Go Back   MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:24 PM   #301
lilo777
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Why should Samsung settle?

They are doing just fine. Here is how Samsung and Apple shares behaved in the last three months:

Click image for larger version

Name:	aapl.png
Views:	57
Size:	10.5 KB
ID:	377303

Apple probably needs this settlement more than Samsung.
lilo777 is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:29 PM   #302
Rodimus Prime
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher729 View Post
Only in the minds of the Fandroids. They remind me of these madmen who are absolutely convinced that Obama is not an American citizen. No rational argument will ever get to them.
more the other way around. Only the Apple Fanboys still think that it means anything. Anyone who is following the facts should see that ruling is going to be appealed and since some very key patents in it have been declared invalid that number is going to drop like a rock.
Rodimus Prime is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:31 PM   #303
Sora
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Quote:
Originally Posted by knightryda12 View Post
Wow, some of you are ridiculously blind. They are not market leaders in any of their products? Lets start with Samsung Electronics...

DRAM - 40.4 % market share (leader)
NAND flash - 40.4 % market share (leader)
Large LCDs - 26.0 % market share (leader)
Active Matrix OLEDs - 97 % markert share (leader)
Lithium Ion batteries - 18.7 % market share (2nd)
All Televisions -17.2 % market share (leader)
Mobile phones - 25 % market share (leader)

On top of that, they are the 2nd largest shipbuilder in the world, 14th largest insurance company, and 19th largest advertising company... if Samsung was it's own country, it's revenue would be the 35th largest economy in the world.

Several people on here underestimate Samsung... they spend more on R&D than apple, are granted more patents than Apple, and are gaining more market share than Apple.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ent_recipients

For those of you arguing the US company vs. Korean company thing, think about it for a second. What has Apple done for you and the US economy? They paid 3% of their revenue in taxes to the US government despite the US market being their biggest! What's the use when all of that money is locked into foreign accounts... its like the Facebook founder who delisted his US citizenship to keep his fortune. They do not care about you or the US economy so stop protecting them with your patriotism! All the REAL Apple US jobs are outsourced to China, in the meantime, the Korean company Samsung is looking to expand it's business in Texas and San Jose. Please don't bring in the US pride thing into allegiance-less nation-less multinational companies that only want the greens in your pockets. On top of that, Samsung hires and creates jobs for many of the korean people, they build research centers and factories all over South Korea, and give jobs to thousands of people in it's country. Although they have scandals and improper practices, the benefits to Korea and its people are tremendous. Is Apple doing the same in its home country ? I don't think so, they just employ thousands of Chinese workers, sit on a 100bilion capitalization that is used for NOTHING and congratulate themselves and shareholders that a bubble stock is going up at wall street.

We are discussing two different issues.
But since you took the time to explain.
I'll take the time to illustrate.

You listed all the areas in which Samsung is the leader in manufacturing. Wonderful. However, this is what I meant.

When you say:------------------ The market leader is:
DRAM---------------------------- Crucial
NAND flash---------------------- SanDisk
Large LCDs---------------------- LG/Sony
Active Matrix OLEDs------------ LG/Sony
Lithium Ion batteries----------- Duracell
All Televisions ----------------- LG/Sony
Mobile phones ----------------- Apple

Samsung is not the first thing that comes to the average consumers minds when you list off all the things they lead in manufacturing.
Just because you the leader in manufacturing everything does not mean your products are good. Hence, master of none.
There is not one product that Samsung makes, that is a Samsung labeled product that is an industry leader. Not one.
__________________
MacBook Pro | Matte 17" | 3.06 C2D | 256GB SSD | 4GB RAM | Mountain Lion
Mac mini | 2.26GHz C2D | 160GB HDD | 4GB RAM
Sora is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:35 PM   #304
jrswizzle
macrumors 603
 
jrswizzle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: McKinney, TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sora View Post
We are discussing two different issues.
But since you took the time to explain.
I'll take the time to illustrate.

You listed all the areas in which Samsung is the leader in manufacturing. Wonderful. However, this is what I meant.

When you say:------------------ The market leader is:
DRAM---------------------------- Crucial
NAND flash---------------------- SanDisk
Large LCDs---------------------- LG/Sony
Active Matrix OLEDs------------ LG/Sony
Lithium Ion batteries----------- Duracell
All Televisions ----------------- LG/Sony
Mobile phones ----------------- Apple

Samsung is not the first thing that comes to the average consumers minds when you list off all the things they lead in manufacturing.
Just because you the leader in manufacturing everything does not mean your products are good. Hence, master of none.
There is not one product that Samsung makes, that is a Samsung labeled product that is an industry leader. Not one.
I would argue Samsung is the "market leader" in TVs. I don't personally own one, but when I think of high end TVs, I think of Samsung first. I would also put them at the head of the OLED category - the LCDs still belong to LG/Sony though. When I think crappy, overstaturated AMOLED displays I think Samsung, when I think high quality/extremely accurate sRGB LCDs I think LG/Sony
__________________
Nexus 5 | iPhone 6+, 6, 2G | Lumia 635 | Fire Phone |iPad Air 2 | Kindle Fire 7" HDX | 21.5" iMac (Early 2012) | 13" Macbook Air (Mid 2013)
jrswizzle is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:38 PM   #305
kdarling
macrumors Demi-God
 
kdarling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Device engineer 30+ yrs, touchscreens 23+.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sora View Post
Just because you the leader in manufacturing everything does not mean your products are good. Hence, master of none.
Another poster pointed out that Samsung is considered a leader in manufacturing memory and CPU chips.

As for mass consumers, Apple buyers often try to get a device batch that has an Samsung LCD screen. Also, see below:

Quote:
There is not one product that Samsung makes, that is a Samsung labeled product that is an industry leader. Not one.
Samsung's Galaxy phones are considered industry leaders.
kdarling is online now   4 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:41 PM   #306
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrswizzle View Post
I would argue Samsung is the "market leader" in TVs. I don't personally own one, but when I think of high end TVs, I think of Samsung first. I would also put them at the head of the OLED category - the LCDs still belong to LG/Sony though. When I think crappy, overstaturated AMOLED displays I think Samsung, when I think high quality/extremely accurate sRGB LCDs I think LG/Sony
I'd also argue that the "general" consumer doesn't know who/nor cares who makes NAND, DRAM, OLED...

They just think "memory" - if they are thinking of it at all.

And first in mind is relative. You ask someone a question like who is the market leader in TVs - they would probably answer Sony, Samsung and Toshiba because those are the first companies that come to mind. That has nothing to do with sales or quality of products.
samcraig is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:44 PM   #307
lilo777
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sora View Post
We are discussing two different issues.
But since you took the time to explain.
I'll take the time to illustrate.

You listed all the areas in which Samsung is the leader in manufacturing. Wonderful. However, this is what I meant.

When you say:------------------ The market leader is:
DRAM---------------------------- Crucial
NAND flash---------------------- SanDisk
Large LCDs---------------------- LG/Sony
Active Matrix OLEDs------------ LG/Sony
Lithium Ion batteries----------- Duracell
All Televisions ----------------- LG/Sony
Mobile phones ----------------- Apple

Samsung is not the first thing that comes to the average consumers minds when you list off all the things they lead in manufacturing.
Just because you the leader in manufacturing everything does not mean your products are good. Hence, master of none.
There is not one product that Samsung makes, that is a Samsung labeled product that is an industry leader. Not one.
That's just bizarre. Let's forget the distinction between retail customers and OEMs. Still, Galaxy SIII was the best selling smart phone in the World in Q3. Samsung TVs outsell everybody by a huge margin and they are considered to be the best TVs. Name me one LG or Sony product with OLED screen. There is none. If Crucial has the best RAM why does Apple put Samsung RAM in all their products? Cheap bastards!
lilo777 is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:45 PM   #308
MacDav
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by QCassidy352 View Post
A patent troll is someone who sits on their patents without practicing them and then sues someone who attempts to use the patented method or technology. You may think apple is overly litigious, but they do practice their own patents, so they are not a troll.
How exactly do you "Practice a Patent"? Just wondering.
MacDav is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:50 PM   #309
Glideslope
macrumors 68030
 
Glideslope's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: NY
This is good...

I want the Appellate Court to see how Samsung refused to negotiate in good faith. After all, Apple could be friends with HTC. Why can't Samsung just meet in the middle. Apple is trying so hard!!

Well, guess they are the problem. Write that check.
__________________
" A leader leads by example. Not by force." Sun Tzu
Glideslope is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:52 PM   #310
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glideslope View Post
I want the Appellate Court to see how Samsung refused to negotiate in good faith. After all, Apple could be friends with HTC. Why can't Samsung just meet in the middle. Apple is trying so hard!!

Well, guess they are the problem. Write that check.
Explain good faith.

Where in the article does it say Apple is trying to settle?

Previous discussions broke down because NEITHER party would concede

Apple can be friends with HTC because HTC isn't a threat to Apple. And HTC can't afford lawsuits - better to pay per device when sold then wind up in court.

Apple's trying very hard. At getting as most out of Samsung as it can. And guess what. Samsung is doing the same.
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:52 PM   #311
spanading
macrumors member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Fly to close the the sun and you will get burnt.

Samsung is getting good at flying close but not too close. From a quick read on wikipedia design patents afford the same protection to functional objects as copyright does to non functional ones like music. Hence, judging this I would assume is somewhat subjective. While Apple cannot claim rights to basic shape and designs, but the white of an ipod or other iOS device is very specific. The way iOS looks like and functions is (or at least was) very specific and something Steve warned all wanabe companies was patented. You were warned Samsung. Even google told you that your original phones interface was too close to iOS. Hence, depending on the judge and jury sometime Apple win and sometimes Samsung do. This very fact would seem to me to show that Samsung is trying to cash in on Apple's style. They maybe getting better at getting close but not too close but it does not cover up what they are trying to do!
spanading is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:58 PM   #312
jrswizzle
macrumors 603
 
jrswizzle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: McKinney, TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
I'd also argue that the "general" consumer doesn't know who/nor cares who makes NAND, DRAM, OLED...

They just think "memory" - if they are thinking of it at all.

And first in mind is relative. You ask someone a question like who is the market leader in TVs - they would probably answer Sony, Samsung and Toshiba because those are the first companies that come to mind. That has nothing to do with sales or quality of products.
I agree - I was simply stating my addendum to his list - not the original list of manufacturing market share. I agree, the majority of the public has no clue what DRAM, NAND or OLED even stands for or what the differences are between the types of memory or OLED vs LCD

----------

BTW - since the thread train has been moving through the neighbor's kitchen and has been well off the tracks for a while now:

I just read up on the HTC Droid DNA - things looks pretty sweet for a 5" phone. I've always been a fan of HTC. When I thought about switching from the iPhone it was going to be to an HTC One X. Too bad the DNA is only on Verizon though....

Hope HTC has a hit on their hands!
__________________
Nexus 5 | iPhone 6+, 6, 2G | Lumia 635 | Fire Phone |iPad Air 2 | Kindle Fire 7" HDX | 21.5" iMac (Early 2012) | 13" Macbook Air (Mid 2013)
jrswizzle is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 03:59 PM   #313
smoledman
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
I'd also argue that the "general" consumer doesn't know who/nor cares who makes NAND, DRAM, OLED...

They just think "memory" - if they are thinking of it at all.

And first in mind is relative. You ask someone a question like who is the market leader in TVs - they would probably answer Sony, Samsung and Toshiba because those are the first companies that come to mind. That has nothing to do with sales or quality of products.
Who cares about the "general" consumer? We're talking about real business here.
smoledman is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:01 PM   #314
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrswizzle View Post

[/COLOR]BTW - since the thread train has been moving through the neighbor's kitchen and has been well off the tracks for a while now:

I just read up on the HTC Droid DNA - things looks pretty sweet for a 5" phone. I've always been a fan of HTC. When I thought about switching from the iPhone it was going to be to an HTC One X. Too bad the DNA is only on Verizon though....

Hope HTC has a hit on their hands!
From what I read - it looks like they need one. Or two. I wish them well. I wish the industry well. No one company can provide a product for everyone that meets their needs.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by smoledman View Post
Who cares about the "general" consumer? We're talking about real business here.
That's not what Sora stated. If you have a problem with the parameter - go yell at him
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:07 PM   #315
moargolems
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Finland
The topic is "Samsung Not Interested in Settlement with Apple over Patent Issues"...

...and there's a flame war going on about Fandroids and Apple fanboys.

Douches.
__________________
hackintosh + galaxy siii + iphone + ipad
moargolems is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:07 PM   #316
nmbr1ctrman
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
If you think these ridiculous patent lawsuits are ridiculous, sign the petition:

http://www.change.org/petitions/unit...es-competition
nmbr1ctrman is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:09 PM   #317
MH01
macrumors 68040
 
MH01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Technarchy View Post
You do know Apple is a software company first so by default that is where their patent concentration would be...it's not like this is news. This has been the case for over 30 years.
Are they not a hardware company? When comparing say to microsoft? Sure OS X is awesome, but they invest in the OS so they can sell more hardware.
MH01 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:11 PM   #318
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by assfeis View Post
The topic is "Samsung Not Interested in Settlement with Apple over Patent Issues"...

...and there's a flame war going on about Fandroids and Apple fanboys.

Douches.
I tried a few times to point this out. Then, admittingly, get sucked into the side convos.

But yes. This thread is about Samsung not wanting to settle. Which I think makes perfect sense. End of story.
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:16 PM   #319
Sora
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdarling View Post
Another poster pointed out that Samsung is considered a leader in manufacturing memory and CPU chips.

As for mass consumers, Apple buyers often try to get a device batch that has an Samsung LCD screen. Also, see below:



Samsung's Galaxy phones are considered industry leaders.
The leader in manufacturing, does not make you the market leader.
Toyota is the a manufacturing leader, but I would hardly consider them the standard of an "Ultimate Driving Machine". That title belongs to BMW. Metaphorically and physically. Drive one.

I'm sure that the LG manufacturing processing isn't the same/equal to Samsung. If they were, buyers wouldn't notice the difference between an LG screen or a Samsung screen.

Question: If I were to go to Germany and replace all BMW emblems on their car manufacturing plants with GMC, would the cars that come out the other end instantly become inferior?

Answer: No. It's not the name that defines quality - it's the process.

Lastly, Samsungs Galaxy phones would love to be the industry leader in smartphones. Love to. Reality suggests they are not.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrswizzle View Post
I would argue Samsung is the "market leader" in TVs. I don't personally own one, but when I think of high end TVs, I think of Samsung first. I would also put them at the head of the OLED category - the LCDs still belong to LG/Sony though. When I think crappy, overstaturated AMOLED displays I think Samsung, when I think high quality/extremely accurate sRGB LCDs I think LG/Sony
It's possible they could be the market leader in TV's, I would give them the leaders in plasma TV's.
I agree with your OLED statement. That I have seen with my own eyes.

----------

__________________
MacBook Pro | Matte 17" | 3.06 C2D | 256GB SSD | 4GB RAM | Mountain Lion
Mac mini | 2.26GHz C2D | 160GB HDD | 4GB RAM

Last edited by maflynn; Nov 14, 2012 at 05:46 PM.
Sora is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:16 PM   #320
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sora View Post
The leader in manufacturing, does not make you the market leader.
Toyota is the a manufacturing leader, but I would hardly consider them the standard of an "Ultimate Driving Machine". That title belongs to BMW. Metaphorically and physically. Drive one.

I'm sure that the LG manufacturing processing isn't the same/equal to Samsung. If they were, buyers wouldn't notice the difference between an LG screen or a Samsung screen.

Question: If I were to go to Germany and replace all BMW emblems on their car manufacturing plants with GMC, would the cars that come out the other end instantly become inferior?

Answer: No. It's not the name that defines quality - it's the process.

Lastly, Samsungs Galaxy phones would love to be the industry leader in smartphones. Love to. Reality suggests they are not.

----------



It's possible they could be the market leader in TV's, I would give them the leaders in plasma TV's.
I agree with your OLED statement. That I have seen with my own eyes.

----------



Thanks. Unnecessary, but thanks.
Reality suggests otherwise.
I'm not sure how you can be a judge of reality given your previous statements. Good luck with that.
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:19 PM   #321
StarTrek
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Dallas, TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
I wonder how much Samsung pays people to come here and rebutt stuff said about them. These days it seems many MR posters are more passionate about defending Samsung as the greatest thing since sliced bread. Isn't there a pro-Samsung website/forum where you could do that? Why would anyone come to a site called MacRumors to read about how great and wonderful Samsung is?
I actually studied with a Director of Samsung in London who told me they pay people to go on to competitors websites and make negative comments, this would then draw an unhinged element to post comments favoring Sams**g on websites like this... a website for Mac, people are scared of Apple, because Apple has the best brand loyalty, hence the lines at a mac store hence they pay people to trash Apple. Scary stuff
StarTrek is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:20 PM   #322
Lancer
macrumors 68000
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Australia
Just imagine hoe much better our tech would be if the likes of Apple and Samsung spent less time in court and more time developing products!
Lancer is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:20 PM   #323
Sora
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilo777 View Post
That's just bizarre. Let's forget the distinction between retail customers and OEMs. Still, Galaxy SIII was the best selling smart phone in the World in Q3. Samsung TVs outsell everybody by a huge margin and they are considered to be the best TVs. Name me one LG or Sony product with OLED screen. There is none. If Crucial has the best RAM why does Apple put Samsung RAM in all their products? Cheap bastards!
Bizarre as it may seem - that's the way the world works. Its what guides consumers to choose products on a daily basis.
It's what consumers recognize - not what they know. A small portion of purchases are not based on consumer recognition. Why do you think brand recognition, placement, alignment, endorsement is a trillion dollar industry?

McDonalds serves the most burgers in this universe. Are they the best? Hardly. Galaxy SIII is the best selling smart phone in the world. Are they the best? Not even close. It's what the masses can afford. Just like a McDonalds burger.

Samsung makes the back plating of their phones out of plastic. Cheap crap is made of plastic.
__________________
MacBook Pro | Matte 17" | 3.06 C2D | 256GB SSD | 4GB RAM | Mountain Lion
Mac mini | 2.26GHz C2D | 160GB HDD | 4GB RAM

Last edited by Sora; Nov 14, 2012 at 04:26 PM.
Sora is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:21 PM   #324
nick_elt
macrumors 68000
 
nick_elt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
How can HTC afford this? (I know someone will say they cant afford littagation) but arnt they in deep **** and not making money? or am i wrong? Im neither for or against htc, never owned their phones.
nick_elt is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:22 PM   #325
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by StarTrek View Post
I actually studied with a Director of Samsung in London who told me they pay people to go on to competitors websites and make negative comments, this would then draw an unhinged element to post comments favoring Sams**g on websites like this... a website for Mac, people are scared of Apple, because Apple has the best brand loyalty, hence the lines at a mac store hence they pay people to trash Apple. Scary stuff
Really? the lines comment? Wow.

Well guess what. My best friend's cousin's brother's nephews great aunt once had pizza with the VP of Samsung marketing and he called the Director of Samsung in London a bit fat liar liar pants on fire.

Again - people need to use less tin foil hats. The truth is scarier to you than this fiction - which is - people can own and enjoy Apple products but also br critical of them. OH NOZ!
samcraig is offline   4 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Apple and Samsung Fail to Reach Deal Over Patent Issues in Recent Mediation Meeting MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 29 Feb 17, 2014 07:37 AM
Apple and Samsung File List of Patent Claims and Accused Products Ahead of Second U.S. Patent Lawsuit MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 41 Feb 6, 2014 05:58 AM
Judge Invalidates Two Samsung Patent Claims Ahead of Second Patent Lawsuit with Apple MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 60 Jan 23, 2014 02:31 PM
Apple and Samsung Said to Resume Settlement Talks Over Patent Dispute MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 55 Jan 7, 2014 03:02 PM
UK Judge Who Chastised Apple Over Samsung 'Apology' Now Consulting as Patent Expert for Samsung MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 253 Mar 9, 2013 08:25 AM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:24 PM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC