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Amethyst
Jun 16, 2007, 08:01 AM
I think many people around here think as me

for me it because "what reason to pay $2500 for last year spec workstation"
I need clovertown cpu , new graphics card and 2GB base ram



Multimedia
Jun 16, 2007, 08:36 AM
I think many people around here think as me

for me it because "what reason to pay $2500 for last year spec workstation"
I need clovertown cpu , new graphics card and 2GB base ramYes those who have proceeded to buy the first gen 8 core are very down on those of us who are still waiting for a 2007 Stoakley-Seaburg motherboard (http://techreport.com/etc/2006q4/clovertown/index.x?pg=1) and a newer-faster stock graphics card. But wait we do. The price of a complete 8-core Mac Pro is closer to $6,000 not $2500. That is why I wait like you. But please note it's not like it's not going to happen as your topic title implies. It's merely a matter of when. My guess is August because it will have been a year since the first gen Mac Pro was announced. And Intel's Clovertown prices are scheduled to plunge at the end of July. While it could be as late as October when the last gen G5 PowerMacs were announced a year and a three quarters ago, to avoid product spotlight confusion, August is more likely so that October can only be all about Leopard.

macenforcer
Jun 16, 2007, 09:30 AM
Yes, wait you could but you would have destroyed all for which they have faught. - Yoda


I am holding out for the quantum processor with biological memory with HD. Will it still run photoshop?

suneohair
Jun 16, 2007, 09:42 AM
Yes, wait you could but you would have destroyed all for which they have faught. - Yoda


I am holding out for the quantum processor with biological memory with HD. Will it still run photoshop?

Save us your banter, really. If you enjoy your 8-core thats great. However, there is a possibility I will be paying $2500 for eight cores while you paid how much?

Sure I could buy now, but I don't see a point with some major things happening with chip prices in a month. I don't NEED it now, so I will wait. Sure I want it, but I can wait.

You don't have to keep posting in these to make yourself feel better about your purchase. You bought, go to the "I love my Mac Pro" thread and quite bugging the people who decide to wait and want to discuss possibilities of the update. Thanks.

P.S. You spelled "fought" wrong. Good quote mess up did you.

macenforcer
Jun 16, 2007, 09:44 AM
Save us your banter, really. If you enjoy your 8-core thats great. However, there is a possiblity I will be paying $2500 for eight cores while you paid how much?

Sure I could buy now, but I don't see a point with some major things happening with chip prices in a month. I don't NEED it now, so I will wait. Sure I want it, but I can wait.

You don't have to keep posting in these to make yourself feel better about your purchase. You bought, go to the "I love my Mac Pro" thread and quite bugging the people who decide to wait and want to discuss possibilities of the update. Thanks.

Just getting sick and tired of all the "I want a better mac pro for cheaper" posts. You get over it. Jeez. Never heard so much whining in my life.

suneohair
Jun 16, 2007, 09:48 AM
Just getting sick and tired of all the "I want a better mac pro for cheaper" posts. You get over it. Jeez. Never heard so much whining in my life.

Except from yourself of course, whining about the whiners... :rolleyes:

Don't read. No one is making you. GO use your Mac Pro instead of posting here. You could encode some video for fun or something. I am personally done posting about it for awhile. I want one, but I am not going to get it til the update. I hope it is sooner rather than later. I can't bring myself to buy now. I like to us my money wisely and like I said with price drops on the horizon, I don't think it would be smart to buy now. Plus, I have to consider the recent MBP update as a reference to what may happen with the Pro.

macenforcer
Jun 16, 2007, 09:53 AM
All I am saying is that complaining on these forums about how the mac pro is a bad deal is getting old. If you are going to wait then wait. This is like the 10th thread that has popped up in the past few days. Mac Pro is a great deal. In a year it will be faster and cheaper. That happens EVERY year. You can wait forever with that mentality.

suneohair
Jun 16, 2007, 10:01 AM
All I am saying is that complaining on these forums about how the mac pro is a bad deal is getting old. If you are going to wait then wait. This is like the 10th thread that has popped up in the past few days. Mac Pro is a great deal. In a year it will be faster and cheaper. That happens EVERY year. You can wait forever with that mentality.

Yeah, but the Mac Pro has been the same for a year. Did you forget that? Sure if they update next year it will be faster and cheaper. But why would I buy the year old model now when an update is imminent at last by the end of the year?

I think you are deciding what our "mentality" so that is suits your argument. MY mentality is to buy when a product is updated. The eight core update to ME is not an update, nor will I be spending over $1000 to upgrade to it anyway, when soon quad cores will be faster and cheaper and could easily trickle their way into the Mac Pro on the base end.

So this isn't about waiting forever, it is about using my money in a way that makes sense and buying now does not make sense. As I have said and as this thread title says, if it was updated today in a way that I thought was good I would buy today. Everyone on these threads tries to use the "you could wait forever so buy now" crap to justify their own purchase. DO you really think posting in these thread about how "You decided to not wait" is really any better than what is happening here? Please.

macenforcer
Jun 16, 2007, 10:09 AM
Yeah, but the Mac Pro has been the same for a year. Did you forget that? Sure if they update next year it will be faster and cheaper. But why would I buy the year old model now when an update is imminent at last by the end of the year?

I think you are deciding what our "mentality" so that is suits your argument. MY mentality is to buy when a product is updated. The eight core update to ME is not an update, nor will I be spending over $1000 to upgrade to it anyway, when soon quad cores will be faster and cheaper and could easily trickle their way into the Mac Pro on the base end.

So this isn't about waiting forever, it is about using my money in a way that makes sense and buying now does not make sense. As I have said and as this thread title says, if it was updated today in a way that I thought was good I would buy today. Everyone on these threads tries to use the "you could wait forever so buy now" crap to justify their own purchase. DO you really think posting in these thread about how "You decided to not wait" is really any better than what is happening here? Please.


Waiting is fine. Complaining on the forums about waiting is just getting old. You are right. Updates are iminent. Waiting is the best logical course of action for best bang for buck. No dispute here. Fact is though that it will always be that way. So you wait 8 months to save a grand. Sure. Ok. If you had waited 14 months you would have saved 2 grand. Its endless. So what is the cut off for waiting I ask? Because apple likes to shoot out updates about a few months after everyone else has them and I tell you what nobody has what you are waiting for now. You are looking at more than 2 months in my opinion. I could be wrong but I don't think so. Just look at the apple timeline. Every update comes months after others are selling them. Then again look at the mac mini, or the macbook. Still no updates on them and those parts have been out for a while.

Waiting is smart if you don't need the system. I got lucky and sold my old Mac Pro for a bundle so I said what the heck, get the Octo. And I did. It is very fast. Even if an update comes it won't be much faster.

I have looked deep into the new intel Xeon and I can tell you what, it won't change really at all for at least 8 months. They are going to a die shrink to 45nm and that is it. Same speed, same 2 chips glued together setup. Might see 330mhz faster on top end, maybe but not at release.

I think you all will be waiting for a while and when it gets here nobody will be that impressed.

cube
Jun 16, 2007, 10:15 AM
At least you are waiting for something that WILL happen.

I am waiting for a single socket Kenstield (or upgradeable) with DDR3 or DDR2, and I'm stuck with my Cube because there's no Mac that matches my needs.

Multimedia
Jun 16, 2007, 10:16 AM
All I am saying is that complaining on these forums about how the mac pro is a bad deal is getting old. If you are going to wait then wait. This is like the 10th thread that has popped up in the past few days. Mac Pro is a great deal. In a year it will be faster and cheaper. That happens EVERY year. You can wait forever with that mentality.It was never my intention to "complain" the 8-core Mac Pro is not ready for me. What I have always written and always consistently intended was to buy the 8-core Mac Pro as soon as it has the Stoakley-Seaburg multi-core memory management chipset (http://techreport.com/etc/2006q4/clovertown/index.x?pg=1) onboard. I have never waivered from that position and have only pointed out that the current first interation of 8-cores is missing that anticipated and wanted as a minimum requirement for me to pull the trigger since November '06 element.The Stoakley platform is based on a 90-nano shrink of the Bensley architecture. Bensley's dual 1,066/1,333MHz front side busses return, this time with support for upcoming 45-nano Penryn chips. Stoakley also features plenty of PCI Express, with 44 lanes of PCIe joined by a pair of second-generation PCIe x16 links. Generation one PCIe links can be used to hook into a variety of peripheral chips to provide Serial ATA RAID, Gigabit Ethernet, and PCI-X connectivity.

Seaburg is the codename for Stoakley's Memory Controller Hub (MCH), which features four channels of FB-DIMMs at 533 or 667MHz. Up to 128GB of memory is supported—double that of Bensley's Blackford MCH. Seaburg also offers an enhanced memory controller that Intel says improves sustained throughput by 25% and a larger, smarter snoop filter optimized for quad-core chips.

The snoop filter stores coherency information on all of the cache lines mapped to system memory. The Blackford MCH's snoop filter isn't really optimized for quad-core designs; affinity groups are tied to each front-side bus, but quad-core CPUs add additional agents to those busses. With Seaburg, Intel has designed a snoop filter with four affinity groups—one for each last level cache on the front-side bus. Seaburg's snoop filter also features a new eviction algorithm, and its size has been increased to ensure complete coverage for future quad core-chips that Intel says will feature larger caches.I don't see why you need to bash us for waiting for what we know is coming next in only a matter of a few more months at most. I have looked at the cost ten times. It's over $6,000 fully loaded. I am not going to dump more than $6,000 for last year's first generation motherboard no matter how fast you think it is already. Barefeets has shown that the current Mac Pro has serious memory mismanagement leaks when it comes to multitasking multithreaded applications all at once. That is because it is missing SS and Leopard. As long as the hardware is not SS enabled this will always be the case.

None of us are saying it's a bad deal. None of us are saying it's not fast. None of us are bashing you for buying it already. In fact we are all congratulating you for your courage to do so. So please stop bashing us for waiting for what we have always been waiting for - 8 cores in a second generation Mac Pro SS motherboard. Can't we all just get along? :)

Eidorian
Jun 16, 2007, 10:21 AM
What bothers me is that the Mac Pro Stoakley-Seaburg thread (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=293910) was just fine until the just buy it now bashers showed up. The original poll was a bit much. Still, if you read back to the first to pages Multimedia apologizes for using "FrakenMac".

What's wrong with us waiting? We never forced you to wait and now you're trying to force us to buy?

slughead
Jun 16, 2007, 10:28 AM
All I am saying is that complaining on these forums about how the mac pro is a bad deal is getting old. If you are going to wait then wait. This is like the 10th thread that has popped up in the past few days. Mac Pro is a great deal. In a year it will be faster and cheaper. That happens EVERY year. You can wait forever with that mentality.

No. When it was released, it was a 'great deal'. Now, it is a 'crappy' deal.

When it was released, you couldn't even HOME BUILD a PC with those components for cheaper.

Now, you can do that and more. On top of that, there is the issue of the video cards being 18 months old and only 1GB RAM.

Therefore: crappy deal.

Not to mention, it'll go all 8 core within the next 2 months after Intel's price drops, so you'd really be quite the fool to buy now, unless of course the updates don't matter to you and you need the machine immediately.

urbanskywalker
Jun 16, 2007, 10:28 AM
In fact we are all congratulating you for your courage to do so.

Courage! Did he go to war or buy a computer?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If I read I'm going to "pull the trigger" or "I'm all in" one more time I think I will go mad.

tribe3
Jun 16, 2007, 11:34 AM
I believe there are different approaches to the purchase of a new system, and they are all valid. Whatever works for you.

Some people like to jump on the new systems without even knowing if it's buggy or not = pre-order just by the paper specs.

Others prefer to buy when the system is mature, the bugs have been ironed out with silent updates or firmwares, and the upgrades and peripherals have dropped in price.

How much was Mac Pro memory one year ago, even at crucial or neweg? Now its less than 100 bucks per gig.

The new Mac Pro will be a beast for sure but if it works only with DDR3 RAM, than it might still come out with 1 gig base and buying more RAM will set you back 3 times as bad. The same will happen with GPU's and opticals (bluray)

A loaded (not even FULLY loaded) Mac Pro will always be expensive as *****. That's the way its meant to be.

Just my opinion.

macenforcer
Jun 16, 2007, 11:36 AM
No. When it was released, it was a 'great deal'. Now, it is a 'crappy' deal.

When it was released, you couldn't even HOME BUILD a PC with those components for cheaper.

Now, you can do that and more. On top of that, there is the issue of the video cards being 18 months old and only 1GB RAM.

Therefore: crappy deal.

Not to mention, it'll go all 8 core within the next 2 months after Intel's price drops, so you'd really be quite the fool to buy now, unless of course the updates don't matter to you and you need the machine immediately.


Crappy deal? Where else can you get an 8 core system at 3ghz? Thats as cutting edge as it gets seeing as how only apple has the 3ghz quad core chip. Whats apple going to do invent a new mboard?

Umbongo
Jun 16, 2007, 11:54 AM
Crappy deal? Where else can you get an 8 core system at 3ghz? Thats as cutting edge as it gets seeing as how only apple has the 3ghz quad core chip. Whats apple going to do invent a new mboard?

Most of the discussion is aimed at both processors and GPUs being "old", but most really only are focusing on the GPU when they say the Mac Pros are outdated. There is also alot of expectation for Workstations to evolve at the same speed as consumer machines.

Though to be fair Apple did refuse to jump on the quad core chip route for 6 months, for what looks purely like trying to avoid confusing customers over what was faster. And Intel were supposed to have Stoakley out for Clovertown months ago. Realistically the chances of anything happening before or very close to the July Price cuts (it wouldn't be beyiond Apple to list new systems weeks before and not ship until later or whatever), is remote to say the least. We'll continue to see these sort of threads until then anyway, and as soon as they are shipping the focus will change to Harpertown and Stoakley, and I would think the 2nd generation DX10 GPUs.

Wild-Bill
Jun 16, 2007, 07:54 PM
Just getting sick and tired of all the "I want a better mac pro for cheaper" posts. You get over it. Jeez. Never heard so much whining in my life.

If you are so "sick and tired" of the 'I want a better mac pro' threads then why on Earth would you open up and read a thread entitled "If apple update mac pro, I will buy it" ?:confused: That makes absolutely no sense. If you're sick of hearing about people waiting for Apple to update the outdated components in the Mac Pro, don't read the threads on the topic.

I don't read posts I'm not interested in. And surely, if I was "sick" of a certain topic here on the forums, I simply wouldn't read it.

Some people want Stoakely-Seaburg. Some people want a better spec'd base configuration. Some people want DDR3 instead of FB-DIMMs. And most people, including myself, want better, current, and readily available video cards. Not only are the video card options outdated, Apple overcharges for them in the BTO options.

Example: Apple charges $149.00 to add a second 7300GT. It can be had from Newegg for $63.99

Steve announced EA and id games are coming to the Mac, presumably to capture some of the computer enthusiast/gaming market. I don't think anyone in that crowd would consider a video card released in January of 2006 to be top of the line......................:rolleyes: :apple:

Alpinism
Jun 16, 2007, 08:23 PM
If you dont NEED it now, buying the Mac Pro now is simply unwise.

statikcat
Jun 16, 2007, 10:57 PM
If you dont NEED it now, buying the Mac Pro now is simply unwise.

Very true.. and many of us in the same boat like to complain and speculate so flamers stay out :D

tribe3
Jun 17, 2007, 12:05 AM
I'm a member of about 10 forums of all the topics as hobbies I have; photo, wide format printers, my car's, my mountain and road bikes, photoshop, and of course computers (and I'm forgetting a couple). I started to read and write on these forums as a way to learn English.

On all these forums there is a group of "Should I buy or should I wait" guys. This is perfectly normal and it goes with the personality of each individual, but I do notice that these guys are the ones that suffer the most from the anxiety of buying and getting screwed by a new model coming out too soon after they pulled the trigger, or the fear of being the ones that buy into the product when it's too new and have to endure the discovery of the bugs that come with many rev.1 stuff.

For some reason I'm more impulsive and if I like the device and it has what I need I just go ahead and buy it, and I rarely regret it.

Now, of all the stuff that I use, computers is the one that I like to keep as close to cutting edge technology as possible (because I use the most for work and fun); and paradoxically it's the gadget that more often than not gets outdated (even if it doesn't get slower...). For this reason I use -- only with computers -- the money in the cookie jar every month method.

Macs are ideal for this because they keep a good resale value and normally I can change my machines every year or so without pain and I enjoy when there is a substantial upgrade in technology because I know I'll have the cash to upgrade.

I hope I didn't bore you guys too much with my story.

Bests.

statikcat
Jun 17, 2007, 12:28 AM
I am not the kind of person to normally care about things becoming outdated or anything. In fact I never have on any other purchase before ever. But in this case anytime soon when the Mac Pro updates a bunch of things the value will probably drop by half. That is a lot of money to loose out on.. this isnt about being paranoid it is about spending a lot of money verey well. This is quite a unique circumstance to me at least.

superlatic
Jun 17, 2007, 05:29 AM
im in the same boat as such, have the £££ in the bank to buy a new mac now. Either going to plump for a stripped down mac pro, or maxed out imac (whichever is updated first).

I could probably hold out until end of june, mid july absolute max before i take the plunge and buy one of the two. However, although an all 8 core lineup would be nice, I for one expect to see something along the lines of the following sooner rather than later

- Two 2.66 Ghz Intel Xeon as the stock option, getting rid of the 2.0 ghz, keeping the other options the same, using the same chipset
- 2GB Ram Base
- Base card as either NVidia 8500 or 8600/ ATI HD 2400, either with 256mb vRam, mid card as ATI HD 2900 512mb VRam, top card as NVidia FX Quatro 5600
- SLIGHT increase in size for the stock HDD to 300GB or 320GB, nothing major.

With apple, I think it is definately a case of prepare to be underwhelmed untill you are overwhelmed

And its my first post, so be kind :)

ob81
Jun 17, 2007, 06:06 AM
I am waiting for the update. Unless it doesn't come before Mid-October. I can get by with my Macbook for the time being. If I needed a comp right now, I would shell out the dough for the Mac Pro right this instant. I don't need it now though. So I am waiting.

cube
Jun 17, 2007, 06:25 AM
Some people want Stoakely-Seaburg. Some people want a better spec'd base configuration. Some people want DDR3 instead of FB-DIMMs. And most people, including myself, want better, current, and readily available video cards.

Wanting DDR3 or DDR2 DIMMs goes together with wanting only one CPU, which could be had now. For having simpler memory with two CPUs, you'll have to wait longer if the reports of Intel dropping FB-DIMMs are true.

Karpfish
Jun 17, 2007, 09:11 AM
Stop complaining like a little bi*ch.Since when does apple owe you an upgrade on anything. They are focusing on Leopard and iPhone and they are considering the 8-core an upgrade most likely. Cn you tell me what you need more than the x1900xt for? PRobably not. I'm sure 95% of the people here do not, and they are just the kind of people who want everything new and complain about it all over the internet. Yeah, but the Mac Pro has been the same for a year. Did you forget that? Sure if they update next year it will be faster and cheaper. But why would I buy the year old model now when an update is imminent at last by the end of the year?

I think you are deciding what our "mentality" so that is suits your argument. MY mentality is to buy when a product is updated. The eight core update to ME is not an update, nor will I be spending over $1000 to upgrade to it anyway, when soon quad cores will be faster and cheaper and could easily trickle their way into the Mac Pro on the base end.

So this isn't about waiting forever, it is about using my money in a way that makes sense and buying now does not make sense. As I have said and as this thread title says, if it was updated today in a way that I thought was good I would buy today. Everyone on these threads tries to use the "you could wait forever so buy now" crap to justify their own purchase. DO you really think posting in these thread about how "You decided to not wait" is really any better than what is happening here? Please.

Gloor
Jun 17, 2007, 10:45 AM
Yes those who have proceeded to buy the first gen 8 core are very down on those of us who are still waiting for a 2007 Stoakley-Seaburg motherboard (http://techreport.com/etc/2006q4/clovertown/index.x?pg=1) and a newer-faster stock graphics card. But wait we do. The price of a complete 8-core Mac Pro is closer to $6,000 not $2500. That is why I wait like you. But please note it's not like it's not going to happen as your topic title implies. It's merely a matter of when. My guess is August because it will have been a year since the first gen Mac Pro was announced. And Intel's Clovertown prices are scheduled to plunge at the end of July. While it could be as late as October when the last gen G5 PowerMacs were announced a year and a three quarters ago, to avoid product spotlight confusion, August is more likely so that October can only be all about Leopard.

I checked the link and it made me believe that Intel already released Stoakley platform. Is that correct?

Umbongo
Jun 17, 2007, 11:02 AM
I checked the link and it made me believe that Intel already released Stoakley platform. Is that correct?

Nope it's not out yet.

skye12
Jun 17, 2007, 11:17 AM
It just works out that about the time the MP is updated I'll be ready to
buy. Every once in awhile we reach these "plateau's," I call them, that are
great times to buy.

An added bonus is Leopard. October is the month if you can wait imo.

Gloor
Jun 17, 2007, 11:20 AM
Do we know when Stoakley is going to be released?

Glass
Jun 17, 2007, 11:34 AM
I just purchased a mac pro. I also purchased the 4 gig upgrade from crucial, and a few extra hard drives.. I got the x1900 upgrade option too.

I know its all about a year old.. and I don't really even 'need' a computer right now. I could use it though, and I am completely happy with the specs and price. So I went for it and plan to enjoy it everyday. If a crazy new computer comes out next week that's okay with me, and I think most people on the market probably think like this. If you want or need a computer.. go get it. you'll be using it for 3-4 years at least anyhow..

Cheers

slughead
Jun 17, 2007, 11:53 AM
I think the problem is that people want the best bang for the buck, and are waiting for the new Mac Pro models to come out, are pissed with all the delays.

Some are suffering financially or are being forced into utilizing temporary solutions.

I've got a friend who has essentially 'called it quits' on buying a MP after the bust at WWDC and may not be purchasing until 2008.

Not everyone can afford to buy a year-old computer at year-old prices. Some people have to be more thrifty, and with the promise of a revised mac pro just around the corner, they can't really afford to pass up the opportunity.

Thus far Apple has delayed leopard and has been sedentary in their MP updates. People who were counting on all these things coming together this summer have been totally screwed by Apple and the iPhone.

Umbongo
Jun 17, 2007, 01:24 PM
Thus far Apple has delayed leopard and has been sedentary in their MP updates. People who were counting on all these things coming together this summer have been totally screwed by Apple and the iPhone.

I guess the problem here is that they were going on rumours mostly started on places like this where people turn what they want into "what's comming". If more people considered, Intel's roadmaps,Apple's history of product revision (especially during the new Intel cycles), and applied some common sense they would have seen that new MPs weren't comming "next week" but at the earliest some time mid summer.

suneohair
Jun 17, 2007, 04:53 PM
Stop complaining like a little bi*ch.Since when does apple owe you an upgrade on anything. They are focusing on Leopard and iPhone and they are considering the 8-core an upgrade most likely. Cn you tell me what you need more than the x1900xt for? PRobably not. I'm sure 95% of the people here do not, and they are just the kind of people who want everything new and complain about it all over the internet.

What is your problem? You must be trying to justify your purchase too huh?

I am in no way complaining, I have having a discusion with people who are waiting for an upgrade like me. I don't even want the X1900XT, I don't game. I do want something newer than the base 7300GT, and when they do that I am sure it will stil be out of date.

You are right, Apple doesn't owe me a damn thing. However, I am not STUPID enough to buy when they will be updating it and when the Mac Pro is a year old.

I have no problem waiting. And like I said, I am discussing possiblities with people who are waiting as well. Why don't you go spend your time doing something else instead of complaining about the people who are "complaining".

I suggest you check your attitude, if you don't want to hear people "complain" don't read the thread.

I guess the problem here is that they were going on rumours mostly started on places like this where people turn what they want into "what's comming". If more people considered, Intel's roadmaps,Apple's history of product revision (especially during the new Intel cycles), and applied some common sense they would have seen that new MPs weren't comming "next week" but at the earliest some time mid summer.

They will come when they come. I decided I can wait. Hell, I will get more reading and studying done anyhow. I don't understand why some of you feel the need to come in here and bash us for deciding to wait and being slightly frustrated with the lack of updates at WWDC, the most likley time to upgrade (note: I did not want fanfare, I just wanted an update).

But whatever, I will just wait. Some of you should take Karpfishs' advice and stop acting like little b*tches, including Karpfish himself.

DavoMrMac
Jun 18, 2007, 03:21 AM
Just wanted to chime in, with all these people saying "Why are people moaning?"… speculating about machines that don't even exist… wanting to guess at when a new model will be out…

Well, after all, this forum is all part of Mac Rumors, so enjoy :)

mdntcallr
Jun 18, 2007, 07:39 AM
apple needs to start updating their mac pros more frequently. i am in the market of buying a new one. but the old model is so unattractive cost wise.

want it with blu-ray built in.

tribe3
Jun 18, 2007, 08:30 AM
apple needs to start updating their mac pros more frequently. i am in the market of buying a new one. but the old model is so unattractive cost wise.

want it with blu-ray built in.

Sure, it will be great to buy a $4000 computer (once you put some RAM and Hard drives) and have it get outdated every 3 or 4 months...

You have consumer PCs for that, with consumer processors and components.

The Mac Pro as much "outdated" as it might be is still the most powerful workstation on the market and it will rock with all the pro apps that you throw at it - even with the GT7300 card.

Maybe Apple should come out with a gamers machine, with the cheaper but still powerful consumer processors, mobo, and other bits, but with the latest and gratest graphic cards (even though the Ati X1900 will play any game at full rez with very decent fps)

I think Apples policy with their Pro line is OK, and you don't hear anybody that uses the MP for serious work complaining about the machine being slow or old.

ob81
Jun 18, 2007, 09:10 AM
Sure, it will be great to buy a $4000 computer (once you put some RAM and Hard drives) and have it get outdated every 3 or 4 months...

You have consumer PCs for that, with consumer processors and components.

The Mac Pro as much "outdated" as it might be is still the most powerful workstation on the market and it will rock with all the pro apps that you throw at it - even with the GT7300 card.

Maybe Apple should come out with a gamers machine, with the cheaper but still powerful consumer processors, mobo, and other bits, but with the latest and gratest graphic cards (even though the Ati X1900 will play any game at full rez with very decent fps)

I think Apples policy with their Pro line is OK, and you don't hear anybody that uses the MP for serious work complaining about the machine being slow or old.

I agree m8. The Mac Pro as it is, is VERY powerful, and evidence of its longevity is shown with previous systems such as the Power Mac G5 that people still use today(would have even longer life had the entire "intel" thing not happened). Apple is growing. What we must ask ourselves is:
1: What is bringing in the most money for Apple(comp-wise)?
2: What audience is buying into Macs?

Pro-level to amateur photographers, musicians, and artist use Macs. This group used Macs way before the big hype that we see now, with the influx of younger buyers (again, a lot of amateur digital life users). I agree that with this influx of younger buyers, most want a more powerful system, but one thats catered more so to the gaming community.

People stress that they are waiting for a new system, mainly because the current one, though to be one of the more powerful systems available, is still arguably a sub performer in the gaming world.

shipdestroyer
Jun 18, 2007, 09:46 AM
Newsflash: computer parts are outdated quickly, and Apple issues relatively few hardware upgrades.

suneohair
Jun 18, 2007, 10:04 AM
I agree m8. The Mac Pro as it is, is VERY powerful, and evidence of its longevity is shown with previous systems such as the Power Mac G5 that people still use today(would have even longer life had the entire "intel" thing not happened). Apple is growing. What we must ask ourselves is:
1: What is bringing in the most money for Apple(comp-wise)?
2: What audience is buying into Macs?

Pro-level to amateur photographers, musicians, and artist use Macs. This group used Macs way before the big hype that we see now, with the influx of younger buyers (again, a lot of amateur digital life users). I agree that with this influx of younger buyers, most want a more powerful system, but one thats catered more so to the gaming community.

People stress that they are waiting for a new system, mainly because the current one, though to be one of the more powerful systems available, is still arguably a sub performer in the gaming world.

I am far from a gamer. In fact, I play zero PC games. So spare me the "influx of gamers to the Mac stuff." I have been using Macs for about 3 years now, I come from a long history of building computers. So I know my stuff and I know when to buy and when not to buy. And this is a bad time to buy a Mac Pro. There are HUGE price drops next month, HUGE!

With that in mind do you really think it is foolish to wait? I think. And shipdestroyer, no duh. Parts are outdated quickly, thanks for the new information. :rolleyes: And yes, Apple released few hardware updates, however the Mac Pro has been the same for close to a year.

Yes the Mac Pro is a beast, I had one last year, but it will be even more of a beast by the end of year. And that wait is worth it to me. No one is saying the Mac Pro is garbage, I am saying it is outdated and with new pricing and parts on the horizon, I would rather wait and be smart with my money than to buy now.

If you don't want to discuss Mac Pro update information, please see yourself out of this thread. Go use your Mac Pros, please. I don't understand what drives some of you to come in here and knock on people for waiting when you do nothing but make generalizations and are horribly rude.

ob81
Jun 18, 2007, 11:04 AM
I am far from a gamer. In fact, I play zero PC games. So spare me the "influx of gamers to the Mac stuff." I have been using Macs for about 3 years now, I come from a long history of building computers. So I know my stuff and I know when to buy and when not to buy. And this is a bad time to buy a Mac Pro. There are HUGE price drops next month, HUGE!

With that in mind do you really think it is foolish to wait? I think. And shipdestroyer, no duh. Parts are outdated quickly, thanks for the new information. :rolleyes: And yes, Apple released few hardware updates, however the Mac Pro has been the same for close to a year.

Yes the Mac Pro is a beast, I had one last year, but it will be even more of a beast by the end of year. And that wait is worth it to me. No one is saying the Mac Pro is garbage, I am saying it is outdated and with new pricing and parts on the horizon, I would rather wait and be smart with my money than to buy now.

If you don't want to discuss Mac Pro update information, please see yourself out of this thread. Go use your Mac Pros, please. I don't understand what drives some of you to come in here and knock on people for waiting when you do nothing but make generalizations and are horribly rude.


Erm, I guess I didn't make it clear that I for one am waiting. I plan on waiting until about Oct 15th. I figure an update will be out well before then.
I am all for buying now though, the computer is still awesome.
Personally, Apple is up 3-0 on me. They got me when I bought my 12" powerbook. They got me when I got my Macbook. They got me after I got my G5 iSight iMac too. I will be damned if I let them get me when I get my Mac Pro!!

Weeks after I got my powerbook and iMac the whole intel thing popped off.

macenforcer
Jun 18, 2007, 11:29 AM
These threads are funny for this reason.


People who need the 8 core mac pro want to wait for something even faster. :rolleyes:

Everyone else just buys the quad. There is no market left for the 8 core. LOL.

suneohair
Jun 18, 2007, 11:40 AM
These threads are funny for this reason.


People who need the 8 core mac pro want to wait for something even faster. :rolleyes:

Everyone else just buys the quad. There is no market left for the 8 core. LOL.

Wrong. If you have money to shell out for the 8-core then go for it. You are getting the fastest quad Xeons out there. Unless you are waiting for the 45nm chips there is no reason to wait now if you want octo.

Now, if they want 8-core but are still unhappy with the video offerings... well they have the right to wait. Since the current offerings are horribly outdated.

And again, an all 8-core line at the todays pricing is very likely considering the huge price drops coming.

I don't think it is about waiting for something faster, but naturally you like are the king of assumptions and generalizations to further your weak arguments. Talking about being bored...

Erm, I guess I didn't make it clear that I for one am waiting. I plan on waiting until about Oct 15th. I figure an update will be out well before then.
I am all for buying now though, the computer is still awesome.
Personally, Apple is up 3-0 on me. They got me when I bought my 12" powerbook. They got me when I got my Macbook. They got me after I got my G5 iSight iMac too. I will be damned if I let them get me when I get my Mac Pro!!

Weeks after I got my powerbook and iMac the whole intel thing popped off.

Don't let them get you this time! Just wait it out! I will be here for support :D

cube
Jun 18, 2007, 11:47 AM
These threads are funny for this reason.


People who need the 8 core mac pro want to wait for something even faster. :rolleyes:

Everyone else just buys the quad. There is no market left for the 8 core. LOL.

- There's people waiting for 2-core or 4-core single socket Core 2 tower.
- There's people waiting for Seaburg, regardless of the number of cores (RNC).
- There's people waiting for better graphics cards, RNC.
- There's people waiting for Intel (so Apple) price cuts, RNC.
- I doubt there's more than a few people wating for faster octocore.

psychofreak
Jun 18, 2007, 11:58 AM
If the Mac Pro line-up went 8-core only...it would seem a bit odd to have a 4x jump from consumer to pro machines...

macenforcer
Jun 18, 2007, 12:00 PM
- There's people waiting for 2-core or 4-core single socket Core 2 tower.
- There's people waiting for Seaburg, regardless of the number of cores (RNC).
- There's people waiting for better graphics cards, RNC.
- There's people waiting for Intel (so Apple) price cuts, RNC.
- I doubt there's more than a few people wating for faster octocore.

Umm you forgot blue ray. :D

Umbongo
Jun 18, 2007, 01:01 PM
If the Mac Pro line-up went 8-core only...it would seem a bit odd to have a 4x jump from consumer to pro machines...

Yeah, really there are many options open to Apple, sadly for the consumer it looks like most choices hinge on what they want to do with price points and marketing, and what Jobs thinks is cool.

macenforcer
Jun 18, 2007, 02:11 PM
Wrong. If you have money to shell out for the 8-core then go for it. You are getting the fastest quad Xeons out there. Unless you are waiting for the 45nm chips there is no reason to wait now if you want octo.

Now, if they want 8-core but are still unhappy with the video offerings... well they have the right to wait. Since the current offerings are horribly outdated.

And again, an all 8-core line at the todays pricing is very likely considering the huge price drops coming.

I don't think it is about waiting for something faster, but naturally you like are the king of assumptions and generalizations to further your weak arguments. Talking about being bored...



Don't let them get you this time! Just wait it out! I will be here for support :D


Wrong. Argument has no basis.

Wild-Bill
Jun 18, 2007, 03:06 PM
These threads are funny for this reason.


People who need the 8 core mac pro want to wait for something even faster. :rolleyes:

Everyone else just buys the quad. There is no market left for the 8 core. LOL.

I haven't seen anyone waiting for "faster 8 cores". It's about the OUTDATED VIDEO CARDS. Plain and simple.

sonarghost
Jun 18, 2007, 03:22 PM
Newsflash: computer parts are outdated quickly, and Apple issues relatively few hardware upgrades.

for some reason i really liked this simple but enlightening statement...

suneohair
Jun 18, 2007, 03:33 PM
Wrong. Argument has no basis.

You are coming to a sad realization. Accept or Deny?

Really, if you can't back up your claims, please don't post. You obviously don't know much. Your arguments are terrible. Go play with your expensive Mac Pro, as I assume you got it to do actual work right? Instead of complaining about the complainers you should really use your Mac Pro so that when I get an 8-core for $1999 (ADC) you will feel like you got your moneys worth.

I haven't seen anyone waiting for "faster 8 cores". It's about the OUTDATED VIDEO CARDS. Plain and simple.

Sorry Didn't use multiquote...again

macenforcer
Jun 18, 2007, 03:46 PM
You are coming to a sad realization. Accept or Deny?

Really, if you can't back up your claims, please don't post. You obviously don't know much. Your arguments are terrible. Go play with your expensive Mac Pro, as I assume you got it to do actual work right? Instead of complaining about the complainers you should really use your Mac Pro so that when I get an 8-core for $1999 (ADC) you will feel like you got your moneys worth.

Please explain????

suneohair
Jun 18, 2007, 04:45 PM
Please explain????

What am I explaining exactly? You come in here and tell us what we want, we had this problem in the other thread as well. People saying "sounds like you want a price drop."

I am not waiting for a faster octo machine, I am waiting for cheaper octos since I know the price is coming down. If you can't understand that, again, don't post.

I also want updated graphics options. Not stuff from nearly a year and a half ago.

tribe3
Jun 18, 2007, 05:15 PM
What am I explaining exactly? You come in here and tell us what we want, we had this problem in the other thread as well. People saying "sounds like you want a price drop."

I am not waiting for a faster octo machine, I am waiting for cheaper octos since I know the price is coming down. If you can't understand that, again, don't post.

I also want updated graphics options. Not stuff from nearly a year and a half ago.

By the time the octos are at your price point they're gonna be old technology and you'll be waiting for the 16 Quad-cores to drop in price.

How was it that you could buy the computer you are using now to write all your complaints?

macenforcer
Jun 18, 2007, 06:09 PM
What am I explaining exactly? You come in here and tell us what we want, we had this problem in the other thread as well. People saying "sounds like you want a price drop."

I am not waiting for a faster octo machine, I am waiting for cheaper octos since I know the price is coming down. If you can't understand that, again, don't post.

I also want updated graphics options. Not stuff from nearly a year and a half ago.

Whats wrong with the current graphics cards? Are you a gamer?

statikcat
Jun 18, 2007, 06:19 PM
By the time the octos are at your price point they're gonna be old technology and you'll be waiting for the 16 Quad-cores to drop in price.

How was it that you could buy the computer you are using now to write all your complaints?

Come on.. I understand some people disagree with our logic but you act baffled. There is a big difference between tech that is 1 year old AND known to be near drastic price reduction.. and processors that are a few months old and NEW to a certain price point.

macenforcer
Jun 18, 2007, 06:26 PM
Come on.. I understand some people disagree with our logic but you act baffled. There is a big difference between tech that is 1 year old AND known to be near drastic price reduction.. and processors that are a few months old and NEW to a certain price point.

If you want the price reduction then just wait. I don't understand the point of these complaint threads. Its not going to make apple do it faster.

- Price reductions coming in August.
- Leapord on machines in October
- New platform will apear December or late January most likely.

These are the dates to wait for. Nothing is going to happen earlier. Just pick the date that you want to wait for. Apple is doing nothing wrong. There is NO NEW TECH FOR THEM TO GIVE YOU NOW.

slughead
Jun 18, 2007, 10:51 PM
Whats wrong with the current graphics cards? Are you a gamer?

What the hell is wrong with you? He already said NO.

Maybe he just doesn't want to pay 2006 prices for 2006 products? Maybe the X1900 XT is a crappily designed card with well known heat problems. Maybe the Quadro 4500 is incredibly overpriced. Maybe the 7300 is to oobsolete to be in a 'top of the line' machine.

Maybe, since Apple IS upgrading them soon, he doesn't want to settle for the year-old machine out now.

Within 1 month clovertowns will cost the same as woodcrests do now. They'll probably update video card options soon as well.

Your argument: WTF! This comp was great in 2006 and is great now! Pay 2006 prices and quit complaining--because someone has a gun to my head forcing me to read every thread I don't agree with!

His argument: Why would I pay full price for something so old? Suck my buttcheeks. I don't care what you think is fair, this is what I want, stop arguing with why I want it.

Wild-Bill
Jun 18, 2007, 11:17 PM
There is NO NEW TECH FOR THEM TO GIVE YOU NOW.

YES THERE IS!!!!! You must not have paid attention to my post on the FIRST page of this thread, or you are retarded.


THE VIDEO CARDS ARE OLD... OLD OLD OLD OLD!!!! And there IS new tech on the market to remedy that. Ever heard of the 8800GTX?? How about the x2900Xt?? To add insult to injury, they STILL charge outrageous prices for that old tech. You can buy a new 7300GT on Newegg for $64.00, yet to add a 'second' 7300GT to the Mac Pro it costs $149.00. :mad:

Get off your high horse. You have your Mac Pro. Go play with it and leave us alone. If you're so tired of the "complaint" threads, DON'T READ THEM!!!

What does the thread title say??? Uh huh. Then WHY do you poke your nose into the thread when you KNOW people will be complaining about the LACK OF UPDATES to the Mac Pro???!!

Madhawk
Jun 19, 2007, 03:07 AM
I am moving from PC to Mac by the end of the year. The MacBook Pro and the iMac are getting or have been updated this year, so there's a very good chance of the Mac Pro being updated by the end of the year, that's 6 months away.

So if you are planning to buy a Mac Pro, I say wait. You will get new Specs and Leopard included. Wait until December 2007, think of it as a Christmas present. You won't regret it. Good things come to those who wait. ;)

Regards...:apple:

mavherzog
Jun 19, 2007, 05:24 AM
Personally, I think things are going to work out pretty good for me. I am in Iraq right now and won't be buying (obviously) until I return home. At the soonest, that will be towards the end of the year...maybe as late as next spring.

Gloor
Jun 19, 2007, 05:51 AM
Personally, I think things are going to work out pretty good for me. I am in Iraq right now and won't be buying (obviously) until I return home. At the soonest, that will be towards the end of the year...maybe as late as next spring.


Wow, just out of interest. What are you doing in Iraq? Journalist?