Samsung's New Texas Factory for A5 Chip Production Now Fully Operational

[mijail]

Look, Hellhammer knows this and we all do really.

I'm glad you know it. I don't know who knows what, unlike you. So I can only refer to what he said.

The point was that Peace said Samsung could copy Apple's design if they manufacture the processor, we were simply pointing out to Mr. Peace that much of that design is open, licenseable specs to begin with.

Yes, thanks for repeating what I already read.
And since that was noticeably incomplete, I added that it was not all "open and licenseable". Did you read that too?

And we were also pointing out the other gorilla in the room : Samsung already has SoC design teams and they've been designing and making SoCs since before Apple even entered the mobile market, by quite a few years too.

So what?
(In any case, Apple has had a history of meddling with processors for a few years before going into "the mobile market" too, at least if with that you are referring to the smartphone market)

 

[Rocketman]

A Korean company builds a chip factory in the Texas to be assembled into a product in China. This makes no sense to me just from the logistical complications, let alone the wage differences.

Here's how it does make sense. The critical component fab and IP and key tech sits in the jurisdiction of your home country. But being rational you build it in a state with 60% less lawyers, regulations, political noise, and taxation. Then you hire smart folks used to working for reduced wages in non-union shops in a relatively low cost of living location.

Moderate costs, good information control, and a bunch less risk of IP theft and widespread cloning. This last point being, keeping the most agregious worldwide cloner, Samsung, under your thumb and getting what you actually need, a simply reliable supplier for a part.

More goodness, less drama, but the sheer extent of effort and strategy to get there is astounding!

Rocketman

 

[balamw]

MOD NOTE: A PRSI offshoot of this thread was created here: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1292495/ to discuss the question if these jobs should preferentially go to Iraq war veterans.

Those who qualify should discuss that topic there, not here.

B

 

[jesushavemercy]

Here's how it does make sense. The critical component fab and IP and key tech sits in the jurisdiction of your home country. But being rational you build it in a state with 60% less lawyers, regulations, political noise, and taxation. Then you hire smart folks used to working for reduced wages in non-union shops in a relatively low cost of living location.

Moderate costs, good information control, and a bunch less risk of IP theft and widespread cloning. This last point being, keeping the most agregious worldwide cloner, Samsung, under your thumb and getting what you actually need, a simply reliable supplier for a part.

More goodness, less drama, but the sheer extent of effort and strategy to get there is astounding!

Rocketman

Not matter how you spin it its a complete joke that foxconn makes apple products.
Apple is helping China and communism grow stronger when america descends.
Im not an american, i will buy an iphone when it's made in usa..

Nokia n9 is made in Finland and rock solid quality compared to the chinese product iphone..

 

[Oletros]

This last point being, keeping the most agregious worldwide cloner, Samsung, under your thumb and getting what you actually need, a simply reliable supplier for a part.

Good joke.

 

[Hellhammer]

Nokia n9 is made in Finland and rock solid quality compared to the chinese product iphone..

Nokia's factory in Salo has been at stake for quite a while now. It won't be long before Nokia is mainly China-made too.

 

[TrentS]

Apple vs. Samsung

I'm just waiting for the day the news comes out announcing that "Apple Buys Samsung", or "Samsung Buy Apple"! Thus ending their long-standing patent lawsuit battle. ha ha

 

[Rocketman]

Apple is helping China and communism grow stronger when america descends.
Im not an american, i will buy an iphone when it's made in usa..

Nokia n9 is made in Finland and rock solid quality compared to the chinese product iphone..

Globalization was at its peak from 2000-2003 under policies installed by President Clinton and his congressional associates. It was then that we shifted a vast amount of reproduceable products to Chinese production along with the know-how of how to do it. Historians and manufacturing consultants have viewed this as the hollowing of our own manufacturing base and the training of China to rise up. Now from one perspective a rising China is more peaceful and interdependent, but in another sense a strong China is a more formidable military power.

While Apple's Chinese production is a tiny fraction of what Wal-Mart and Target and many others and their vendors do there, it is noticeable.

My main concern for Chinese manufacture of electronic goods is the possibility of secret back door access to info we all know exists to suit our government, but at least I want only our government to have the keys to those doors.

China has its own problems to deal with including a lack of internal leadership due to years of breeding sheeple. Our current welfare and victimhood society here, is doing that to a large portion of our culture now too.

Our great strength is in our ethic of working hard, working smart, being willing to take risks, and the ability to fail and move on again. Some day China may also develop that to a degree, but not as an inherent aspect of an entire society like we have.

I suggest not killing it with increasing emphasis of government and regulation in our lives. We need to be able to do things for ourselves, and that includes voluntarily helping others less fortunate or capable than us, just as it was long before we had an income tax or a welfare system.

But as an obscure company named Apple literally changes the culture and personal productivity and interactivity of our society, and those all over the world, it should be noted change can come on a large scale from unlikely places at the effort of one or a very small number of folks. We have will.

The will of Apple certainly has been used for good, on a very large scale.

Rocketman

 

[jesushavemercy]

Nokia's factory in Salo has been at stake for quite a while now. It won't be long before Nokia is mainly China-made too.

Its because of Nokias recent fails,
However Samsung is another example of production in homeland.

 

[KnightWRX]

So what?

So the point was someone saying "Another chance for Samsung to copy!" and we were pointing out how ludicrous that was in the context of Semi-conductors.

From your will to debate this, am I to assume you share Mr. Peace's opinion that Apple giving manufacturing of the A4, A5 and A6 to Samsung, they are taking a risk ?

----------

I'm just waiting for the day the news comes out announcing that "Apple Buys Samsung", or "Samsung Buy Apple"! Thus ending their long-standing patent lawsuit battle. ha ha

Both companies have far too high value for that to happen on any side.

 

[Timzer]

How can any American not Applaud this? You can't spin it any other way, but a big Good Job Samsung. What does Apple manufacturing contribute to it's own country of origin? When you really give it some thought, Apple isn't even American when you look at parts and manufacturing. This is quite sad for such an iconic "American" company. I think a company with so much power should take a more responsible stance with manufacturing in countries with such horrible track records in Human Rights violations.

 

[alent1234]

A Korean company builds a chip factory in the Texas to be assembled into a product in China. This makes no sense to me just from the logistical complications, let alone the wage differences.

makes perfect sense. can't think of any major CPU produced in China. the hard part in CPU production is working out the kinks in a new process or new design. it's not like you press a button and the machine just makes CPU's. takes months of calibration and other work. look at all the issues AMD is having.

you need a lot of experienced people to do this. When Intel makes a new CPU it does it in Oregon first. once the process is worked out all the other worldwide factories copy it. but the actual work of getting it up and running is done in the US

for high end products it's cheaper to pay experienced people more and get it done faster

 

[divinox]

Nokia's factory in Salo has been at stake for quite a while now. It won't be long before Nokia is mainly China-made too.

Nokia aren't leaving Salo, out of both political, economical and ownership reasons.

 

[vanzantapple]

Dear Apple,

Look what Samsung can do, hire American workers. Hint Hint Hint.

Signed, unemployed forever

............

I know, I know...blah blah blah.. Thumb me down.

 

[mijail]

From your will to debate this, am I to assume you share Mr. Peace's opinion that Apple giving manufacturing of the A4, A5 and A6 to Samsung, they are taking a risk ?

I don't see the need for a connection between wanting to know/understand and being a partisan. Even if there was, how would knowing that be useful to you? Are you looking for facts/information or for partisanism? I'm sorry but I am more interested in the former.

But anyway, to answer the question: yes, to my eyes it is a clear risk. At the very least, the classical problem of having a supplier which is also a competitor.

About the copying risk... Surely it's not so easy as "OMG they're gonna just xerox it". But of course it would be less risky if the very competitor wasn't manufacturing that kind of piece.

----------

Dear Apple,

Look what Samsung can do, hire American workers. Hint Hint Hint.

Signed, unemployed forever

I forget, where was Apple going to build those spaceship campuses?

 

[Apple Corps]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)



You know what is even funnier? If Samsung cancels the contract. Imagine the impact of it on iProducts.

Big impact on Apple - but I suspect Apple would own SAMSUNG due to the breach of contract damages.

 

[Hellhammer]

Nokia aren't leaving Salo, out of both political, economical and ownership reasons.

They are. Nokia has fired so many people here in Finland during the last few years that it's just a matter of time until the Salo factory is taken offline. Their business isn't doing all that well either so maintaining a factory, which manufactures phones that nobody buy, in Finland where everything is expensive doesn't make any sense.

It's been an elephant in the room in here. Everyone knows that it will happen soon but nobody wants to talk about it.

 

[KnightWRX]

I don't see the need for a connection between wanting to know/understand and being a partisan. Even if there was, how would knowing that be useful to you? Are you looking for facts/information or for partisanism? I'm sorry but I am more interested in the former.

But anyway, to answer the question: yes, to my eyes it is a clear risk. At the very least, the classical problem of having a supplier which is also a competitor.

About the copying risk... Surely it's not so easy as "OMG they're gonna just xerox it". But of course it would be less risky if the very competitor wasn't manufacturing that kind of piece.

So you're saying a leader in the semi conductors field, with patent filing/year numbers 2nd only to IBM and way ahead of Apple, that has been producing their own designs for years prior to Apple even coming up with the A4 would copy Apple's design ?

Sorry, I don't see the risk there, nor does Apple it seems. Samsung knows semi-conductors, they already make their own SoC, they don't need Apple's engineering, they have their own.

Frankly, Peace and anyone claiming "Samsung will copy Apple SoCs!" are just trying to bash the competition again.

 

[divinox]

They are. Nokia has fired so many people here in Finland during the last few years that it's just a matter of time until the Salo factory is taken offline. Their business isn't doing all that well either so maintaining a factory, which manufactures phones that nobody buy, in Finland where everything is expensive doesn't make any sense.

It's been an elephant in the room in here. Everyone knows that it will happen soon but nobody wants to talk about it.

Except, production actually isn't that much more expensive, as labor costs are becoming an increasingly small part of production and the government does what it can to reduce costs even further (mainly, cost of electricity).

Where i live, it is Volvo that has the stronghold on the city. For as long as i can remember there have been talks about shutting the plant down. Yet, as it turns out, they keep investing in it. With billions invested, no one is going anywhere. Switching costs are too great.

That said, countries like ours will always take severe blows staff-wise in bad times. But theres a significant difference between cutting back on production, and moving it. To move production you need the new productional facility to pay off the entire sunk cost. Thats easier said than done, when you have billions invested already.

 

[dethmaShine]

Because apple is simply a one giant troll company.

Isn't this just great?

Apple bashing on MacRumors and people calling names? And after all, people refer to MacRumors as a place of worship of Apple fanboys. Funny.

 

[Dan--]

Maybe this opens the door for an A5 powered Apple TV in the near future. Yay.

 

[norbinhouston]

Way to go Texas! It was pretty savvy of Samsung to put a factory in Austin. At the time Texas had two of the largest PC companies in the world, Dell and Compaq. Lots of degreed people moved to take advantage of job opportunities.

 

[danahn17]

We at the Macrumors forum know more about Samsung than certain Mr. J.K. Shin. Lee Jae-yong may as well hire us for controlling the operations.

Actually, when you read at some posts here, you'd also think that some people know more about Apple than Steve Jobs, Tim Cook, Jony Ive, and co combined

 

[mijail]

So you're saying a leader in the semi conductors field, with patent filing/year numbers 2nd only to IBM and way ahead of Apple, that has been producing their own designs for years prior to Apple even coming up with the A4 would copy Apple's design ?.

Funny how patents are alternatively a thing to respect and a symbol of degeneration.

I don't live in your black-or-white world, so I can't really answer. But Turning the question around seems as interesting: you mean other companies would never, ever be interested in Apple's designs?

Also, Samsung makes everything from fridges to telephones. Do you really think intelligent to conflate all those patents and compare such a number with what a more "centered" company does?

And you seem to keep ignoring that Apple has played with processors for a long time too - and that, apart from the imported talent from other companies.

Sorry, I don't see the risk there, nor does Apple it seems. Samsung knows semi-conductors, they already make their own SoC, they don't need Apple's engineering, they have their own.

I never said they need them. I hope they don't .
What I said is that it sure is risky paying your competitor to make something you need. Copying is just one of the possible problems.

Frankly, Peace and anyone claiming "Samsung will copy Apple SoCs!" are just trying to bash the competition again.

Frankly, you love generalizing too much.

 

[AustinIllini]

Way to go Texas! It was pretty savvy of Samsung to put a factory in Austin. At the time Texas had two of the largest PC companies in the world, Dell and Compaq. Lots of degreed people moved to take advantage of job opportunities.

For whatever reason, Austin is a tech giant. The "silicon hills" include companies like Samsung, National Instruments, Emerson, IBM, Apple (Austin Campus), and Dell in the north suburbs. I also applaud Samsung for expanding American jobs. While I don't care for their phone products, I admire that they and Apple can work as partners even in a hostile tech environment.