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Wozniak, Jobs, and Pirates

Interviewer: When you built the Apple I, you had to offer it to H-P because you worked for them, right?

Woz: I don't know if most people would think that way, but I had this real strong ethical background that came from my father.
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Interesting answer, considering that he was a blue-box toting phone phreak.
 
Originally posted by Doctor Q
Interesting answer, considering that he was a blue-box toting phone phreak.
Click to expand...

LOL - and yet he wouldn't build a transmitter as he didn't want to pollute the airwaves could have had a sort of wireless display 20 years ago!
 
Xerox?

Can someone give a brief history of Xerox's "original" GUI-based operating system (the one that Apple/Msoft supposedly "stole" from them in "Pirates of Silicon Valley")?
 
Re: Re: of Pirates....

Originally posted by tjwett
ofcourse Bud makes 40s. here's a chick using a few to get her workout on. silly me, i used to just drink them.
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Apologies.

My question remains, why not go for the extra hoppy goodness of Old E? Or Steel Reserve?

-N
 
Re: Xerox?

Originally posted by erockerboy
Can someone give a brief history of Xerox's "original" GUI-based operating system (the one that Apple/Msoft supposedly "stole" from them in "Pirates of Silicon Valley")?
Click to expand...
The Alto computer with its graphical interface was developed by Xerox's Palo Alto Reseach Center in 1973. Steve Jobs got a tour of PARC that inspired him to create the Macintosh. Microsoft copied Apple and the rest is history!
 
Re: Re: Re: of Pirates....

Originally posted by NatronB
Apologies.

My question remains, why not go for the extra hoppy goodness of Old E? Or Steel Reserve?

-N
Click to expand...

Red Hook is the domestic beer of the future. Get on board before it gets too trendy... Lucky me, I now live close to their breweries -- having a big delicious birthday Amber Ale right now -- bmuwahahahahaha!

OT, I liked the little scene between Jobs and Gates: "What's this you've been working on, this, what is it, WINDOWS?!?!?" (paraphrased).

Its kinda funny to think of Gates being a junior partner to Jobs in any enterprise. Makes me wonder how much of the Evil Empire is based on Jobs' abuse of him.....food for thought...I think....
 
wow... slow rumor day :(

AAAnyway, the movie was my main tool during college to turn the tide of the Mac-haters. I remember screening the movie with some of my Windoze-lovin' friends. After the movie ended, they were all like: "Damn, Bill gates is a major ******!" or "So that's what happened!"

I felt like an evangelist, spreading the word of Steve; much like I still am today! :D

:eek: "Repent, ye Window sinners, be it 95 or 98, 2K to NT! The way of the Apple is at hand!!"
 
Great member name, JediMacster!

Speaking of humor, I saved a knock-knock joke that Woz distributed to his friends by e-mail in July 2002. You can probably guess who SJ and SW are. Pay attention to who says what and you'll get the joke.

SJ: Knock Knock.

SW: Who's there?

SJ: Control Freak.

SJ: Now YOU say 'Control freak who?'.
 
Re: Re: Xerox?

Originally posted by Doctor Q
The Alto computer with its graphical interface was developed by Xerox's Palo Alto Reseach Center in 1973. Steve Jobs got a tour of PARC that inspired him to create the Macintosh. Microsoft copied Apple and the rest is history!
Click to expand...

Actually Apple didn't 'steal' the GUI. Apple paid Zerox for the GUI concept. This was a big point in the Apple-MS lawsuit. Apple paid for the concept but MS was allowed to steal far more than just the original concept.
 
Re: Re: Re: Xerox?

Originally posted by AmbitiousLemon
Actually Apple didn't 'steal' the GUI. Apple paid Zerox for the GUI concept. This was a big point in the Apple-MS lawsuit. Apple paid for the concept but MS was allowed to steal far more than just the original concept.
Click to expand...

IIRC...what the hell, it's a rumor...

Back in the day when Apple was up and coming and wasn't public yet, Xerox wanted to buy stock. Apple (Jobs, Woz, etc.) knew that Xerox PARC was where new and creative new things were being developed (because of some old employees who now worked for Apple told them so) so they made a tour of PARC as well as permission to use whatever they observed there part of the stock trade. What they saw was a GUI where icons represented commands. What they thought they saw was a GUI where icons represented the files on the computer and a way to navigate those files. Thus, the Mac GUI wasn't even really borrowed from Xerox, but was created by mistake. The other big idea they pulled out of PARC was the mouse which also made it into the Mac. The third big idea that was floating around PARC at the time was object oriented programing, which they didn't pick up on and incororate into the Mac.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Xerox?

Originally posted by painandgreed
IIRC...what the hell, it's a rumor...

Back in the day when Apple was up and coming and wasn't public yet, Xerox wanted to buy stock. Apple (Jobs, Woz, etc.) knew that Xerox PARC was where new and creative new things were being developed (because of some old employees who now worked for Apple told them so) so they made a tour of PARC as well as permission to use whatever they observed there part of the stock trade. What they saw was a GUI where icons represented commands. What they thought they saw was a GUI where icons represented the files on the computer and a way to navigate those files. Thus, the Mac GUI wasn't even really borrowed from Xerox, but was created by mistake. The other big idea they pulled out of PARC was the mouse which also made it into the Mac. The third big idea that was floating around PARC at the time was object oriented programing, which they didn't pick up on and incororate into the Mac.
Click to expand...

not sure what you are upset about. you just agreed with me. apple compensated xerox. windows users always try to say well apple stole from xerox. this isn't true. apple had permission to use what steve observed.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Xerox?

Originally posted by AmbitiousLemon
not sure what you are upset about. you just agreed with me. apple compensated xerox. windows users always try to say well apple stole from xerox. this isn't true. apple had permission to use what steve observed.
Click to expand...

Not upset, just expanding to fill in details. :)
 
Well thank you both for helping to dispel the myth that Apple was no better than M$. Apple got some ideas from Xerox, Xerox got some compensation. Whereas M$ (Gates, really) bought some crappy software (DOS) from a guy in a basement, which they had already licensed to IBM before even owning it, for much more (and more than it was worth), but still retained ownership of it ("hardware is where the $$$ is" says IBM), then pretended to be nice to Apple to directly STEAL it's UI, and beat Apple at their own game (releasing Windows in Japan), eliminating competition though unfair business practices, further stealing other's software (and making a crappier version of it), thus creating a Monopoly.

Let me know if I missed anything.

-

That's not just business as usual, it should have been illegal - so where is the US Government in all of this?
 
Funny, I came away thinking, wow, I knew Gates was an a, but Jobs is too!

Now when I see jobs in his keynotes, I see Noah. I keep wondering what the hell he's doing to all the OSX programmers.

Originally posted by JediMacster
wow... slow rumor day :(

AAAnyway, the movie was my main tool during college to turn the tide of the Mac-haters. I remember screening the movie with some of my Windoze-lovin' friends. After the movie ended, they were all like: "Damn, Bill gates is a major ******!" or "So that's what happened!"

I felt like an evangelist, spreading the word of Steve; much like I still am today! :D

:eek: "Repent, ye Window sinners, be it 95 or 98, 2K to NT! The way of the Apple is at hand!!"
Click to expand...
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Xerox?

Hmmm... I seem to recall reading an interview of one of the engineers at PARC who was hired by Apple to design their first GUI. Along with many others of course. He said they took the concept and expanded on it, but he didn't bring with him a lick of code. It was all recreated from scratch, since recreating was pretty much better anyway.

So with that in mind, how did the programmers create something by mistake? I'd think this guy knew what was going on at PARC. Maybe the icons were just commands. But I wouldn't call it a mistake. I'd call it an idea.


I'll try to hunt down that interview. It was great.

Originally posted by painandgreed
IIRC...what the hell, it's a rumor...

Back in the day when Apple was up and coming and wasn't public yet, Xerox wanted to buy stock. Apple (Jobs, Woz, etc.) knew that Xerox PARC was where new and creative new things were being developed (because of some old employees who now worked for Apple told them so) so they made a tour of PARC as well as permission to use whatever they observed there part of the stock trade. What they saw was a GUI where icons represented commands. What they thought they saw was a GUI where icons represented the files on the computer and a way to navigate those files. Thus, the Mac GUI wasn't even really borrowed from Xerox, but was created by mistake. The other big idea they pulled out of PARC was the mouse which also made it into the Mac. The third big idea that was floating around PARC at the time was object oriented programing, which they didn't pick up on and incororate into the Mac.
Click to expand...
 
Xerox

I would imagine that a Mac user (even one from 1984) would have some learning to do in order to use Xerox's Smalltalk machines. The Lisa / Macintosh team did a lot of refining of behavior (3 button -> 1 button mouse will do that to you).
 
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