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arn
May 2, 2002, 04:48 PM
Firewire 2 on the mysterious eBay Quicksilver Server (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2002/05/20020502153139.shtml)?

You can decide... Overview of 1394b (http://www.1394ta.org/Technology/About/ppt1.PDF) [PDF file] found on this page at 1394ta.org (http://www.1394ta.org/Technology/About/1394b.htm) had pictures of the upcoming 1394b connectors:

1394b ports (http://www.macrumors.com/images/1394b.gif)
Port on Server Motherboard (http://www.macrumors.com/images/mboardport.gif)

eyelikeart
May 2, 2002, 04:57 PM
so could it just have been a scrap from Apple?

if so...maybe someone stole it & is selling it?

or maybe it's a leakout... :confused:

King Cobra
May 2, 2002, 04:59 PM
Well at least this information was not from SpyMac, so it must be real :) .

It would be interesting how many other companies who sell CD and DVD writers/burners integrate Firewire 2 and/or USB 2 into their products.

Does Firewire 2 come Bluetooth compatible, so that you can plug and go portable?
__________________

Any time is a great time for iPod.

iH8Quark
May 2, 2002, 05:04 PM
Well it certainly looks copulatory with the Firewire 2 connector.

Gigawire would be good. I noticed in the PDF that it mentions "DTV" as an application. Does this refer to digital video? I figure it doesn't mean that you can hook your satellite dish up to it. :D ;)

Ensign Paris
May 2, 2002, 05:08 PM
Looks like it to me, I hope it is Gigawire and I really hope this is coming soon!

Ensign

Xapplimatic
May 2, 2002, 05:20 PM
OK, this is definitely not a standard motherboard.. and the color and the extra memory slot are two easy to spot proofs. The question about what is that port between the two FireWire ports and the Ethernet. I would be inclined to belive it to be a combo video output port like what's on the iBook and iMac, because Apple can accomodate old Fireware 1394a through a new port with the adaptor cable.. and why only one 1394b port if that's what it is?

strider42
May 2, 2002, 05:24 PM
Originally posted by King Cobra

Does Firewire 2 come Bluetooth compatible, so that you can plug and go portable?


I'm curious as to what you mean by that. how can firewire be bluetooth compatible. They are completely separate connection standards, and firewire 2 has a data transfer rate some 800 time higher than bluetooth.

King Cobra
May 2, 2002, 05:27 PM
Yeah, that Bluetooth question I asked...forget about it.

I meant that in regard with people asking about Bluetooth and the iPod. If a future iPod has Firewire 2, how does Bluetooth work?
__________________

Any time is a great time for iPod.

mischief
May 2, 2002, 05:42 PM
sorry guys.

arn
May 2, 2002, 05:43 PM
Originally posted by mischief
sorry guys.

next to the standard firewire...

There are 2 usb, 2 firewire, unknown port, and Ethernet.

The unknown port looks like 1394b. Reload the image... I've circled the suspect port.

arn

mischief
May 2, 2002, 05:50 PM
The conservative bet is that it's a modem.

But it's hard to see from that angle.:confused:

cp21yos
May 2, 2002, 05:59 PM
Has anyone noticed that by my rough calculations (being in Sydney, Australia not helping) the auction ends during Steve's Keynote at WWDC!

mischief
May 2, 2002, 06:05 PM
Now THAT's funny!!!!:D

Macmaniac
May 2, 2002, 06:09 PM
This is getting really strange, something is going on. Could this have been stolen? Where on Earth did he get it? This is wierd, lets keep on eye on this.

King Cobra
May 2, 2002, 06:10 PM
I just compared the keynote time to the eBay date:

Keynote: 14:00:00 (unsure of time zone)
eBay sale: 18:15:00 EST

It does seem interesting, but it could be a coincidence. Count on anything at WWDC.
__________________

Any time is a great time for iPod.

mischief
May 2, 2002, 06:12 PM
happens in the bay area so it would be 2 PM cupertino time or 14:00 PST.

madamimadam
May 2, 2002, 06:34 PM
Oh, I am SO glad I got a look at that thing straight away because now:

"The item you requested ( 2020903080 ) is invalid or no longer in our database. Please check the number and try again. If this message persists, the item has expired and is no longer available."

:(

It was good while it lastest.... all hail the "mothership"
;)

Wildcat
May 2, 2002, 06:43 PM
Did anyone else notice the copyright date on the PDF file supplied about firewire 2 is november 13 2000. It also says that virtually all VCR's, DVD's, and DVT's will have firewire a by 2002. Correct me if I am wrong but we are in 2002 and I dont think I have seen many units with firewire compatability other than standard DV cameras.

King Cobra
May 2, 2002, 06:47 PM
Originally posted by Wildcat
Did anyone else notice the copyright date on the PDF file supplied about firewire 2 is november 13 2000. It also says that virtually all VCR's, DVD's, and DVT's will have firewire a by 2002. Correct me if I am wrong but we are in 2002 and I dont think I have seen many units with firewire compatability other than standard DV cameras.

Wow, the turn of the millennium was that long ago? :)

But there are some units with Firewire ports, such as CD-RWs and Hard Drives (where would I be with USB?). However, these new appliances started using USB 2.0 BEFORE any Apple product was officially released with USB 2.0, as far as I know.

So that means that sooner or later future appliances may have this FireWire 2 technology built in. And we still have some time to go before we see 2003.
__________________

Any time is a great time for iPod.

Wildcat
May 2, 2002, 06:52 PM
my point was that the PDF was out of date.

mc68k
May 2, 2002, 06:53 PM
Originally posted by mischief
The conservative bet is that it's a modem.

But it's hard to see from that angle.:confused:

Why would they have a soldered modem on a server? Compared with the 1394b port, the height/width doesn't seem right for a modem.

First real dose or true rumor madness in a while! :)

King Cobra
May 2, 2002, 06:55 PM
Point well taken, Wildcat.

But I chose to address the issue further for certain possibilities/options that may pop up.

I would like to see Firewire capability with a VCR to a Mac so I do not need to keep watching Hostile Waters on the VCR! Maybe I can record the movie (I cannot buy the DVD for it, because I do not think there is a DVD version).
__________________

Any time is a great time for iPod.
300 posts and still counting.

Wildcat
May 2, 2002, 07:04 PM
I was not trying to argue that connections from various devices ( VCR's) to PC's will never occure. I was just trying to piont out this odd date on this PDF. Take it to mean whatever you will. Ohh yeah Macs Dont have USB 2 compatability yet. But yes there are some devices out there that are USB 2 copatable. And I don't even think that firewire b is even a standard yet.

Mr. Anderson
May 2, 2002, 07:06 PM
Originally posted by mischief
The conservative bet is that it's a modem.

But it's hard to see from that angle.:confused:

But look at it in relationship to the network plug - the rj45 outlet is just a little bit bigger than a modem - and the plug in question is tiny, smaller than the standard firewire. The pdf says its 8mmx5mm, that is small and its about what we're seeing. I'd place a bet that its 1394b.

Quark
May 2, 2002, 07:15 PM
Originally posted by King Cobra

...Wow, the turn of the millennium was that long ago?...

No. The turn of the millennium was a year and four months ago.

EXAMPLE:
B.C.--A.D.
3,2,1,1,2,3 --> 2001 = 2000 years

They skipped year 0.
B.C.--A.D.
3,2,1,0,1,2,3 --> 2000 = 2000 years

Jan. 1, 2001 is the first day of the new millennium, just as Jan 1, 3001 will be the turn of the next millennium.

:rolleyes:

Wildcat
May 2, 2002, 07:17 PM
well said Quark:)

mcrain
May 2, 2002, 07:31 PM
I still think that it has to be firewire 2. We know that it isn't far from being ready to come out, and it would be silly for them not to have it on test mobos.

It even has that same funny indent down the top.

I vote that it's firewire 2.

But, is it live or is it memorex? Or in this case photoshop?

mc68k
May 2, 2002, 07:45 PM
Originally posted by mcrain
But, is it live or is it memorex? Or in this case photoshop?

Could be, but I would say no. All the factors of this recent discovery all point towards something real, although anything's possible.

If this was a joke, it'd be one sick, sick joke…

mischief
May 2, 2002, 09:12 PM
AKA Gigawire.

Yeah.......that was it.

I've seen this before in a retrofitted 9600 chassis. didn't know what I was looking at then but learning about things recently have put it's bugginess in prespective. That rev was from a year ago..........:eek: :cool: :D

gerror
May 3, 2002, 03:45 AM
Isn't the processor a bit too slow for a demo? I mean, we are all talking about (dual) 1.5 gig in the next G4/G5.

DaveGee
May 3, 2002, 08:42 AM
Okay...

I too think that connector is FW2/Gigawire (I still hate to call it that since I really thought by the WordMark text Gigawire would be something else) but anyway... FW2 ... Now if it is a FW2 connector what is Apple gonna use to demo it? I mean Steve would look pretty silly talking about FW2 and the speed it brings to the platform and then have nothing available to show how useful it is. They better not bring out some $5,000+ digital video cam with a FW2 connector since that would be a pretty lame demo and besides that, I'm not even sure current DVCams even max out the current FW bus. Does anyone know for sure?

Cisco has been a name that kept popping up when Gigawire was talked about... Could Apple be in a position to finally provide IP over FW? This is something PeeCee users have been doing for quite some time but for some strange reason Apple has left that space to 3rd party developers and lets face it - if Apple doesn't roll it into the OS 'most' will not adopt it.

5 new G4s networked via FW2 over glass fiber and the max speed available (1.6 or 3.2) That sure would be a cool demo... (for for folks like me) but even I will admit that it won't 'ring the bell' for most.

The initial FW demo was done with a DVCam (1st demo) and then a pocket drive bus powered (2nd demo) and I still remember how 'effen' cool it was that MacOS didn't crash when Steve pulled the plug from the drive and the system that was playing the movie just paused. That alone 'sold' me on FW.

FW2 brings a ton of speed and even distance (and slower speeds) to the table... I'd just love to know how Steve will show it off...

Dave

p03
May 3, 2002, 09:27 AM
Yeah, that's all. Nice daydreaming :D

mischief
May 3, 2002, 10:27 AM
I think NOT.

there's no GPU on that mobo. Not to mention how lame it would be to put an iBook VGA in a rack.

FW 2 makes the most sense.:D

SPG
May 3, 2002, 12:43 PM
Firewire2, 1394b, gigawire. If they are all the same thing (the first two are for sure), it will surely be adopted. The fact that the PDF is old just shows how freakin long it takes for everyone to agree on a new standard. The port on the board does look like the new FW2 port, and for those interested the connector designs were even published in Macworld a few months ago, so I don't think that there's anything revolutionary here except that Apple is having a tough time keeping it's prototypes and testbeds securely locked up in Cupertino.
Firewire2 is not just meant for DV cameras which work just fine on 1394a, but for the future cameras that will run in HD, and for cluster compouting.

jg3
May 3, 2002, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by mc68k
Why would they have a soldered modem on a server?
Backup. It's not unusual for a server to have a modem so it can dial in if the net connection via ethernet goes bad. However, I think this looks more like the FW2 port from the PDF than RJ-11.

p03
May 4, 2002, 03:19 PM
You guys are beyond hope. Gigawire has nothing whatsoever to do with FireWire 2: why would they rename FireWire, especially in a misleading fashion (there's nothing "giga" about it)?

Also, you look up the trademark description for Gigawire: it's clearly wireless.

And that's a VGA connector. Learn to live with it.

mc68k
May 4, 2002, 03:50 PM
And that's a VGA connector.
A VGA connector? Did you compare the connector with the Firewire 2 port that arn provided? Why would they have a soldered in VGA connector? Only on laptops, 8600 desktop machines and below do/did they have soldered VGA connections.
Learn to live with it.
Strong words from a newbie. Bring your skepticism somewhere else and stop trying to cause a flame war.

Rower_CPU
May 4, 2002, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by p03
You guys are beyond hope. Gigawire has nothing whatsoever to do with FireWire 2: why would they rename FireWire, especially in a misleading fashion (there's nothing "giga" about it)?

Also, you look up the trademark description for Gigawire: it's clearly wireless.

And that's a VGA connector. Learn to live with it.

The pictures in the 1394b PDF clearly show a port that is identical to the one on that board. Please supply a picture of a VGA port scaled to match a current Firewire port for fair comparison. I can go around saying it's a p*nis enlarger port, but saying don't make it so...learn to live with it.

LethalWolfe
May 4, 2002, 09:00 PM
Originally posted by DaveGee

..., I'm not even sure current DVCams even max out the current FW bus. Does anyone know for sure?
Dave

DV is 36 Mbps (FW is 400Mbps).


Lethal

LimeiBook86
May 4, 2002, 11:31 PM
(this refers to a statment I read one page one) I wish I could see the motherboard.... someone should have saved the picture.... WHY DIDN'T THEY!? Or they should have taken a screenshot of the screen (by pressing COMMAND(apple)+SHIFT+3) Then you can e-mail it to people who want it. Apple can take away the site but not your image!:(

Rower_CPU
May 5, 2002, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by LimeiBook86
(this refers to a statment I read one page one) I wish I could see the motherboard.... someone should have saved the picture.... WHY DIDN'T THEY!? Or they should have taken a screenshot of the screen (by pressing COMMAND(apple)+SHIFT+3) Then you can e-mail it to people who want it. Apple can take away the site but not your image!:(

Look around man. arn's post leading off this thread has a picture, so do several other threads about this mobo...

Do some research before you go off on a rant!

DaveGee
May 5, 2002, 07:00 AM
Originally posted by LimeiBook86
(this refers to a statment I read one page one) I wish I could see the motherboard.... someone should have saved the picture.... WHY DIDN'T THEY!? Or they should have taken a screenshot of the screen (by pressing COMMAND(apple)+SHIFT+3) Then you can e-mail it to people who want it. Apple can take away the site but not your image!:(

This is a wonderful first post... Two thumbs up! :rolleyes:

DaveGee
May 5, 2002, 07:07 AM
Originally posted by LethalWolfe
DV is 36 Mbps (FW is 400Mbps).

Thanks Lethal... I kinda thought FW supported speeds much faster than DVCams... Now back to the question at hand...

Since nothing (that I know of) comes close to maxing out 1394a (400Mbps) what would Steve use to really show of the power of 1394b (800/1600/3200Mbps)? The only thing I can think of would be networking over FW. The problem with that is Apple doesn't support IP over FW (yet).

This would be a really cool feature for 10.2 and my fingers are crossed but other than that what else could Steve/Apple use to show off the power of FW2?

Dave

willmore
May 5, 2002, 09:45 AM
Originally posted by iH8Quark
Well it certainly looks copulatory with the Firewire 2 connector.

Gigawire would be good. I noticed in the PDF that it mentions "DTV" as an application. Does this refer to digital video? I figure it doesn't mean that you can hook your satellite dish up to it. :D ;)

FireWire has grown substantially in the past few years in its number of applications, partially due to its bandwidth and overall market acceptance. FireWire has in the past been considered a possible addition to ReplayTV/TiVo-type devices, DTV, and such, although something in the back of my head tells me that the bandwidth needed for full-blown HDTV would take more than FireWire 1 could provide. Also, FireWire has been touted as the perfect stereo cable, replacing copper, RCA composite, optical, etc.

If you remember when FireWire was just being discussed, it was the "magic bus." The "magic" part became from its ability to serve as a bus between anything; computer to keyboard/monitor/camera/printer/stereo/etc., hard drive to TV, TiVo to TV, etc. The list goes on and on. What we're seeing now is the gradual realization of that grand scheme.

lucs
May 5, 2002, 08:17 PM
i mean, dude, it just makes so much sense for Apple to release firewire 2 in the coming months. All we have to hope for is that 3rd party hardware developers also start using it....

but then again, we all know that Apple is not the kind of company that abides, its the kind that makes everyone else adapt to their way.

It's like that Limp Bizkit song, "i'm gonna do things my way, things my way, my way or the highway"

btw, limp bizkit rocks ass.

lucs
May 5, 2002, 08:36 PM
i mean, dude, it just makes so much sense for Apple to release firewire 2 in the coming months. All we have to hope for is that 3rd party hardware developers also start using it....

but then again, we all know that Apple is not the kind of company that abides, its the kind that makes everyone else adapt to their way.

It's like that Limp Bizkit song, "i'm gonna do things my way, things my way, my way or the highway"

btw, limp bizkit rocks ass.

Rower_CPU
May 5, 2002, 08:38 PM
lucs-
What's up with the double-postings?

King Cobra
May 5, 2002, 08:44 PM
Let me make a few replys.

First to lucs:
Limp Bizkit is a cool artist. I am even playing that song right now.

Second to lucs:
Limp Bizkit is a cool artist. I am even playing that song right now. :)

Third to the guys in the previous page about the turn of the millennium:
I knew that the mil. changed from 2000 to 2001. My comment about it being that long ago was supposed to mean that I was living in the previous millennium that short while ago. Time seemed to soar.

I have heard rumors about this Firewire 2 being as fast as 800Mbps. How fast is it really?
__________________

Any time is a great time for iPod.

Scottgfx
May 6, 2002, 12:41 AM
Originally posted by willmore


FireWire has grown substantially in the past few years in its number of applications, partially due to its bandwidth and overall market acceptance. FireWire has in the past been considered a possible addition to ReplayTV/TiVo-type devices, DTV, and such, although something in the back of my head tells me that the bandwidth needed for full-blown HDTV would take more than FireWire 1 could provide. Also, FireWire has been touted as the perfect stereo cable, replacing copper, RCA composite, optical, etc.


The compressed form of HDTV will fit nicely inside the bandwidth of Firewire. The ATSC form of digital television we are using here in the US is MPEG2 based and is only 25 to 50Mb/s. I can't remember the exact number. I've heard about plans to record the compressed HDTV signal directly to mini DV cassettes or digital VHS for some time.

p03
May 6, 2002, 08:39 AM
Okay, just because I'm a newbie at a... cough second-rate rumors site, I don't know anything.

So let's see... Apple includes a FireWire 2 slot. FireWire 2 is compatibe with "legacy" FireWire. So why include two "legacy" FireWire ports as well?

Then... You guys say, why have a laptop VGA port on a desktop motherboard?

Well... How about "to save space"? Here (http://www.apple.com/imac/images/specscallouts01152002.jpg)'s the iMac's MiniVGA port. Here (http://www.apple.com/ibook/images/ibookports06132001.jpg)'s the iBook's.
And this (http://www.apple.com/powermac/images/moreinfor07092001.gif) is the current PowerMac's back panel. Not exactly the same, though similar somewhat.

I'll eat crow if that port turns out to be a FireWire 2 indeed... But please, at least forget about GigaWire... That ain't FireWire 2! (Or triple crow for me, we'll see.)

p03
Jul 23, 2002, 10:57 AM
This is from the MacRumors.com front page:

The "mystery port" that was on early designs of the motherboard was a mini-VGA video port (like on the P80 iMac, iBook & PowerBook), and is not in the final product because it was only needed for testing the units sans-video card.

I rest my case.

Rower_CPU
Jul 23, 2002, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by p03
This is from the MacRumors.com front page:

I rest my case.

Too bad that's not what's going to be on the final mobo.;)

PS. For a "second-rate rumors site" we sure have gotten a lot of press lately.:p

p03
Jul 23, 2002, 11:22 AM
Originally posted by Rower_CPU

PS. For a "second-rate rumors site" we sure have gotten a lot of press lately.:p

Way to go! MOSR, Think Secret, beware! :)