NFC-Equipped iPad Air 2 Sparks Speculation of Future Apple Pay Registers for Small Businesses [Updated]

[cube]

I did not think something could look more silly than taking pictures with a tablet.

 

[deeddawg]

this would help Apple pay adoption significantly for 500 dollars a business can accept NFC payments?

They can already do that for $238 if they don't need cellular capability.
http://www.amazon.com/VeriFone-Ethe...=8-3&keywords=verifone+wireless++terminal+nfc

 

[itr81]

That was on the payment processor's end, and has been caught & fixed. Chase explicitly said it wasn't anything on apple's end that caused the issue. I have been double charged before when using a regular magnetic card. It's a tiny bit of hassle, but usually easily rectified.

BOA has double charged many times before Apple Pay and many time after Apple Pay. I don't have Apple Pay but I've been double charged about 5 times with BOA since having their credit card.

 

[Col4bin]

"It brings Apple Pay out from the big box store and into farmers' markets and boutiques."

Incredibly smart idea.....should be interesting to watch. Heck, those small farmers markets and boutiques that use iPads as their POS systems are more advanced than the big-box stores who's systems are still stuck in 1999.

You know that little gadget that plugs into an iDevice, allowing for a consume to easily swip their credit card? Bingo.

Patent a similar portable design like that allows the consumer to simply wave their iDevice in front of it for payment.

Somebody will make a lot of money here. (100% positive it's already in production.)

 

[John.B]

You guys crack me up. "a few hiccups in an otherwise smooth release". You think people getting duplicate charges is a "hiccup"? Wonder how you'd feel if one of those hiccups was a $5000 item and the duplicate brought you over your credit limit and screwed your card.

Right...smooth with just "a few hiccups".

That was entirely Bank of America's doing.

 

[captain cadet]

Didn't iFixit find that there were no NFC antennas, despite the chip being present?

http://rapidnfc.com/blog/118/apple_iphone_6_and_case_of_missing_nfc_antenna
could be the same thing

 

[mabhatter]

There wasn't any NFC antennas in the device from iFixit, but it's unusual to include a chip and not have plans for it. Perhaps it'll be an add on later?

They still use the CHIP to process online Apple Pay transactions.. The encryption and token making is in hardware for security. I would guess Apple could offer it as an online service over wifi or mobile... But both half a would just talk to Apple, not each other?

 

[wakeupz]

If true, I think this would help Apple pay adoption significantly for 500 dollars a business can accept NFC payments? Yes please.

You can already do that. Use your iPad with Square Register by downloading it for free.

I for one can't see how Apple can win this market. Sure Apply Pay would be great but running a business is so much more.

What about all Android users who can't pay? Will I lose them as a customer? What about credit cards who people still use for years to come and what about my backoffice? Is Apple going to integrate with QuickBooks for me?

 

[ElectronGuru]

You know that little gadget that plugs into an iDevice, allowing for a consume to easily swip their credit card? Bingo.

Patent a similar portable design like that allows the consumer to simply wave their iDevice in front of it for payment.

Somebody will make a lot of money here. (100% positive it's already in production.)

Yeah, that does make sense. Duplicate square + applePay, adding a reader and antenna to the purchase system. If it also supports online purchases, theyve got a homerun. Take over in person buying, in person selling and online buying. Add in person to person and they can replace PayPal too. Wow.

----------

What about all Android users who can't pay? Will I lose them as a customer? What about credit cards who people still use for years to come and what about my backoffice? Is Apple going to integrate with QuickBooks for me?

ApplePay is NFC so done correctly, it would support all NFC clients.

 

[CFreymarc]

With the move towards VoLTE, the distinction between voice and data has blurred to the point that now the networks have to do extra work to special-case the billing of voice calls.

My childrens' children will never be issued a phone number.

It is already happening. There is this sub-culture of iPod Touch users who migrate from WiFi hotspot to hotspot only using third party messaging services. They can even voice call via Skype and other services. Then there are the myriad of reasons why WiMAX never took off to consumer ranks.

Just a matter of time before we see the carriers selling "non-numbered" smartphones with UUIDs or some other scheme to ID users away from the NPA numbering scheme. To think the current phone number scheme is almost sevety years old now.

Sad thing is Palm tried this ten years ago with a data voice service. The carriers pushed back hard on saying it would tax their data services way too much. Technically after analog cell phones, it was all digital packets with different priorities and billing rates. Palm could never crack the nut moving the carriers away from their cash cow into a business model that is at least ten times larger than voice calls.

 

[ptb42]

This could also be used for accepting payments at your table in a restaurant.

 

[BigHonkingDeal]

There wasn't any NFC antennas in the device from iFixit, but it's unusual to include a chip and not have plans for it. Perhaps it'll be an add on later?

Yeah on next years model....

 

[John.B]

What about all Android users who can't pay? Will I lose them as a customer?

Assuming this were a design to take NFC payments, why wouldn't an NFC payment from an Android phone work?

What about credit cards who people still use for years to come and what about my backoffice? Is Apple going to integrate with QuickBooks for me?

It's an enhancement. Whole Foods didn't suddenly stop taking credit cards when they turned on Apple Pay. And the payments will still have to go through a payment processor to your bank, same as before.

 

[l00pback]

It's been said already, but I wanted to throw in my two cents.

I think this is meant to enable - not compete with - services like Square, allowing them to accept Pay. Just as their service currently comes with a mag-strip card reader, in the future it'll come with an NFC reader instead - or maybe additionally. Providing the NFC hardware on the iPad reduces the development cost of what would essentially be just an antenna module that would attach via the Lightening port (presumably with a pass-through for power). All the encryption and other security features would be handled by iOS on the iPad, and the actual Tx/Rx would be handled by the add-on module.

 

[rigormortis]

What's Apple take on each transaction, 30%?

apple charges the bank 0.15 % , or maybe less. i am not sure. I'm pretty sure its 15 cents for every $100 and apple agrees to be the liable party on chargebacks. apple does not charge the merchant.

emv is shifting liability. in 2 years , if a merchant takes a swipe, and the transaction is charged back to the merchant, the merchant will have to pay for the transaction. the bank will pay for the transaction and be liable if the purchase was made with emv or rfid. apple pay is unique, because its apple that is paying for the chargebacks and neither the bank or the merchant.

my 2 year figure might be 1 year for point of sale and 2 years for gasoline

 

[John.B]

This could also be used for accepting payments at your table in a restaurant.

Anything has to be better than giving your credit card to a server who disappears with it for 10 minutes.

 

[gnasher729]

That's to protect people from themselves. From looking like an idiot making phone calls with a 10" tablet

But yes, it would have been nice if it did support voice calls through Bluetooth though

This is obviously funny, but if you have an iPad with you while your phone battery is empty, given the choice between looking stupid and not making an important phone call, most people would appreciate the choice and look stupid.

 

[TouchMint.com]

I was kind of thinking they might do something like this to cut out companies like square and paypal.

 

[Menel]

what's apple take on each transaction, 30%?

.15%

----------

Continually surprising me is that cellular iPads have all the hardware to make voice calls, but won't.


B

False. They do not.
The cellular transceiver chips in iPads are often data only chipsets absent voice capability.

 

[ptb42]

You guys crack me up. "a few hiccups in an otherwise smooth release". You think people getting duplicate charges is a "hiccup"? Wonder how you'd feel if one of those hiccups was a $5000 item and the duplicate brought you over your credit limit and screwed your card.

I don't suppose you know that Bank of America admitted it was their problem?

 

[thekev]

What's Apple take on each transaction, 30%?

High fees would not work there. Credit card companies charge roughly 2-3%, and Apple would have to come in well below that, as their role is more limited. I get that the comment has some sarcasm, but I wanted to add approximate numbers.

 

[Menel]

apple charges the bank 0.15 % , or maybe less. i am not sure. I'm pretty sure its 15 cents for every $100 and apple agrees to be the liable party on chargebacks. apple does not charge the merchant.

emv is shifting liability. in 2 years , if a merchant takes a swipe, and the transaction is charged back to the merchant, the merchant will have to pay for the transaction. the bank will pay for the transaction and be liable if the purchase was made with emv or rfid. apple pay is unique, because its apple that is paying for the chargebacks and neither the bank or the merchant.

my 2 year figure might be 1 year for point of sale and 2 years for gasoline

1year. Oct 2015.
If a Merchant takes a swipe, from a card that supports EMV, but takes the swipe anyway.

If the consumers card doesn't have EMV yet... Not the merchants problem.

 

[Patriot24]

It's been said already, but I wanted to throw in my two cents.

I think this is meant to enable - not compete with - services like Square, allowing them to accept Pay. Just as their service currently comes with a mag-strip card reader, in the future it'll come with an NFC reader instead - or maybe additionally. Providing the NFC hardware on the iPad reduces the development cost of what would essentially be just an antenna module that would attach via the Lightening port (presumably with a pass-through for power). All the encryption and other security features would be handled by iOS on the iPad, and the actual Tx/Rx would be handled by the add-on module.

Generally I'd agree. The only reason I think they may go further is their penchant for controlling the experience (and in this case, the money) from end-to-end.

It may be a stepped approach:

• 2014: Launch Apple Pay
• 2015: NFC-equipped iPads to enable thirty party payment system support (Square)
• 2016: Apple Pay expands to include a wallet (a.k.a. Apple Bank) and direct device-to-device payments

 

[captain cadet]

I think that they included this chip not because of the NFC functionality but for the included Secure Element which safely stores the payment keys. This supports Apple's story that you can still use Apple Pay for online transactions, just not in person ones. Thus NFC is not needed but the secure element is.

It's much harder for a malicious app or hacker with hands-on access to the device to pry the keys from the secure element than it is from the normal flash memory, as it's tamper resistant. It's basically a smart card (similar to the "Chip&Pin" EMV chip in a normal payment card), it's also a bit like a TPM module in Windows laptops/tablets.

Also notice that while the iPad includes the NXP65V10 it does not include the iPhone 6's AS3923 NFC booster chip which Apple uses to interface with the antenna. Without this its strength will be too weak to actually use NFC unless there was a fairly large antenna somewhere (and there is no space for that on the casing as it would have to be behind a plastic cover).

So I don't agree with the conclusion in the Gigaom article. While I would have loved to see NFC in the Air 2, I don't think it has the actual NFC functionality and in my opinion that's not why the chip is there.

They could have gone for a Secure Element chip without NFC but it would probably have required making new drivers, which probably wasn't worth the hassle as these chips won't be very expensive to begin with.

http://rapidnfc.com/blog/118/apple_iphone_6_and_case_of_missing_nfc_antenna
it could jut be hidden?

 

[sziehr]

why do i feel this new iPad is what the next iPhone will look exactly like on the inside.