HP Defends New Ultrabook Design Against Noted Similarities to Apple's MacBook Air

[ftaok]

http://www.macworld.com/article/1166743/macalope_copy_paste.html

Interesting that HP copied the "patented" Apple trackpad/keyboard offset. That offset is one of the things that bugs me with Apple laptops. I'm a touch-typist, so I really like having the trackpad right underneath my thumbs, so a trackpad that's aligned with the space bar is perfect ... but it looks like crap.

So I'm totally conflicted on this one.

Kudos for HP for having the courage to center the trackpad and disregard function in favor of form.

ft

----------

Not here. Corporations were recently given personhood, so in America Apple would be "sir", and "is". Why? Because we are retarded.

Interesting take on it. Perhaps the reason this law was passed was to allow the US population to be grammatically correct when speaking about corporations. Certainly easier to do that than it would be to teach proper grammatical stylings.

 

[bawbac]

Only to corporate clients trying to stay under budget right? That doesn't seem like a good analogy to this type of luxury PC device.

I should harsh on HP, but do you think this Envy Spectre is going to sell at this price?

Ever heard of Delta Airlines, Boeing or Lockheed Martin.
They need reliability. They don't use Apple.

Take a tour of your local PSAP dispatch center as well where lives depend on the computer to function reliably.
You will either find a Dell or HP PC.
You know why?
They are reliable and can be kept on 24/7 for years without failure.
These PSAP's don't cycle their equipment/PC's for around 10 years so the equipment must be reliable and work consistently for years to come.

Apple is a good consumer simpleton computer (for those who have deep pockets) and a good media related tasks computer but not for mission critical computer that lives depend on.

Apple has their little niche but businesses need dependability and not just smooth lines and neat looking computers.

The Spectre may sell well to business travelers who use Windows and need the lighter weight. Their price point is not far from what people pay for high end Dell & HP laptops today.

 

[Dillenger]

Looks Ok, but it still runs Windows, enuff said.

 

[NAG]

You got to be kidding right? The Toshiba Portégé 7020ct had no internal Floppy or Optical drive since and that was in 2003...they even marketed it as a Ultra Notebook.
The Concept of the MBA, as well as it may be executed, is not new at all...

As much as I (and probably most of the guys around here) like Apple products, this whole "They did it first"-attitude is just plain silly...

Where did I say first?

Like it or not, Apple popularizes and accelerates these moves much faster than any other manufacturer. Yes, the iPhone wasn't the first smart phone. Yes, the iPod wasn't the first hard drive MP3 player. Yes, the iMac wasn't the first computer.

You're not disproving anything other than your strawman with arguments like that.

Simply put, when did Intel announce the original Ultrabook specifications? When did these Ultrabooks start flooding the market? Was it 2003?

Feel free to answer a made up question that I didn't ask and act all indignant, though.

 

[planetnaples]

Although this thread appears to be winding down now, I do have a question. To any of those who obviously have their panties in a twist about this announcement, why do you care so much what HP does? What's it to you?

 

[bawbac]

Although this thread appears to be winding down now, I do have a question. To any of those who obviously have their panties in a twist about this announcement, why do you care so much what HP does? What's it to you?

Because for some reason, people are not allowed to have choices or affordable products that meet or exceed Apple products.

It's getting to the point with some people that Apple products are accessories or a common bond with people that are not to be out done by competitors.

It kind of reminds me of the new Audi owners on a rant about other car manufacturers making simular eyelid like LED strip running lights in the headlights that look like the new Audi headlights.

 

[TallManNY]

Ever heard of Delta Airlines, Boeing or Lockheed Martin.
They need reliability. They don't use Apple.

Take a tour of your local PSAP dispatch center as well where lives depend on the computer to function reliably.
You will either find a Dell or HP PC.
You know why?
They are reliable and can be kept on 24/7 for years without failure.
These PSAP's don't cycle their equipment/PC's for around 10 years so the equipment must be reliable and work consistently for years to come.

Apple is a good consumer simpleton computer (for those who have deep pockets) and a good media related tasks computer but not for mission critical computer that lives depend on.

Apple has their little niche but businesses need dependability and not just smooth lines and neat looking computers.

The Spectre may sell well to business travelers who use Windows and need the lighter weight. Their price point is not far from what people pay for high end Dell & HP laptops today.

All good arguments for why HP shouldn't go out of business. But the Spectre is a clean lines luxury desktop. Maybe it will sell okay, but it will have to be to an executive with enough clout to get the bean counters to pay for a $1400 laptop that does nothing more than the $700 Dell. I don't think there are that many people in that market. And those that are, can also say, give me a Mac Air and bootcamp it with windows. And don't get too excited about the spec advantage over the 9 month old Air. In a month or two the new Air will come out and it will have the same ore better specs than this Spectre.

 

[scoobydoo99]

Two things....

1. In British (and some other variants of) English, corporations and some other collective nouns are considered to be plural - so "Apple are" and "HP are" are absolutely correct. The MacRumours community is worldwide - so accept that some members are using a different dialect of English, or often have English as their second, third, fourth... language.

2. Forum rules frown on correcting grammar/syntax/spelling, etc. I got a warning a few days ago about commenting on a post that used text messaging shorthand.

1. I am quite aware that the internet is worldwide. It was obvious that the poster was from the UK. That really doesn't affect my point. The grammar rules are actually applied the same in this case whether in American English or British English. It is true that Britons more frequently use the correct plural pronouns when applicable, but in this case the collective nouns were indisputably singular. So - American or British, the rule (and application) is the same.

2. I frown upon internet "rules".

 

[orthorim]

Ever heard of Delta Airlines, Boeing or Lockheed Martin.
They need reliability. They don't use Apple.

Take a tour of your local PSAP dispatch center as well where lives depend on the computer to function reliably.
You will either find a Dell or HP PC.
You know why?
They are reliable and can be kept on 24/7 for years without failure.
These PSAP's don't cycle their equipment/PC's for around 10 years so the equipment must be reliable and work consistently for years to come.

Apple is a good consumer simpleton computer (for those who have deep pockets) and a good media related tasks computer but not for mission critical computer that lives depend on.

Apple has their little niche but businesses need dependability and not just smooth lines and neat looking computers.

The Spectre may sell well to business travelers who use Windows and need the lighter weight. Their price point is not far from what people pay for high end Dell & HP laptops today.

Comparing Apples & Oranges... Apple doesn't make high reliability server systems! News at 11... come to think of it Apple doesn't make airplanes either. Surprise!

An HP laptop is also not a high reliability server system so this is of no relevance whatsoever. And as far as normal laptops go, Apple is pretty much killing everyone in the quality department with their unibody aluminium shell. Not because it looks cool, but because it's near indestructible.

I agree that business doesn't care too much what computers cost. But I think the DANGER for any WinTel system right now is that Macs have entered business already in some kind of halo effect on iPads and iPhones. Once there is a large scale Mac deployment in a company they'll figure out pretty quickly that maintenance costs of Mac vs Windows does not compare: Windows doesn't hold a candle. Once that news is out, watch out for a Mac revolution in business.

I would not have said this even a year ago - corporate IT, which I deal with on a daily basis, seemed incapable of change. And why change to something that's easier to maintain when all you know is Windows, and all your money comes from that knowledge. IT would never recommend macs. But with demand for iPads exploding, corporations finding alternatives to Windows-only solutions for their corporate software... this has changed dramatically over the last year. Apple might become an accidental corporate behemoth, without even trying. Their software has been superior for years, decades even - this is why most technical people I know use Macs for development. Less time wasted dealing with Windows BS, more work getting done...

 

[thisrocks]

Can't wait to see what specs this thing has, pointer to what the new MBA is going to have.

I want to see 8gb of memory, if not, Ivy Bridge may not be worth the upgrade for me over my 2011. Especially if the whole HiDPI thing pans out.

8gb + Retina = Sweet spot
4gb + Retina = Scary
4gb + USB3 = eh. I can wait

Why do I need 8gb? Because the processor on the thing is amazing and I'm a Tab pig. Also, VM.

 

[blow45]

Comparing Apples & Oranges... Apple doesn't make high reliability server systems! News at 11... come to think of it Apple doesn't make airplanes either. Surprise!

An HP laptop is also not a high reliability server system so this is of no relevance whatsoever. And as far as normal laptops go, Apple is pretty much killing everyone in the quality department with their unibody aluminium shell. Not because it looks cool, but because it's near indestructible.

I agree that business doesn't care too much what computers cost. But I think the DANGER for any WinTel system right now is that Macs have entered business already in some kind of halo effect on iPads and iPhones. Once there is a large scale Mac deployment in a company they'll figure out pretty quickly that maintenance costs of Mac vs Windows does not compare: Windows doesn't hold a candle. Once that news is out, watch out for a Mac revolution in business.

I would not have said this even a year ago - corporate IT, which I deal with on a daily basis, seemed incapable of change. And why change to something that's easier to maintain when all you know is Windows, and all your money comes from that knowledge. IT would never recommend macs. But with demand for iPads exploding, corporations finding alternatives to Windows-only solutions for their corporate software... this has changed dramatically over the last year. Apple might become an accidental corporate behemoth, without even trying. Their software has been superior for years, decades even - this is why most technical people I know use Macs for development. Less time wasted dealing with Windows BS, more work getting done...

Good point about them not even trying, it's apparent by the smb shares issues where current macs can't access an industry standard smb network drive reliably. And if some of us think that os x lion is a mess, people using os x lion server attest to the fact that we don't know what mess means if we haven't used the server version. Yeah they might become an accidental corporate behemoth, and most corporations try to avoid this accident for good reason.

 

[D-Dave]

Where did I say first?

Here

... And both times it just so happens that Apple is the first to get rid of those drives?

And just to clarify my previous Post for you, I was talking about the concept of the MBA as being a rather small, very slim Notebook without a Floppy or an optical drive. The added Note about the Term Ultrabook used back then was just a little bit of icing, not the cake. (hence the separation from the main sentence using "...")

Twisting this into an argument about who made the concept popular with the masses, or when someone announces specifications for this concept simply has nothing to do with what I said.

Feel free to put some flames to my strawman

 

[thisrocks]

Basing Min-spec off the Spectre XT which is available for customisation now, with ship on 25th June....

Looks like we're still limited to 4gb of memory, and probably still a 256gb SSD.

The upgrade so far is looking to be limited in terms of specs, don't know if I want to be jumping into Retina/HighDPI //IF IT HAPPENS// with 4gb, no matter how advanced Mountain Lion is...and I don't know if my 2011 is worth selling for Ivy Bridge (+USB 3) alone. We will have to see.

Note: Of course this is all speculation based on this very competitively priced HP device, but without a budget laptop, Apple will most likely be looking to keep their Air nicely priced too - All things considered.

 

[KnightWRX]

don't know if I want to be jumping into Retina/HighDPI //IF IT HAPPENS// with 4gb, no matter how advanced Mountain Lion is...

The 2GB models already push out that amount pixels with no problems over mDP + Internal monitor.

 

[thisrocks]

The 2GB models already push out that amount pixels with no problems over mDP + Internal monitor.

Eh.

Apple raised the bar once again, they delivered everything we wanted, except for 15" (arguable) and it gets completely ignored because of the Retina. That said, I am skipping out this gen MBA for the Retina, and then jumping back on board for MBA Haswell in 2013 - after which time I will be sick of carrying around 2kg and Diablo 3.

It will continue my Retina-centric Apple buy-ins. I only got this (13-1.7-256gb) because it was the cheapest ultrabook available at the time, and was going to be traveling for 3 months with it. (Cool story and all that)

 

[anomalogue]

And what's wrong with competition and providing consumers with choices?

This is about providing consumers with real choices between distinctly different options.

If you allow companies to make cheap copies of other people's ideas, why should anyone innovate? Let Apple pay for your R&D and market testing. And that's pretty much what most smart phone makers have been doing.

Now that Samsung has gotten its well-deserved spanking, maybe they will actually follow Microsoft and Amazon and make genuine attempts to provide differentiated products instead of trying to duke it out in price battles.

To mangle Churchill: "Companies will always innovate, once all other options have been exhausted." The courts exhausted Samsung's options.

 

[Michael Scrip]

Apple weren't the first to use a thin, wedge shaped design. This Sony Vaio was available 4 years before the first MacBook Air was released. Also note the chiclet keyboard.

Hmmmm.... so HP copied Sony and Apple?

That's twice as bad.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

This HP is a cheap copy. Yes, Apple may not own silver, but most likely were the first ones to use a one block of laser routed aluminum to build their new notebooks, while the competition were still playing with different kinds of plastic and carbon fiber.
BTW, ASUS just released a shameless copy of the MacBook Air.

 

[z31fanatic]

This is a three year old thread. Let it go.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

This is a three year old thread. Let it go.

LOL
Thank you for pointing at that.

 

[Cole Slaw]

I started reading this thread from page one. Took me three pages of reading before I realized it was 3 years old!