iPod touch 2nd Gen Ipod Touch and Iphone Memory

[ks-man]

It seems that on the various boards and rumor sites the general consensus is that the next versions of the Iphone will be 8GB and 16GB, and the next Ipod Touch will be 16GB and 32GB. It doesn't seem very logical for Apple to do this. I think that Apple would want them to be the same or else have the Iphone with larger storage.

I understand that the Iphone is more expensive to make, so having less storage keeps the price more reasonable, but they run the risk of losing potential Iphone customers to the IPT simply due to the increased storage availability. I think we all agree that Apple would prefer if a customer was going to choose one or the other, they'd rather the customer get the Iphone, if for no other reason than the AT&T kickback.

My guess is that Apple will offer 3 versions of the Iphone (8GB, 16GB and 32GB) and two versions of the IPT (16GB and 32GB). They can even price the 32GB Iphone higher than the standard increase to satisfy those who want the largest storage iphone regardless of price.

I also think that Apple should (though they probably won't) get the Iphone release schedule to coincide with the IPT and other Ipods.

Thoughts?

 

[Sussman]

My thought is that the 16GB flash drives were not ready to be mass produced to keep up with the iphone. The 8GB flash drive is easier/cheaper to manufacture so they put them in the iphones. There were less 16GB flash drives available so they put them in the ipod touch. I do believe the iPhone will see at least a bump up to 16GB sometime in 2008. As for 32GB, I'm thinking not. The average phone user does not need nearly that much memory. But I could be wrong.

 

[SXR]

I've heared alot of people complaining that the iPhone has very little memory. What? It has alot! 8 GB , thats alot. Most phones can go to 4 with SD Card and you dont hear people complaining there. Are they expecting Apple to put a HDD in the iPhone?

 

[ks-man]

My thought is that the 16GB flash drives were not ready to be mass produced to keep up with the iphone. The 8GB flash drive is easier/cheaper to manufacture so they put them in the iphones. There were less 16GB flash drives available so they put them in the ipod touch. I do believe the iPhone will see at least a bump up to 16GB sometime in 2008. As for 32GB, I'm thinking not. The average phone user does not need nearly that much memory. But I could be wrong.

Perhaps, but if they have some 32GB drives for the Ipod Touch (which no one is saying they will do), it seems that it would make more sense to split them between the IPT and the Iphone. Nowhere does it say that they can only raise the price $100 to go from 16 to 32. Also while the average phone user doesn't need 32GB, there is usually a market/bragging rights for creating a high end version. Why else do electronic companies make 110" plasmas for $250k and then limit production to 50-100 units worldwide?

I would think if they had any 32GB drives they would price them something like this:

Iphone
8GB $349
16GB $449
32GB $599-$699

IPT
8GB $299
16GB $349
32GB $499-$599

They could drop the 8GB Touch and lower the 16GB one to $299 (or perhaps offer the 8GB for $249) but they really don't need to. $299 is a good price of entry for the Touch interface and they could add a few other things (bluetooth, speaker etc.) to justify a second gen IPT. They limit the inventory on the 8GB version and end up selling a lot more 16GB units at a higher price.

The price of the 32GB units would of course depend on the cost of supply for a 32GB flash drive at the time of release. Perhaps they start off at the high end and get a price reduction in 6 months.

This is all speculation

 

[ks-man]

I also think offering more options with different sizes helps sales even in the top end models. Most people decide on purchasing an IPT or Iphone by determining the cost of entry (the lowest end model), and then end up purchasing a higher end model, "I can double my memory for only an extra $100."

If they leave out the lowest end model at the reduced price then some people will decide it isn't worth entering the market.

I think this year Apple dropped some low end models (4GB Iphone) b/c they wanted to keep the Iphone scarce (it wouldn't be as cool to see a friend with it if everybody had one). Otherwise why wouldn't they have offered the 4GB model for $299 or $349?

The business model probably plans for mass adoption in the next two to three years after they are more familiar with the cell phone business. This is what happened with the original Ipod.

 

[gloss]

I don't see 32GB players happening until late next year, honestly. And I expect Apple to keep the iPod touch and iPhone at storage parity starting this year.

 

[cwolves]

IPT
8GB $299
16GB $349
32GB $499-$599

yeah, um..no

$500 is the most that apple has EVER charged for an iPod and they havn't charged more than $400 since the 3rd gen.

The prices for the next touch will be exactly what the prices for this one are:

$300 and $400. Those are apple's prices - EVERY launch since the 4G iPod has had these prices.

 

[ks-man]

yeah, um..no

$500 is the most that apple has EVER charged for an iPod and they havn't charged more than $400 since the 3rd gen.

The prices for the next touch will be exactly what the prices for this one are:

$300 and $400. Those are apple's prices - EVERY launch since the 4G iPod has had these prices.

Then I doubt that we will see a 32GB Ipod Touch until earliest end of next year.

 

[cwolves]

Then I doubt that we will see a 32GB Ipod Touch until earliest end of next year.

you were expecting earlier? Apple makes disk size changes every 4 months when deemed necessary. This means that the soonest we would possibly see a 32GB touch will be Feb '08. Unfortunately 32GB flash won't be cheap enough by then...

A 32GB touch will be out at the end of '08, possibly the beginning of '09 depending on supply/prices. Apple won't release it until they can sell a 32GB touch for $400.

The "iPod Touch v2" will be out Sept-ish of '09.

It's what apple does. The only way this changes is if there's an unpredicted leap in flash space/price or if apple decides to sync the touch's disk sizes with the classic iPod. In that case apple releases 10/20/30/40GB iPod touch's (not all 4, I'm just not sure which ones), and the date changes because of it. A 40GB touch could probably be launched around march '09.

 

[Warbrain]

you were expecting earlier? Apple makes disk size changes every 4 months when deemed necessary. This means that the soonest we would possibly see a 32GB touch will be Feb '08. Unfortunately 32GB flash won't be cheap enough by then...

A 32GB touch will be out at the end of '08, possibly the beginning of '09 depending on supply/prices. Apple won't release it until they can sell a 32GB touch for $400.

The "iPod Touch v2" will be out Sept-ish of '09.

It's what apple does. The only way this changes is if there's an unpredicted leap in flash space/price or if apple decides to sync the touch's disk sizes with the classic iPod. In that case apple releases 10/20/30/40GB iPod touch's (not all 4, I'm just not sure which ones), and the date changes because of it. A 40GB touch could probably be launched around march '09.

I'm not completely sure if you're able to get flash memory in capacities of 10/20/30/40 as it is like RAM and needs to follow the standard.

 

[cwolves]

I'm not completely sure if you're able to get flash memory in capacities of 10/20/30/40 as it is like RAM and needs to follow the standard.

That's an arbitrary standard...there's no technical reason behind it. If apple were to ask a manufacturer to make 5 million 20GB chips it would happen.

 

[Warbrain]

That's an arbitrary standard...there's no technical reason behind it. If apple were to ask a manufacturer to make 5 million 20GB chips it would happen.

Every thing that I've found shows that this is the only way that NAND flash memory can be arranged. Could be different with a different type of flash memory.

 

[ks-man]

you were expecting earlier? Apple makes disk size changes every 4 months when deemed necessary. This means that the soonest we would possibly see a 32GB touch will be Feb '08. Unfortunately 32GB flash won't be cheap enough by then...

A 32GB touch will be out at the end of '08, possibly the beginning of '09 depending on supply/prices. Apple won't release it until they can sell a 32GB touch for $400.

The "iPod Touch v2" will be out Sept-ish of '09.

It's what apple does. The only way this changes is if there's an unpredicted leap in flash space/price or if apple decides to sync the touch's disk sizes with the classic iPod. In that case apple releases 10/20/30/40GB iPod touch's (not all 4, I'm just not sure which ones), and the date changes because of it. A 40GB touch could probably be launched around march '09.

I think I was expecting sooner. Since there are about 50 companies out there with Apple and the Iphone/Touch in their sights I think Apple needs to do enough to keep people in the Apple camp. The Apple brand is one powerful thing they have going for them and I think they need to ensure that other devices don't have far larger capacity for like devices.

Apple has always been able to charge a price premium to the other devices so that is why I'm expecting the memory increases to be soon but at steep prices. Apple needs to appease those that want the best device regardless of the price. As you say, in the past Apple has held off to releasing until they could release with prices in their preferred range, but the competition is getting much fiercer than in the past and may be something Apple can't ignore.

On Engadget there appears to be a new Iphone/Ipod look alike released with Touch screen every day.

 

[cwolves]

Every thing that I've found shows that this is the only way that NAND flash memory can be arranged. Could be different with a different type of flash memory.

Yeah, this is inaccurate. It's technically easier (or rather just as easy) to manufacture NAND/NOR memory in powers of 2 as it is to manufacture it in any range in between. In other words if you're going to make a 50GB chip you might as well make a 64GB chip for the same effort.

effort != price != marketing, however. It IS cheaper to manufacture a 50GB chip than it is to manufacture a 64GB chip, and from a marketing point of view (and since apple actually makes their own chips now) it may be better to say 40GB than it is to say 32GB.

I think I was expecting sooner. Since there are about 50 companies out there with Apple and the Iphone/Touch in their sights I think Apple needs to do enough to keep people in the Apple camp. The Apple brand is one powerful thing they have going for them and I think they need to ensure that other devices don't have far larger capacity for like devices.

When has apple EVER done anything in direct response to the market? Apple does things when they do them.

There is no pressure on the iPhone / iPod right now. iPod Touch > Zune > iPod Classic according to the majority opinion but even people that know this are 10x as likely to buy an iPod classic as they are to buy a Zune. There's a dozen phones out there that are better than the iPhone, but ask anyone what their "ideal" cell phone is and it's an iPhone or an N95/N8xx if they're technically savvy. Nothing else comes close, not even Treos. If you did a poll I'd bet on the iPhone hitting 70%, the Nxx and treo splitting 20% somehow and everything else taking the last 10%.

Technically speaking the iPhone is junk compared to the N95. But it's sleeker and has a MUCH higher public opinion.

Apple's public opinion right now is right up there with Google's. They've both made some mistakes recently but almost the entire world is behind both companies. Apple's not going to change their marketing strategy any time soon.