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arn
Jul 30, 2002, 06:37 PM
The Inquirer (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=4700) reports that, according to their sources, Apple is preparing for an update on their SuperDrives.

The updates hinted at include 4x DVD-R and 12x CD-R as well as long awaited TiBook/Superdrive options.

ShaolinMiddleFinger
Jul 30, 2002, 06:48 PM
If Apple's going to put a superdrive into the TiBooks, I'm buying one the minute it's announced.

kishba
Jul 30, 2002, 07:19 PM
damn i just bought a new tibook 800... it hasn't arrived yet but i will be one frustrated customer if apple annoucnes superdrive powerbooks right after i buy mine... :(

cyberfunk
Jul 30, 2002, 07:27 PM
I'm wondering, does it take more NRG to burn your average DVD-R than a CDR ? Sure... it takes more time to burn, therefore it must use more laser energy.... but, per second of burning, does it use more energy? A consideration... can u burn a full disc on bat power ?

coolkamio
Jul 30, 2002, 08:07 PM
Originally posted by cyberfunk
I'm wondering, does it take more NRG to burn your average DVD-R than a CDR ? Sure... it takes more time to burn, therefore it must use more laser energy.... but, per second of burning, does it use more energy? A consideration... can u burn a full disc on bat power ?

Well...
A DVD-R takes about 29 min to burn.
4700Mbytes / 2,7Mbytes/s (2x DVD-R)
1740 seconds / 60 seconds = 29 min

The dvd-r in the market only use about a 20% more energy than cd-rw drives.
I think that an optimized superdrive for tibook can reduce the power consumption.

MrEFord
Jul 30, 2002, 08:18 PM
Bah, I just bought a new Pbook Ti... oh well.

Scab Cake
Jul 30, 2002, 08:20 PM
I was wondering if anyone could provide some answers to these questions...

I'm pretty sure that it takes a laser temperature of approximately 200 degrees celsius to burn and crystallize a CD-R. Is the burning temperature the same for DVD-R?

What are the physical material differences between DVD-Rs and CD-Rs (other than the width of the coiled material in the disc)? Essentially, what are the compositional differences between CD-R and DVD-R?

I'm sure this would all factor into battery usage. I know that DVDs have to spin faster and, by nature, use more battery power. My extremely uninformed opinion would leave me to believe that Apple would have to provide new battery technology to include a superdrive (as well as a really efficient way to disperse the heat through the machine). I know that the latest revision of the powerbook supposedly resolved the heat issues, but I haven't had access to the new models. Anyone out there with some comparisons?

cryptochrome
Jul 30, 2002, 08:22 PM
You know what the ironic thing is? If they can fit a superdrive in a TiBook, they could put it in an iBook too.

Man, if they came out with an iBook/Superdrive option I'd be all over that...

Backtothemac
Jul 30, 2002, 08:34 PM
If they put one in the PowerBook, they will sell a lot of new PowerBooks! They won't put one in the iBook until it has a G4. The G3 just cannot handle it.

ponyboy
Jul 30, 2002, 08:36 PM
Originally posted by kishba
damn i just bought a new tibook 800... it hasn't arrived yet but i will be one frustrated customer if apple annoucnes superdrive powerbooks right after i buy mine... :(

That is the nature of the beast buddy... I bought my first G3 tower a month before they released the G4, had I been on these forums prior or even knew they existed I would have known. I am typing this on a Rev. A Tibook and believe me they have been updated far beyond my machine and I wish I had a new one.

I tend to think this rumor is true a good friend of mine and I were discussing the powerbooks and he said he wasnt buying one until they had superdrives, my comment was that'll be a while and he told me that he just finished shooting and ad for it... We'll see.

askien
Jul 30, 2002, 08:50 PM
Backtothemac said:

If they put one in the PowerBook, they will sell a lot of new PowerBooks! They won't put one in the iBook until it has a G4. The G3 just cannot handle it.


I can't think of one reason why the G3 wouldn't be able to handle burning DVD's. I can think of reasons why it would not be fast encoding MPEG's (the lack of Altivec acceleration,) but what about data DVD's with backups and such?

I really don't understand Apple's policy of having products that can't run some of its software, no matter how slow.

In my opinion they should make all software run on both G3's and G4's or get rid of G3's entirely.

This is irrelevant to desktop Macs because, except for the old iMacs they are all G4-based. What about iBooks, which are awesome machines otherwise? See, I don't want a powerbook. I want an iBook. It's small and sexy.

I would use a powerbook as a desktop replacement, or as a mobile computer, but not as a "real" laptop, you know, the kind you actually use all over the place. It's too big.

Oh, and it would be great if Apple could graft Altivec on top of the sahara chip.

coolkamio
Jul 30, 2002, 09:00 PM
The Apple expo paris will be on Sep-10, anyone thinks or knows if the new tibook with superdrive, and the new Powermac will be presented in this expo?

I'm Spanish, and i'm thinking that a little travel to Paris would be great if apple presents the pro-line of his computers.

Uhmm...
Ohh happy day! ;)

Apple Expo Paris 2002 (http://www.apple-expo.com/)

MacMaster
Jul 30, 2002, 09:15 PM
Originally posted by cyberfunk
I'm wondering, does it take more NRG to burn your average DVD-R than a CDR ? Sure... it takes more time to burn, therefore it must use more laser energy.... but, per second of burning, does it use more energy? A consideration... can u burn a full disc on bat power ?
Answer me this: Do you really need to burn a DVD when you're on the go (not near a AC outlet)? You're going to have made the DVD and then just plug it in and let it sit there and burn....

Hawthorne
Jul 30, 2002, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by askien
Backtothemac said:


I can't think of one reason why the G3 wouldn't be able to handle burning DVD's. I can think of reasons why it would not be fast encoding MPEG's (the lack of Altivec acceleration,) but what about data DVD's with backups and such?

IIRC, a G4 is required to run iDVD, that's why.

mymemory
Jul 30, 2002, 10:10 PM
Well, this is a good news, I think that the problem with burning a CD or DVD in a TiBook is not the laser if no the spining, that is a electromotive engine and that consumes energy more than a lazr beam for sure, any way I think Apple is giving you the option of a mobile superdrive, the energy factor is not as important as the funcionality you are gonna get as a costumer.

Is good to hear we are gonna get a new drive soon.

But the processor, THE PROCESSOR!!!:confused: :confused: :confused:

AndyAMPohl
Jul 30, 2002, 10:10 PM
No doubt this has been brought up before in other threads, but does Apple plan to pursue DVD-RW? A DVD-RW in a powerbook would be incredible. I heard Sony is planning on something for their next laptop.

Andy

iH8Quark
Jul 30, 2002, 10:38 PM
Originally posted by MacMaster

Answer me this: Do you really need to burn a DVD when you're on the go (not near a AC outlet)? You're going to have made the DVD and then just plug it in and let it sit there and burn....

Some folks (especially in the city where real estate is around $300 / sq. ft.) have ditched the minitower as their home computer, and use portables. They take up so much less space, less cords, and are mobile.

Monitor = about 4 Sq. Ft.
$1200
+
Keyboard / mouse = about 2.5 Sq. Ft.
$750

-----------------

$1950 in space saved by getting a portable. AND you can remove it from the table easily and use the space for something else. Like dinner. :D

Yes. I would welcome a TiBook with SuperDrive.

Snowy_River
Jul 30, 2002, 11:13 PM
Originally posted by iH8Quark


(especially in the city where real estate is around $300 / sq. ft.)

Boy, I hope that I never live in that city... That would mean that a 1,000 sqft house would cost (I presume we're talking buying, not renting) $300,000! Whew. That makes my head spin...

eric_n_dfw
Jul 31, 2002, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by AndyAMPohl
No doubt this has been brought up before in other threads, but does Apple plan to pursue DVD-RW? A DVD-RW in a powerbook would be incredible. I heard Sony is planning on something for their next laptop.

Andy
The QuickSilver and G4 iMac SuperDrives are DVD-RW drives. iDVD just doesn't support it from what I understand. If you use Toast 5 you can use DVD-RW's with them. (Can anyone with a SuperDrive back me up on this?)

I would presume a TiBook SuperDrive would be the same.
-Eric S.

MacMaster
Jul 31, 2002, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by eric_n_dfw

The QuickSilver and G4 iMac SuperDrives are DVD-RW drives. iDVD just doesn't support it from what I understand. If you use Toast 5 you can use DVD-RW's with them. (Can anyone with a SuperDrive back me up on this?)

I would presume a TiBook SuperDrive would be the same.
-Eric S.
Yes their superdrives are DVD-RW drives. It would seem logical that iDVD would only support DVD-R disks (I can't check to confirm this right now). Toast 5 does support DVD-RW disks however.

iH8Quark
Jul 31, 2002, 01:29 AM
Originally posted by Snowy_River


Boy, I hope that I never live in that city... That would mean that a 1,000 sqft house would cost (I presume we're talking buying, not renting) $300,000! Whew. That makes my head spin...

The sacrifice is worth the gain in other departments. ;)

(and, BTW, that's $300 sq. ft. for a loft. A 1000 sq. ft. house would be in the neighborhood of $0.5 mil. You have to buy the land it's on. :rolleyes: )

yes...if we could all live on cheap desert land....I mean sand... ;)

Arcady
Jul 31, 2002, 05:31 AM
I love these guys who whine about just buying a PowerBook G4 and they can't burn DVD's.

"WAH! I had $3500 to spend on a laptop and I am too poor too spend $399 more for a DVD burner!"

Try running OS X on a 9600 for a few months and you'll quit your bitching. I was planning to buy a new Mac, but not after all the BS Apple has put upon us lately. I'm buying CPU upgrades, refurb and used Macs, and whatever else I can get that does not give Apple a cent. I have already bought 27 Macs in 18 years. And now they want $99 for a 2 cent email address. Screw them ....

Rocketman
Jul 31, 2002, 06:02 AM
Originally posted by MacMaster

Answer me this: Do you really need to burn a DVD when you're on the go (not near a AC outlet)? You're going to have made the DVD and then just plug it in and let it sit there and burn....

If you are capuuring DV video and have an under 20gb drive you might occasionally save to DVD. If you are a video editor you might save to tape, er, dvd, the final version for a customer review.

With more people able to do reasonably edited video with titles this may tricke down to lectures, graduations, weddings and other highly common events. I am sure Apple hopes leigions of TiG4 and DV camera equipped people are going around working.

Rocketman

eric_n_dfw
Jul 31, 2002, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by Arcady
I love these guys who whine about just buying a PowerBook G4 and they can't burn DVD's.

"WAH! I had $3500 to spend on a laptop and I am too poor too spend $399 more for a DVD burner!"

While I tend to agree, the $399 burner (if you can find an external one for that much) will cost you about $1399 when you throw in DVD Studio Pro. iDVD doesn't support external burners.

woodsey
Jul 31, 2002, 07:03 AM
I believe the current powerbooks are the most expensive ever!

I would hope Apple offer DVD-R as an optional extra, if not the price could jump quite considerably and be out of reach of many.

Rocketman
Jul 31, 2002, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by Rocketman


With more people able to do reasonably edited video with titles this may tricke down to lectures,


This could result in study groups forming and recording lectures by one person while the rest go to the beach or a party in college. Store-forward comes to EDU.

:cool:

Nebrie
Jul 31, 2002, 07:31 AM
Originally posted by woodsey
I believe the current powerbooks are the most expensive ever!

I would hope Apple offer DVD-R as an optional extra, if not the price could jump quite considerably and be out of reach of many.

No they're not. Remember the first TiBooks? $3500?

sphereboy
Jul 31, 2002, 08:09 AM
Does anyone think that they might be able to fit the superdrive in the current body case of the TiBook.

Maybe they will offer an upgrade for current TiBook users.

I don't really care about the superDrive... but it is a nice toy to have and to show off to my (sshhh PC) buddies.

Peace. :)

bretm
Jul 31, 2002, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by Snowy_River


Boy, I hope that I never live in that city... That would mean that a 1,000 sqft house would cost (I presume we're talking buying, not renting) $300,000! Whew. That makes my head spin...

Here' in Atlanta a 1000 sq ft house would could easily cost $400,000 in the midtown area. And they're all around 80 years old!

People who bought in (or little old ladies) before the olympics in 96 have made a nice profict on their previously $150,000 homes.

Macmaniac
Jul 31, 2002, 08:29 AM
This could mean that new there will be new powermacs soon with new super drives;) If all the speculation is right then it could be as soon as august.
I have yet to see a DVD burner in ANY laptop, so the TiBook could be the first:)

eric_n_dfw
Jul 31, 2002, 08:33 AM
Originally posted by woodsey
I believe the current powerbooks are the most expensive ever!

I would hope Apple offer DVD-R as an optional extra, if not the price could jump quite considerably and be out of reach of many.
Actually, when you compare the top of the line, $3199, TiBook 800 to prior PowerMac's they're quite in line.

Per EveryMac.com (http://www.everymac.com/systems/by_casetype/portable.html), the original retail on prior portable Mac's that were equal to or greater than the G4 800 TiBook (not adjusted for inflation):
09/20/1989, Macintosh Portable (16 MHz 68HC000): $6500
02/11/1991, Macintosh Backlit Portable (16 MHz 68HC000): $6500
02/10/1993, PowerBook 165c (33 MHz 68030): $3400
10/21/1991, PowerBook 170 (25 MHz 68030): $4600
10/19/1992, PowerBook 180 (33 MHz 68030): $3870
07/07/1993, PowerBook 180c (33 MHz 68030): $4160
05/16/1994, PowerBook 520c (25 MHz 68LC040): $4000
05/16/1994, PowerBook 540 (33 MHz 68LC040): $4580
05/16/1994, PowerBook 540c (33 MHz 68LC040): $5200
11/20/1996, PowerBook 1400c/117 (17 MHz PowerPC 603e): $3500
07/14/1997, PowerBook 1400c/166 (166 MHz PowerPC 603e): $3500
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/180 (180 MHz PowerPC 603e): $5000
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/200 (200 MHz PowerPC 603e): $5500
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/240 (240 MHz PowerPC 603e): $6400
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300c/100 (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $4500 <--- Mac Trivia: The 5300 series are the infamous Mac's that caught on fire! :eek:
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300cs/100 (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $3500
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300ce/117 (117 MHz PowerPC 603e): $6500
05/16/1994, PowerBook Duo 280c (33 MHz 68LC040): $4750
08/28/1995, PowerBook Duo 2300c (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $4500
11/10/1997, PowerBook G3 (1st Gen.) (250 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $5700
05/06/1998, PowerBook G3/233 (233 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
05/06/1998, PowerBook G3/250 (250 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $4400
09/01/1998, PowerBook G3/266 (266 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
05/06/1998, PowerBook G3/292 (292 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $5600
09/01/1998, PowerBook G3/300 (300 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $5000
05/10/1999, PowerBook G3/400 (400 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
02/16/2000, PowerBook G3/500 FW (500 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
01/09/2001, PowerBook G4/400 (500 MHz PowerPC 7410 (G4)): $3499


(Boy - am I a geek or what!) :cool:

Wyvernspirit
Jul 31, 2002, 09:12 AM
So what you are saying is: The price on the current powerbooks is very reasonable if compared to earlier model years. Interesting...

heinzruediger
Jul 31, 2002, 09:23 AM
I would be pi**ed, if this is gonna happen, I just got my TiBook, after a long time saving my bucks.

marcsiry
Jul 31, 2002, 09:33 AM
Everyone is aware that computer products are updated every 3-6 months.

If you don't buy a machine within a month of its introduction, then you're going to see it update "soon" after you bought it. It's inevitable!

I just bought a dual 1 Ghz, knowing full well that the PowerMacs are due for an update. Will it be as fast as the new machines? No. Is it faster than my old 500 mhz G4? Heck ya!

So now, every day I get to have a much better experience working than I did with the 500...who knows how long it will be before the new machines are finally delivered? Who knows how long it will be before all the bugs in the new configuration are worked out? I'll wait to buy until at least the second generation of the new machines.

And then there's always the possiblity of another "Yikes"... that the new machines are stopgaps, and thus crippled somehow.

I limped along with my old machine for the last two years, knowing there were faster machines out there... somehow I survived. You'll survive, too!

heinzruediger
Jul 31, 2002, 09:54 AM
yes, that's a good point !

sphereboy
Jul 31, 2002, 10:00 AM
Originally posted by heinzruediger
I would be pi**ed, if this is gonna happen, I just got my TiBook, after a long time saving my bucks.

You should enjoy your TiBook. I know i do. It's a shame they do this to us, BUT there is a small light of hope.. that would allow us to upgrade our TiBook with a superDrive... who knows

MacArtist
Jul 31, 2002, 10:22 AM
I did a start to finish DVD on a Dual 1GHz and it took @ 2 1/2 hours. That is taking 40min of DV footage, importing it into iMovie, throwing in a title, exporting it for iDVD, dropping it into an iDVD project,and burning the DVD. The most cpu, and power, intensive task is converting the footage to mpeg2 right before burning the DVD.

I would have to say that one would be cutting it very close with a full battery if they did the above steps just as I did. We are all realists and know that with uses such as video editing and DVD authoring, you don't get 5 hours of battery life out of a powerbook. So for a SuperDrive equiped Tibook to be a viable mobile option, Apple needs to up the battery life on it (which they very well might do with the next update). At that time this will make one hell of a portable to show off to everyone.

djniche
Jul 31, 2002, 10:54 AM
SuperDrive for laptops due later this year
July 31 - 10:50 ET Pioneer plans to launch a recordable DVD drive for laptops, which will write DVDs at 2x, record CDs at 16x, and rewrite CDs at 10x, according to c|net. There's no word yet on whether Apple's PowerBook G4 will be able to accommodate the drive; the PowerBooks requires a slimmer drive than most laptops.

Rower_CPU
Jul 31, 2002, 11:04 AM
Link to the c|net article:
http://news.com.com/2100-1040-947250.html

pianojoe
Jul 31, 2002, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by MacMaster

Yes their superdrives are DVD-RW drives. It would seem logical that iDVD would only support DVD-R disks (I can't check to confirm this right now). Toast 5 does support DVD-RW disks however.

You're right. iDVD doesn't write to DVD-RWs on my Dual 800 G4, Toast does. Getting a lot of errors with cheap DVD-RWs though.

SPG
Jul 31, 2002, 11:21 AM
This has come up before (I think three months ago?) and everyone either didn't understand what was involved or poopooed the idea that anyone would ever need or want a DVD burner in a laptop. I personally figured we were a year out at least before we'd get one, but I will gladly admit to being wrong if I can get my hands on one soon.
Anyway, the drives look to be a near reality and I think it will be a boost for Apple. This will almost certainly mean a new tiBook enclosure modification, unless Pioneer has been able to get the whole thing down to the ultra ultra ultra slim size needed for the current G4ti, now if only everyone would agree on DVD-RW or DVD+RW as the format...

TechLarry
Jul 31, 2002, 12:09 PM
Originally posted by MacMaster

Answer me this: Do you really need to burn a DVD when you're on the go (not near a AC outlet)? You're going to have made the DVD and then just plug it in and let it sit there and burn....

If you have 1MB of data more than what you were using can hold, yes :)

TL

Snowy_River
Jul 31, 2002, 12:13 PM
Originally posted by woodsey
I believe the current powerbooks are the most expensive ever!

I would hope Apple offer DVD-R as an optional extra, if not the price could jump quite considerably and be out of reach of many.

Sorry, not by a long shot. I bought a 200MHz PB3400 when they came out (the middle option, not the high end which ran at 240MHz). That machine cost $5500 with only 16MB RAM. Add enough RAM to do something with it, and you pushed over $6k. (Yes, RAM was much more expensive back then.) So, the PBs now are cheap by comparison.

neilt
Jul 31, 2002, 12:19 PM
Originally posted by TechLarry


If you have 1MB of data more than what you were using can hold, yes :)

TL

umm.....
isn't it more cost effective to use 2 700MB cd's at <50 instead of one DVD at $5?

neilt

bretm
Jul 31, 2002, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by MacArtist
I did a start to finish DVD on a Dual 1GHz and it took @ 2 1/2 hours. That is taking 40min of DV footage, importing it into iMovie, throwing in a title, exporting it for iDVD, dropping it into an iDVD project,and burning the DVD. The most cpu, and power, intensive task is converting the footage to mpeg2 right before burning the DVD.

I would have to say that one would be cutting it very close with a full battery if they did the above steps just as I did. We are all realists and know that with uses such as video editing and DVD authoring, you don't get 5 hours of battery life out of a powerbook. So for a SuperDrive equiped Tibook to be a viable mobile option, Apple needs to up the battery life on it (which they very well might do with the next update). At that time this will make one hell of a portable to show off to everyone.

Interesting. I burned a 57minute DVD with a G4 350 in about 4 hours or less. Encoding in iDVD and burning. You'd hope that the Dual Gig offered more than a 25%-30%speed increase that my 350mhz that only cost 1500bucks 2.5 years ago. Guess iDVD doesn't use the dual processors. But still.

coolkamio
Jul 31, 2002, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by neilt


umm.....
isn't it more cost effective to use 2 700MB cd's at <50 instead of one DVD at $5?

neilt
700 x 2 = 1400Mb...
Dvd storage capacity is 4,7Gb...
4700 / 700 = 6,7 cd's
0,25$ x 6,7 = 1,67$

A dvd cost 1 - 2$ in this online-shop in packs (http://store.yahoo.com/meritline/dvdrblankmedia.html)

1,28$ /dvd for a 25 pack double-sided (9,4Gb).
I think that the prices of dvd-r are very reasonable today.
And DVD's are best than cd's, for all.
The advantages are a lot!.
For example, you can burn a copy of your os x, installation and boot from the dvd...
With cd's cannot...
I only need to say, welcome superdrive to tibooks

Rocketman
Jul 31, 2002, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by neilt


umm.....
isn't it more cost effective to use 2 700MB cd's at <50 instead of one DVD at $5?

neilt

A DVD is about 6 CD's of data so yes they are "cheaper" and also less leading edge so the drives are cheaper as well. So this may be a viable option.

But if you use a portable computer with a 20+ gb drive and your problem is filling up the drive too often, the best option is external drive(s) or DVD so you don't have to burn dozens of CD's, but far fewer DVD's or external firewire drives.

Typical uses would be taking alot of high resolution digital photographs, digital recording of audio or especially digital video.

I suspect when HDTV resolution goes consumer every computer will have raid and some method to hook up to the server for offload, possibly wireless or many local hard access points.

Rocketman

http://v-serv.com/-upload/avatar.jpg

Joshlew
Jul 31, 2002, 01:08 PM
Ha ha! I've been waiting for this!:D ;) :cool:

Rocketman
Jul 31, 2002, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by eric_n_dfw

Actually, when you compare the top of the line, $3199, TiBook 800 to prior PowerMac's they're quite in line.

Per EveryMac.com (http://www.everymac.com/systems/by_casetype/portable.html), the original retail on prior portable Mac's that were equal to or greater than the G4 800 TiBook (not adjusted for inflation):
09/20/1989, Macintosh Portable (16 MHz 68HC000): $6500
02/11/1991, Macintosh Backlit Portable (16 MHz 68HC000): $6500
02/10/1993, PowerBook 165c (33 MHz 68030): $3400
10/21/1991, PowerBook 170 (25 MHz 68030): $4600
10/19/1992, PowerBook 180 (33 MHz 68030): $3870
07/07/1993, PowerBook 180c (33 MHz 68030): $4160
05/16/1994, PowerBook 520c (25 MHz 68LC040): $4000
05/16/1994, PowerBook 540 (33 MHz 68LC040): $4580
05/16/1994, PowerBook 540c (33 MHz 68LC040): $5200
11/20/1996, PowerBook 1400c/117 (17 MHz PowerPC 603e): $3500
07/14/1997, PowerBook 1400c/166 (166 MHz PowerPC 603e): $3500
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/180 (180 MHz PowerPC 603e): $5000
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/200 (200 MHz PowerPC 603e): $5500
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/240 (240 MHz PowerPC 603e): $6400
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300c/100 (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $4500 <--- Mac Trivia: The 5300 series are the infamous Mac's that caught on fire! :eek:
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300cs/100 (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $3500
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300ce/117 (117 MHz PowerPC 603e): $6500
05/16/1994, PowerBook Duo 280c (33 MHz 68LC040): $4750
08/28/1995, PowerBook Duo 2300c (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $4500
11/10/1997, PowerBook G3 (1st Gen.) (250 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $5700
05/06/1998, PowerBook G3/233 (233 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
05/06/1998, PowerBook G3/250 (250 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $4400
09/01/1998, PowerBook G3/266 (266 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
05/06/1998, PowerBook G3/292 (292 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $5600
09/01/1998, PowerBook G3/300 (300 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $5000
05/10/1999, PowerBook G3/400 (400 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
02/16/2000, PowerBook G3/500 FW (500 MHz PowerPC 750 (G3)): $3500
01/09/2001, PowerBook G4/400 (500 MHz PowerPC 7410 (G4)): $3499


(Boy - am I a geek or what!) :cool:

I found this post instructive because there seems to have been some sweet spots in terms of price/performance that some people had access to as early adopters.

Powerbook 165c 2-10-93
Powerbook 520c 5-16-94 (me)
Powerbook 1400c 11-20-97
Powerbook G3-233 5-6-98
Powerbook G3-400 5-10-99
Powerbook G4-400 1-9-01 (me)

One wonders when the next revolutionary speed bump will occur at or below the seemingly magical $3500 price point.

The PB-G4 seems to have longer legs than most largely due to altivec and full access to a plethora of IO options. A considerable trade could happen in aftermarket upgrading of Ti-G4 computers. Also it was released near the beginning of the life of the G4 chip itself which Apple certainly has alot of computers developed around.

The list itself needs to be sorted by date order and have missing items added.

Rocketman

http://v-serv.com/-upload/avatar.jpg

Rocketman
Jul 31, 2002, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by eric_n_dfw



Per EveryMac.com (http://www.everymac.com/systems/by_casetype/portable.html), the original retail on prior portable Mac's (not adjusted for inflation):

09/20/1989, Macintosh Portable (16 MHz 68HC000): $6500
02/11/1991, Macintosh Backlit Portable (16 MHz 68HC000): $6500
08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300ce/117 (117 MHz PowerPC 603e): $6500
02/17/1997, PowerBook 3400c/240 (240 MHz PowerPC 603e): $6400




Since Apple charged $6500 for portables when they "had to", and they were physically bigger then as well, maybe what they need now is a "superportable".

1. Larger screen and footprint. Holds an additional drive and spare battery.

2. Thicker. Holds a PCI slot as well as on-board cellmodem.

Whatever features hard core pros need (pro aidio I/O, IP phone, Conferencing Video camera). It seems all-in-one design desktop alternative is a big reason people buy ultra expensive portables and portability in terms of battery usage is needed but not very often for the most part. Those who are true road warriors either buy extra batteries or hook to power sources along the way.

But a Ti-G4-4x1000mhz with onboard raid might be fairly cool for $6500.

Then all you have to do is start a scheme for Airport+ everywhere, restaurants, gas stations, office buildings, public parks, whatever.

:cool:

Rocketman

kelp
Jul 31, 2002, 01:35 PM
It makes sense that they are going to release new PowerBooks soon, and the SuperDrive upgrade seems like a reasonable enhancement.

About a month ago Apple gave every employee signifigant disconts on some of their product line.

Each employee gets 6 discounts each, that they can give to their friends.

Thats how I got my 800Mhz G4 Titanium for a pretty good price. iBooks were also included in that discount. But I'm not sure what else had the price cuts.

eric_n_dfw
Jul 31, 2002, 01:39 PM
I previously posted that iDVD doesn't support external DVD-R's

As reported on xlr8yourmac.com today, OWC has a iDVD enabler to make it work with thier firewire DVD-R drive.

I stand corrected.

Blackcat
Jul 31, 2002, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by eric_n_dfw
I previously posted that iDVD doesn't support external DVD-R's

As reported on xlr8yourmac.com today, OWC has a iDVD enabler to make it work with thier firewire DVD-R drive.

I stand corrected.

The trouble is Apple don't sell iDVD, so there is no legal way to get it :(

jadam
Jul 31, 2002, 04:50 PM
uhhhhh ... omfg....

Since when do TiBooks have 20gb HDs??

your G4 350 was just burning, his Dual 1ghz powermac also IMPORTED the video and he added some iMovie effects, than reencoded it then burned it.

Apple DEFINETLY needs to upgrade there batteries, i mean SERIOUSLY if a PC laptop with aprocessor that takes 30 watts of heat can do 5 hours of battery life, how come my ibook with a processor that takes up 4 can only do 5 hours? WE NEED BIGGER BATTERIES!! lol.


Cool about the SuperDrive

AND Sony already has a laptop with a DVD burner, but the laptop is not a "laptop" its a desktop replacement, and is like 2" thick plus has a 16.2" Screen. Definetly not competition to a TiBook

Processors? arent they stepping up to 1ghz and 64mb DDR memory for the Radeon 7500?

...... what else??

iBooks rock the way they are, just put in a better video card and 200mhz DDR Memory which the ibooks support(well the processor not the chipset)

Over Achiever
Jul 31, 2002, 05:53 PM
Originally posted by jadam

Since when do TiBooks have 20gb HDs??

I bet that guy had an older rev of the tibook

Originally posted by jadam

Apple DEFINETLY needs to upgrade there batteries, i mean SERIOUSLY if a PC laptop with aprocessor that takes 30 watts of heat can do 5 hours of battery life, how come my ibook with a processor that takes up 4 can only do 5 hours? WE NEED BIGGER BATTERIES!! lol.

You've got to be kidding. Name one PC laptop that lasts 5 hours...even the Dells conk out in three hours. WTF ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? I still want bigger, better batteries though :D

TechLarry
Aug 1, 2002, 10:10 AM
I've got the SuperDrive in my G4 iMac, which is the (previously) new Pioneer DVR-104 (DVD-R/RW).

It works perfectly, and I have NONE of the compatibility problems that my friends using DVD+RW on PC's have had with their discs playing on home players.

The DVD+RW can scream "We're a little bit faster" all they want, but it boils down to actually being able to do something with the discs you make, and in that case the DVD-R/RW drives are far superior.

Every single test I've read on the Net indicates problems with DVD+RW compatibility, and typically ZERO issues with DVD-R/RW.

My point is that Apple is making the right decisions here :)

TL

P.S. Having 4X is nice, and I'll get one for my PC, but burning DVD's is a "Start and walk away" process either way so it's not as important as one would think. The progress is nice, though, and the faster CDR burning speeds will definitely be welcome.

TechLarry
Aug 1, 2002, 10:17 AM
I know this isn't your doing, Eric. You just posted the info, so I'm not dogging you :)

"08/28/1995, PowerBook 5300c/100 (100 MHz PowerPC 603e): $4500 <--- Mac Trivia: The 5300 series are the infamous Mac's that caught on fire! "

Yep. One of them. In a Lab. Never was sold to a consumer.

This is the most over-blown legend in computing history :)

And it was a battery designed by Sony, not Apple, that was at fault.

TL

TechLarry
Aug 1, 2002, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by Wyvernspirit
So what you are saying is: The price on the current powerbooks is very reasonable if compared to earlier model years. Interesting...

IMHO, Apple's notebooks are priced BETTER than PC notebooks if you compare what you get for the money.

Take a look at a high-end IBM, Toshiba, etc... that are fully loaded bricks. They can be FAR more expensive than Apple's best TiBook and aren't nearly as compact or efficient.

They also aren't nearly as snazzy.

Desktop's are another story. Apple's prices are terrible compared to PC's.

TL

TechLarry
Aug 1, 2002, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by neilt


umm.....
isn't it more cost effective to use 2 700MB cd's at <50 instead of one DVD at $5?

neilt

If all you are copying is 701MB of data, of course it is.

If you have 4.3GB of data, though, or a Video file that is 4GB, that changes things.

One of the things I use my G4 iMac for is kind of novel. I use it to back up my two Win2K Servers. Until I had the iMac and DVD burner, I had no real affordable way to do it.

I'll say this much for toast (as much as I despise Roxio), it works damned well with Win2K Server Drives mounted on the Mac desktop :)

It's funny, the iMac was 1/2 the cost of a tape drive big enough to do these backups.

Of course, it takes time, and it's not automatedlike a DLT loader, but I'm not a rich corporation here :)

TL