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ankehuber

macrumors member
Jul 26, 2007
30
0
Let's just hope they release a shiny new iMac on the same day of the ML launch for us to upgrade to.
 

3282868

macrumors 603
Jan 8, 2009
5,281
0
But where do you draw the line? This is exactly why Apple has succeeded with their 'closed' ecosystem. There is massive amounts of effort to test an OS on every configuration out there. By limiting the hardware, Apple can release new versions as quickly as they do. Look at how long it takes Microsoft to release a new OS. There are infinite numbers of hardware configs out there.

Oh I agree, but this isn't about every system. This is about systems that can run M.L. and do with a simple tweak, and these systems are not more than 4-5 years in age, some 3. As many have stated, Apple has supported systems for as long as 7-8 years in age, but that changed with Tiger then Snow Leopard. Now it seems 3 years is the end for support which is an issue for developers who need the latest OS for Xcode.

Further, how does one justify the issue with Apple selling Mac Pro 1,1 models as full 64-bit, yet no EFI64 written for them? Adding further insult to the professionals who spend thousands on systems only for Apple to drop support 3 years later. That's inexcusable and adding support for those systems doesn't impair technological advancements, in fact it would seem to do just the opposite.

A few years ago I worked for a company that had eMac's which Apple stopped supporting with the release of Leopard in 2006. It wasn't because the system was too old, Apple placed a cutoff point for the processor speed. I simply tweaked the install plist, loaded it on an eMac and the system FLEW, was much faster than Tiger, using "LeopardAssist". In the end, this is about selling more hardware and making more billions for people that make a living off these system they spend much more on than a comparable Windows unit.
 

mrbyu

macrumors 6502
Jul 5, 2011
324
62
Except that on average, Mac owners keep their computers longer than PC users. Only geeks like us have to have the latest and greatest OS. My wife, who is a programmer by trade, still runs 10.6 on her MacBook. Why? Because it still does what she needs it to do. It didn't suddenly stop working when Lion was released.

You got the point, Sir.

I have a friend who still runs Tiger (!!!) on his early 2007 white MacBook. With a RAM upgrade he could also use Lion, but it simply wasn't that urgent for him.

Anyway, Lion was always pure joy to use (at least for me, I've never experienced speed problems on my 2011 MBA 13'). I couldn't live anymore without the full screen mode and the new multitouch gestures, they are simply so intuitive that the moves are in my fingers. And Mac App Store and iCloud brought OS X into the real digital era. If we can believe in the tester's experiences, Mountain Lion is going to take this whole package to a sophisticated, stabilized level.

So I'm really looking forward to it, because it seems to be a bloody good, long-term OS.
 

apolloa

Suspended
Oct 21, 2008
12,318
7,802
Time, because it rules EVERYTHING!
The only 'technical' reason why ML isn't supported by machines more than 5 years old is simply to encourage people to upgrade their hardware.

They've been doing the same with iOS for years, yet every time a new version comes out, jail breakers have proved that they work fine on older devices.

Although people upgrade their phones more often, I still see plenty of 3 and 3G iPhones around, but yes you can keep it going with jail breaks after Apple drops it's support.

Although its important to note that Snow Leopard looses new security updates in a few weeks - Lion has until next year's OS release. This is a big change (the short amount of time for OS security updates) and needs to be fixed, IMHO..

I didn't think of this! So basically Apple will just leave everyone who upgraded OSX last year when the new one comes out in terms of support and essential security updates, which, as far as I'm concerned it is responsible for for a LONG time?
 

rockland

macrumors newbie
Jun 17, 2008
27
0
Translation: We need your money more than you do. Keep buying our products or we'll brick them one by one.
 

BornAgainMac

macrumors 604
Feb 4, 2004
7,302
5,311
Florida Resident
I still find it hard to believe people with old machines would rush out and download ML in the first year. It isn't in their DNA to be an early adopter. Tiger/Leopard/Snow Leopard will be fine for those folks anyways.
 

dona83

macrumors 6502
Nov 26, 2004
319
47
Kelowna, BC
My 2006.5 iMac will serve the rest of its life happily running Lion, I'm not going to complain. Sure it's not going to gain some of the cool new things in Mountain Lion but it's not losing anything either. At six years old, it's EOL from a support perspective even for me. Even if it did bug me, so what? I can sell the machine for $300 and move up to a Mid-2007 iMac for cheap, but I threw in a 1TB HD so it could serve as an iTunes media server, and besides, I can upgrade my MBP to ML. :D
 

k2k koos

macrumors 6502a
fair I think

Except that on average, Mac owners keep their computers longer than PC users. Only geeks like us have to have the latest and greatest OS. My wife, who is a programmer by trade, still runs 10.6 on her MacBook. Why? Because it still does what she needs it to do. It didn't suddenly stop working when Lion was released.

Good point, in fact, my nearly 9 year old ALu Powerbook G4, running OSX 10.4 Tiger, is pretty much still doing what I need it to do. I can surf the net, I can receive&send e-mails, I can store my pictures, listen to music, make music using Logic Pro, write letters, spreadsheets etc. Pretty much all every day stuff, (perhaps with the exception of Logic Pro that not everyone would use), and the thing still works ok. I say ok as the backlight of the display is slowly dying and it takes a little while to get up to 'full' brightness, and I can even post on this forum, that ought to count for something!
Oh, and still no viruses or malware on my machine (thanks to the fact that those who write that stuff can't be bothered to target the powerpc architecture I guess...) . :)
 

parapup

macrumors 65816
Oct 31, 2006
1,291
49
Actually, what hurt consumers is that Microsoft switched to WDDM and WDF instead of their old driver model, making older NT drivers not able to function properly.

The way things work in Microsoft land - not many people upgrade their OSes directly - they get the OS upgrade when they buy a new machine and then they run it for a long time - supported with updates.

OEMs selling Vista based machines did make sure to have a WDDM driver and as such few people were burnt for considerable amount of time due to not having WDDM capable driver. (Part of it was also that people hated Vista and wanted to stay on XP until Win 7 came out.)
 

JayLenochiniMac

macrumors G5
Nov 7, 2007
12,819
2,389
New Sanfrakota
If Apple is going to start bricking machines based on year/models, customers who normally go top of the line in order to extend the life of their machines will be less likely to do this. There's a wide range of performance difference even within the same year machine.
 

scionfriar

macrumors member
Apr 26, 2005
37
1
I could live with Lion on my Mac Pro 1.1 if they'd at least give us decent iCloud document integration like they should have in the first place. To make that a ML only feature is pretty weak.
 

3282868

macrumors 603
Jan 8, 2009
5,281
0
I still find it hard to believe people with old machines would rush out and download ML in the first year. It isn't in their DNA to be an early adopter. Tiger/Leopard/Snow Leopard will be fine for those folks anyways.

How about developers that need the current OS X for Xcode/development whose systems can run M.L. and do run it with a simple tweak? Three year old systems with 64-bit support run Windows 7 and 8 preview in full 64-bit perfectly, yet cannot (according to Apple) run M.L. and thus will not be able to use their perfectly good systems for development.

This is the issue many are taking.
 

mabaker

macrumors 65816
Jan 19, 2008
1,209
566
They dropped all models which do not support at least OpenGL 3.2 core profile. I think this is the main story here. Personally, I welcome this decision.

You welcome a decision of Apple being plain too lazy to update the Firmware of their most expensive computer (Mac Pro)?

BTW. people on the forum got ML running on a Macbook from 2007 with GMA950 running perfectly.

This is planned obsolescence.
 

mgsolidsnak3

macrumors member
Mar 31, 2007
35
0
Funny thing is that my core2duo 64bit macbook will be able to run just fine Windows 8 but not its own proprietary OS :apple:
 

Reason077

macrumors 68040
Aug 14, 2007
3,633
3,674
Mountain Lion GM runs like crap on my two year old 27" iMac i5 with 8GB RAM.

Uhh really? It runs great on my Early 2008 iMac with 4GB RAM. Very snappy. And even pretty good on my Late 2010 Air with 2GB.

Admittedly the iMac ran like crap until I dropped an SSD into it, but that was true with any recent version of OS X.

I think OS X is really built with SSDs in mind these days, they make a huge difference.
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
The way things work in Microsoft land - not many people upgrade their OSes directly - they get the OS upgrade when they buy a new machine and then they run it for a long time - supported with updates.

OEMs selling Vista based machines did make sure to have a WDDM driver and as such few people were burnt for considerable amount of time due to not having WDDM capable driver. (Part of it was also that people hated Vista and wanted to stay on XP until Win 7 came out.)

You're forgetting all the external USB/other peripherals though, like printers, scanners, webcams, etc... ;)
 

doctor-don

macrumors 68000
Dec 26, 2008
1,604
336
Georgia USA
Whoah, bad news for me using a 3.0 2x dual core mac pro tower maybe.

Kinda pisses me off my mac pro may not get new osx, especially when there isn't a proper new mac pro. Apple ought not release osx that won't work on semi recent models. Pretty bad for customers. Could be an reason to upgrade... To a windows workstation

Mine (early 2008) says
Model Name: Mac Pro
Model Identifier: MacPro3,1
Processor Name: Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Processor Speed: 2.8 GHz
Number Of Processors: 2

It's listed as EFI64 although it also says the default mode is 32-bit in Mac OS X (client), 64-bit in Mac OS X Server.

Is that different than what you are describing?

How is the mode determined / changed (32-bit <-> 64-bit)?
 

Daalseth

macrumors 6502a
Jun 16, 2012
599
306
OK But

My brand new MBP will get the upgrade for free. Cool.
My Late 2008 MB could get it BUT I am leaving it on Snow Leopard because that's where I run Rosetta software. I have an old FileMaker I need once a year but it's not worth buying an upgrade. I have an ancient MS OfficeX that still runs fine, under Rosetta. Not going to give any more to MS for a new one with that abomination called the ribbon.
 

Thunderhawks

Suspended
Feb 17, 2009
4,057
2,118
[B said:
Originally Posted by hayesk
Except that on average, Mac owners keep their computers longer than PC users. Only geeks like us have to have the latest and greatest OS. My wife, who is a programmer by trade, still runs 10.6 on her MacBook. Why? Because it still does what she needs it to do. It didn't suddenly stop working when Lion was released.[/B]

My experience is that every time I bought a new Mac, the Mac processing was faster at doing what I needed done. It was always waiting for me to do the next thing!

As I did more and got faster to adjust to the new power things reversed. I then tweaked were I could (memory, hard drive , accelerator boards etc.)
Now I am waiting sometimes for the Mac to be done.

That is the point when I want a new machine with the latest speed processors etc. which would then come with the latest OS.

That cycle has happened to me since 1984 and lasts about 4 years, more if I can tolerate it or a new "latest" machine is eminent to be released.

I intentionally skipped Lion so far, as all of what I am doing is fine and working and I like snow leopard.

Some companies do not update their software and I still run old stuff.

Of all of my Macs (20 plus) since 1984 only THREE had issues (fixed myself), all others I could still run today.

Summary, if you want the latest upgrade get it, but admit to yourself that you don't really need it.

As posted : If all your stuff works you'll survive without ML just fine.
 

435713

macrumors 6502a
May 19, 2010
834
153
1. MS would NEVER EVER try to push people to upgrade to their new OS if they were in more of a position to. The Legacy support is the kindness of their hearts of course.

2. The XBOX 360 may have stagnated consoles, going to be 7 years old soon, but that stagnation is good for teh legacy. And that POWA is untapped still and we dont need new consoles.

3. MS is the greatest company that ever lived, and do things just for the consumer and only the consumer in mind.

4. Google is second best and Android is updated and supported on older devices all the time.

I love having their "stuff" on my chin. :p

Thumbs down imminent. Would you dare thumbs down MS macrumors? Would you dare. ? O they got rid of thumbs down. *sad face*
 

Moonjumper

macrumors 68030
Jun 20, 2009
2,740
2,908
Lincoln, UK
I love it. You can't swing a cat around here without hitting somebody who swears they'll never give up Snow Leopard. Now people are up in arms because their second hand eBay specials won't load ML. XD

You talk as if all people have the same opinion. You will learn differently from spending time on these forums. :)

Some people won't give up Snow Leopard. Different people want or need the latest OS. Personally, I much prefer Snow Leopard, but I will need the latest OS at some point for Xcode support.

I have had my iMac since new, so not an eBay special, and still love it. I need quite a few more people to buy my games before I can afford a new Mac. Hopefully the 2 on the way will sell better than my current game.
 
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