboot into OS X now. The problem is that Vista's hibernate is really kinda non-working on many chipsets at the moment, and I wouldn't be surprised if that is why the feature got pulled.
Ok excuse my ignorance, can someone explain the real world advantages (no techno-mumbo-jumbo) of ZFS to the average consumer? Doesn't Time Machine work without ZFS anyway? There just seems to be so much hype about this filesystem; am I missing something that will change my life of computing so dramatically? Or, does one need to be a system admin that manages a huge amount of data to see the true advantage of ZFS?
ZFS isn't a file system for the average home consumer, but nine out of ten average home consumers are obsessed with it because they believe it possesses "magical" qualities. Eight out of ten are fascinated with it simply because think "ZFS" is a cool-sounding name that must be "really fast".
For the average consumer in the short term, I can see a couple of benefits. Disk corruption is a lot less likely, and in certain configurations, a corrupted disk can fix itself. It also offers built in compression, which means less data has to be transferred, so some transactions will actually be faster.
IMHO this is the kind of thing that an average consumer shouldn't worry about. Just like most consumers shouldn't really care that OS X kernel is derived from BSD. However, both concepts are significant in the scheme of things, because an OS is a lot more than the widgets you see or the app that you browse the web with (in fact, those things aren't really part of the OS anyway.)
Think of it like this- what makes a BMW different than a Kia? There is definitely a difference and most drivers can tell, even if they can't articulate the differences in mechanical engineering terms. In my opinion, the same is true for Leopard vs. Vista. Leopard is better because it is better under the hood, AND it has better seats and a nicer paint job to boot (no pun intended.)
Does ZFS have leather seats?
I've never ever seen a Windows computer consistently sleep/hibernate. Makes me wonder why Apple even considered it in the first place. (They should know by now that Windows screws things like that up.)
Command-line level? Ugh, last time I touched a command line, I nearly destroyed a Unix server. (Don't ask.) Methinks I shall avoid ZFS it it can't be set up with a point-and-click.
What excites me most about ZFS, is, if I under stand it right, that it has a kind of smart scheduling for buffered successive read write operations. In essence it could help with the thing I hate most about any OS, which is when I run a program that makes heavy use of the disk the OS pretty much freezes and becomes unresponsive (that damned beach ball). Arrrrrgh, I hate it so god damned much!
I always though that it was a windows thing and credited it to m$'s incompetent programmers. I can't tell you how disappointed I was to see the same thing happen in OSX once I pulled the trigger and made the switch.
I always though that it was a windows thing and credited it to m$'s incompetent programmers. I can't tell you how disappointed I was to see the same thing happen in OSX once I pulled the trigger and made the switch.
I'm sure that's what I am doing already!
I take the NTFS drive out of my Freecom mediaplayer stick it in an external firewire box and Hey Presto!! load it up with movies.
Maybe that's not what you mean though...
The ZFS developer preview 1.0 is available for all ADC members, and from the ReadMe file we can read:
"ZFS is a new filesystem from Sun Microsystems which has been ported by Apple to Mac OS X. The initial (10.5.0) release of Leopard will
restrict ZFS to read-only, so no ZFS pools or filesystems can be modified or created. This Developer Preview will enable full read/write
capability, which includes the creation/destruction of ZFS pools and filesystems."
So it is clear that the initial release 10.5.0 of Leopard won't have read/write ZFS capability as officially stated by Apple. However it seems that Apple is really committed to ZFS as this developer build shows, they plan to bring the read/write capability to further updates of Leopard.
So, the developer version which is now already available does support read/write, but once Leopard will be shipping (4 months from now) it will only do ZFS read-only? And Apple will probably implement the read/write capability at a future update (i.e. 10.5.1 around X-mas orso..)?
Taking their time, eh?
Nah, this is probably a very good thing. Just too bad it just isn't ready by October.
I want my software raid-z2!
First time it will be available for affordable consumer level computers.
Fast, reliable and affordable.
More space and speed with compression.
These days cpu's have lots of unused processing power and bus bandwidth is the key issue with many apps.
When Tiger got out, it was not possible to support software raid-5 with all those G3's and such...
First time it will be available for affordable consumer level computers.
Fast, reliable and affordable.
More space and speed with compression.
These days cpu's have lots of unused processing power and bus bandwidth is the key issue with many apps.
When Tiger got out, it was not possible to support software raid-5 with all those G3's and such...
Although I haven't loaded it yet, that's extremely doubtful. Booting from a ZFS drive would (if I'm not mistaken) require a firmware update, which this is not. The "developer preview" is essentially just a set of command-line tool upgrades and additions so that developers can test and use ZFS filesystems.
"ZFS is a new filesystem from Sun Microsystems which has been ported by Apple to Mac OS X. The initial (10.5.0) release of Leopard will
restrict ZFS to read-only, so no ZFS pools or filesystems can be modified or created. This Developer Preview will enable full read/write
capability, which includes the creation/destruction of ZFS pools and filesystems."
So it is clear that the initial release 10.5.0 of Leopard won't have read/write ZFS capability as officially stated by Apple. However it seems that Apple is really committed to ZFS as this developer build shows, they plan to bring the read/write capability to further updates of Leopard.
I'm confused on this. The initial release of 10.5.0 will have ZFS support but no read/write? So basically no support? What's the point if you can't even do anything with it like, you know, actually reading/writing?
That's like giving someone a book that doesn't have any pages, and that they'll get the pages a couple months from now.
Quoted from the Developer ZFS Preview readme PDF...
"ZFS is a new filesystem from Sun Microsystems which has been ported by Apple to Mac OS X. The initial (10.5.0) release of Leopard will restrict ZFS to read-only, so no ZFS pools or filesystems can be modified or created. This Developer Preview will enable full read/write capability, which includes the creation/destruction of ZFS pools and filesystems."
This stuff is publicly available same as XCode and other such utilities are, by the way. All you need is an "online" ADC member account, which is basically just an Apple ID that's been registered on the ADC site.
"ZFS is a new filesystem from Sun Microsystems which has been ported by Apple to Mac OS X. The initial (10.5.0) release of Leopard will restrict ZFS to read-only, so no ZFS pools or filesystems can be modified or created. This Developer Preview will enable full read/write capability, which includes the creation/destruction of ZFS pools and filesystems."
This stuff is publicly available same as XCode and other such utilities are, by the way. All you need is an "online" ADC member account, which is basically just an Apple ID that's been registered on the ADC site.
For instance, awesome Self Healing with ZFS. Check out the video:
http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/zfs/demos/selfheal
Man, that's an awesome technology. Of course now this makes me want to mirror my 500GB external, and those things are still pretty expensive.
What does this mean?
I have read a lot about ZFS recently - with regards to Apple in particular, but the thing I still don't understand is what the real benefit will be for regular users of OS X - especially if Time Machine will not be utilising its main benefits.
Dramatically increase productivity on OS X
I have read a lot about ZFS recently - with regards to Apple in particular, but the thing I still don't understand is what the real benefit will be for regular users of OS X - especially if Time Machine will not be utilising its main benefits.
Dramatically increase productivity on OS X