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Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 12:28 PM
I've seriously had enough of this now. I love using Leopard and really don't want to go back to Tiger but it looks like that's what I'm gonna have to do until this wireless problem is fixed. Like many people, using WPA causes the connection to drop during normal internet use. So I changed it to the less secure WEP and I was able to use the internet more or less normally ... except for large file downloads.

Every time I try and use a program like Software Update the connection will just drop in less than a minute. Only by using a completely UNSECURE connection can I download large files properly. I was hoping that the last Leopard update would have fixed the problem but alas nothing. I've been following this thread on the Apple website and it looks like a lot of people still seem to be affected despite various attempts to try and come up with a solution by themselves:

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1195706&tstart=165

I bought my MBP so I could use it in a portable way with the freedom of wireless and it's annoying that I can't. And I know from various websites and forums including MacRumors that there's a lot of other people out there who are having to suffer in the same way, or compromise and get themselves a really long network cable!

How long is it gonna take?

I would've expected something like this from a new release of Windows but not Mac OS. Have they even admitted there's a problem? What was Tiger like when that was released; did it have annoying problems that were eventually fixed and if so how long did it take?

Finally, if I decide to use an unsecure network will data being sent over HTTPS (such as a banking site) still be secure? Or is using HTTPS over an unsecure wireless network a big no no? (It certainly sounds like a bad idea!)

Cheers :)



Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 12:32 PM
Are you going through a router when this problem occurs ?

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 12:38 PM
Are you going through a router when this problem occurs ?

Yes I am.

No problem when connected up with a cable, just the wireless. I've tried loads of different options on the router but WEP and Unsecure are the only ones that seem to work. And it works perfectly well when using Tiger or Windows.

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 12:41 PM
What kind of router is it? Is it a .N ? and are you using .N only wide channel config?

If you have a wireless device that's not .N going through the router it will slow down to the lowest speed wireless device.

cohibadad
Nov 26, 2007, 12:46 PM
Have you contacted Apple? Is this a known issue on some Macs? The reason I ask is because I haven't seen this problem on the 13 Macs we use which are a combination of new intels, upgraded intel MBPs, upgraded G4 PB and upgraded G4 PM.

danny_w
Nov 26, 2007, 12:46 PM
Sorry I can't help with the wireless problem (I'm still on Tiger), but to answer your question, Tiger had its share of problems as well. Tiger did not become stable enough to use (at least for me) until 10.4.3 (Panther was still much more stable and MUCH faster). I would expect the same from Leopard, so I have no plans to upgrade for a while yet. Hope you get your issues resolved.

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 12:46 PM
What kind of router is it? Is it a .N ? and are you using .N only wide channel config?

I have a "Sweex Wireless Broadband Router 11G" so I assume it's a .g rather than .n

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 12:52 PM
I have a "Sweex Wireless Broadband Router 11G" so I assume it's a .g rather than .n


Technical Details

Standard, downwards compatible with IEEE802.11b WLAN
Compatible with IEEE 802.3 and IEEE 802.3u Fast Ethernet
Compatible with PPTP
PPoE
Static IP and DHCP Client
Security with Wired Equivalent Privacy 64/128 bits
Data speed: 54 Mbps
MAC filtering
1x 10Base-T/100Base-TX to the WAN port
4x 10Base-T/100Base-TX to the LAN ports
Auto MDI/MDIX on the LAN and WAN ports
Windows 98SE / ME / 2000 / XP compatible




I'd suggest getting a new router.

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 12:52 PM
Have you contacted Apple? Is this a known issue on some Macs?

Yeah I told them, like a lot of other people have. It is weird how some people are having problems and others aren't. Hopefully Apple can get the bottom of it and the more data they get from users the more easily they'll be able to work out which factors are causing the problem.

Sorry I can't help with the wireless problem (I'm still on Tiger), but to answer your question, Tiger had its share of problems as well. Tiger did not become stable enough to use (at least for me) until 10.4.3 (Panther was still much more stable and MUCH faster). I would expect the same from Leopard, so I have no plans to upgrade for a while yet. Hope you get your issues resolved.

Yeah, I anticipated problems from Leopard but I was expecting more user interface issues rather than something as fundamental as wireless, especially as it was working so well in Tiger.

I know I sound angry but I can't complain in all fairness. I love Leopard's new features and it's only really large downloads that cause problems which I can always download at night setting my network to unsecure I suppose. I bought Leopard at a good price so I didn't mind taking the risk especially as I knew I had Tiger on hand in case things went wrong.

I just hope they release a new update soon though ... ! :D


I'd suggest getting a new router.

But why? It works perfectly well with Tiger, Windows and Linux.

Or are you saying my router's out of date in terms of specs? I did buy it over a year ago at a pretty cheap price I have to admit! Haha.

Spend over $3000 on a MBP and nothing on a router. That's life!

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 01:00 PM
Yes I'm saying that router is out of date spec wise.Especially when you're using a .N wireless card in your Mac.

It would definitely help.A lot.

The new routers are cheap.

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 01:08 PM
My cousin's got a new router, I'll go round to his and see what type it is and whether it fixes the problems on my MBP. If it does and Apple don't release a new update any time soon then it looks like I might have to splash out on a new router this Christmas!

Thanks for your help mate. The whole .N thing never crossed my head as a possible problem!

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 01:13 PM
Yup the router makes all the difference.I use an AEBS router connected to a cable modem and my rate is always around 270.

danny_w
Nov 26, 2007, 01:16 PM
Yup the router makes all the difference.I use an AEBS router connected to a cable modem and my rate is always around 270.
I had considered buying an AEBS but have read about so many having problems with it lately (esp. related to dropouts and resets) that I was scared to do so. What version h/w (newer 1Gb or older 100Mb) and f/w are you running?

iJawn108
Nov 26, 2007, 01:23 PM
SMC Routers work nice with my macbook if thats any help

Megatron
Nov 26, 2007, 01:24 PM
Another vote here for trying a new router. I have a cheap Belkin wireless router and WPA is working fine for me in leopard.

milk242
Nov 26, 2007, 01:26 PM
I use to have a dlink that would drop my mbp connection frequently but not my other pc computers. All I did was change my router to buffalo and now I never get a dropped connection on my mbp

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 01:27 PM
I had considered buying an AEBS but have read about so many having problems with it lately (esp. related to dropouts and resets) that I was scared to do so. What version h/w (newer 1Gb or older 100Mb) and f/w are you running?

I'm using the rev.a 100Mb and it runs like a charm.I have it on almost constantly with a PC and a Macbook and Mac Pro going through it.

Mindflux
Nov 26, 2007, 01:28 PM
My AEBSn (Gigabit) works great! :D

dr_lha
Nov 26, 2007, 01:29 PM
Yes I'm saying that router is out of date spec wise.Especially when you're using a .N wireless card in your Mac.

It would definitely help.A lot.

The new routers are cheap.
Throwing hardware at software problems is a mug's game.

This guy doesn't need a new router. I'm using a 4 year old router with my Mac and it works great, as it should. Most cable companies provide internet connection rates that wouldn't even Max out a "B" Router, let alone a "G" or "N". I wouldn't see any real benefit from spending $200 on a "N" router personally.

Luckily I'm not having issues with Leopard and Wireless, and I have a MBP with a "N" card.

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 01:32 PM
Throwing hardware at software problems is a mug's game.

This guy doesn't need a new router. I'm using a 4 year old router with my Mac and it works great, as it should. Most cable companies provide internet connection rates that wouldn't even Max out a "B" Router, let alone a "G" or "N". I wouldn't see any real benefit from spending $200 on a "N" router personally.

Luckily I'm not having issues with Leopard and Wireless, and I have a MBP with a "N" card.


Well ya know if it were a software problem I would have the same problem but I don't.

It's SOP to duplicate problems in order for it to be a bug.

Alloye
Nov 26, 2007, 01:33 PM
No wireless problems here. I'm using an AEBS (100 Mbps) in b/g compatible mode.

dr_lha
Nov 26, 2007, 01:35 PM
Well ya know if it were a software problem I would have the same problem but I don't.
How do you figure?

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 01:41 PM
How do you figure?

Bugs have a tendency to be found in any Mac with the same brand Airport card.

vanmacguy
Nov 26, 2007, 01:42 PM
I'm using a newer DLink N router on a MBP with Leopard and have no problems at all.

It might not be that your router needs to be replaced because it's out of spec, it may be degrading. If it's a few years old it might just be wearing out. Given that these things are so cheap, I don't personally expect a long life from them and probably replace mine every two years.

Cheers.

dr_lha
Nov 26, 2007, 01:51 PM
Bugs have a tendency to be found in any Mac with the same brand Airport card.
There are too many variables to make such a blanket statement I'm afraid. The facts however, are clear: The threat starter's hardware has not changed, only the software has changed (Tiger->Leopard). Everything worked fine on Tiger, but doesn't on Leopard.

That's a software problem, not a hardware one.

To the thread starter: Did you do a clean install of Leopard or an upgrade?

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 01:58 PM
It might not be that your router needs to be replaced because it's out of spec, it may be degrading. If it's a few years old it might just be wearing out ...

But how does that explain why it works perfectly well with Tiger and Windows?

There are too many variables to make such a blanket statement I'm afraid. The facts however, are clear: The threat starter's hardware has not changed, only the software has changed (Tiger->Leopard). Everything worked fine on Tiger, but doesn't on Leopard.

That's a software problem, not a hardware one.

To the thread starter: Did you do a clean install of Leopard or an upgrade?

I'd heard of problems with people doing an "Upgrade" or "Archive and Install" so I went for the whole hog and did a complete clean install. Looks like I still couldn't avoid the problems that others before me seemed to be experiencing though!

razorme
Nov 26, 2007, 02:06 PM
But how does that explain why it works perfectly well with Tiger and Windows?

I'd heard of problems with people doing an "Upgrade" or "Archive and Install" so I went for the whole hog and did a complete clean install. Looks like I still couldn't avoid the problems that others before me seemed to be experiencing though!

I have had problems ever since that one update in Tiger (10.4.10 I believe) on my MBP where I would lose connections all the time. I finally got rid of the old PPC kernal extensions that were carried over through all my OS X upgrades and now it doesn't drop the connection anymore - but I will get stalls which take a few seconds to recover from. I solve this problem by streaming a 24 kbps station on iTunes (at 0% volume). I have a new D-Link DIR-655 Wireless N/Gigabit router.

I wonder sometimes where I should just get a new router as well - I have heard people say the D-Links just don't work well with the wireless hardware in Macs. (Note: Upgrading to Leopard didn't change anything).

darbyclash34
Nov 26, 2007, 02:06 PM
I am having a problem in that networks that work completely under 10.4.9, like my local free wireless network, don't even show up under 10.4.10, 10.4.11, 10.5, or 10.5.1! My brother was just here with his year old MacBook, and he was getting full signal strength! It doesn't even show up on my list of available networks! This is on a brand new (shipped with a Leopard drop-in disc) MacBook Pro. I can't see why an older, half as expensive machine should be so much better than my brand new machine.

Shawn

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 02:17 PM
I have had problems ever since that one update in Tiger (10.4.10 I believe) on my MBP where I would lose connections all the time.

I am having a problem in that networks that work completely under 10.4.9, like my local free wireless network, don't even show up under 10.4.10, 10.4.11, 10.5, or 10.5.1!

You know what lads, before I did a clean install of Leopard I'm sure I remember installing the lastest updates. Can't remember if they were for Tiger or just for the MBP or a combination of both.

Could that have affected the firmware for the built in wireless in any way you think? Or were they strictly software updates? After installing the updates I literally went off and did the Leopard install so I never had chance to check whether the updates themselves could also have been a cause of the problems!

darbyclash34
Nov 26, 2007, 02:20 PM
I did notice that while my brother and me had the same Airport Model info, he did have an older firmware version.

Shawn

Neutral Gamer
Nov 26, 2007, 02:31 PM
My Firmware version is 1.2.2 and my "Wireless Card Locale" is set to USA even though I'm in the UK. Anyway to change that or is it set automatically / when bought?

Any of those two pieces of information mean anything to anyone and think they could have an effect?

Wild-Bill
Nov 26, 2007, 02:34 PM
Powerbook G4 12", Leopard. No problems with a D-Link DGL-4300 "Gamerlounge" wireless G router.

Also, when home for the holiday no problems with my PB nor my sister's SR Macbook w/ Leopard going through a Netgear 614 v6 wireless router. However, I told her not to update to 10.5.1 yet b/c of the freezing keyboard issue.

Hope this helps anyone.

darbyclash34
Nov 26, 2007, 04:18 PM
I also have firmware version 1.2.2 and my location is set to the US, but thats correct. My brothers non buggy Airport had firmware 1.0.4 I believe, definitely something in the 1.0.x series. Wonder if we can find a trend?

SiliconAddict
Nov 26, 2007, 04:54 PM
Yes I'm saying that router is out of date spec wise.Especially when you're using a .N wireless card in your Mac.

It would definitely help.A lot.

The new routers are cheap.


He does NOT need to upgrade his router simply because he has an N card in his laptop. :rolleyes:

Draddy
Nov 26, 2007, 06:30 PM
I had to buy a new router completely when I bought leopard... .neither my MBP or my iBook would connect to my old belkin router.... I had had enough anyways (extremely slow) so I bought a new netgear rangemax and haven't really had any more problems.

Peace
Nov 26, 2007, 06:32 PM
He does NOT need to upgrade his router simply because he has an N card in his laptop. :rolleyes:

I never said he "needed" to upgrade it.I said it would help a lot.:)

geoking66
Nov 26, 2007, 08:34 PM
No wireless problem here with Leopard, I'm wireless with a Wireless G router across the house (on an iMac).

vansouza
Nov 26, 2007, 09:29 PM
I have no problem with my MBP. It only connects wirelessly through a Netgear router. I upgraded from Tiger to Leopard, if that makes a difference.

Mlobo01
Dec 2, 2007, 06:25 PM
I upgraded my external drive (via usb 2.0) to test it out, the very first issue was that I could not connect to my router it could not find it, I have the router with its ssid in non-bradcasting mode and under password protected, it could not find it and when it did find the signal it would get lost upon restart. I knew that under Tiger by deleting some of the plist files it would improve, so I deleted the entire prefs folder under the user account and under the system account, it did improve but it remain even better when I changed the location from automatic to "home" as for Tiger there where similar issues but everyone forgets because of the upgrades and hints etc, there where 3 upgrades within a short period after its initial release, alas Tiger on my main HD is very stable now but the lure of Leopard is too enticing not to try. A lot of folks have managed to improve their systems by doing a clean install, I decided to tough it out and stick with the upgrade to see how much I could fix: I fixed the wireless issue, the sleep issue and finally the system preferences issue (non-locking panes)I could not fix no matter how much I read so I did an 'archive and install' and it worked and I managed to keep my pictures and settings etc, I did hit the password issue snag upon restart but since I had a second account I logged in and reset my password from there, now im trying it out with no issues (for now)SO the plist files to delete are the following: systempreferences,network configuration, Directoryutility,Directory. I also know that the utility disc does not correct permission correctly so it prevents the system from flushing corrupt caches, try using cocktail and clean all caches, look at the Console logs to monitor if they are being cleaned or not, if not the manual way is also proper (finder>go to folders>/etc or /var>caches)

Mlobo01
Dec 2, 2007, 06:34 PM
when you are configuring the your settings just make a different location like"home' etc, turn off ipv6, if your router gives out any DNS or router info its good to also input this information under the DNS tab in network location you made (system prefs>network>configure airport>tcp/ip>dns) input the router's ip address. Also know that Leopard's wireless icon on the menu bar represents data rate now and not signal strength.

Animalk
Dec 2, 2007, 06:38 PM
My wireless in leopard works fine except for my school network which is TTLS-PAP.

No matter what i try to do, the bloody software won't listen to me and just puts its own settings. Even a CS student (me) can't figure out the problem.

To me it appears that rewrite of the Wireless manager has let slip a couple bugs. It's gone completely bonkers. It remembers things that I have completely erased from the computer. :(

Mlobo01
Dec 2, 2007, 06:57 PM
If you go to the Directory Utility (applications>utilities) there are some panes in which you can in input the information you might need, it seems that you need to input more information than the network preferences requires. I also remember reading that some folks got their wireless service back when they restarted their routers, In your case just check to see if the settings stick by deleting the Networkconfiguration.plist file under user>library>preferences

Neutral Gamer
Dec 2, 2007, 07:08 PM
when you are configuring the your settings just make a different location like"home' etc, turn off ipv6, if your router gives out any DNS or router info its good to also input this information under the DNS tab in network location you made (system prefs>network>configure airport>tcp/ip>dns) input the router's ip address. Also know that Leopard's wireless icon on the menu bar represents data rate now and not signal strength.

This is good advice and something I've tried before as well. It definitely makes a difference, although still not perfect it's definitely worth trying for those who are still having problems.

In the TCP/IP tab changing the IPv4 setting to "Manual" and entering in the required information (eg. Subnet Mask) from your router is also something I'd recommend to everyone.

Mlobo01
Dec 2, 2007, 10:26 PM
I was checking the network prefs pane and under the airport configuration there is a TTLS-PEAP setting under 802.1X tab, maybe thats what you need to configure, hope that helps as well. IT helps to look at the Console logs to see if theres something thats preventing the connection, together with the Terminal app you can learn certain commands that may fix the system, I fixed a certain repeating message:"...com.apple.nis.ypbind...will restart in 10 seconds" that was peventing the system to go to sleep on its own, so through another command it allowed me to terminate that function and sleep came back on its own, you just need to be careful and understand the commands you are making, if you google "Terminal commands in OS X" you get a good amount of sites that show proper commands that may help maintain your computer, these are easy to learn and a very effective.

Mlobo01
Dec 2, 2007, 10:51 PM
One of the most successful workarounds for this issue involves deleting networks and AirPort keychains then re-establishing them, as described
here:"http://www.macfixit.com/article.php?story=2005093011343164."
Now some users have reported that deleting the following file:
/Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/com.apple.airport.preferences.plist
can resolve the issue.MacFixIt reader Matthew Powell writes:
"I updated my Mac Mini Core Duo from 10.4.6 to 10.4.7 and had an AirPort problem. After a reboot, the machine appeared to associate to the access point, but didn't get a DHCP address. The interface got a self-assigned address instead. The 'Renew DHCP Address' button had no effect.
"I was able to get connectivity back by selecting 'Other...' from the AirPort menu, then re-entering my SSID and password. But connectivity was lost again after a reboot."I ended up deleting:/Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/com.apple.airport.preferences.plist and the System keychain entry for my AirPort, and then reconfiguring AirPort. I'm still connected after a reboot."

razorme
Dec 15, 2007, 06:11 PM
I have had problems ever since that one update in Tiger (10.4.10 I believe) on my MBP where I would lose connections all the time. I finally got rid of the old PPC kernal extensions that were carried over through all my OS X upgrades and now it doesn't drop the connection anymore - but I will get stalls which take a few seconds to recover from. I solve this problem by streaming a 24 kbps station on iTunes (at 0% volume). I have a new D-Link DIR-655 Wireless N/Gigabit router.

I wonder sometimes where I should just get a new router as well - I have heard people say the D-Links just don't work well with the wireless hardware in Macs. (Note: Upgrading to Leopard didn't change anything).

Note for those with a DIR-655... there is a beta firmware v1.11 available... I've only tested briefly, but so far I am getting much better wireless connections with my MBP SR.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r19247567-Info-DIR655-firmware-105-suddenly-stopped-obtaining-DHCP-add~start=80

Originally written by SloPoke1 @ DSLReports:
... download the latest firmware in this ftp site. »ftp://customer@cainfo.dlink.ca username: customer password: dlinkcustomer and look for the DIR-655 folder inside that folder that is the new firmware version.

Mlobo01
Dec 19, 2007, 09:34 PM
I just looked at the firewall logs and it registered the folowing messageec 19 21:40:25 Mac-Mini Firewall46: Deny configd data in from 192.168.0.1:67 uid = 0 proto=17
The IP address above is my wireless router's address. so the firewall is indeed blocking the connection from my router.
you may obtain this information by going to System prefs>security>Firewall>Advanced>enable login.
I found this hint on how to disable the blocking, Im testing it now so look out for further posts:
http://discussions.apple.com/message...3303&stqc=true
Also macrumors has posted that Apple has seeded to developers an update (10.5.2) standing at a titanic 350Mbs
Another hint...
Is to open keychain Access and by selecting your network password>select access control and set it so it could be accessed by all applications.
Also I set the computer to sleep and it regain the connection on its own, maybe its as simple as this?
Anyway I will keep on testing and posting,cheers mates!

Mlobo01
Dec 19, 2007, 09:50 PM
I loaded the wireless strength widget from the folks that make istat, and by elevating my router above the computer I was able to get 10-15% more signal strength, I raised about 4 feet above. It is snappier

flyinmac
Dec 19, 2007, 10:11 PM
I'm surprised that you're having trouble with Leopard. I've got Leopard installed on my iBook G4 and MacBook Pro. Both machine's can see my neighbor's wireless network. That's really impressive since he's somewhere between a quarter-mile and a half-mile away from me (the houses are spread-out quite a ways in my area).

I know it's his network because his name and his wife's name come up as the usernames on the router.

I have no idea what brand of router they are using. But, I can see them. I haven't bothered trying to log-on since I don't really care. I haven't bothered to walk to their house to discuss it (I forgot to mention it the last time they came over to claim - note I say claim - that their dogs would no longer be spending all their time in my yard).

But, the interesting thing, is that I couldn't see their network with OS X 10.4.x on either system (despite knowing it was there because my Wife's XP machine could see it).

In my case, 10.5 seems to see it better than 10.4 did.

Edit: Also, just an observation that I forgot to mention... For some odd reason, my Mac Pro cannot see his network in Windows Vista. So, apparently, 10.5 finds his network better than both Windows and 10.4 Tiger on my Mac Pro.

I've never bothered trying to log-on to his network to browse around. But, if my machines can see it from this far away, I'm impressed.

Neutral Gamer
Dec 19, 2007, 10:23 PM
...Also macrumors has posted that Apple has seeded to developers an update (10.5.2) standing at a titanic 350Mbs ...


God I hope that 10.5.2 FINALLY fixes the problem. I'm sure a lot of us were expecting 10.5.1 to be the saviour but it looks like in mid January with a new year having started, a new solution will be coming our way ... (keeps fingers crossed).

I installed the latest MBP update for the non-responsive keys issue and now I have no problems with it (although my problem was only every now and then and no way as bad as some people have been experiencing on these forums). So by the same logic I hope that Apple do the same for the wireless problem in January!

Anyway I will keep on testing and posting,cheers mates!

Good to see you're still trying to sort it out my friend - keep at it! :D

I'm surprised that you're having trouble with Leopard ...

In my case, 10.5 seems to see it better than 10.4 did.

That's great for YOU but that doesn't make people like myself and others who have posted in this thread and countless other threads on the net feel any better, does it?

We're not making this up you know; there are people out there who have this problem. A problem which doesn't affect Tiger or Windows but does affect Leopard. Like the unresponsive keys on the Macbooks and Macbook Pros, not everyone suffers from it, but those who do get pretty annoyed with it.

There's obviously random reasons for why some people are having problems and others aren't - I just hope Apple, thanks to the feedback a lot of us have been sending, have worked out what the contributing factors are and can come up with a solution ... quick!

P.S. I'm glad your wireless experience of Leopard is better than Tiger. I mysef find shutdown times for example faster than in Tiger. Yet I know there's a lot of people complaining about how long it takes for them.

It doesn't affect me but I do feel for them and accept that different people are having different experiences with Leopard. Hopefully 10.5.2 will give us ALL the same positive experience. :)

Mlobo01
Dec 20, 2007, 12:32 AM
The connection had no problems, when I would put it to sleep and wake it up it would find the appropriate network, except when the computer went to sleep on its own, then upon waking it, it would not find the network, there was something else missing, since we all have narrowed down that one of the connectivity issues (Wire and wireless) is due to a firewall anomaly It actually made me remember that early Panther 10.3 had a Firewall issue as well, we could not alter the firewall settings and ports because the feature was locked or greyed out, so in a forum like this one it was figured out that Panther had by default 2 firewalls active: (ipfw) and the one from Sys Prefs, this little bug could of creeped out again in Leopard, so I managed to input in the Terminal App the following command:sudo ipfw flush , entered my password then input y for yes. this flushes any rules set by the 'other' firewall, This could of been creating conflict by blocking the router's connection protocol. If we set rules with one it would be difficult to set rules for the ipfw that I believe it only accesible through Terminal, ipfw as we've seen in Console still has it own log file. After I did the flush command I restarted and tested to see if it retain the connectivity, then when the computer fell asleep on its own, it did reconnect to my network!, after several restarts it connected and when I put it to sleep manually it reconnected also. I wont cry Voila just yet, but I would like to read of others trying these hints.

Mlobo01
Dec 20, 2007, 07:31 AM
I left the computer to sleep on its own, and this morning my mini lost connectivity, I went to test my laptop and it picks up my network instantly.
So im back to square one but I do feel that answer is closer than before.

Plymouthbreezer
Dec 20, 2007, 09:13 AM
When Airport Scans, I still get mouse spazzes. Kinda annoying.

Mlobo01
Dec 20, 2007, 09:36 AM
my firewall log read:
12/20/07 8:41:13 AM com.apple.launchd[85] ([0x0-0x30030].com.opendoor.doorstopx[370]) Exited: Killed
12/20/07 8:42:13 AM Spotlight[92] Invalid kMDItemPath for DoorStop X 2.2

This was a leftover from a Firewall app called DoorstopX, that I deleted when I was troubleshooting the connectivity issue, under the library>application support I found the Doorstop deamon, this even when thhe app is trashed it keeps on working, still theres no proof that this makes the connectivity crash but I wanted to test it in a non-contaminated manner so I left the computer to sleep on its own, it went to sleep and it reconnected fine, this test was after I deleted this deamon, now im back to test mode, I will let it sleep again, go to work and when I get back I'll see if it reconnects and see if long term sleep affects it, it could be that upon self-sleep it does not log out the connection, thus causing the drop.

Mlobo01
Dec 20, 2007, 09:58 AM
I've been keeping up with this issue and I've been also tracking the Apple Supports forums as well, I believe that the issue is starting to point out towards Leopard's hastily designed Firewall, the combination of System Preferences not retaining settings and configurations, the Utility Disc App that seems that its been dumbed down in this iteration, unable to fix certain permissions therefore bugs and anomalies never go away, the inability of Leopard to discard old caches that truly affect system performance, the ipfw (a secondary Firewall?) which I believe is an old Panther app and bug that's back?, A Keychain Access App. that maybe prone to errors, my laptop is different, why? could it be that the intel version of Mac OS X has slightly more glitches? you also need to remember that Apple is new at developing for intel processors, and its a good possiblity that they may have overlook a lot, so be patient and see if the upcoming update can resolve our woes or if collectively we can come to various solutions.

Silverbird0000
Dec 20, 2007, 12:28 PM
I am using an Apple Airport Express router and multiple macs running Leopard, some that came with it and some that were upgraded. The network is secured and I have no problems downloading big files. I don't have any problems at all.

Mlobo01
Dec 20, 2007, 06:50 PM
I had a reply from the Apple Support forum that confirmed for me that Leopard indeed has a secondary Firewall, The Infamous ipfw! the same one that showed up in panther, well it occured to me that if its set to a default setting how are we to now what it denies or allows access to? your router's ip address may be being denied connection because ipfw is set to a specific address different from the Systems preference Firewall. How do we check its configuration? do the following: in Terminal type: sudo ipfw list _then enter
in one of the lines it shows what ip addresses are being allowed, like this:"allow any from 192.168.0.0 to 24" if this is different from your router then flush the rules with the following command: sudo ipfw flush _then enter
it should configure an address closer to your router's. check to see if the connection behaves as it should. All this time it could of been lurking there unannounced! please try and post any results, thanks

SilentPanda
Dec 22, 2007, 12:47 PM
I've been having wireless issues ever since 10.5.1 myself. I have both a Mac Pro and Powerbook. I'm using the AEBS with hidden network, mac filtering, and WPA2. I haven't touched the config in ages... but once I went to 10.5.1 I get random drop outs. I ended up going to my box of cables and pulling ethernet to the Mac Pro as it's getting annoying. Hopefully it's a 10.5.1 issue and 10.5.2 will fix it. I might reinstall 10.5 on my powerbook (I rarely use it) to see if 10.5.1 is the culprit.

Oddly enough both computers seem to disconnect at the same time which to me implies it's an issue with the router but I haven't touched or moved the thing in ages... I'm wondering if the OS is sending some weird information to the base station which borks it.

kaiwai
Dec 22, 2007, 12:52 PM
I've been having wireless issues ever since 10.5.1 myself. I have both a Mac Pro and Powerbook. I'm using the AEBS with hidden network, mac filtering, and WPA2. I haven't touched the config in ages... but once I went to 10.5.1 I get random drop outs. I ended up going to my box of cables and pulling ethernet to the Mac Pro as it's getting annoying. Hopefully it's a 10.5.1 issue and 10.5.2 will fix it. I might reinstall 10.5 on my powerbook (I rarely use it) to see if 10.5.1 is the culprit.

Oddly enough both computers seem to disconnect at the same time which to me implies it's an issue with the router but I haven't touched or moved the thing in ages... I'm wondering if the OS is sending some weird information to the base station which borks it.

Firstly, why have you got it hidden - have you even read the number of posts who have problems, then find its resolved after they make their router visible?

SilentPanda
Dec 22, 2007, 01:06 PM
Firstly, why have you got it hidden - have you even read the number of posts who have problems, then find its resolved after they make their router visible?

Because I've had it hidden for........ ever? It's been set up this way since I got the base station which was at least 2 years if not 3.

My iPhone is connected to the base station just fine. It's just 10.5.1 that can't connect to it consistently.

kaiwai
Dec 22, 2007, 04:57 PM
Because I've had it hidden for........ ever? It's been set up this way since I got the base station which was at least 2 years if not 3.

My iPhone is connected to the base station just fine. It's just 10.5.1 that can't connect to it consistently.

For what reason?

Make it visible and see if it makes a difference.

Don't ask questions, just do it.

SilentPanda
Dec 22, 2007, 07:00 PM
For what reason?

Make it visible and see if it makes a difference.

Don't ask questions, just do it.

Sir yes sir!

/salute

Edit: Shucks... still broken... :rolleyes:

QuarterSwede
Dec 22, 2007, 07:11 PM
The interesting thing is that in my house, my PB has no problems what so ever but my wife's MB loses the connection a lot or shows that it's connected fine but the browser gives her random 404 errors. We're both running Leopard 10.5.1

Neutral Gamer
Dec 22, 2007, 07:13 PM
Sir yes sir!

/salute

Haha, kaiwai's tone may be a little harsh but he does have a point about making your wireless network visible.

I'd also recommend changing the WPA2 option to something else or even unnecrypted to see if that makes any difference (although don't keep it like that for long!). I found that using an unencrypted network solved my problems. But I only do so in the middle of the night and when I need to download large files.

It's all worth trying to see if it makes any difference. Also, when does your connection drop out - is it when you're downloading a large amount of data, e.g. Software Update, or is it just completely random when just surfing the web for example?

When I first installed Leopard my connection would go all the time and I couldn't even open a webpage like Yahoo! without it dropping out. Then after changing the connection to WEP and messing around with some of the network settings I managed to make things a lot better. But I still get random problems when downloading large files.

Anyway, here's the settings I changed (this is copied from a post on a separate thread I made nearly a month ago):

1. In Network Preferences click on the Airport section on the left.
2. Make sure Location is Automatic and "Ask to join new networks" is unselected.
3. Click the Advanced button.
4. Make sure your network is in the Preferred Networks table. And make sure when you created your network before that you selected "Remember this network".
5. Tick "Remember any network this computer has joined"
6. Untick the other two options.
7. In the TCP/IP section set "Configure IPv4" to "Manually".
8. Put in your local IP address for "IPv4 Address".
9. Put in the Subnet Mask from your Router's configuration web page. (Mine was 255.255.252.0).
10. Put in the IP address of your Router - again you can find this from your Router's configuration web page.
11. Set "Configure IPv6" to "Off".
12. In the DNS section remove all the DNS Servers and add the ones that again should be found in your Router's configuration web page. (For me it was 194.168.4.100 and 194.168.8.100).
13. Press OK and then press Apply.

Hope it helps, and if not Leopard 10.5.2 is getting closer and closer ... :D

Neutral Gamer
Dec 22, 2007, 07:16 PM
The interesting thing is that in my house, my PB has no problems what so ever but my wife's MB loses the connection a lot or shows that it's connected fine but the browser gives her random 404 errors. We're both running Leopard 10.5.1

It just goes to show how RANDOM this problem is!

If everyone keeps submitting these problems along with their hardware (computer and router) and software specs to Apple then hopefully they'll be better able to get to the bottom of it.

But at least it shows why some people say that Leopard has no wireless problems or that it's even BETTER than Tiger while some of us are experiencing the exact opposite.

SilentPanda
Dec 22, 2007, 08:13 PM
Also, when does your connection drop out - is it when you're downloading a large amount of data, e.g. Software Update, or is it just completely random when just surfing the web for example?

It only goes out when I'm sitting at the computer using it... and it's random... normally I'm just browsing the internet.

(actually it probably goes out when I'm not using the computer too but... I'm not here to notice of course!)

While disabling some options may or may not fix the issue, disabling WPA2, hidden network, and mac filtering to get it to work still leaves it broken. It doesn't fix it. It's just a work around. These options *have* been working for 2+ years. I'm pretty sure 10.5.2 will fix it... I hope...

Mlobo01
Dec 22, 2007, 10:44 PM
So far so good, I have not lost connectivity since last I posted, I am testing a new account and its also running well, I believe that migrated accounts transfer poorly under this iteration of Leopard, mainly because of the transferred prefs, unresolved permissions and caches. Once you get over these small hurdles it seems to open the time to keep on testing other performance related matters, I think we must abandon the notion of carrying over our prefs to a system that likes to write files under it's own environment.
My compilation of fixes include the following if not already listed by others: Turn off ipv6, in SysPrefs>energy saver: turn off "put disc to sleep", flush the ipfw, under the Firewall app. (under essential or specific items)include to allow widgets the need the internet, browsers, messengers, mail clients,quicktime or any video players. under the network pane input the dns numbers, also I found this old hint from macosxhints to make system prefs remember:
"Mac OS X Networking Problems? Try deleting these preference files
We previously noted this procedure as part of a workaround for users who were unable to use AirPort functionality after applying one of Apple's firmware updates.
MacFixIt reader Colin writes "I had a bizarre problem where my network settings were screwy. Although I don't use it PPPoE was checked and every time I unchecked it, it would re-enable itself."
If you are experiencing a problem similar to this, or an issue where Network Preferences cannot remember other settings, delete the following files using the Terminal's "sudo rm" command:
/var/db/NetworkInterfaces.xml
/var/db/SystemConfiguration/*.xml
(jan 2003, issue with panther)

d wade
Dec 23, 2007, 04:41 PM
i have never once had a wireless problem with leopard. linksys router here. sounds like your router is the problem, not leopard.

theBB
Dec 23, 2007, 05:27 PM
i have never once had a wireless problem with leopard. linksys router here. sounds like your router is the problem, not leopard.
A piece of software that prevents robust communication with a lot of routers should not be absolved of fault so easily.

There is a chance at around the time you installed Leopard, you also got a neighbor who setup a new network or something like that that started causing a lot of interference problems. If that is the case, a new router may not help.

Mlobo01
Dec 23, 2007, 05:31 PM
i have never once had a wireless problem with leopard. linksys router here. sounds like your router is the problem, not leopard.
Actually it is the slight configurations in Leopard, the router is fine, Im running Leopard on an external drive via USB to test it, my internal meanwhile has Tiger, my laptop is running Leopard and it has never had an issue, while I could not connect my mac mini to the internet my laptop ran flawlessly, when I would reboot in Tiger it connected with no issues. I have posted possible configurations from all over the place and so have others, from the Apple support forums and from past hints as well, so if you have not had any issues with Leopard then you have managed well, in the mean time others have had issues with it and the router will prove the innocent bystander in Leopard's connectivity issue. For now I have implemented the fixes and I think I understand what I did, it has leveled off nicely but Im still testing. I really do not know if you have been following the thread but if you like just read a couple of prior posts to orientate yourself to the issues that are affecting users, Thanks for the input.

Mlobo01
Dec 23, 2007, 08:13 PM
is running Leopard with no network issues since the day I installed it, I have rebooted, left it alone to go to sleep on it's own and have put it to sleep manually as well and upon wake it finds the network, but my mac mini has been a different case, I m running Leopard from an external drive to fully tested, I have Tiger on the internal HD justin case, Im posting on another thread here in macrumors about it, and the key is minor configurations mar its robustness in certain configurations and through reading the support post in both macrumors and the Apple forums I can deduct that migrated accounts seem to experience more issues, the ghost of copying over files still haunts this Cat, I've also experienced minor glitches when I have copied files from another drive to the desktop and it asks me for a password, but a minor permission adjustment fixes that. The combination of the inconsistent Firewall, the ipfw itself, the System prefs app that some people have reported that it could not retain settings and could not be locked or was found to get unlocked after reboots? Disc Utility has been dumbed down and we do not know if it does anything worth while anymore, easy Keychain corruption also permeates some users, plugin issues etc.
some have done a clean-install and have done away with the issues, I have stayed the course and have managed to fix 99% of the bugs with the help of fellow members and apple forum folks, but once its stable then all goes well, but Leopard has been glitchy as any other OS X iteration in their initial inceptions. hopefully 10.5.2 will address all or most of them

BryanP
Dec 24, 2007, 01:36 AM
No problem with WPA or WEP either on Leopard.

I agree with getting a new router.

sowillo14
Dec 24, 2007, 01:48 AM
I was using an Action Tech, but had the exact same problems. I went to Radio Shack, and picked up a Net Gear, and ran it out the back of the Act. Tech. Since then it has been flawless, and no problems downloading huge files.

Neutral Gamer
Dec 24, 2007, 07:55 PM
No problem with WPA or WEP either on Leopard.

I agree with getting a new router.

I was using an Action Tech, but had the exact same problems. I went to Radio Shack, and picked up a Net Gear, and ran it out the back of the Act. Tech. Since then it has been flawless, and no problems downloading huge files.

It's good to know that you've both got no problems, but for those of us affected, there was no problem in Tiger, Windows or Linux with the same hardware so I find it totally unacceptable to blame everyone BUT Apple for this problem.

I'm not gonna spend money on a new router. IF Apple don't fix this problem with the upcoming 10.5.2 update then I'll be downgrading to Tiger and will, no doubt like many others, be starting a mass online petition which I have a funny feeling quite a few people would want to join ... :D

Anyway, HAVE A MERRY :apple: CHRISTMAS EVERYONE !

poohat1000
Dec 25, 2007, 08:13 PM
1. In Network Preferences click on the Airport section on the left.
2. Make sure Location is Automatic and "Ask to join new networks" is unselected.
3. Click the Advanced button.
4. Make sure your network is in the Preferred Networks table. And make sure when you created your network before that you selected "Remember this network".
5. Tick "Remember any network this computer has joined"
6. Untick the other two options.
7. In the TCP/IP section set "Configure IPv4" to "Manually".
8. Put in your local IP address for "IPv4 Address".
9. Put in the Subnet Mask from your Router's configuration web page. (Mine was 255.255.252.0).
10. Put in the IP address of your Router - again you can find this from your Router's configuration web page.
11. Set "Configure IPv6" to "Off".
12. In the DNS section remove all the DNS Servers and add the ones that again should be found in your Router's configuration web page. (For me it was 194.168.4.100 and 194.168.8.100).
13. Press OK and then press Apply.



This(combined with sudo ipfw flush in terminal) seems to have done the trick! Thanks

poohat1000
Dec 25, 2007, 08:26 PM
Nope, spoke too soon.

It seems doing that is a quick fix. I get about 5 minutes of connectivity then im offline again, reflushing and turning airport off / on then seems to do the trick.


This is not cool, ****ing unbelievable really... and to think, its the 5.1 update that GAVE me the issues - did not have them before.

kaiwai
Dec 27, 2007, 05:48 AM
Nope, spoke too soon.

It seems doing that is a quick fix. I get about 5 minutes of connectivity then im offline again, reflushing and turning airport off / on then seems to do the trick.


This is not cool, ****ing unbelievable really... and to think, its the 5.1 update that GAVE me the issues - did not have them before.

For some reason I occasionally lose the connection, then it works ok, I'm wondering whether when it scans for new networks it accidently loses the connection to the existing one. Do you have a lot of wireless networks around where you are?

BarbabusMac
Dec 27, 2007, 05:52 AM
This is an amazing thread ... we have full wireless force in-play in our house -- 7 macs of all shapes and sizes --- including some 2 MacBook Pros that are less than a month old - all are running leopard and all are wirelessly connected to each other and the interenet -- with no outages (drops) at all ... I wonder if we too are headed for the issues your facing?:eek:

poohat1000
Dec 27, 2007, 08:35 AM
yes we have a lot of networks.


It was the 10.1 update that GAVE ME the issue, i was fine before.

Even plugging in an ethernet cable is resulting in near dial up speeds.


This needs fixing

synth3tik
Dec 27, 2007, 08:37 AM
I use WPA and have no issues at all. well...... I like to not pay my internets bill on time:D

kaiwai
Dec 27, 2007, 09:37 AM
yes we have a lot of networks.


It was the 10.1 update that GAVE ME the issue, i was fine before.

Even plugging in an ethernet cable is resulting in near dial up speeds.


This needs fixing

Don't you mean the 10.5.1 update?

As for your ethernet cable - have you talked to Apple yet? have you tried different cables? any interference? I'm just going through the laundry list of possible causes.

poohat1000
Dec 27, 2007, 01:46 PM
Don't you mean the 10.5.1 update?

As for your ethernet cable - have you talked to Apple yet? have you tried different cables? any interference? I'm just going through the laundry list of possible causes.

yeah sorry my bad - 10.5.1... the ethernet cable is serriously old and has been through a couple of wars. So that might be it in regards to that.

However, today i had enough - went out and bought a wireless Linksys. Replaced my airport. 100% fixed instantly.

Neutral Gamer
Dec 27, 2007, 04:28 PM
However, today i had enough - went out and bought a wireless Linksys. Replaced my airport. 100% fixed instantly.

So hold on a sec, so Apple's OWN Airport router doesn't work properly with Leopard for you while a Linksys one does? How ridiculous is that!

If that's the case then Apple have no excuse.

Still, glad you've got a working wireless connection now!

flyinmac
Dec 27, 2007, 05:46 PM
So hold on a sec, so Apple's OWN Airport router doesn't work properly with Leopard for you while a Linksys one does? How ridiculous is that!

If that's the case then Apple have no excuse.

Still, glad you've got a working wireless connection now!

It probably has more to do with the quality of the routers by comparison and the signal strength they emit / quality of reception.

Apple's own wireless routers have always been a bit weak in the features compared to offerings from other companies. I'd go with Linksys (and I do) for a router before using Apple's. Sure, Apple's are easy to set up, but they lack in some areas compared to the Linksys routers I've compared them to.

Particularly in the security / encryption options.

poohat1000
Dec 27, 2007, 07:06 PM
So hold on a sec, so Apple's OWN Airport router doesn't work properly with Leopard for you while a Linksys one does? How ridiculous is that!

If that's the case then Apple have no excuse.

Still, glad you've got a working wireless connection now!

thanks :D

yep thats exactly the deal, i just unplugged the airport, replaced it with the linksys set it up and bam! really fast, not one drop out.

bit of a joke aye

Mlobo01
Dec 27, 2007, 09:18 PM
today I left my system asleep, when I came back from work and awoke the computer, it gave me the message of "your known network could not be located" so I was a tad singed but I tried something different, I put it manually to sleep and then awoke it right away and the network logged on like usual. it was the first time in about 5 days that the connection was lost, regained as it is in seconds. I looked at the Console logs and there was no special messages. hmmmm!

kaiwai
Dec 28, 2007, 05:12 AM
thanks :D

yep thats exactly the deal, i just unplugged the airport, replaced it with the linksys set it up and bam! really fast, not one drop out.

bit of a joke aye

Quesiton, when you connected to the airport base station, is it set to N mode in 2.4 or 5ghz?

mjfarsi
Dec 29, 2007, 12:15 AM
I just recently upgraded (or so i thought) from a Powerboook with OSX 10.3.9 to a new MacBook with Leopard.... Ever since the upgrade I have been experiencing slow browsing with both Firefox and Leopard. I was wondering if any other users had this problem and knew how to fix it?

Some things I experience are slow browsing, pages timing out, pages loading incorrectly, pictures not loading...

I just tried turning off my airport, and connecting my laptop to the modem directly, the problem went away!!!

I have also put in:
sudo ipfw flush
Into Terminal, this seemed to help a bit. This worked for about 5 minutes then stopped working.

Sound familiar? Any suggestions?

mjfarsi
Dec 29, 2007, 12:16 AM
Does anyone know if a new router helps... if so what Make and Model?

kaiwai
Dec 29, 2007, 10:55 AM
Does anyone know if a new router helps... if so what Make and Model?

There have been lots of raves about Linksys routers; for me, my house is no bigger than a postage stamp, so both the Linksys WAG54G and AEBS work perfectly.

zane19
Dec 29, 2007, 11:00 AM
I got a belkin Wireless N router yesterday, strangely enough it has been rock solid in "G only" mode, however will not work in "N only" or "mixed" modes. I am assuming there is something wrong with the n mode.... I am unsure whether it is this same issue, and it will hopefully be resolved when apple updates leopard in their next upgrade.

All these wireless problems are really unfortunate, as it seems as the only way to get a rock solid connection across all the various standards is through Apple's own Airport extreme router. Pretty ridiculous if you ask me, seeing as there are standards for a reason.

Nothing looks worse on Apple. I can't stand sitting next to a friend who is blazing around the net on their $800 dell, while we struggle around on our $2000+ macbook pro's.

Does anyone else have problems isolated to wireless N???

if not... what router are you using, other than the Apple.

Neutral Gamer
Dec 29, 2007, 11:23 AM
Nothing looks worse on Apple. I can't stand sitting next to a friend who is blazing around the net on their $800 dell, while we struggle around on our $2000+ macbook pro's.


Yep, that's what REALLY bugs me about this whole situation and even more so for those, like myself, who spent over $3000 on their MBP's.

My cousin bought a super cheap PC laptop with Vista on it and I can't believe how slow it's become after just a couple of months; "Instant Search" is slower than Spotlight, boot up times, shut down times, anti-virus software updates etc.

Yet despite all that she doesn't seem too fussed (maybe she's just used to it?). As long as she can surf the web wirelessly around her house downloading whatever she needs to, she's alright. While I have to be tethered to a wire if I need any kind of connection stability.

I can talk confidently to her, with a smile on my face, about speed, Quicklook, Spaces and lack of viruses / spyware. But when it comes to wireless .... "roll on 10.5.2" is what I whisper quietly to myself! :rolleyes:

gvegastiger
Dec 29, 2007, 04:56 PM
Does anyone have a solution to the "none of your preferred networks are available" message that pops up every single time I wake up my powerbook running leopard?

I put my home network into the preferred list and unchecked the ask to join option. Anything else?

mjfarsi
Dec 30, 2007, 07:18 PM
Haven't had that problem.. when is 10.5.2 coming out?

kaiwai
Dec 31, 2007, 01:28 AM
I got a belkin Wireless N router yesterday, strangely enough it has been rock solid in "G only" mode, however will not work in "N only" or "mixed" modes. I am assuming there is something wrong with the n mode.... I am unsure whether it is this same issue, and it will hopefully be resolved when apple updates leopard in their next upgrade.

All these wireless problems are really unfortunate, as it seems as the only way to get a rock solid connection across all the various standards is through Apple's own Airport extreme router. Pretty ridiculous if you ask me, seeing as there are standards for a reason.

Nothing looks worse on Apple. I can't stand sitting next to a friend who is blazing around the net on their $800 dell, while we struggle around on our $2000+ macbook pro's.

Does anyone else have problems isolated to wireless N???

if not... what router are you using, other than the Apple.

Bloody hell! N isn't even standardised yet! so stop crapping on about standards.

As for wireless N, yes it is unreliable. Stick to mixed mode, and be done with it.

Neutral Gamer
Dec 31, 2007, 03:13 AM
Just thought I'd say that I changed the channel on my router from 11 to 10 yesterday and it actually made a difference.

I was able to download the Quake IV demo from the Apple site. It wasn't perfect though; it dropped the connection once and it was downloading around 600-700 KB at a time before pausing for around 10-15 seconds or even more than 30 seconds sometimes before resuming.

Whereas using an ethernet connection it downloaded continuosly and in the end downloaded it over 3 times faster!

Still, at least I can now download large files without it losing the connection every 15 seconds ... :)

kaiwai
Dec 31, 2007, 03:20 AM
Just thought I'd say that I changed the channel on my router from 11 to 10 yesterday and it actually made a difference.

I was able to download the Quake IV demo from the Apple site. It wasn't perfect though; it dropped the connection once and it was downloading around 600-700 KB at a time before pausing for around 10-15 seconds or even more than 30 seconds sometimes before resuming.

Whereas using an ethernet connection it downloaded continuosly and in the end downloaded it over 3 times faster!

Still, at least I can now download large files without it losing the connection every 15 seconds ... :)

If you have a look through Zdnet news, there was an article talking about how different channels are better are resisting interference. For me, I have my router set to automatic, which means I'm sitting on Channel 6 - works beautifully.

When ever I hear people complain about reliability I have to ask myself - what have/aren't they doing?

scotty96LSC
Dec 31, 2007, 07:08 AM
Like many of you, I'm having intermittent drops with my wireless. Waiting for a fix from Apple I guess. Seems to be the most prevalent when I wake my MBP from sleep, Sometimes it picks up the network other times it doesn't. Usually turning off then on airport will pick up my home network.:confused:
Running Linksys Wireless G Router, WEP enabled, MAC Address only, SSID broadcasting off.

kaiwai
Dec 31, 2007, 07:34 AM
Like many of you, I'm having intermittent drops with my wireless. Waiting for a fix from Apple I guess. Seems to be the most prevalent when I wake my MBP from sleep, Sometimes it picks up the network other times it doesn't. Usually turning off then on airport will pick up my home network.:confused:
Running Linksys Wireless G Router, WEP enabled, MAC Address only, SSID broadcasting off.

1) Why is SSID turned off?
2) Why aren't you using WPA?
3) Mac address filtering - why? there is no need if you use decent security.
4) What channel are you operating on? have you tried others?

Mlobo01
Jan 1, 2008, 04:07 PM
You should be able to have ssid turned off or turned on, the thing I've observed in Leopard is that it does not carry prefs right, specially if its a migrated account, Leopard likes to write and modify files under its own environment, I would set the ssid on then restart the router, then the system then log back to the router then turn off ssid, restart router. I have it off and it has not dropped in a couple of days. I would make sure you have a second location to try it out under system prefs and have selected "remember any networks this computer has joined" also "allow the router to logoff"

Mlobo01
Jan 5, 2008, 08:26 AM
So I have managed to maintain a stable connection by going into the router's settings and selecting one channel instead of automatic and selecting mixed mode instead of Wireless G. It has been stable and connects after sleep or any shutdowns.

yankeehoo
Jan 11, 2008, 10:04 PM
I've experienced what sounds like the same behavior as has been reported here. I have to frequently turn airport off and on because traffic just stops flowing - never any error messages or notification of a problem - signal strength stays put, data just stops flowing and DNS doesn't work. The interesting thing is that it only seems to happen when I'm running off battery and don't have the power plugged in. I have an early MacBook running 10.5.1

Anyone seen this pattern?

spring
Jan 11, 2008, 10:24 PM
^On my MBP my connection drops whether I am plugged in or using battery power. Unlike some people here, after waking up or booting up my connection works perfectly fine. It's just that at random times, I will lose all data connection even though it shows I have full bars. Simply turning OFF/ON the airport seems to correct the problem or renewing the DHCP; I don't have to reboot my MBP like what some people are doing.

mjfarsi
Jan 11, 2008, 10:56 PM
This is so stupid though, we shouldn't have to do all these tricks to get our internet connection to work. I have just about had it... if i can't get a permanent fix soon, i am done with this macbook.

Mlobo01
Jan 12, 2008, 04:43 AM
I have noticed that the network settings in Leopard are not as robust as they should be, they are very meticulous for each type of setting or connection, if you select the ethernet connection you must bring this setting all the way to the top of "selected services" and delete the rest for that particular setting, if you are connecting via wireless then do a location like:"wireless home" or "wireless work", if ethernet then "ethernet home" or "ethernet work" etc, whenever you establish these settings for the first time in the network settings you need to restart the computer and if posssible the router, afterwards you just select the location via the finder menu bar (apple logo>locations)...avoid the 'automatic' set-up... also in the keychain app, there's a function where upon you can check for its stability (keychain first aid) try and see if there's an issue with the Keychain Access app.If I think of anything else i will post it.

Mlobo01
Jan 12, 2008, 04:57 AM
I will post later on snapshots of my network settings and maybe that will help someone here, it is better to try and tackle this issue now then have to be disssapointed with the upcoming 10.5.2 upgrade, if the upgrade resolves this then its all good but what if it does'nt?

I've experienced what sounds like the same behavior as has been reported here. I have to frequently turn airport off and on because traffic just stops flowing - never any error messages or notification of a problem - signal strength stays put, data just stops flowing and DNS doesn't work. The interesting thing is that it only seems to happen when I'm running off battery and don't have the power plugged in. I have an early MacBook running 10.5.1

Anyone seen this pattern?
I have read that by resetting the PMU, the issue improves...take the battery off, press the power button for ten seconds then reconnect your battery,restart.

Mlobo01
Jan 12, 2008, 09:24 PM
pics of my network settings...

Mlobo01
Jan 12, 2008, 09:26 PM
pic 6

Neutral Gamer
Jan 12, 2008, 09:56 PM
Mlobo01, I notice from your screenshots that you're using a wireless network with WEP - does WPA not work properly for you?

I only ask cos of how everyone says how easily crackable WEP is. I'm using WEP myself cos WPA caused too many problems but I'd prefer to use something more secure.

Still, only 2 days till MWSF and hopefully 10.5.2 ... :D

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 08:33 AM
I'll try it and post the results, I have read that also, and I truly do not know how it could be cracked? I think it could be someone's exaggerated sense of alarm (I could be wrong), but I'll try it and see how stable it is. I also set my router to transmit for a small area about 20 feet, since its right in my room. anyone else trying to pick up the signal will barely register it and not to mention that its SSID broadcast is off.

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 10:05 AM
pic 7,

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 10:06 AM
pic 8

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 10:07 AM
pic9

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 10:11 AM
I will try these settings and post my results, One thing I did notice is the Lock symbol on my Airport networks list, it was not there before with WEP, and can someone explain if WPA-PSK is different from WPA alone? if not my next trial is WPA alone. I will try theses settings for the connectivity properties, what happens when the system goes to sleep or shutdowns etc, and I will post the results, Thanks

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 11:04 AM
http://www.wi-fiplanet.com/tutorials/article.php/3552826
This is a good article regarding this theme.

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 11:37 AM
http://db.tidbits.com/article/8942
http://www.takecontrolbooks.com/wifi-security.html?14@@!pt=TB874
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en-us&q=WEP+break+in&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30114/98/
These are good articles explaining its properties, and hopefully what you read in most posts regarding WEP's vulnerabilities falls within the folder of corrupt or misused information, I believe now that it is vulnerable because I have read and understood why its obsolete instead of re-hashing someone else's info-tidbits.
When you research these details then you can apply whatever method you feel suits your range of privacy, for now Im staying with WPA just to be sure no one is using my network, and I would like to truly thank Neutralgamer for his suggestion that prompted me to research this matter. Thanks N!

Tefret
Jan 13, 2008, 11:59 AM
For testing purposes, I looked into hacking WEP... and after following a pretty easy to follow walk through.. I was able to crack my own 128bit wep key in about half hour. And that was using a really old laptop, I think on newer laptops it would probably be faster.

I changed my wireless now for mac filtering and now I never have to worry.

Mindflux
Jan 13, 2008, 12:03 PM
For testing purposes, I looked into hacking WEP... and after following a pretty easy to follow walk through.. I was able to crack my own 128bit wep key in about half hour. And that was using a really old laptop, I think on newer laptops it would probably be faster.

I changed my wireless now for mac filtering and now I never have to worry.


Until someone spoofs your Mac address. ;) I do the same thing though, no encryption just Mac filtering. if someone wants to spend time spoofing a mac address on my network so be it.

Neutral Gamer
Jan 13, 2008, 12:24 PM
...I would like to truly thank Neutralgamer for his suggestion that prompted me to research this matter. Thanks N!

No probs my friend; glad to be of service! :D At least your WPA setting works, I wish mine would.

I changed my wireless now for mac filtering and now I never have to worry.

I do the same thing though, no encryption just Mac filtering. if someone wants to spend time spoofing a mac address on my network so be it.

I never even knew anything about MAC address filtering before. There was a setting on my router called "MAC Address Control" which I never gave a second look to. But you're both right; why worry about WEP or whatever when you've got MAC filtering on anyway? Thanks guys.

I've enabled it as well now just for the 5 computers in my house and hopefully I can sleep a little bit easier now. Isn't it great when everyone just helps each other out (intentionally or unintentionally) in forums? :)

Mlobo01
Jan 13, 2008, 02:22 PM
Airport Connection problems...
user jegdart98 writes...
"I copied over v1.6.2 of IO80211family.kext which I copied from a backup of a 10.4.10 system, and my reconnect issue has gone away. My router is a Linksys wrt300n and I connect at 130mbps."
It's been working fine for a couple of weeks, I haven't had to reboot after sleeping at all.
here's the thread:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1200966&start=195&tstart=0
Also an update on my testing, the connection has been a little jumpy but is been improving since I established the new settings. also I established the MAC filtering. Im testing both my mini and laptop. The WEP encryption seemed to slow down the signal, without the encryption it does seem snappier.

megfilmworks
Jan 13, 2008, 02:56 PM
This is so stupid though, we shouldn't have to do all these tricks to get our internet connection to work. I have just about had it... if i can't get a permanent fix soon, i am done with this macbook.

I'd think twice, a lot of people at my work have various PC laptops (Dell, Sony Vaio, etc.) and they seem to struggle everyday with our company wifi connection. They are always amazed how quickly my MacBook Pro connects and identifies all available networks. Nothing is perfect.

Mindflux
Jan 13, 2008, 10:42 PM
No probs my friend; glad to be of service! :D At least your WPA setting works, I wish mine would.





I never even knew anything about MAC address filtering before. There was a setting on my router called "MAC Address Control" which I never gave a second look to. But you're both right; why worry about WEP or whatever when you've got MAC filtering on anyway? Thanks guys.

I've enabled it as well now just for the 5 computers in my house and hopefully I can sleep a little bit easier now. Isn't it great when everyone just helps each other out (intentionally or unintentionally) in forums? :)

Just make sure the IP range you give out via DHCP is as 'few' as the addresses you are filtering. If you have 5 items grabbing DHCP then limit your range from 192.168.0.2 - 192.168.0.7.

If you let DHCP go hog wild it'll issue out new addresses to any machine.

Mlobo01
Jan 15, 2008, 03:05 PM
So far so good, Im satisfied that the connection is stable, it was a rocky start for my connection and it did get lost upon long-term sleep, once after restart as well, but I left it alone for a while and it began to stabilize further, I have no idea if its the caches or the way its registering upon other files but I have tested it in all manners, Im gonna see if not having any WPA set-up makes a difference in terms of speed, since my network has a short reach about 20ft. radius, and I only have 2 machines. Also I set the router to a short preamble, Im researching the significance of the now over google. Im not sure if all routers have these same settings, but supposedly short preamble makes for better video-audio and VOIP streaming, can anyone opine and that or test his/her equipment. thanks
http://www.dd-wrt.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=1508&sid=d0a9acb239f727146c251d5387383c3b

Mlobo01
Jan 15, 2008, 03:11 PM
http://www.intel.com/support/wireless/wlan/sb/CS-025317.htm

darwinian
Jan 15, 2008, 04:56 PM
I just want to add my frustration to this thread! I switched back to a Tiger partition on my MBP recently because it was so annoying -- every single stinkin' time I had to log in, I have to manually enter my hidden SSID and the password. WPA or WPA2 Personal by the way. To add insult to injury, the dialog that opens asking to join a network > other... doesn't accept full keyboard access (i.e. tabbing to all fields), so I have to find my mouse (actually never handy) and click through.

My security includes MAC address filtering, hidden SSID, WPA/2 personal strong password, restricted IP space, private IP space, and a faraday cage around my condo. Just kidding about the faraday cage. It could be one or all of these things contributing to the weirdness; I have not taken the time to systematically go through each variable to test it. But as someone else stated, I should freaking have to! :)

This is just one of the few Leopard problems I am having (another deals with Bluetooth).

On the other hand, Tiger has been flawless in all of these respects (thank goodness it's not my hardware). Now if conftest would just stop crashing on fink builds. :)

Mlobo01
Jan 15, 2008, 09:24 PM
I have read that WPA-PSK is better for home use, WPA2 I believe is for enterprise use where a RADIUS server is needed to verify a certificate, 802.1X. login stuff etc. maybe switching to personal WPA is more recommended. One thing I have observed in Leopard is that it does not digest migrated files nor prefs well, it likes to write files under its own environment due to their permissions or native caches etc. I would suggest to start simple,
Start with no security, re-enable your SSID broadcasting, try mix mode and switch to one channel only, please check the pics concerning the network settings in the prior posts, forget the Firewall for now, see if that begins network stability, try sleep then a log off, then a restart, if it begins to work then go back and establish your WPA then MAC filtering, followed by the turning off of the SSID, to be finished with the firewall being set to suit. I have notice in the Console logs a small inconsistency, but reading other posts makes me allude to a timing fracture within the connectivity daemon. I have notice that there are Time adjustments of about .0100 of a sec. etc, I do know that in computer lingo this could be a very long time specially when it comes to connecting to a network, at a particular moment this can cause a glitch in the connection even though I have set the time to sync with the Apple server, maybe this server is overwhelmed or glitchy itself and could be sending the wrong adjustments, therefore causing the anomaly with the airport daemon. Im just guessing, but by observing my current system its been occurring less and less.

Mlobo01
Jan 15, 2008, 09:46 PM
As you can see, Leopard is being tested safely.

mjfarsi
Jan 16, 2008, 04:53 PM
The conference came and went and no mention of 10.5.2??? When do you think we will see it?

Mlobo01
Jan 16, 2008, 05:20 PM
for those that would like to try re-installing 10.5.1 to see if your networks stabilize, just go to library>receipts and find the 10.5.1 file and trash it, then go to the Apple site and download the stand-alone upgrade, maybe its better than the Software Upgrade one. (just a thought)

spring
Jan 16, 2008, 05:41 PM
I can't find it on Library/Receipts. Any other way of removing 10.5.1 and reinstalling it again?

I really hope Apple fixes this, constantly having to Turn Off then Turn On WiFi is really starting to bother me.

^I just noticed you are from Weehawken. I'm from Leonia, by Fort Lee :)

Neutral Gamer
Jan 16, 2008, 07:42 PM
The conference came and went and no mention of 10.5.2??? When do you think we will see it?

Yeah, there was so much excitement / controversy over the MacBook Air that a lot of people, including myself, completely forgot about 10.5.2 !

Surely it can't be that far away now? We all know that the update was seeded to developers in December and there's more than just wireless issues that it addresses (Stacks List View anyone?) so I'm sure there's a lot of people waiting for it.

As Engadget said in December:
This is just the first distribution of the update, and a release to users is rumored to hit mid-January, coinciding with new hardware at Macworld.

I'm just waiting for the day I can edit this thread's title to include the word "FIXED" ! Any day now ... :cool:

majordude
Jan 16, 2008, 08:04 PM
I can't find it on Library/Receipts. Any other way of removing 10.5.1 and reinstalling it again?

I am equally frustrated. I can connect but I get kicked off... yet the antenna icon on the tool bar says on and full-ball connectivity! I have to reboot to get my MBP to reconnect to my Netgear N wireless router.

I just trashed my SystemConfiguration folder (under Finder > Macintosh HD > Library > Preferences) and after a reboot re-set up my network. So far so good but it hasn't been a long time so I'll keep ya'll posted.

flyinmac
Jan 16, 2008, 08:20 PM
The conference came and went and no mention of 10.5.2??? When do you think we will see it?

I am the master of predictions. I'll stand by my prediction with a money back guarantee.

You ready... Get out your pencils, mark your calendars...


OS X 10.5.2 will be released sometime this year.


There you go. I'll absolutely guarantee you that my prediction is 100% accurate. :D

megfilmworks
Jan 16, 2008, 09:45 PM
The conference came and went and no mention of 10.5.2??? When do you think we will see it? February is my guess.

Mlobo01
Jan 16, 2008, 10:03 PM
I can't find it on Library/Receipts. Any other way of removing 10.5.1 and reinstalling it again?

I really hope Apple fixes this, constantly having to Turn Off then Turn On WiFi is really starting to bother me.

^I just noticed you are from Weehawken. I'm from Leonia, by Fort Lee :)

HD>Library>Receipts>boms>com.apple.pkg.update.os.10.5.1.bom

Mlobo01
Jan 16, 2008, 10:06 PM
I am equally frustrated. I can connect but I get kicked off... yet the antenna icon on the tool bar says on and full-ball connectivity! I have to reboot to get my MBP to reconnect to my Netgear N wireless router.

I just trashed my SystemConfiguration folder (under Finder > Macintosh HD > Library > Preferences) and after a reboot re-set up my network. So far so good but it hasn't been a long time so I'll keep ya'll posted.

this is one of the suggestions that worked for me, also remember to avoid using 'Automatic' location, make one using the assistant or just name one like "home" etc. flushing the ipfw also worked for me (under Terminal input:sudo ipfw flush)

Superlat
Jan 17, 2008, 06:41 AM
Here's Steve's solution = go buy an iPhone, its the only thing Steve the God cares about anymore. Retard. No mini update, oversized, overpriced, overkill tower, and ok, maybe a cool laptop, and maybe not. Meanwhile, the meat and potatos stuff is totally random. Get a grip, egomaniac Jobs.

Mlobo01
Jan 17, 2008, 06:45 AM
In the Network tab, in the DHCP Client ID box I inputed the address of my system, with ipv6 off, under the Wireless Network selection pull-down list I have my network, it had been working so far but this morning after a long Sleep state the network dropped after 6 days, not bad but I will try this configuration anyway for more stability and reliability. After I inputed the DHCP address my own IP address changed to another number. Remember that I'm using WPA-PSK.

spring
Jan 17, 2008, 04:44 PM
After following all the possible fixes in this thread, I am still dropping my wireless connection. I really hope that 10.5.2 addresses and fixes the issue.

Mlobo01
Jan 17, 2008, 05:21 PM
why I got a second IP address, it gives out a different number each time you make another location, my "automatic" location has 192,168.0.100 my "home" has 192.168.0.102.

Mlobo01
Jan 17, 2008, 05:41 PM
here my home location...

majordude
Jan 17, 2008, 07:16 PM
this is one of the suggestions that worked for me, also remember to avoid using 'Automatic' location, make one using the assistant or just name one like "home" etc. flushing the ipfw also worked for me (under Terminal input:sudo ipfw flush)

Well, it lasted one day and then it burped. I just tried it again with a new location instead of "Automatic". Hope that helps. :mad:

Mlobo01
Jan 17, 2008, 11:06 PM
"I am equally frustrated. I can connect but I get kicked off... yet the antenna icon on the tool bar says on and full-ball connectivity! I have to reboot to get my MBP to reconnect to my Netgear N wireless router"

The airport icon in Leopard means Data Rate and not signal strength, which means that you could be connecting to the router but still not be able to go to the internet, also if its stable then burps just let it be, turn the airport off and on to regain the signal and keep it like it is until it starts to become stable, I have noticed that as it gets more usage it becomes more stable, it could be that since Leopard likes writing files under it's own environment it starts to gather data via the caches and system files to obtain a better protocol, thats my theory and Im sticking to it. try it out.

Mlobo01
Jan 17, 2008, 11:13 PM
just in case someone missed this pic...also try mixed mode then swith back to N or G

majordude
Jan 18, 2008, 12:10 AM
just in case someone missed this pic...also try mixed mode then swith back to N or G

I've never seen that screen before. Where is it in Leo? :confused:

Mlobo01
Jan 18, 2008, 12:33 AM
you know how to access the router correct? just asking no malice intended.

majordude
Jan 18, 2008, 08:24 AM
you know how to access the router correct? just asking no malice intended.

I thought that was somewhere in OSX... I didn't realize that was your router's config screen. :p

anjinha
Jan 18, 2008, 08:47 AM
I didn't read the whole thread but I use WPA Personal at home at WPA Enterprise at school at my connection never dropped once. And I'm running Leopard.

soLoredd
Jan 18, 2008, 08:56 AM
I didn't read the whole thread but I use WPA Personal at home at WPA Enterprise at school at my connection never dropped once. And I'm running Leopard.

Yeah, I'm also using WPA/WPA2 Personal at home and so far, haven't had any issues at all. I'm running an Airport Extreme at the far end of my home with an Airport Express WSD mode in my front room. I upgraded to Leopard a month ago and my network has been just as stable as with Tiger.

Even still, I hope it gets fixed because of all the people I've come across having the issue.

Mlobo01
Jan 19, 2008, 07:17 PM
Ted400 reports the following: "So... a week later and still running. It looks like this problem is directly related to the permissions listed in the keychain as stated earlier. I was able to speak with a Apple Product Specialist today (after being on hold for an hour), and it seems that he agreed that that was the problem. He stated that when you upgrade you may have been asked to accept that ol' pop up box regarding the keychain access. If at any point you did not choose to accept ALL changes it could have changed the permissions on the keychain item for your network, thus causing the problem. I hope this solves the problem...we will have to wait and see."
I did recently delete all the keychains, keychainprefs.plist and in the keychain app, whenever you redo your settings go back and highlight the key for your wireless network and double click then under the Access Tab select the "allow all apps to access this key" or see if the System prefs and an Airport file icon is there.

majordude
Jan 19, 2008, 07:28 PM
It looks like this problem is directly related to the permissions listed in the keychain as stated earlier.

Well, this may be the case for you but I did a clean install and I have these problems! :mad:

Mlobo01
Jan 19, 2008, 08:09 PM
when you highlight the key for your wireless network and you double-click, under the Access Control tab, does it show in the list the system preferences icon or an airport file icon?

Mlobo01
Jan 19, 2008, 08:24 PM
1) do you have your machine's IP address on the DHCP filtering field within your router?

2) do have your machine's Airport ID on the field that allows to connect to the internet?

spring
Jan 20, 2008, 12:14 AM
I have both Airport and System Preferences in the Access Control tab. Do you still select "Allow all applications to access this item," or do I keep it at "Confirm before allowing access?"

osxy
Jan 20, 2008, 07:28 AM
Also got problems:

Hardware:
Belkin ethernet router
Linksys WAP54G

New config:
Linksys WRT150N

Also tried with:
Linksys WRT54GC

Only computer with problems is my iMac C2D 2.16Ghz (white) with Leopard.
We got a Macbook, PowerBook and a iBook all running Leopard with no problems.

Screenshot Illustrating the problem:
http://skitch.com/andrekemmeren/r5ty/dips
(HTTP download and SSH, stable data stream)

Mlobo01
Jan 20, 2008, 09:00 AM
I have both Airport and System Preferences in the Access Control tab. Do you still select "Allow all applications to access this item," or do I keep it at "Confirm before allowing access?"

keep it under "Confirm before allowing access" for the network, if for some reason iChat is giving you the message of the firewall allowance then you go to the iChat key and select "allow all applications..." try it and see, if for some reason it does not work then delete that key and start anew, you can also doi it in a single swoop by deleting the keychainaccess.plist file but that entails re-doing all your passwords again. just go step by step to see if it gets stable.

Mlobo01
Jan 21, 2008, 09:56 PM
I found this cup in an oriental store, plus my own graphic design, a toast to the
airport issue!

Mlobo01
Jan 21, 2008, 10:07 PM
if you would like this desktop go the site below it gives you the proper size.
http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=2210630849&size=l

Mlobo01
Jan 23, 2008, 01:44 PM
If you wish to trouble-shoot further just make another account and make it an administrative instead of standard, log off yours then into the new account and set your connection to see how stable it could be, I have done this before to compare what kind of internet plugins or files I get with the new account, or if there's different plugins that can prevent connections or trouble shooting quicktime videos that cant be watched if you have corrupt browser settings, caches or preferences etc, if your new account is better, then just move all your files into the new account and delete the old one, or if this one gets too buggy then you can always delete it for good and you still have your old account. also this account will have all fresh keychains and preferences, if you open a questionable app or widget then you know what's causing the issue. if you have too many files to copy over then through root or the superuser you can move these files without copying them holding down the command key while click-dragging the files being moved.

inajeep
Jan 25, 2008, 09:23 AM
Wandered over from the apple forums to this thread and thought I'd add my woes.

I have a dlink dir-655 N wireless router but not using the N protocol. With a brand new Macbook Pro w/ a fresh Leopard install. Running wirelessly, the macbook pro sometimes doesn't awake properly and uses a self assigned IP but can happen at any time. I had originally thought some type of interference was the issue until I see others with the same issue.

I tried the keychain setting change and it didn't work for me.

My router is not using port forwarding, the SSID is visable, no MAC filtering, WEP 128bit encryption because not all my wireless devices can do WPA.

Tommie Montana
Jan 25, 2008, 10:56 AM
Hello all,

I've had my share of network connection problems, but I finally solved it. I used a manually set IP address, but until about last week, it wasn't flawless.

My setup is:
IP 192.168.10.2
Subnet 255.255.255.0
Router 192.168.10.1 (doesn't change so you have to check this)

Now with this I still had the problems. What finally solved it was setting the right DNS.
I've added: Lan, the router, and the default router gateway (can be found in your router config page). The last is what seemed to fix it all. Then I added 127.0.0.1 too because I need that for my hotmail and yahoo pop access.

I hope I have helped at least someone by posting this, since it works perfect for me. By the way: my issue was that the internet suddenly stopped working, while I was still perfectly connected to the WLAN. Maybe some of you in this topic (didn't read much of it) have other issues that won't be solved with this.

skyrider007
Jan 25, 2008, 11:32 AM
I want 10.5.2, hopefully it'll fix the WiFi issues!

Mlobo01
Jan 25, 2008, 06:28 PM
"My router is not using port forwarding, the SSID is visable, no MAC filtering, WEP 128bit encryption because not all my wireless devices can do WPA"

Can you do MAC filtering even if you only have WEP? I dont know so im asking, and can you try it? or do you have the machine's Airport IDs registered in the DHCP field in your router? thanks

Mlobo01
Jan 28, 2008, 09:11 PM
I have 2 macs, I have the following settings, maybe this can help you obtain a stable connection, starting with my router settings: I have one channel instead of Automatic, mixed mode until you get stability then you can switch to G or N, short preamble, SSID is off, but on is fine, WPA encrypted, WEP is fine but you need MAC filtering anyways on both, in the MAC filtering fields you should have all your Mac's Airport Ids registered, only these will access the internet. In the DCHP field enable a DHCP Server, which means that one of your machines needs to become this server, I selected the mini since that is what I use the most. with the Server enabled give your main mac the address of your choice preferably any numbers starting with x.x.x.100 this machine will now distribute these numbers to all machines that connect including the main Mac itself, it will get an IP address of x.x.x.101 or if you make a second location on that same machine it will become 102. (using "emac" to represent any computer)it will show up like this:"Static DHCP list:eMac: x.x.x.100 with the MAC address of (your eMac's Airport ID) in the Dynamic DHCP list your eMac shows like this: eMac:x.x.x.101 Mac address: (a string of about twenty numbers aprox.) next to it will be the lease expiration date. The IP address of the router could be 192.168.1.1 or 0.1, this field shows the subnet mask and the Domain name should be your network's name.
To my network settings, I use a secondary account, I think that the "Automatic" location is glitchy
I have checked"ask to join new networks" in the network name: (the one you use) in the Advanced section under Airport I only have my network and nothing else for now, it shows the type of security or nothing if its an open network, checked below is "Remember any networks this computer has joined" and "Disconnect from wireless networks when logging out" this enables the connection to log out properly during sleep,log outs and shut-downs. Under the TCP/IP tab: in the DHCP Client ID: is the DHCP server's IP address:x.x.x.100, ipv6 is off, hit OK, go back to the Airport network pane and select: "apply" if you get connected to the router only and no internet, then log back to your router and see if there are any DNS addresses in the Status page and input those numbers in the DNS tab in the network setting, hit ok and then Apply. try any web page and try for stability. Also before you start go to the terminal app and type: sudo ipfw flush then enter Y for yes, that flushes the ip rules of the secondary firewall thats been causing issues.In the DNS tab you should see the Routers ip address of x.x.x.1 and the Search Domain field; (the name of your network) try and post any results.

Lava Lamp Freak
Feb 3, 2008, 04:00 PM
I have the wireless problem too, and have been reading the discussions on the Apple forum.

I have an iMac that I bought back in September. I upgraded to Leopard the day it was released. The next day, I started having wireless dropouts. For the prior month I had not had a single occurrence.

I have an Airport Extreme. My security is WPA/WPA 2. In addition to my iMac I also have a MacBook Pro, iPhone, Tivo HD, and PS3 -- all connected wirelessly. The iMac is the only device that has an issue with the wireless connection. The MBP, also running Leopard, has not had a single dropout.

Just as others have described, I will suddenly find myself unable to load web pages even though the icon shows I am still connected. It will eventually grey out and no longer show my network name in the menu. Sometimes rebooting fixes it, but most times I just sit in frustration for 10-20 minutes because I am unable to acquire a connection. During those times I will get a connection failed or connection timeout error.

Sometimes this problem happens once a day, other times once an hour. The longest span I've went without loosing my connection is about a month. It just started happening again on Friday after no problems at all since before Jan 1.

I have read through most of the posts on the Apple forum over the last few months and tried everything from changing network settings, deleting keychains, and deleting preference files. I assumed it was fixed since I went so long without a drop.

It is making it very difficult to play WoW since I'm dropping so often these last few days. This is very annoying.

Software or hardware, computer or router -- I don't know where the problem lies. I just know I'm sick of it.

Mlobo01
Feb 3, 2008, 10:14 PM
I've been trying to reproduce these problems and re-solving them so let me post my latest issue/solution, I messed around with the router settings to see if I could reproduce the drop-outs etc, I did and upon two hours of trouble what made the connection stable was that I had to reset my router, (reset when it is on) after the hard reset and using an ethernet cable I reset it so there is no encryption and to log on to the router all you have to do is type "Admin" on the user field and the password is either sent in the clear or its"password" my first step was to establish the name of the wireless network, channel, ssid off or on-apply. start with little, configure your network settings and see, In your network setting configure so you have a secondary address, have ethernet at the top of services then Airport, now that you have connected via ethernet try the wireless signal, you should now get an IP address for your machine and you should see your router's address, go back to the router and set your new password and establish your encryption, or if no encryption the use mac filtering or not, enable the DHCP server and establish your main machine's IP address as the server for it, if this works you can now configure your next machine. remember to adjust your network setting as you change the router's settings and to disconnect your ethernet cable for full testing.
The hard reset of the router is good way to begin, believe me I've reproduced this issue to trouble-shoot since my connection has been stable for 25+ days

Lava Lamp Freak
Feb 5, 2008, 10:43 AM
Yesterday I lost my connection and was not able to reconnect at all. After more than an hour of being unable to reestablish the connection, using my MBP, I removed the WPA security and left the network open, but I made it private so that others couldn't see it. That allowed me to connect.

I've still lost my connection a few more times since the changes, but now it reestablishes the connection within a minute. At least it seems without security enabled I am able to reconnect more quickly, but it is still interfering with my online game play.

Mlobo01
Feb 5, 2008, 10:37 PM
some routers have the ability to assist online games by going into the applications page, or look into your router for these settings, it could be that you need these numbers inputed in your router? also if you have encryption off you could use MAC filtering in order to deny access unless its your machine.

darwinian
Feb 6, 2008, 08:13 AM
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but my testing has narrowed down the wireless problems by and large to the combination of the login panel and a wireless connection with WPA/WPA2 security enabled. Once I enabled automatic login and no login on wake from sleep or screensaver, most (but not all, underline) of the wireless problems were fixed.

The other wireless problem is the bluetooth shutting down intermittently. While I cannot recreate conditions to reproduce this based on something particular, it turns out that a combination of my wireless kbd and mouse is what causes the issue. Resetting the keyboard only (and not the mouse) works for me to fix both the mouse freeze and the kbd freeze. It's even more annoying since I cannot reproduce it, though it continues to happen. Reverting back to Tiger and both of these problems were gone, so I concluded that it's not hardware, either in the BT module of the MBP or the mouse or kbd.

inajeep
Feb 7, 2008, 07:42 AM
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but my testing has narrowed down the wireless problems by and large to the combination of the login panel and a wireless connection with WPA/WPA2 security enabled. Once I enabled automatic login and no login on wake from sleep or screensaver, most (but not all, underline) of the wireless problems were fixed.

The other wireless problem is the bluetooth shutting down intermittently. While I cannot recreate conditions to reproduce this based on something particular, it turns out that a combination of my wireless kbd and mouse is what causes the issue. Resetting the keyboard only (and not the mouse) works for me to fix both the mouse freeze and the kbd freeze. It's even more annoying since I cannot reproduce it, though it continues to happen. Reverting back to Tiger and both of these problems were gone, so I concluded that it's not hardware, either in the BT module of the MBP or the mouse or kbd.

The issue seems to effect people differently. I have disabled Bluetooth and use WEP 128bit due to other older wireless devices that don't do WPA. I can download large files (IE the latest software updates ~11 MB) but occasionally with no apparent pattern I lose connectivity to the router. Just the MacBook Pro, nothing else has this issue. Coming out of sleep mode it happens more frequently but it can happen in the middle of using it too. No wireless mouse or kbd in my case. It's troubling that the issues are wide ranged and various things effect the issue. It makes solving it much more difficult for Apple.

Neutral Gamer
Feb 11, 2008, 04:27 PM
Now that Apple has (finally!) released 10.5.2 I'm expecting / hoping floods of people reporting that the wireless issues are now a thing of the past.

I can't wait to change the thread title to "FIXED" but the joke is that it took so long that I haven't even got my MBP anymore so I need to hear the good news from you lot ... (crosses fingers) .... :D

On a sidenote it'd be great if they release the new MBP's tomorrow as well now that 10.5.2 is ready. Then I'll be able to get straight back into the world of Mac without having to worry about potential Wi-Fi dropouts ...

MrT8064
Feb 11, 2008, 05:08 PM
my airport used to take 1min to connect to my network after being in standby, that has now been reduced to 13 seconds, slow, but better.

thanks Apple!!!

fluidedge
Feb 11, 2008, 05:26 PM
downloading to my mac pro now - will report back later (maybe tomorrow!)

It's ironic that the problem we're trying to fix is all but preventing us from downloading the update!

Neutral Gamer
Feb 11, 2008, 05:45 PM
It's ironic that the problem we're trying to fix is all but preventing us from downloading the update!

That is funny actually (well in a sad kind of way!).

I had the same problem when I was trying to download 10.5.1, which was also touted by many at the time as the possible fix to the problem. (Let's hope history doesn't repeat itself). In the end I had to download the update on my PC and burn it to a disc to install. Annoying.

fluidedge
Feb 11, 2008, 05:47 PM
luckily my ibook still has tiger on it so i can download the update and move it over on my usb jump drive

fingers crossed! Pleeeeeeease work. Please.

fluidedge
Feb 11, 2008, 06:38 PM
well there we go!!

I'm successfully writing this on my mac pro, version 10.5.2!!

No dropouts - rock solid signal!!

I'm not being too cocky though until i give it a thorough test tomorrow. But i have to say, so far so good!! Been surfing around for 10 minutes and it's great!

Well done apple!

majordude
Feb 11, 2008, 06:53 PM
I'm successfully writing this on my mac pro, version 10.5.2!! No dropouts - rock solid signal!!

Wireless? No dropouts?

I've been hard wired for the past three weeks because my wireless doesn't work. :(

fluidedge
Feb 11, 2008, 06:57 PM
sorry yeh i only connect to the internet via airport - i was having terrible troubles, to the point of not being able to use the internet really, but now it seems to be all fixed.

acfusion29
Feb 11, 2008, 07:02 PM
well there we go!!

I'm successfully writing this on my mac pro, version 10.5.2!!

No dropouts - rock solid signal!!

I'm not being too cocky though until i give it a thorough test tomorrow. But i have to say, so far so good!! Been surfing around for 10 minutes and it's great!

Well done apple!

It WAS fine for me in 10.5 and 10.5.1, but now it's ****ed up. I get dropped every couple of minutes. I'm probably going to lose my connection as soon as I hit Submit Reply. :mad:

fluidedge
Feb 11, 2008, 07:06 PM
It WAS fine for me in 10.5 and 10.5.1, but now it's ****ed up. I get dropped every couple of minutes. I'm probably going to lose my connection as soon as I hit Submit Reply. :mad:

:( Oh dear - hopefullly it's just the OS bedding in the new update?

Keep restarting, turning airport on and off and maybe deleting your current location and set up a new one.

Turn your router/modem on and off too.

good luck

spring
Feb 11, 2008, 10:04 PM
I really hope that 10.5.2 fixed the problem since I've had the wifi dropout problem in 10.5 and 10.5.1. I installed 10.5.2 but I just haven't been able to test the wifi because I'm in school hardwired. when i go home or something then I'll finally be able to test out if the connection is more stable now.

brasscat
Feb 11, 2008, 10:06 PM
Just for the record, I've seen this problem since Tiger... It seems to be getting better though (less drops) as the revisions roll out.

acfusion29
Feb 11, 2008, 10:07 PM
:( Oh dear - hopefullly it's just the OS bedding in the new update?

Keep restarting, turning airport on and off and maybe deleting your current location and set up a new one.

Turn your router/modem on and off too.

good luck

Alright I'll try that. Thanks for the help, I'll keep you guys updated. If it continues, I'm going to call Apple.

Edit: Maybe my config is screwing everything up? Is there any way to reset it?

fluidedge
Feb 12, 2008, 04:11 AM
Been going for a few hours now and still rock solid - looks like apple have done it for me!

The rest of the update is pretty smooth too - why do people want to disable the transparent top bar? I love that.

Not sure what all the fuss about stacks was either

Lava Lamp Freak
Feb 12, 2008, 10:58 AM
I'm still having dropouts on my iMac, the same as before 10.5.2 update. My MacBook Pro, iPhone, PS3, and Tivo have never lost a connection to the same router.

The strange thing is when it drops the connection, no wireless networks can be seen for a brief period. Then mine shows back up but says connection refused. Nothing I do helps. I have tried restarting router and restarting computer.

It reconnects when it wants to. Sometimes it is minutes, sometimes it is an hour, which happened two nights ago. I am on closed network with no security. Previously I had security and turned that off hoping it would help.

desistyle
Feb 12, 2008, 03:37 PM
Never had this problem in 10.5.1, but no my connection drops every 5 minutes or so in 10.5.2.

Can someone point out a list of things to try? I'm using WPA on my router, could using wpa2 fix the prob?

fluidedge
Feb 12, 2008, 03:51 PM
i use WEP 128bit

desistyle
Feb 12, 2008, 04:05 PM
isn't WEP's security and speed supposed to be inferior to WPA?

fluidedge
Feb 12, 2008, 04:12 PM
perhaps, but i haven't exactly got government secrets on my computer. If a hacker wants to steal all my holiday photos he's welcome to them.

128bit WEP is still pretty strong though isn't it?

majordude
Feb 12, 2008, 06:05 PM
128bit WEP is still pretty strong though isn't it?

It can be cracked in 60 seconds (http://www.shawnhogan.com/2006/08/how-to-crack-128-bit-wireless-networks.html). :eek:

fluidedge
Feb 12, 2008, 06:21 PM
It can be cracked in 60 seconds (http://www.shawnhogan.com/2006/08/how-to-crack-128-bit-wireless-networks.html). :eek:

wow - i thought it was a bit better than that! I thought it would take hours of intensive hacking

hmmm - will look very seriously at WPA now (I trust that is a bit stronger?!)

Lava Lamp Freak
Feb 12, 2008, 07:57 PM
My problems are worse than ever. Before the 10.5.2 update I would loose my connection once or twice a day. Now I'm not able to keep a connection for 10 minutes. iMac is about to meet iDumpster.

I think this proves it is software. There may be something hardware involved, but seeing as how the update is making things even worse for some people, while fixing it for others, shows that something is a little screwy in the software.

desistyle
Feb 12, 2008, 10:00 PM
Ok, 10.5.2 ***** sucks. I had no wireless problems before but now I do since upgrading.

I've tried changing my router to WEP, WPA, WPA2...losing connection on all. Tried repairing disk permissions and rebooting, still losing connection.

Is there any way i can go back to 10.5.1? Losing your wireless connection every 5-10 minutes really makes you not want to use your computer...

NJPitcher
Feb 12, 2008, 10:11 PM
My problems are worse than ever. Before the 10.5.2 update I would loose my connection once or twice a day. Now I'm not able to keep a connection for 10 minutes. iMac is about to meet iDumpster.

I think this proves it is software. There may be something hardware involved, but seeing as how the update is making things even worse for some people, while fixing it for others, shows that something is a little screwy in the software.

My problem EXACTLY this blows, I time out every 5-10 minutes

geeserver
Feb 12, 2008, 10:45 PM
Ok, 10.5.2 ***** sucks. I had no wireless problems before but now I do since upgrading.

I've tried changing my router to WEP, WPA, WPA2...losing connection on all. Tried repairing disk permissions and rebooting, still losing connection.

Is there any way i can go back to 10.5.1? Losing your wireless connection every 5-10 minutes really makes you not want to use your computer...


Change the CHANNEL/FREQUENCY setting on your wireless router.

desistyle
Feb 12, 2008, 10:58 PM
Change the CHANNEL/FREQUENCY setting on your wireless router.

My router only operates at 2.4ghz. I tried a bunch of different channels with the same result.

I just bootcamp'd into windows about 30 minutes ago, not a single drop so far. Clearly an issue with apple's airport drivers or something....

acfusion29
Feb 12, 2008, 11:10 PM
I think I fixed it.

I'm probably jinxing it right now... but whatever

I did this:

Cleared all my saved network keys
Reset my modem to factory settings
Changed my frequency in my settings from AUTO to 11.

Haven't been dropped for like 5 hours..

desistyle
Feb 12, 2008, 11:19 PM
Hmm, i'm not sure how to reset my 2wire to factory settings. I cleared my one network key and rebooted my router..but that's it.

Ritte
Feb 13, 2008, 05:48 AM
I think I fixed it.

I'm probably jinxing it right now... but whatever

I did this:

Cleared all my saved network keys
Reset my modem to factory settings
Changed my frequency in my settings from AUTO to 11.

Haven't been dropped for like 5 hours..

Even when you downloading large files (like 100mb from rapidshare) ?

I've only been dropped when downloading large files, otherwise I don't have any dropping.

mrod
Feb 13, 2008, 06:18 AM
Last night I had the first "drop-out" from the WiFi which could only be reset by disabling and re-enabling it. So, it looks that, from my point of view, 10.5.2 has made the problem worse.

I've never had problems with it under 10.5.0 and 10.5.1

(I was using a 2.6GHz MBP by the way.)

Neutral Gamer
Feb 13, 2008, 06:37 AM
Well, we've got to 200 posts and it looks like the problem just doesn't want to go away. :(

The worst thing is that people who NEVER had any wirless issues before have suddenly joined our club thanks to the new update - I feel pretty sorry for those people. Of course it does appear from this thread and others that SOME people are now sorted and if I still had my MBP I'd love to know if I was one of them!

Unfortunately a lot of people aren't so lucky as this thread that was setup yesterday shows:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=432284

I don't know what else to say; I'm kinda giving up hope here. All I can say is for people to keep sending their feedback to Apple themselves, describing the problem and hardware you have in detail:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/macosx.html

In the meantime I think I may have to get back my Tiger disc from the guy who bought my MBP before I decide to buy a Mac again ...

Viremia
Feb 13, 2008, 07:26 AM
I've had nothing but problems with wifi since the airport update that came out after 10.4.10. It drops connection all the time. Nothing that I did would keep it from doing that. I got so used to turning off and on the wifi that it almost feels weird to not have to do it now.

That's because 10.5.2 finally fixed my wifi problems. Since the update came out, not one single dropped connection.

For those still having problems or having new problems with wifi, I feel your pain but am glad I don't have it anymore. Let's hope Apple fixes this without messing mine up.

Mlobo01
Feb 13, 2008, 09:56 PM
I was trying the connection and I put the computer to sleep, it sleeps on its own fine, then it cant find the network? I tried my own hint of deleting the keychain and starting a new one, did it once (nothing happened) and then I decided to inspect the control access panel and one item was missing: which was the system preferences icon on this list, i add it to the list and now i tested it and i think its working so inspect your keychain access allowed apps.

fluidedge
Feb 14, 2008, 06:33 AM
just had a bit of scare - i thought i was completely fixed then the connection dropped!

Changed my security to WPA-PSK (as i've been meaning to do for ages) and it all seems to be OK again.

Everyone with problems - try this:

-turn airport off on all your wirelessly connecting machines
-Hardwire a computer to the wireless router
-type 192.168.0.1 (or whatever your router IP is) into safari/firefox
-Reset your security to WPA-PSK, if you already using WPA-PSK then reset it anyway
-change your password (everyone choose a new password) and whatever else you need to do
-restart the router etc
-unplug from the router
-search for 'keychain' in spotlight (well thats how i do it) and delete the keychain password for your current network
-now turn Airport on on one machine you use to surf wirelessly
-click on network properties
-assist me
-follow the instructions
-do the same for all other machines

So hopefully you have now completely reset the connection, deleting all memory of the old connection(s)

Let us know if this works out - it seems to have done the trick for me

inajeep
Feb 14, 2008, 07:30 AM
After the update I haven't experienced any disconnections. I was able to download and install the 10.5.2 without any issues. It's been a couple of days but my MacBook Pro is rarely powered down and it's either being used or in sleep which before is what would bring on the issues.

Another issue I had is when I used the laptop with another router(Motorolla) at a different location. Very very slow to connect or open pages. I never changed any settings so I'm gonna be interested to see if the problem goes away this weekend.

In both cases I'm using WEP. I don't have WPA options because of other older devices that don't support WPA.

motulist
Feb 14, 2008, 07:35 AM
Wifi still broken for me on 10.5.2 - For some particular networks it cant connect at all in the first place.

Everything worked on 10.3.9 using the automatic settings, upgraded to leopard and now I can't connect to some networks no matter what I do. It can still connect to other networks, and other 10.3 and 10.4 and vista machines I have still connect to all the networks perfectly.

Airport is still broken in Leopard.

Mlobo01
Feb 14, 2008, 04:08 PM
how do you have your network settings configured? if you have pics just post them, there may be something thats overlooked.(never mind answering I already posted on your other thread,motulist) I guess we can define two types of issues here, those users who are connecting to various networks and are constantly mobile and those who have a personal network at home and cant connect, so the answers need to be distinct. please specify for whom are you issuing possible solutions and thanks all for the any input, thanks again.

Mlobo01
Feb 14, 2008, 06:14 PM
It was at miami airport that I had trouble connecting, the full bars on but I had no router ip, their automatic loadpage would not load, anyway it was only after a while that their page loaded. no instant on. I did make it's own location, I did a traceroute through network utilities, and it was a "no go" until for some reason it kicked in, I did nothing special other than to hit the the "renew dhcp lease". did I mention I did install 10.5.2? :cool:

clevin
Feb 14, 2008, 06:16 PM
is there any thought about this might be a hardware problem?

Mlobo01
Feb 14, 2008, 09:00 PM
I have a mac mini (intel) and a powerbook g4, the powerbook has been more consistent than the mini, I think that this thread applies mostly to portables, I have read on the apple forums that some had had issues with the airport card itself (a certain series), Im running a home wireless network so my testing on the field is limited, most of my posts have been about achieving a stable connection at home, thats why I ask those that are coming into this thread to state the issue as best you can and to make the differentiation between home network and mobile connections such as connecting at Starbucks and such.

Mlobo01
Feb 15, 2008, 01:03 PM
Searching through one of my external drives for airportd (airport daemon) I found its location under /usr/bin/libexec or the hidden files of the HD, when I looked in the same spot it was not there under the new 10.5.2 upgrade, it had been relocated to Groups://. this can explain the initial connectivity problems after the upgrade, after a quick permissions repair and a cache clean-up it seems to have stabilize (for home networks at least) and adding the system preference app to the keychain control access applet help return it to normal. So far its been good and I've been connected for the last 4 days or so.

Consultant
Feb 15, 2008, 01:32 PM
I have a "Sweex Wireless Broadband Router 11G" so I assume it's a .g rather than .n

A lot of modems, especially the cheap stuff, don't work well with either windows or mac os x.

NO PROBLEM HERE WITH AIRPORT EXTREME N.

Neutral Gamer
Feb 15, 2008, 04:59 PM
A lot of modems, especially the cheap stuff, don't work well with either windows or mac os x.

NO PROBLEM HERE WITH AIRPORT EXTREME N.

But the point is that it DOES work well with Windows XP, Windows Vista, Mac OS Tiger and some Linux distros. It's Leopard that's the problem; blaming the hardware is letting Apple off the hook. If they just put the networking components used in Tiger into Leopard then a lot of people's problems would vanish.

veteq
Feb 15, 2008, 06:53 PM
I am experiencing exactly the same issue that the initial post described. My Imac drops the connection for no operant reason, the problem gets worse when I am downloading a large file. It took me two tries to get 10.5.2 update. I am using a new Linksys 802.11N router, never happens to the windows machine. I also notice that WPA was much worse then WEP, I never tried it with security off.


being new to MAC, I thought I had gotten a bad unit; Iwas about read to return it to the store when I came across a few threads describing the drop connection issue with 10.5.
this needs to be fixed

majordude
Feb 15, 2008, 09:11 PM
Grrr!

I set a bookmark using Quick Links, Subscribed Threads... so I always see the threads I replied to when I log into MacRumors.

I go nuts every time I see this thread. :mad:

"When the hell are Apple gonna fix..."

The better question is...

"When the hell is our skools gonna..." teach people proper grammar! :rolleyes:

(For you in Rio Linda, it should read... "When the hell is Apple...")

Maybe I just need to drink decaf. ;)

Neutral Gamer
Feb 15, 2008, 09:39 PM
Grrr!

I set a bookmark using Quick Links, Subscribed Threads... so I always see the threads I replied to when I log into MacRumors.

I go nuts every time I see this thread. :mad:

"When the hell are Apple gonna fix..."

The better question is...

"When the hell is our skools gonna..." teach people proper grammar! :rolleyes:

(For you in Rio Linda, it should read... "When the hell is Apple...")

Maybe I just need to drink decaf. ;)


majordude, I never knew you felt so strongly about the grammatical properties of the title. So, as to avoid your upcoming heart attack and keep the fragile notion of world peace in order, I have decided to ease your stress and changed the title accordingly.

All you had to do was ask! After all you only had 2.5 months to tell me ... :D (I'm surprised you haven't mentioned the capital "W" in "Wireless" as well; I get night sweats waiting for someone to reprimand me on that one.)

Now if only Apple would fix the wireless problem in the same way I fixed the title; we've both had the same amount of time after all ...

Vitek
Feb 15, 2008, 10:53 PM
I can't stand this anymore! Apple should fix this ASAP, it's REALLY getting annoying

majordude
Feb 15, 2008, 10:56 PM
majordude, I never knew you felt so strongly about the grammatical properties of the title. So, as to avoid your upcoming heart attack and keep the fragile notion of world peace in order, I have decided to ease your stress and changed the title accordingly.

GOD BLESS YOU! :D

majordude
Feb 15, 2008, 11:08 PM
I can't stand this anymore! Apple should fix this ASAP, it's REALLY getting annoying

Annoying is an understatement. Frankly, I think it lets Apple off the hook. It's like putting up with the idiosyncrasies of an old car, an old machine or maybe an old piece of shareware that crashes twice a day but is still better than most software you can find in Staples.

I believe that having a viable wireless internet connection (especially on a notebook computer) is non-negotiable.

Fixing this issue should be priority one for Apple. Obviously it isn't. :mad:

Frankly, I don't even know if they even believe it is an issue.

I paid something near $3K for something that Dell would have charged me $1K for and I'd be able to get email at LAX, Starbucks and in my %$@^& home! :mad:

Benisio
Feb 16, 2008, 02:33 AM
I installed 10.5.2. The size of the update was only 180mb. That update didn't solve the problem with Wi-Fi connection to my D-link router. Then I went to Apple.com and downloaded "Combo Update 10.5.2". After the instllation EVERYTHING is ok! My Wi-Fi connection is solid.:):):)

Mlobo01
Feb 16, 2008, 06:28 PM
"I think that these elements add stability to the network...the system prefs app, the systemUIserver, apple80211agent and the network diagnostic app shows there because that the only way to establish the keychain after the update. No matter how many times you set the configurations in the network pane it does not establish a keychain, unless you do a diagnostic and check the box that says;"add password to keychain" then you add these apps to the access control tab"
after this post I tested it and the connection dropped during sleep so...
I had to delete all the plist files because it did not re-connect after I awoke the computer from sleep, so I threw away the system configuration folder, all airport plists files and the keychain, upon restarting the keychain showed the files I was looking for which is the systemUIserver and the airport deamon, (in the keychain lists as: airport) I added the System prefs and the apple80211agent. I think this stabilizes yet again the network.

simulacrum
Feb 20, 2008, 08:19 AM
I was pulling my hair out there for a few days, but the 10.5.2 update solved the problem completely. I was this close to downgrading back to Tiger... I actually put the disk in the slot but canceled out of installation.

I kept thinking of those Mac vs. PC commercials where they claim PC users were "downgrading" back to XP due to problems with Vista...

fluidedge
Feb 20, 2008, 04:04 PM
perhaps another fix:

Create a new keychain.

i've just done this and it seems to have stabilized my connection.

I think the problem must lie within the keychain somewhere. Either time machine is corrupting the keychain, or there is a conflict within the keychain somewhere that seems to mess up the airport.

Jesus! You'd think by now between us we'd have found some hard and fast way of sorting this out wouldn't you! I hope apple are looking at this and trying all the things we're suggesting and bolting down a proper fix into 10.5.3!

Neutral Gamer
Feb 20, 2008, 04:11 PM
Jesus! You'd think by now between us we'd have found some hard and fast way of sorting this out wouldn't you! I hope apple are looking at this and trying all the things we're suggesting and bolting down a proper fix into 10.5.3!

I think it's time I sent Apple links to this thread and the various other Mac Rumors threads devoted to wireless problems with 10.5.1 and 10.5.2. Either that or it's time for a mass online petition ... what do you think?

Rexmac
Feb 22, 2008, 12:37 AM
Im running 10.5.2. and I was having this problem before the latest update. The wireless connection problems are happening on different routers and networks both open and closed.

Somehow I am able to consistently use firefox and IE in Parallels with XPSP2. If I have signal strength of any amount it works brilliantly on the XP side.

I have been through the available channels and posts on this thread and sometimes it helps for a few hours/days. After almost resigning to have to use XP for wireless I thought I would restart my MB. Now both operating system's browsers work.

Sometimes using network utility works... although at a rate that might as well be inconsistent.

Right now I am writing this from safari 10.5.2. all four browsers I have are connected (safari, firefox, and IE and firefox on xp).

I have reset routers, passwords, erased caches, keychain information, done some terminal commands (thank you Mlobo01) and now after two hours without connectivity through 10.5.2, I am suddenly on after a restart with Option/Command pr. Now I am on very solid as it usually is when I finally get online.

There should be a fix here soon. Thank you all for your help, time and energy.

superspud
Feb 22, 2008, 01:10 AM
i have been having random dropped connection for the last few months but ths past week it has gotten MUCH worse. i upgraded to 10.5.2 but it didnt solve anything, and could have possbily made it worse.

now when i try to log on ichat it connects, disconnects, connects, disconnects over and over until i can no longer log on b/c its timed out.

also at times i will have full strenth from my wirless network but it will act as if i am not connected and not load pages or log onto ichat.



wtf is going on? this is seriously annoying...

Luzzio
Feb 22, 2008, 05:13 AM
having wireless probs here too.

Such a shame... I hope it's not my router..cos I do manage to connect, but there are times which the Macbook just refuses to detect my wireless and connect to it.

Mlobo01
Feb 24, 2008, 07:48 PM
In seeking more stability within my home network, In the keychain app I created a new keychain in my user field and in the login field, my main network keychain is located in the system section. In the new keychain I renamed the Kind of keychain to:"Wireless network password" while the "name" "Wireless" is the name of your network, and the location of the new keychain is the same of your system location, in the area called "where" you find the information to be copied over, in the Access Control tab add the following files: apple80211agent and systemUIserver located in core services and the system prefs app. save changes, do one for your Login section and another for your user section. see if this improves stability, so far its been days since I did this and I've trying it out and the machine connects after sleep and restarts quickly.

antibact1
Feb 24, 2008, 07:56 PM
People may want to check this link out

http://gedblog.com/2008/02/20/solving-airports-mystery-dropouts/

benoitgphoto
Feb 24, 2008, 08:13 PM
People may want to check this link out

http://gedblog.com/2008/02/20/solving-airports-mystery-dropouts/

Even though I'm not an expert, I think this makes a lot of sense. I don't have any signal drop-outs on any of my 2 macs. I use a D-Link DIR-625 router (apparently known to be problematic with signal drop-outs) and there is only 1 other wireless router in my neighborhood...so as per this article, channel interference is not a problem for me and as I said, I don't have any drop-outs and never had (no matter Leopard version). It will be interesting to see people reporting on that.

mikeyredk
Feb 25, 2008, 12:21 AM
ill add to this…

Wifi had been solid with 10.4 no problems but ever since i jumped to 10.5 wifi has been driving me crazy. Right now using 10.5.2 router wrt54g firmware tofu.

What i learned

When using network diagnostics (boy did apple bury this) when I had problems connecting to websites it would tell me I had a green connection between the my computer and the ISP but not to the internet or server which I find odd. Turning off the airport card and on again gave me all greens again until it fails. But no other computer is affected so its not my router or firmware it has to be something local that is affecting the connection.

ambient
Feb 25, 2008, 12:53 AM
im experiencing the same problems on my MBP.. i have spent weeks trying to fix it.. narrowing down every possibility.. new router, internet connection ect.

The way i get it working is by restarting the computer and router and the same time

fluidedge
Feb 25, 2008, 04:23 AM
People may want to check this link out

http://gedblog.com/2008/02/20/solving-airports-mystery-dropouts/

Interesting and i'll give it a try, but it doesn't explain why this only occurs in leopard and not tiger

stvfisher
Feb 25, 2008, 04:11 PM
Seems the above link is stating his connection issue was due to interference from other Wireless networks. I don't think that's the case with most of our connection issues. I know for sure there are only 2 networks in my area and we are on different channels (I setup both networks). I still have drops on my Mac while my wife has no problems on her Thinkpad.

Draft
Feb 26, 2008, 04:48 AM
People may want to check this link out

http://gedblog.com/2008/02/20/solving-airports-mystery-dropouts/

I am also having this issue. The exact issue is that the connection slows down to almost 0 after using the slingbox for a while or copying a large file over the network.

I haven't tried the fix in this link yet, but I have noticed that there are 10+ wireless routers picked up by my MBP. I will try this when I get back home and see if things aren't better.

Green2Delta
Feb 26, 2008, 11:45 AM
My new (refurbished) MBP seems to be having trouble with only secured networks. It usually takes a few minutes to load pages and I constantly get "page cannot be displayed" screens. I know the problem isn't with my network because my windows based PC works fine, as well as another windows based laptop in the house. But I took it over to a friends house the other day and it worked flawlessly on his unsecured network.

So I have narrowed the problem down to my MacBook Pro + secured network. Are there some airport settings that I'm missing that would help stabilize my connection?

MacGeek7
Feb 26, 2008, 11:47 AM
I've had less and less problems with my MacBook and wi-fi dropouts since Leopard .1 and .2 updates

nsbio
Feb 26, 2008, 12:11 PM
Is wifi dropouts a really common problem? If so, why not complain to Apple and, if dropouts occur soon after purchase, return a computer or demand a refund for the purchased Leopard upgrade.

That said, I have not had problems with dropouts in Leopard (10.5.1 or 5.2) on a G4 PB.

Kilamite
Feb 26, 2008, 12:26 PM
People may want to check this link out

http://gedblog.com/2008/02/20/solving-airports-mystery-dropouts/

Makes a little bit sense as to why a drop out might occur to all network devices.

However, when a drop out occurs, it is just me that it happens to - my Windows based flat-mates stay connected.

Also, Tiger was fine.

jhande
Feb 26, 2008, 12:52 PM
Although I still have problems screen sharing, Leopard to Leopard, the suggested switching off of IP6 has helped a lot. No connections dropped in the last 24 hours.

dextertangocci
Feb 26, 2008, 02:37 PM
My MBP with 10.5.2 drops the connection every few minutes with Airport:mad:

It worked fine under Tiger.

Tman90
Feb 26, 2008, 04:05 PM
Makes a little bit sense as to why a drop out might occur to all network devices.

However, when a drop out occurs, it is just me that it happens to - my Windows based flat-mates stay connected.

Also, Tiger was fine.

That's also true with me, all the awful windows machines in my house have fine wireless.

does anyone know how to disable other networks from being scanned? (ie the ones you dont want to use, so that the one you do want to use will be the only one it tries to connect to). surely this would get rid of some of the interference.

Kilamite
Feb 26, 2008, 06:54 PM
That's also true with me, all the awful windows machines in my house have fine wireless.

does anyone know how to disable other networks from being scanned? (ie the ones you dont want to use, so that the one you do want to use will be the only one it tries to connect to). surely this would get rid of some of the interference.

It isn't the scanning that causes interference, it is the fact that there is two or more routers operating on the same channel and frequency.

Your Mac will only scan for available networks when you click the AirPort drop-down box or if you aren't connected to any wireless networks.

Mlobo01
Feb 26, 2008, 09:18 PM
I switched to channel 2, instead of 6 which is what most of my neighborhood is using according to iStumbler, and so far its been connecting without issues. But its good to go back on this big thread and READ some of the hints posted, I read some of the recent posts and it seems that some are posting as if this thread just initialized, so my advice would be to go back and apply or try some of the good info posted.

Draft
Feb 27, 2008, 03:50 AM
I am also having this issue. The exact issue is that the connection slows down to almost 0 after using the slingbox for a while or copying a large file over the network.

I haven't tried the fix in this link yet, but I have noticed that there are 10+ wireless routers picked up by my MBP. I will try this when I get back home and see if things aren't better.

Last night, I tried some of the tips in the previous posts. After changing my security from WPA to WEP and changing the channel to a non-used channel, all drop-outs seemed to have stopped.

The one problem I'm still having is copying large files via the finder from my G4 desktop (wired) to my MBP (wireless). When trying to do this, the first 10 megs or so copy within a second or 2. After this, things slow to a crawl, copying about 5-10 megs per minute. As a comparison, I tried copying the same file via scp and the entire 400 MB file copied in about a minute. This points directly to Apple's implementation of network file sharing.

Has anyone else seen similar issues?

I'd still like to try turning off IPv6 and trying again. I'll try this tonight and let everyone know the outcome.

russmeier
Feb 27, 2008, 07:04 PM
I also faced the dropped connections -- but only after upgrading to the latest Mac OS X release. I have a new MacBook bought the day after Christmas with Leopard pre-installed. It worked perfectly with ATT DSL for 6 weeks. Then, I updated to 10.5.2. Immediately, my wireless started dropping regularly (DSL model is a 2WIRE790). So, off to the internet I went to find a solution.

I can't find it right now in a Google search, but earlier this week I found a post on a sight by someone named "Lori" so credit goes out to her for discovering this and I hope she's reported the bug to Apple.

She discovered that Back to My Mac was someone erroring and removing the "default" dns path in the dns route tables. Each time default is removed, the wireless goes out. Default shows up again after a recycle of the airport card in the computer.

Anyway, tonight, my Mac was dropping every 2 minutes or so. It was very annoying. So, I tried what she suggested, I turned off Back to my Mac -- something I never turned on in the first place! Sure enough, my Mac hasn't dropped a connection in over three hours now. From once every 2 minutes to none in 3 hours!

It seems -- right now -- to have worked for me. I hope it works for you as well.

Russ

desistyle
Feb 27, 2008, 07:52 PM
Wait, so you never had back to my mac enabled but after the update it was already enabled? Interesting!

Where do you enable/disable it? I will go home and check if it's enabled on my machine...

russmeier
Feb 27, 2008, 08:14 PM
Wait, so you never had back to my mac enabled but after the update it was already enabled? Interesting!

Where do you enable/disable it? I will go home and check if it's enabled on my machine...

Nope, I sure didn't enable Back to My Mac. So, my guess is that the Mac OS X update did enable it. I never use .Mac to back stuff up, and I always make sure with every new machine to turn these "features" off.

It's now been another hour with no drops.

You can find anything using spotlight. Just open system preferences, in the spotlight box type "Back to my Mac". It will highlight .Mac. You'll find it in a tab in there.

Now, if you're not a .Mac member, then this is not the solution to your problem because you can't be "Back to My Mac-ing" without .Mac. But, if you are a .Mac member -- give it a shot!

Good Luck.

Russ

clayj
Mar 1, 2008, 11:32 PM
This random disconnect/failure to connect issue is driving me nuts. I keep running into the following: Getting prompted to join my network, even though the keychain already has my network name and WPA password; getting disconnected for no apparent reason, even though my MBA is about 4 feet from my AirPort Extreme base station; "connection timeout" after about 3 seconds when trying to connect; and having to turn AirPort on my MBA on and off several times before it will connect. I've already tried adjusting virtually every network setting I can think of (I am not switching back to WEP), but only my MBA, with its Leopard 10.5.2, has issues connecting and staying connected to my wireless network; all of my other network devices, even 50 feet away, can connect to my AEBS and stay connected without any issues.

I just now added SystemUIServer and Apple80211Agent to both entries for my network in Keychain Access. Hopefully this will help.

Apple, if you're reading this: GET THIS FIXED NOW. You can't blame this issue on anyone else.

iZoom P5
Mar 2, 2008, 12:01 AM
Clayj, that's exactly my problem, just as you described. It is very frustrating for iMac G5 that I just installed Leopard on today has Airport problems while the iBook running Tiger is just running as smooth as ever.

No matter what I change to try to get the iMac working, the iBook connects just fine. It's a challenge just to try to sync the settings because they switched certain things around (i.e. Interference Robustness in the menu bar).

I'm with you that they get a fix on this pronto!