New Mac Pro Confirmed to Have Removable CPU

[kwikdeth]

so here's a question i have - as i understood it, the dual xeon mac pros had CPUs that had no thermal cover on them - the usual silver plate that identifies the cpu and build location and revision and such. are the new mac pros the same way?
i understood it to be that the lack of that thermal plate made adding aftermarket CPU upgrades a bit tricky since you had to remove the plate to get optimal thermal performance.

 

[ApfelKuchen]

It's not a surprise to me. It's Manufacturing 101 - when the quantity produced is relatively low, modularity is more likely, in order to support BTO options and minimize the need to re-tool from one year's models to the next. The fact that it doesn't look like yesterday's modular design is beside the point. The fact that the GPU cards are a proprietary design is beside the point - Apple needs these to be modular for Apple's own purposes.

 

[tkatz]

so here's a question i have - as i understood it, the dual xeon mac pros had CPUs that had no thermal cover on them - the usual silver plate that identifies the cpu and build location and revision and such. are the new mac pros the same way?
i understood it to be that the lack of that thermal plate made adding aftermarket CPU upgrades a bit tricky since you had to remove the plate to get optimal thermal performance.

It would appear to have the plate intact.

http://cdn1.appleinsider.com/cpu-131227.jpg

 

[LordVic]

This is true of any computer ever made. You can't use a socket that still doesn't exists to host the CPU.

yeah, but if you buy in early enough in the socket lifecycle, you have usually another generation afterwards. so ~2 years of current model CPU's using that socket.

going into 2011 now, means 6 months of "current" CPU's for this socket.

don't get me wrong. Loving the fact it's a socket.

 

[N64]

FINALLY we can lay this to rest.

You CAN replace the CPU, GPU, and internal storage. While non-proprietary connectors would be nice ... its Apple, what did you expect?

Well, the CPU isn't using proprietary connectors. In a few years, a CPU upgrade on this specific Mac Pro model will be cheaper as the CPUs it uses go out of date, or at least that's what happened with my 2008 Mac Pro.

 

[rGiskard]

Apparently the GPUs are replaceable but use a proprietary connector. So technically you could buy some kind of upgrade kit from Apple/OWC like with SSD but not buy some standard PC graphics card and just plug it in.

http://www.mac4ever.com/actu/84534_...-mac-pro-sont-inter-changeables-prise-en-main

You talking about non-standard form factors for the video cards, so anything not officially produced for Apple is very unlikely. Besides that, swapping out GPUs in the nMP requires cleaning off and reapplying thermal paste, along with a lot of disassembly. There is no way Apple or OWC are going to sell that sort of upgrade kit. No effing way at all. If OWC offers any sort of upgrade, they will require you to send in the MP for them to perform the upgrade.

 

[jasonvp]

It's probably wise to keep the old CPU so it can be swapped back in if warranty work is required. In that case, only the 12-core upgrade is worth doing for a nice $700. Not enough to add the four HDD bays missing from the nMP, but a start.

I'm not sure I necessarily agree. What this validates is the potential for putting any 1600 or 2600 series V2 chip into the socket. The 6-core upgrade Apple gives you only has 12MB of cache. What if the work you do would benefit from a 25MB cache? There's a 2600-series 6-core like that.

What if you want a faster 8-core chip? One that's 3.3 or 3.4GHz base clock? There are 2600-series 8-core chips like that.

How about a 10-core processor? Those are available, and not something Apple will allow you to upgrade to.

The potential is pretty large, actually. The monetary value and "is it worth it?" is totally up to the individual, obviously.

 

[rGiskard]

To the haters who jumped to the conclusion that the CPUs would not be upgradeable, feel free to post your apologies here. A little claim chowder is good for the soul.

Nobody claimed the CPU would not be upgradable. It's the GPUs which are not upgradable. Nothing has changed.

 

[LordVic]

I'm not sure I necessarily agree. What this validates is the potential for putting any 1600 or 2600 series V2 chip into the socket. The 6-core upgrade Apple gives you only has 12MB of cache. What if the work you do would benefit from a 25MB cache? There's a 2600-series 6-core like that.

What if you want a faster 8-core chip? One that's 3.3 or 3.4GHz base clock? There are 2600-series 8-core chips like that.

How about a 10-core processor? Those are available, and not something Apple will allow you to upgrade to.

The potential is pretty large, actually. The monetary value and "is it worth it?" is totally up to the individual, obviously.

fear with that is using CPU's not standard to apple might pose thermal problems with this design.

iunno. just brainstorming here.

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Nobody claimed the CPU would not be upgradable. It's the GPUs which are not upgradable. Nothing has changed.

to be fair to him: i dont think i ever posted to the affect since it was my pure speculation, but given Apples track record with their custom built stuff is soldered in parts and proprietary connectors.

I am going to go ful out on record that I am more than pleasantly surprised and happy to see that they went with the standard socket CPU's in this device.

 

[N64]

But a proprietary connector on the GPUs SUCKS.

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Nobody claimed the CPU would not be upgradable. It's the GPUs which are not upgradable. Nothing has changed.

The GPUs are upgradeable.

 

[aloshka]

You talking about non-standard form factors for the video cards, so anything not officially produced for Apple is very unlikely. Besides that, swapping out GPUs in the nMP requires cleaning off and reapplying thermal paste, along with a lot of disassembly. There is no way Apple or OWC are going to sell that sort of upgrade kit. No effing way at all. If OWC offers any sort of upgrade, they will require you to send in the MP for them to perform the upgrade.

Applying thermal paste is not really a big deal. Most everyone built DIY machines at one point or another. And vid cards don't follow specs, but no reason that it can't be made, unless the connector isn't pciex and is some weird form. Can't really tell

 

[Gudi]

RAM and CPU, yes. GPUs? You can remove the old ones, but good luck finding a new one to drop in.

These parts are not hard to find, there is only one source to get them from. But being proprietary to one vendor (who has a monopoly on pricing) is not the same thing as being technically un-upgradable.

 

[LordVic]

But a proprietary connector on the GPUs SUCKS.

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The GPUs are upgradeable.

I haven't seen this yet. can you provide a link please?

 

[aloshka]

I haven't seen this yet. can you provide a link please?

Looking around mr forums multiple people have said GPUs are upgradable. Asked my business guy (he is pretty smart, not just general sales person) said they are and showed me some documentation manual the says the same thing. Ironically it said the ssd isn't upgradable which I thought was weird until I saw the connector for it. Is it dual ssd blades and runs in raid?

 

[jasonvp]

fear with that is using CPU's not standard to apple might pose thermal problems with this design.

iunno. just brainstorming here..

I could see this being a potential concern for folks, but in reality I doubt it'll play out. Most of the CPUs I mentioned (save one of the 8-core) are all 130W TDPs. And that falls right in line with the chips Apple is already using; the other 8-core is actually 150W.

I'll bet a dollar Apple has engineered a little wiggle room in the case's design to allow for hotter chips. My dual 3.46Ghz x5690s are both 130W TDP, and they chug along in my 5,1 just fine. Those are way more power-hungry than any of the chips Apple has used in the dual 5,1 Pro.

All that to say: I'm betting a 150W TDP chip won't melt the thing down. ;-)

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I haven't seen this yet. can you provide a link please?

Look at the tear down? The GPUs can be pulled from the unit just like the CPU card can. If the GPU units can be pulled from the unit, then they can be upgraded.

Upgraded to what? Well, that remains to be seen. They're a proprietary card at the moment, and only Apple supplies them. So at most, you can buy the D700 cards directly from Apple and upgrade the D300s yourself. But you'll almost certainly pay a boat-load more money to Apple doing it that way.

 

[rGiskard]

I'm not sure I necessarily agree. What this validates is the potential for putting any 1600 or 2600 series V2 chip into the socket. The 6-core upgrade Apple gives you only has 12MB of cache. What if the work you do would benefit from a 25MB cache? There's a 2600-series 6-core like that.

What if you want a faster 8-core chip? One that's 3.3 or 3.4GHz base clock? There are 2600-series 8-core chips like that.

How about a 10-core processor? Those are available, and not something Apple will allow you to upgrade to.

The potential is pretty large, actually. The monetary value and "is it worth it?" is totally up to the individual, obviously.

I should have added the disclaimer "At this time" and "your needs may vary", obviously.

As far as the other options you described, absolutely! The 10-core Xeon E5-2690 V2 is a relative steal at $1855, almost $1000 less than a retail 12 Core Xeon E5-2697 V2. Compared to Apple's $3500 12-core, that's a $2000 savings if you sell the original CPU on ebay.

 

[LordVic]

I could see this being a potential concern for folks, but in reality I doubt it'll play out. Most of the CPUs I mentioned (save one of the 8-core) are all 130W TDPs. And that falls right in line with the chips Apple is already using; the other 8-core is actually 150W.

I'll bet a dollar Apple has engineered a little wiggle room in the case's design to allow for hotter chips. My dual 3.46Ghz x5690s are both 130W TDP, and they chug along in my 5,1 just fine. Those are way more power-hungry than any of the chips Apple has used in the dual 5,1 Pro.

All that to say: I'm betting a 150W TDP chip won't melt the thing down. ;-)

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Look at the tear down? The GPUs can be pulled from the unit just like the CPU card can. If the GPU units can be pulled from the unit, then they can be upgraded.

Upgraded to what? Well, that remains to be seen. They're a proprietary card at the moment, and only Apple supplies them. So at most, you can buy the D700 cards directly from Apple and upgrade the D300s yourself. But you'll almost certainly pay a boat-load more money to Apple doing it that way.

Looking around mr forums multiple people have said GPUs are upgradable. Asked my business guy (he is pretty smart, not just general sales person) said they are and showed me some documentation manual the says the same thing. Ironically it said the ssd isn't upgradable which I thought was weird until I saw the connector for it. Is it dual ssd blades and runs in raid?

thanks gentlmen, i'll take a better look later at everything (I'm like ADD while at work, should probably focus here a little better).

you know, i always hesitate to ask questions as such here, cause often times the response i get is insanely negative and people who want to misconstrue questions as loaded bias against apple.

people are so sensitive

 

[SeattleMoose]

This is awesome news! Just upgrade your processor and it'll be like you have a brand new machine again! This just seriously changed my mind about what to get. Knowing that I can upgrade the processor down the road I think I will be picking up the low end Mac Pro instead of the high end iMac and then be set for a great many years!

Just when I was leaning away from buying the nMP (audio engineer who has zero use for dual GPUs), I find out the RAM, SSD, and CPU are ALL upgradeable. Logic may never end up utilizing the GPUs so I may still end up paying for extra HW I don't need. But for the long haul the GPUs no longer matter to me (if Logic is updated to utilize the GPUs that is "frosting"). Now I am buying the system because all the components THAT DO MATTER can be upgraded down the road (for lower $$$ than doing so right now).

I'm in. Now when can I walk into an Apple store and walk out with entry level standard config Quad Core nMP?

 

[marioguarneros]

What about RAM, SSD and GPU?

We already know that the RAM is upgradable, OWC already sells the upgrades.

 

[rGiskard]

Look at the tear down? The GPUs can be pulled from the unit just like the CPU card can. If the GPU units can be pulled from the unit, then they can be upgraded.

Upgraded to what? Well, that remains to be seen. They're a proprietary card at the moment, and only Apple supplies them. So at most, you can buy the D700 cards directly from Apple and upgrade the D300s yourself. But you'll almost certainly pay a boat-load more money to Apple doing it that way.

Nobody, not OWC, and sure as hell not Apple, are going to sell upgrades that require users to mess with thermal paste. You could buy the parts from Apple, but at the prices they charge for replacement parts you'd be better off selling the MP and buying a new one.

It's also HIGHLY unlikely that any video card manufacturers would set up an assembly run for the special boards used in the MP. For the MP tower it was easy, just flash a Mac ROM on it, slap some Mac stickers on the cooler, and profit. No special assembly lines needed.

 

[puckhead193]

well it does look harder to do, hopefully you will only have to do this once or twice for the span of the machine.
Great news. I'm already waiting for prices to drop for the 12 core

 

[rGiskard]

We already know that the RAM is upgradable, OWC already sells the upgrades.

And the SSD, since OWC sells SSD upgrades for other Macs with proprietary connectors. And it was clear from early photos that the CPU was installed in a socket.

But it's nice that others are learning about this now.

 

[jasonvp]

Nobody, not OWC, and sure as hell not Apple, are going to sell upgrades that require users to mess with thermal paste.

I'll bet money that Apple will sell them. Will they warranty the work that you do? Nope. But they'll sell the parts.

You could buy the parts from Apple, but at the prices they charge for replacement parts you'd be better off selling the MP and buying a new one.

Which is... pretty much what I said.

It's also HIGHLY unlikely that any video card manufacturers would set up an assembly run for the special boards used in the MP.

Again, you're just restating what I already have.

 

[rGiskard]

well it does look harder to do, hopefully you will only have to do this once or twice for the span of the machine.
Great news. I'm already waiting for prices to drop for the 12 core

Check out the 2.9 GHz 10-core! If you don't need those extra two cores, it's a steal, at about the same price as a 3.0 GHz 8 core.

 

[5590982]

To the haters who jumped to the conclusion that the CPUs would not be upgradeable, feel free to post your apologies here. A little claim chowder is good for the soul.

Seriously, 'Apologies'? To whom? Apple? Phil Schiller? Perhaps these people could make an offering at the Steve Jobs altar you keep in your basement in order to appease... you, I guess?

'Apologies', for making an assumption about a tech product. Like, someone's feelings were hurt. Wow.