and then completely break it for many customers. My logic 9.1.7 is... F'd in the A. Logic studio waste of F'n 550$ until they get it working again. and yes i have tried EVERYthing to fix it.
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Apple Moving Toward Release of Logic Pro X?
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and then completely break it for many customers. My logic 9.1.7 is... F'd in the A. Logic studio waste of F'n 550$ until they get it working again. and yes i have tried EVERYthing to fix it.
One year later and we get a fake screenshot of the startup screen.
over 3 years later and no logic update from 9. What's up Apple?
http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/09/26/image-claims-to-show-launch-screen-for-logic-pro-x
over 3 years later and no logic update from 9. What's up Apple?
http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/09/26/image-claims-to-show-launch-screen-for-logic-pro-x
The same with Imacs.Maybe its the Pro area Apple doesn't like anymore,just prefers Forstall Maps.
Geez, I don't know how Apple could make it more clear that they are moving AWAY from "Pro" applications to consumer grade applications - wasn't Final Cut X enough of an example??
This thread is over a year old now and speculation is still going ... Kudos to you die-hard Apple fans but anyone serious about audio production isn't going to stick with Apple anything.
If Apple did eventually release a new version of Logic it will not be a "Pro" application, it will be GarageBand like (again look at Final Cut X as an example of the exec thought process ... it's the same process).
But regardless of the speculation, most audio professionals keep a diversified tool base. It's not that Logic Studio 9 isn't still useful, it's just that the rest of this industry continues forward with regular yearly updates that increase productivity and expand creativity. I still use Logic Studio 9, but I use it less and less as my other tools just out perform it (far less bouncing), are more flexible, and have a larger 3rd party support base.
Pro applications are of little to no interest to Apple (just not enough return on investment for them) -- that's the change, consumer grade applications is where Apple is at.
Diversify your tools, don't depend on Apple, you will only be let down.
This thread is over a year old now and speculation is still going ... Kudos to you die-hard Apple fans but anyone serious about audio production isn't going to stick with Apple anything.
If Apple did eventually release a new version of Logic it will not be a "Pro" application, it will be GarageBand like (again look at Final Cut X as an example of the exec thought process ... it's the same process).
But regardless of the speculation, most audio professionals keep a diversified tool base. It's not that Logic Studio 9 isn't still useful, it's just that the rest of this industry continues forward with regular yearly updates that increase productivity and expand creativity. I still use Logic Studio 9, but I use it less and less as my other tools just out perform it (far less bouncing), are more flexible, and have a larger 3rd party support base.
Pro applications are of little to no interest to Apple (just not enough return on investment for them) -- that's the change, consumer grade applications is where Apple is at.
Diversify your tools, don't depend on Apple, you will only be let down.
If you don't know, you haven't been paying attention. FCPX was missing a ton of professional features on initial release (multicam, red raw, no OMF exports, no XML, fixed workspace, external monitor, tape batch capture, chapter markers, JPEG issues, audio editing, etc. etc. (the list of what it can't do is mind boggling) -- Sure they've since released several updates to get "some" of the features in FCPX, but it's still not a Professional product by any means and frankly it's not priced to be a professional product. And if you start to compare FCPX to real professional products, the missing features and performance expand even more.
There are very few professional hold outs using FCPX - still some on FCP7 but many have moved on, just check some of the forums like Creative COW and others sites of professional real world folks.
But the focus of this thread is Logic Studio and the continued speculation of an upgrade (over a year later and still nothing, nada, zip). The same folks that made the decision to release a consumer grade product of FCPX are the same folks making the decisions about Logic Studio.
Give you a hint, even if Apple were doing a ground up re-write of Logic Studio, with their available programming resources, it would not take over 3 years to produce ... I can guarantee you that. Apple have NO commitment to "Pro" level applications, if they did they would allocate resources and we'd be seeing new "upgrades" every year like the rest of the professional industry.
There are very few professional hold outs using FCPX - still some on FCP7 but many have moved on, just check some of the forums like Creative COW and others sites of professional real world folks.
But the focus of this thread is Logic Studio and the continued speculation of an upgrade (over a year later and still nothing, nada, zip). The same folks that made the decision to release a consumer grade product of FCPX are the same folks making the decisions about Logic Studio.
Give you a hint, even if Apple were doing a ground up re-write of Logic Studio, with their available programming resources, it would not take over 3 years to produce ... I can guarantee you that. Apple have NO commitment to "Pro" level applications, if they did they would allocate resources and we'd be seeing new "upgrades" every year like the rest of the professional industry.
But many of those features have been added or will be added so it doesn't jive with your "consumer" tag. Final Cut Pro X is not a move towards the consumer space although it is a new app and thus studios would be smart to keep FCP 7 stations around. So let's say that you're hypothesis that Apple doesn't care about Professional has not been substantiated lets move on to Logic Pro
A rewrite of Logic Pro doesn't need to happen. Final Cut was rewritten because the legacy versions used Quicktime as a foundation and Quicktime is a 32-bit framework that cannot make the transition to 64-bit so Final Cut Pro X moved to AV Foundation. Is Logic Pro based on Quicktime as well?
Nope
It's based on Core Audio and Core Audio is already 64-bit so comparing one's development processor to the other is foolish. Logic Pro already had a UI change to a single window UI and moved to Core Audio a long time ago.
I'm not sure I'm going to take hints from you...it doesn't sound like you really know the "why" behind the decisions being made. It's fear easier to just simply prattle on about how Apple doesn't care about Professionals and not extend any brain power to see what obstacles exist for a given application.
Thanks for playing.
Why is it people seem to think "it's a game" and even more amusing people seem to feel they have some sort of "control" over the game.
Anyway, as a professional software engineer, film editor, and composer/producer I can assure you making a transition from a 32bit application to a 64bit application is NOT a difficult task. I've done this process a few times, have you? In fact, the task isn't really challenging at all (ask any moderately seasoned software engineer) and they are projects I've not really enjoyed because they aren't mentally challenging nor creative.
The reality is Apple own Quicktime code base, if they were motivated to do so (read commitment) they could have easily moved it to 64bit long ago ... this isn't a reason/excuse nor was it a road block or even that relevant to why Apple decided to re-write FCPX.
Seriously, you really feel Apple care about the professional segment?? Your talking about a company that pumps out a new iPhone every year, a new iOS every year ... a company with almost limitless resources at this point in time. You really believe Apple couldn't do the same with FCPX or Logic Studio ... they could re-write both FCPX and Logic Studio every 6 months if they wanted to, they have resources. The professional segment just doesn't make the kinda money they want out of their investment, so it doesn't get allocated much investment (read resources). As a result, Apple doesn't keep up with other "professional" applications. Trust me, Adobe, Sony, Avid, Cakewalk, all these other companies are VERY thankful Apple pulled out of the professional segment.
1. MacPro's don't get update for 3-4 years
2. Took them 3 years for FCPX which had less functionality than their existing FCP7
3. Logic Studio X has no ETA, all "rumors" have been wrong so far and we're 3+ years
This simply is NOT a commitment to a professional market segment - not even close. Not only is the writing on the wall, it's spelled out in black and white.
It's not a game, it's a professional reality, diversify and don't depend on Apple.
Rob I'm sure you have made the transition. For a simple app a few code changes and a recompile may do the trick. For a framework that is a decade old and has thousands of apps that rely on it that task is exponentially more difficult. I'm sure it was possible but not feasible. I can literally grab a CD ROM and playback video from it on my Mac today without the Quicktime stack blowing up.
I'm actually liking this new era of "affordable" tools.
Blackmagic Cinema cameras coming in at sub $3k. Smoke drops to $3495 and computing power continues to climb. Is Apple going to invest a bunch of money into a market that is still relatively small and offers negligible profit? Probably not but I see them continuing to push Final Cut Pro and Logic Pro forward using Apple technologies and if Adobe and other companies grab share that's ok.
It's a little more than just a re-compile and changing of types/pointers ... there are allocation changes and more, but it's not what I would consider "heavy hitting" nor "difficult" coding.
Agree the framework has been lagging and some poor decisions were made on how to move that framework to 64bit (lots of feet dragging) ... put part of that was the relative new introduction to Intel instruction set, so Apple had A LOT of catching up to do compared to frameworks on other platforms. It's still not an excuse and Apple clearly still don't like this "Intel" thing ... it was a decision made to keep the company alive.
I'd bet you $1000 that Apple will eventually do away (switch over to Apple's CPUs) with all of their products that are Intel based ... primarily because Intel will go head to head with Apple in the mobile arena come 2013 (ish) ... last thing Apple wants is a reliance on Intel. So as far as I can tell, this is just the start of the phasing out of Intel hardware. Apple is designing their own CPUs now, not Motorola, not Intel, not IBM ... their very own (at a huge cost I might add). Apple has been buying up all kinds of chip design companies.
Ever watch a show/documentary called "Connections" with James Burke? Apple is a good candidate for an episode of that show.
Apple's A6 CPU is not as fast as they hoped and they are beginning to understand the same laws of physics that applied to Intel apply to them. Does Apple have enough money and resources to go head to head with Intel mobile ... money and resources yes, but Intel have a huge advantage of time and experience. The ONLY way Apple will beat Intel is if they buy Intel -- not out of the question.
It'll be interesting to see how long Smoke lasts on OSX only ... I personally am an C4D R14 + Adobe Suite (with a little Logic Studio and Cakewalk), it covers most of my bases and is affordable and has a lot of flexibility ... case in point a AMD 64 CPUs (4 X 16 CPUs) 128GB RAM 880GB SSD RAID render server cost me $6000 ... Apple have nothing that could even get close to that performance/cost ratio.
Point being, what's going on with Pro hardware/applications from Apple is connected to more long term goals of where Apple want to be ... what $100 Billion in cash reserves does for a company is allow it's execs to think bigger, much bigger -- what used to be a main source of revenue (pro apps/hardware) for the company is now almost completely irrelevant to them ... as professionals, we need to realize that, accept it, and diversify.
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Trouble is, without OSX, it's pretty much Windows or nothing, which is a problem for many of us. I could do without the Apple hardware easily, but the prospect for converting my workflow and OS back to Microsoft is not a pleasant idea, nor is the hackintosh route. I suppose at some point, there will be no choice left.
OSX is certainly my preferred OS but it's restricted to a old version of OpenGL 3.x which is a serious handicap to 3D performance when compared to DX11 on Windows side. Why Apple hasn't moved to OpenGL 4.x is beyond me?? Anyway, these are some of the dangers living with Apple timelines, you just never know what they'll do -- and that uncertainty is a big problem.
I've said it before and I'll say it again ... Apple need to use their current cash leverage while it still lasts. Stop buying all these smaller chip designer companies, buy Intel (one stop shop) -- kill two birds with one stone (remove some mobile competition and gain access to a huge wealth of resources and faster CPU/GPU technology). Once Intel is secured, open OSX up to all -- this would kill Microsoft.
I'd hate to see this happen (lack of competition is never good), but from a business perspective this would be the smart course of action for Apple. But knowing how Apple leverage, I think "their world" is an infinitely worse (in terms of end user control) place than Microsoft's.
I don't have a big problem with Win7 (it matured well), Win8 that's another story.
"from a business perspective" I wouldn't blame Apple for dumping Mac desktops altogether. Unfortunately, they clearly don't need it from that point of view.
Redmatica integration
I really hope Apple includes Redmatica's Keymap pro into the EXS24! It would make the EXS24 one of the most powerful samplers available!
I really hope Apple includes Redmatica's Keymap pro into the EXS24! It would make the EXS24 one of the most powerful samplers available!
I really hope Apple includes Redmatica's Keymap pro into the EXS24! It would make the EXS24 one of the most powerful samplers available!
Oh yes forgot about the Redmatica purchase. Hard to see Apple losing interest in Logic Pro if they're still buying assets to improve it.
With all the talk geared towards apple dumping pro users, the redmatica buy could well be for future GarageBand iPad technology!
iOS Garageband doesn't use plugins though and Redmatica products are all plugins. It's unlikely that their products at large will be used in iOS product for some time.