in most places it costs more than that? what?????
let me check austrian store.
11" mba 999
4 to 8gb ram upgrade +100
where do you live?
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8 GB of ram, myth?
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in most places it costs more than that? what?????
let me check austrian store.
11" mba 999
4 to 8gb ram upgrade +100
where do you live?
Germany. The apple store is overpriced here.
At Saturn and mediamarkt the 13" base mba is 850.
i knew you were lying.
german apple store:
11"mba €999
4-8gb ram upgrade €100
"Problem is that in most places it costs more than that." is also a lie.
i couldn't care less what some shops offer with their variable prices on possibly outdated models. the way you compare prices is worthless. i just checked both german saturn and mediamarkt online shops and i can't find the prices you listed there either btw. they have different prices.
it's 100. which makes it reasonable to upgrade. even after the price hike. the end.
You are tripping
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I was talking 13", not 11".
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What?! You either need to look up what the word "to lie" means (hint: it doesn't mean being in a horizontal position) or you are tripping bad!
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the 2014 models are hardly outdated. The 2015 models are not offered yet, but fall drastically in price after about 4 weeks. Mediamarkt and Saturn prices have varied between 730€ and 900€ for a 13" base MBA. The out the door prices in any of theses stores is now 800 - 850.
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You need to check better: http://www.mediamarkt.de/mcs/product/APPLE-MacBook-Air-13.3-Zoll,48353,489008,1271389.html?langId=-3
You are tripping
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I was talking 13", not 11".
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What?
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the 2014 models are hardly outdated. The 2015 models are not offered yet, but fall drastically in price after about 4 weeks. Mediamarkt and Saturn prices have varied between 730 and 900 for a 13" base MBA. The out the door prices in any of theses stores is now 800 - 850.
don't waste my time. just read my posts again if u are bored.
As an example, here at the unversity I go to, all the computers in Engineering labs use 4GB for CAD work. We've built entire highway interchanges on 4GB of RAM. Over the summer two years ago, I was making Electrical Drawings from scratch in AutoCAD on my iMac, which only had 6GB of RAM at the time.
Same at the Office. On one of the workstations next to the CAD Tech, I had task manager open while running a couple of projects on AutoCAD Civil 3D(granted, they weren't big projects) with 10 tabs or so of IE on a separate monitor and still only used 3.31GB of RAM and this is on Windows 7. I highly doubt the CAD Tech in the Office is using any more than 5-6GB of RAM and these workstations have 16GB.
I'm truly convinced that if you have to ask if you need the extra RAM, 99% of the time you don't need it. This is from someone who had a 16GB 15" cMBP. I just never used it, which is why when I upgraded to retina, I couldn't justify the extra expense of getting 16GB. Those who need 16GB know they 16GB, and configure accordingly.
Same at the Office. On one of the workstations next to the CAD Tech, I had task manager open while running a couple of projects on AutoCAD Civil 3D(granted, they weren't big projects) with 10 tabs or so of IE on a separate monitor and still only used 3.31GB of RAM and this is on Windows 7. I highly doubt the CAD Tech in the Office is using any more than 5-6GB of RAM and these workstations have 16GB.
I'm truly convinced that if you have to ask if you need the extra RAM, 99% of the time you don't need it. This is from someone who had a 16GB 15" cMBP. I just never used it, which is why when I upgraded to retina, I couldn't justify the extra expense of getting 16GB. Those who need 16GB know they 16GB, and configure accordingly.
It's called arithmetic and I find it quite handy.
Your posts are utter nonsense.
You are writing weird **** that I am "lying":
http://www.mediamarkt.de/mcs/product/APPLE-MacBook-Air-13.3-Zoll,48353,489008,1271389.html?langId=-3
You go into any mediamarkt in Germany and the price for a base 2014 13" MBA including tax is between 800 and 850 Euros.
You can also track pricing changes with graphs like at the stock exchange here: idealo.de
I use parallels windows 7 and visual studio in base 11" air without problems. In fact for most people's uses you'll fill your cpu cache before you fill that 4gb ram. That doesn't mean you should get and i7 instead of i5 though, it'll cycle fast enough you'd never be able to tell anyways.
Well think about it like this: why would anyone ever buy 4gb instead of an extra $100 for an 8gb machine? $100 isn't much. Sure, it's not money you want to throw away, but it's not a godly sum of money.
So if someone is putting in a lot of thought about the question of whether to spend $100 more or not, usually that means $100 is a lot of money to that particular person. Not always, but most of the time, someone who is rich will buy the 8gb ram IF he thinks it might come in handy. But someone whose money is tight, that's not nearly as straightforward a decision.
So within that framework, yes, buying a computer is a pretty big decision. You'll likely be stuck with it for 4-5 years after all. If putting down an extra $100 was such a no-brainer, you probably wouldn't mind selling your laptop every 2 years and buying a new one.
But if an extra $100 is a big deal for you, then selling a $1k laptop every 2 years for $70 and having to find an additional $300 to buy the newest $1k edition will be an even bigger deal.
Which is why the future proofing mania makes a lot of sense to me. Most people who toss & turn over $100 can't afford to simply sell the old & buy the new everytime their needs change, they must think ahead.
duh? obviously and that's exactly why more ram is better. and necessary.
exactly. i like to say: "I can´t afford to buy cheap stuff."
also don't forget the increased resale value. which is one of the macs biggest advantages.
I usually am researching case law. And there are hundreds of sources needed to draft a brief. And I don't do one case at a time and I don't do one each day, so I have dozens of cases I am working for days or weeks, and go back and forth. Even on this site for fun, right now, 11 tabs open. Much faster to click another tab while this one takes 2-3 seconds to send this post and refresh.
For research, there might be tons of pdf's of papers open in the back ground too that will soak ram, and if there are tons of annotations it will eventually start to chug (I've even brought down my i7-3770k +32gb ram to its heels with massive uncompressed pdfs so any performance will help).
Just saying. I don't mind the occasional slowdown but it can get frustrating when on a deadline I agree.
Just saying. I don't mind the occasional slowdown but it can get frustrating when on a deadline I agree.
Ok, but there is also opportunity cost to consider. That $100 could be used to something else, which is even more important thing to consider if money is tight. Of course you might get most or all of that $100 back when you sell your machine. But I like to think that if money is tight, it is tight right now, and things will get better in the future. So that $100 can be much more valuable now than in, say, 4-5 years.
4GB is prob ok most of the time. But uses can change over the life of the machine and from my perspective, I like having the extra so I never have to worry about it.
[For the record I have 16GB, in a cMBP 15"]
[For the record I have 16GB, in a cMBP 15"
]
See, I knew you were the one lying when you said you followed our posts all of the time. If you had, you would see that we've also discussed OVER AND OVER AND OVER how the price difference between a 4 and 8GB Air is rarely only 100 dollars. Many retailers run specials including student discounts or moving coupons on new base model Air's that they have which means you can always get a base model Air for much cheaper than the $999.00 that Apple sells it for.
If anyone buys a base model from Apple then they need their head examined because they could get that same machine elsewhere for 2-300 dollars cheaper depending on sales, specials and such. So yes if someone is hell bent on buying it directly from Apple, the difference in price is usually only 100 dollars, but when there are so many deals to be had on base models, the difference often becomes 2-300 and when that is the case, it is foolish to spend that much more on an extra 4gb of ram you will likely never need.
If your 2 year old laptop is fine except that you need twice the RAM all of sudden, then why would you buy a brand new computer?
Based on my experience with the used market for Apple laptops, you'd probably be able to find a used model from the same year with twice the RAM for maybe $50 more.
So you save money by buying the base model no matter what.
Also, I take issue with the idea that people who buy the 4GB model are probably strapped for cash because $100 for the upgrade isn't THAT much money.
I bought a new MBA last year with 4GB even though I can easily afford a $100 upgrade, simply because I understand what I do with computers and how much memory it requires and I know that I simply would not see any benefit from 8GB. It's not an issue of cost or who can afford what. What sense does it make to spend $100 on something that you have zero use for?
Oh I agree it can be better to save the $100. I'm not saying $100 is nothing, I was just explaining to to you why it's not as easy a decision you makes it out to be.
You basically ask why it's so important to get 8gb of ram, when you can just get 4gb and then upgrade whenever you need to and why it's something that drives so much discussion and thinking if it's that simple.
And I just explained that if $100 is something you need to think about, then that probably means $100 is a lot to you. Which means that selling and rebuying a laptop every 1-2 years isn't an option (unless you're sure you're getting a promotion, as opposed to say getting fired in a year from now). You need to make that decision now.
That's not me saying 'spend $100, it's a no brainer'. I understand there's opportunity cost. It's just me explaining why the decision isn't a no-brainer, as opposed to you saying 'it's not a major life decision' as if anyone who worries over $100 can just go and buy a new & better laptop a year later when he needs to, as if that's somehow the default position for everyone who worries about $100. Again, doesn't mean spending the $100 now is always the best choice, just explaining where the 'future-proof mania' you talk about comes from.
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The majority of Apple revenues are from outside the US, so you may want to consider that sales channels aren't universal. For example here in Europe I can get a 10% student discount from Apple, but no other retailer offers it. We also don't get BestBuy movers' coupons, and as Mac products are in high demand, they're usually on the list of exemption to deals like 'pay no VAT this weekend' that retailers tend to run.
So in short, for my particular situation I do indeed buy cheaper from Apple than from other retailers. Surprise. Except if I want to buy last year's model, then it's about the same. But why would I pay equal money for 10% slower CPU/GPU, 50% slower SSD, and a lower resale value, and have to do repairs/warranty etc through a non-Apple retailer, instead of buy from Apple and get this year's model same price?
If I were stateside, completely different story. The deals you can get on e.g. a new MBA 2014 from BestBuy with the right coupon strategy compared to a 2015 MBA is much, much better value. But I hope you appreciate again that most of Apple's revenues and customers are not stateside, and that this forum isn't visited by just US citz.
It's a good point. With your analogy though, you're saying instead of buy 8gb and pay $100 now, buy 4gb and pay $50 in a year to switch to 8.
But that 'switch' is for a strangers' laptop, not upgrading your own or buying new. You're getting a 2nd hand laptop for $50. And you have to go out and sell your laptop, and buy the other one and hope there's not much time inbetween where you're without a laptop.
So the question becomes: would you exchange your MBA for someone else's equivalent MBA for $50? Cause that's what you're saving essentially between buying a $100 8gb right away, or selling for X and paying X+$50 a year later.
I wouldn't. Maybe if you're strapped for cash, yeah. But generally I wouldn't be so eager. There's a risk involved in buying 2nd hand and on a $1k machine, I would rather keep my own MBA that I know, than buy one without guarantee or reliability and hope it's in good shape. (unless you buy refurb then the risk is low but there's no way you can sell your laptop for equal or more than the refurb price).
But yeah it's a good point. As for spending for zero use, I agree. This whole discussion is strictly when you're expecting to need 8gb in the (near) future. If you absolutely know you'll just be word processing, youtubing, skyping and netflixing, yeah no way in hell its good sense to get 8gb.
That's true, it's not just $50. It's also the time to sell your current laptop, buy a new one, transfer your stuff, and risk the possibility of getting a used laptop in worse shape than the one you sold.
But then again, this is the fallback plan for a situation you thought would be unlikely to happen when you bought the laptop. So the odds of going through this inconvenience are small.
Definitely if you think the chances are 50-50 (or whatever) that you will need more RAM in the next few years then you should just get the upgrade.
Yes, and remember that 4GB doesn't limit you to the same software that your grandma runs. Software development, a lot of scientific computing, and other serious stuff often needs less CPU power and memory than "just" streaming a high-res Netflix video.
Remember that serious people did serious things with computers when they had 1GB of RAM, and much less than that too, of course.
I monitor my macs resources closely. I noticed that netflix seems to use weirdly high amount of memory. Just like moving large amounts of files pushes cpu to 400% for a while after the transfer.
As Motrek mentioned, specialized and even professional media creation software often only require very little resources, while others are absurdly ram hungry. For example Adobe Lightroom 5 uses hardly any memory, while Dragon dictate recommends more than 8gb to run smoothly. Another specialized software I run for work would still run fine with 256mb.
The reason why the poster cyclance thinks there is a "ram squad" is that this is small forum and the posters commenting on the regular RAM threads are usually the same. We pretty much know what we are talking about and tell people as it is. Sometimes someone comes along and insists on spreading some obvious nonsens and I tell them of.
One of those nonsense assumptions is that when a mac lags it is always because there isn't enough ram. In 90% of the cases this turns out to be hogwash, but some posters insist on "buy more ram".
please stop telling others what i think. you can't look inside my head.
you are highly motivated to steer people away from getting 8gb ram. this is a sport for u. it's always the same 3-4 people. you seek out ram threads and upvote each other within minutes. arguing the whole day. refining your posts several times. (most replies from meister are modified around 4 times).
you have now resorted to compare prices of 2nd hand macs, last year models, discounted macs to built to order configurations. so you can justify the lie that it's more than 100 difference in most countries.
ridiculous.
The upvote feature you are constantly refering to is meaningless and also anonymous.
You don't know who is upvoting what.
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I constantly hear Eduard Khyl in my head while reading his posts
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I have over 4000 posts (PRSI and private forums not counting) to keep track of my modification history you would have to be cyber stalking me.
Also modifying posts is a feature of this forum and I am not sure what it has to do with the topic on hand.----------
What? ... Where? ... 2nd macs? ... wtf? ....
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