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Can the GeForce Drive two 30" at Full Rez?

B

Brent Turbo

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 24, 2002
69
0
Boston, MA
I believe the specs here are a tad bit misrepresented, since Apple has been unclear about their new display...

On order to support the full 2560 x 1600 resolution, the monitor must utilize BOTH ports in tandem on the nVidia 6800 card. It is possible to run two 30" displays off of one card, but they must both run at a lower resolution, as supported by DVI standards.

In short, you cannot have two 30" Apple displays running at 2560 x 1600 on the same computer. It's not a big deal, since almost no one could afford that configuration in the first place.
 
two Dual DVI connectors?!?

In fact, it comes with two Dual DVI connectors, allowing users to drive two 30" Apple Displays.
Click to expand...

Does this mean that it can support four smaller displays? Just imagine four 23 or 20" screens around you..... mmyessss.... haha.

If so, will we be able to run some games in a panoramic fashion? I guess it would get sluggish in higher settings with 3 monitors.
 
PismoGuy said:
Does this mean that it can support four smaller displays? Just imagine four 23 or 20" screens around you..... mmyessss.... haha.

If so, will we be able to run some games in a panoramic fashion? I guess it would get sluggish in higher settings with 3 monitors.
Click to expand...

That is a misquote. It comes with Dual DVI connectors. Not TWO Dual DVI connectors. There is no such thing as a dual DVI connector, but there is such thing as a hardware technology that links two DVI connectors together to support displays larger than the DVI standard can accomodate.
 
Brent Turbo said:
I believe the specs here are a tad bit misrepresented, since Apple has been unclear about their new display...

On order to support the full 2560 x 1600 resolution, the monitor must utilize BOTH ports in tandem on the nVidia 6800 card. It is possible to run two 30" displays off of one card, but they must both run at a lower resolution, as supported by DVI standards.

In short, you cannot have two 30" Apple displays running at 2560 x 1600 on the same computer. It's not a big deal, since almost no one could afford that configuration in the first place.
Click to expand...

Brent,

Maybe you could try reading before you speak. It has DUAL DUAL DVI interfaces. The monitor doesn't plug into 2 ports, Dual DVI is a DVI port with two DVI signals, using previously unused pins in the connector.

This graphics card has the equivilent of 4 DVI ports using the 2 Dual DVI Ports.

Therefore you can run two monitors at full resolution, Apple wouldn't pull a stunt like that and stand up in front of a crowd and say you can get 8.2 million pixels off that card if it wasn't true.
 
Brent Turbo said:
That is a misquote. It comes with Dual DVI connectors. Not TWO Dual DVI connectors. There is no such thing as a dual DVI connector, but there is such thing as a hardware technology that links two DVI connectors together to support displays larger than the DVI standard can accomodate.
Click to expand...


Again, wrong. Try reading apple's website.
 
Brent Turbo said:
I believe the specs here are a tad bit misrepresented, since Apple has been unclear about their new display...

On order to support the full 2560 x 1600 resolution, the monitor must utilize BOTH ports in tandem on the nVidia 6800 card. It is possible to run two 30" displays off of one card, but they must both run at a lower resolution, as supported by DVI standards.

In short, you cannot have two 30" Apple displays running at 2560 x 1600 on the same computer. It's not a big deal, since almost no one could afford that configuration in the first place.
Click to expand...


I dont' think this is right. The "old' DVI standard utilized half of the pins. The "new" DVI standard utilizes all of them. You ONLY use one DVI connector to fully power a 30" display.

You can power two 30" off the same card. One DVI port per display. (It would have been helpful to call the new connectors DVI2 or something.)
 
From Apple's website:

Dual Link DVI
The 30-inch Cinema HD Display requires the next level of DVI connectivity — “dual link” to drive the massive amount of pixels to the screen. And the NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL graphics card (available from the Apple Store) delivers, with the most advanced graphics engine available. This card, designed specifically to support the dual link DVI connection, delivers 2560 by 1600 resolution. Even better, it can drive two 30-inch Apple Cinema HD Displays, giving you the ultimate creative canvas. This card will be available for Mac only in August 2004.
 
Frixo Cool said:
Yup, it's DUAL DUAL and it does support 2 x 2560x1600.
Click to expand...

Hence why during the video he said not only is it Dual DVI, its Dual Dual DVI and the crowd gasped. :)
 
dguisinger said:
Brent,

Maybe you could try reading before you speak. It has DUAL DUAL DVI interfaces. The monitor doesn't plug into 2 ports, Dual DVI is a DVI port with two DVI signals, using previously unused pins in the connector.

This graphics card has the equivilent of 4 DVI ports using the 2 Dual DVI Ports.

Therefore you can run two monitors at full resolution, Apple wouldn't pull a stunt like that and stand up in front of a crowd and say you can get 8.2 million pixels off that card if it wasn't true.
Click to expand...

Sorry buddy, but that's not the case....

The technology known as "Dual Link DVI" supports resolutions up to 2048x1536. It requires both ports to drive a signal higher than that.

HEre's the DVI standard if you'd rather believe marketing:

http://www.ddwg.org/dvi.html

I'm not trying to poop in anyone's conflakes here, I just want to make sure nobody has any false hopes for these displays before they get a mortgage on their house.
 
dguisinger said:
Hence why during the video he said not only is it Dual DVI, its Dual Dual DVI and the crowd gasped. :)
Click to expand...
Maybe we should include the old term sheet... since this is getting confusion and calling it DVI2 would again be confusing when DVI 2.0 does show up. :confused:
Terms recognized by the DVI 1.0 Specification:

DVI-D Digital Only
DVI-I Digital and Analog
Dual Link Dual Link DVI supports 2x165 MHz (2048x1536 at 60 Hz, 1920x1080 at 85 Hz). A dual link implementation utilizes all 24 of the available pins.
Single Link Single Link DVI supports a maximum bandwidth of 165 MHz (1920x1080 at 60 Hz, 1280x1024 at 85Hz). A single link implementation utilizes 12 of the 24 available pins.
Click to expand...
 
Brent Turbo said:
Sorry buddy, but that's not the case....

The technology known as "Dual Link DVI" supports resolutions up to 2048x1536. It requires both ports to drive a signal higher than that.

HEre's the DVI standard if you'd rather believe marketing:

http://www.ddwg.org/dvi.html

I'm not trying to poop in anyone's conflakes here, I just want to make sure nobody has any false hopes for these displays before they get a mortgage on their house.
Click to expand...

OMG Dude, read the f*n website and watch the f*n presentation. Dual DVI Link is a single port. It is not standard DVI x 2!
 
dguisinger said:
From Apple's website:

Dual Link DVI
The 30-inch Cinema HD Display requires the next level of DVI connectivity — “dual link” to drive the massive amount of pixels to the screen. And the NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL graphics card (available from the Apple Store) delivers, with the most advanced graphics engine available. This card, designed specifically to support the dual link DVI connection, delivers 2560 by 1600 resolution. Even better, it can drive two 30-inch Apple Cinema HD Displays, giving you the ultimate creative canvas. This card will be available for Mac only in August 2004.
Click to expand...

Right. It CAN drive two 30" displays. It says NOWHERE that it can drive two displays at 2560 x 1600. Read it again. It's called marketing.
 
it isn't a question of "old" or "new" DVI connections...it's the same standard...a good portion of the full set of pins simply weren't being used by most DVI cards and monitors...

Workstation PC graphics cards like the Quadra series have been using the whole DVI bandwidth, though what is being called dual DVI is really two signals running on one connection. (the IBM T221 needs two "dual DVI" connections to go above 21hz at full resolution (which is an insanely high 3800x1600). To achieve 40hz, it needs all four DVI channels. And it has been around since early 2003, at least that's when I heard about it.

i must point out here, that it seems a bit misleading to quote THG's review of the PC 6800U, when we all know (or should) that the Mac version will likely be quite a bit different, in function AND in performance...other high-end Mac graphics cards available right now are down-clocked so that the current machines can handle the power requirements. down-clocking, obviously, leads to a slower card. How much slower is yet to be seen. My point is simply that we have no idea what speeds the core and memory will be running on this Mac version of the 6800U.

Just to clarify a couple of things, you CAN attach 2 30" screens to this card. You can't, though, expect identical (or, if the speeds are enough different, comparable) performance.

just running a desktop resolution of 2560x1600 is going to put a lot of stress on the card...add 3D effects processing to the burden, and even a Quadra3000 has a bit of trouble running the T221 and doing 3d at the same time...
 
dguisinger said:
OMG Dude, read the f*n website and watch the f*n presentation. Dual DVI Link is a single port. It is not standard DVI x 2!
Click to expand...

You're 100% correct! Dual Link DVI is ONE port. The video card in question has TWO dual link DVI ports. Each dual link DVI port can support a resolution UP TO 2048x1536. That is far below the advertised resolution of 2560 x 1600. In order to display that resolution on ONE 30" display, a cable must be plugged into BOTH dual link DVI ports. Plugging in two monitors requires a lower resolution on both displays.

Get it?
 
What's so difficult about this?

It is simple: the 30" display can be driven by ONE dual-link DVI port.

The nVidia 6800 Ultra card has TWO dual-link DVI ports.

From Apple's website: It is the first card available to support the DVI standard dual link digital signal specification from the two DVI ports it features.

Dual-link DVI supports 330 MHz of bandwidth. 2560x1600 at 60Hz uses 246 MHz. It easily fits on ONE Dual-link DVI connection!
 
Brent Turbo said:
Right. It CAN drive two 30" displays. It says NOWHERE that it can drive two displays at 2560 x 1600. Read it again. It's called marketing.
Click to expand...
Brent, you are DENSE.

Apple has come out and said DUAL DUAL DVI in the Keynote, watch it your freaking self. They say it on their website. We have posted the specs that say Dual DVI uses all the pins.

Now it is time for you to sit down and shut up. Stop spreading false truths.
 
chmilar said:
It is simple: the 30" display can be driven by ONE dual-link DVI port.

The nVidia 6800 Ultra card has TWO dual-link DVI ports.

From Apple's website: It is the first card available to support the DVI standard dual link digital signal specification from the two DVI ports it features.
Click to expand...

Again, you're totally right. It's fully possible to run the 30" display off of one port, but you will not be able to achieve the full 2560 by 1600 resolution.
 
Brent Turbo said:
Right. It CAN drive two 30" displays. It says NOWHERE that it can drive two displays at 2560 x 1600. Read it again. It's called marketing.
Click to expand...


The Mac GeForce 6800 has two dual link DVI ports. Each can drive a 30" screen at its native 2560x1600 resolution.

"The DVI standard specifies a single connector that handles two different digital signal bandwidths: single link and dual link. At 165MHz, the single-link bandwidth supports HDTV and UXGA (1600-by-1200-pixel resolution) display formats. The dual-link bandwidth (transmitted over a single cable) uses the same DVI connection, but it supports much higher resolutions, such as the 2560-by-1600-pixel res"


blakespot
 
dguisinger said:
Brent, you are DENSE.

Apple has come out and said DUAL DUAL DVI in the Keynote, watch it your freaking self. They say it on their website. We have posted the specs that say Dual DVI uses all the pins.

Now it is time for you to sit down and shut up. Stop spreading false truths.
Click to expand...

The problem is that you don't understand the terms. Yes, it is DUAL DUAL DVI. Meanint TWO x DUAL DVI

One DUAL DVI = maximum resolution of 2048x1536, so if you plug the monitor into ONE DUAL DVI port, then how do you expect to get a highed resolution than that out of one port?
 
blakespot said:
The Mac GeForce 6800 has two dual link DVI ports. Each can drive a 30" screen at its native 2560x1600 resolution.

"The DVI standard specifies a single connector that handles two different digital signal bandwidths: single link and dual link. At 165MHz, the single-link bandwidth supports HDTV and UXGA (1600-by-1200-pixel resolution) display formats. The dual-link bandwidth (transmitted over a single cable) uses the same DVI connection, but it supports much higher resolutions, such as the 2560-by-1600-pixel res"


blakespot
Click to expand...


I'd be interested in knowing where that came from, because that goes against the very Dual Link DVI standard itself. It could be possible if it were a floating standard and could be modified by Apple, but I didn't think that's how DVI worked.
 
Brent Turbo said:
You're 100% correct! Dual Link DVI is ONE port. The video card in question has TWO dual link DVI ports. Each dual link DVI port can support a resolution UP TO 2048x1536. That is far below the advertised resolution of 2560 x 1600. In order to display that resolution on ONE 30" display, a cable must be plugged into BOTH dual link DVI ports. Plugging in two monitors requires a lower resolution on both displays.

Get it?
Click to expand...

*LAUGHS*

Look at what you just said! You are saying a Dual DVI port can't drive the resolution on one monitor.
 
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