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933 or dual 1000?

V

video activist

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Feb 4, 2002
3
0
Bellingham
I'm a student filmmaker looking to buy my first Mac. I'll primarily be using the machine to run FCP and other DV editing software. I've got $3000 to spend. Which machine should I get? If i go for the 933 I could have $$ left over to buy things like a wide angle lens for my GL-1 and other things (flat panel display, RAM, drives, etc). If I go for the dual 1ghz I'll have a screeming machine that won't be out of date quite so quickly and will render video effects faster.

Which machine?

Another question: does the new video card in the G4s allow you to hook up two monitors without any extra hardware?

Ready to buy....
 
the video cards on ALL new g4s support dual monitors (one apple display w/ADC and one normal vga monitor)

i have an 867 instead of a dual 800 b/c os 10 makes fcp fast enough for me and it let me use money and max out the ram, add another hard drive and buy the beautiful 17 apple lcd--it's the BEST monitor i have ever owned

i also bought an ipod... you have no idea how useful this is as a student... i can listen to music on the way to school and take my files to and fro

i love apple

oh yeah read my sig and you'll see what happened to me
 
The dual 1GHz would be SOOOOO good but, realistically, wouldn't it be better, if you have no more than $3000, to get more RAM and more HD space... esp. if you want to do a lot of video editing. Those HDs sound HUGE but you know just as well as I do that once you start doing video work it looks tiny all of a sudden. Also, the 933 is MORE than capable of giving you nice speeds for FCP.

Lets think realistic not "man, I would LOVE one of those"
 
tough situation man, I feel your pain :D

If you have a set budget (for example, $3000 firm and nothing more for the next six months) I'd say go with the 933Mhz. Especially if what you want to do with the computer is more important than the computer itself. What I mean by that, is that some people get really excited by hardware, some people by what they can do with it, and some people about both. But if you don't need to have the latest and greatest, go with the 933.

Who wouldn't want the DP 1GHz? ;) But realistically, I think the 933 + extras is a much better way to go. 933 is nothing to laugh at, it's still blazingly fast!!
 
when your are a student, unless you are very rich, you have to make do with less than you usually want and, you might hate to hear this, the experience will give you the real education a college gives you that you will remember for a lifetime

in the real world, no matter what it is, you will need to implement projects with deadlines and often limited budgets

i will catch heck for this, especially since i am a techie and "i should know better", but get the 933...i wish i had a 933 and i could do a lot on it and just a few months ago, a 933 G4 was totally unheard of!
 
get the 933.... maybe load it up with a gig of ram. you'll be happier with that extra equipment, even if you have to deal with a slower computer. remember, that 933 is blazing fast anyway. you'd be spoiling yourself otherwise. i've learned to do my work on a G3 out of necessity, and i'm not complaining.
 
look at an 800 dual or 867. there should be a few still around at a good price.
use the extra $'s to max the ram and get a lot of storage (like a video array.....ACARD pci card and 2 x 80gb). the 800 dual can have 2 monitors hooked up. you might even have $'s for a lens.
 
If you're intent on raw processing speed, and it's between the 933 and dual1GHz, go with the dual. Definitely. More money but it will last longer.

Or, the ultimate advice: Wait for the G5. ;)
 
The truth... Listen to me

Get the Dualie. In the near future, most progrmas will have dual processing capabilities. It will also last longer, and comes with good hard drive space. OR. Get a teacher to buy you the best dulie, which ill drop the price to 3,000. 1.5GB RAM, 2x80, its loaded. Get a 17in diasplay from apple for 400 dolars more with discounts. Take my advice, you will be happy
 
my thoughts...

I say go for the 933...

u are a student still....u will have plenty of power from the 933, not to mention some saved money u can spend on something else....

I agree wholeheartedly with networkman as well...

when your are a student, unless you are very rich, you have to make do with less than you usually want and, you might hate to hear this, the experience will give you the real education a college gives you that you will remember for a lifetime
 
Eye...

What happens when FCP takes more advantage of dualies? I say get the EDU. discount, and get the dualie for 3,000 with the works. Spend an extra 40 dollars and get a 15in LCD. Or you can get the lower model dualie with a 17in LCD from apple. I wouln't get the 933 because the addons dont make the computer much faster. The processor is all that matters, and you cant buy a new one of those...;)
 
I'm looking at the "Higher Education Student" page and the "Fastest" is 2819 and the "Ultimate" is 3430. Where is this 3000 number from?

As for the original post, I went for the dual 1ghz because its a whole lot easier to add ram/hd/raid/dual monitors etc later than try to upgrade the cpu. I figure, get the dual now, and throughout the year upgrade stuff. IDE raid is probably next in a few months, then another 512mb (which would max it out) then another 17" lcd!
 
Re: Eye...

Originally posted by Mac_User
What happens when FCP takes more advantage of dualies? I say get the EDU. discount, and get the dualie for 3,000 with the works. Spend an extra 40 dollars and get a 15in LCD. Or you can get the lower model dualie with a 17in LCD from apple. I wouln't get the 933 because the addons dont make the computer much faster. The processor is all that matters, and you cant buy a new one of those...;)
Click to expand...

Man, that'd be a nice setup. BUT:

This guy's a student filmmaker. No need to get a full all out production unit. He'll be ready to replace it once he graduates and gets a paying job. Heck, he may not even have to because the job will provide the computer anyway. The 933 is more than fast enough, heck, we got an Avid last year that was only 533MHz or something like that. (And well, who knows if we'll be able to buy faster processors in the future. We have been before, but that market seems to have died recently...)

My recommendation: as a student, you wanna get the best value for your money. Getting the duallie gets you nothing but faster render times. Getting the wide angle lens for the camera means getting the shot vs. not getting the shot! So do you wanna save 20 minutes from the final render time and potentially not get the shot you wanted? The lens wins hands down. (Unless you already have access to a wide angle lens and just want one of your own.) One tip: spend the money on things that get you more creative control!

No need for a 17in LCD when it still limits your resolution to 1280x1024. Instead, get 2 good 19" CRTs and an extra video card for the computer. This gives you much more screen real estate for FCP and you'll want lots of real estate for FCP.

You'll also want hard drive space. How much space will depend on how long your films will be, how lazy you are in logging and archiving your tape stock and how many concurrent projects you're working on at one time. I'm not sure how many hard drives PowerMacs can fit inside the case but go ahead and add one extra. If need be, you can even setup a RAID via the Disk Tools in OS X (if you'll be using OS X.)

Final spec:
933MHz G4 Tower (you may still be able to get an 867MHz tower, the speed difference is negligible but the L3 cache in the 933 could make a difference)
2 60-80 GB drives (possibly external FireWire if need be)
2 19" CRTs
1 Extra video card to drive second CRT
1 GB ram

This may run you close to a Dual 1GHz but you'll be better off with the extra screen real estate and hard drive space. Maybe even get some studio monitors for good audio if you've got a few bucks left. Get yourself a miniDV deck instead of using the GL1 for a deck. Or, if you've got access to decks at the school's studio, get a FireWire hard drive so you can capture to the drive at the studio and bring the footage back to your home/dorm/bedroom and work on it there. There's just so many more useful things than spending the extra money on something to save a few minutes!
 
Originally posted by balliet
I'm looking at the "Higher Education Student" page and the "Fastest" is 2819 and the "Ultimate" is 3430. Where is this 3000 number from?

Well, If you buy it through a dept. at school, cut the ram down to 1 gig, take the ATI card instead of the Nvidia and take off the modem you end up with $2988. It's not $3000 but it's pretty close.
Click to expand...
 
Get the dual, it will make your life more pleasurable. Spend less and be less happy, or spend more and be more happy:)

I got the dualie gig-er baby and I love it :)
 
id definitely saw use the education discount and get the dual 1ghz. $2698 for a dual g4 is amazing. so just go for the 512mb ram and fill it out yourself later at non apple prices. mac_user knows what he is talking about, dont listen to these other people they just like telling people to get slower machine because they like feeling superior. "oh your just a student, well you couldnt possible need the same system i a PRO user needs. silly boy run along now and buy an used machine or an imac."
 
Lemon

Thanks for supporting me Lemon. I believe that he can get his minor upgrades later on. Spend the few extra dollars and get something nice that you can say "wow" to. Remember this...you cant upgrade the processor once you buy the machine. I would get the NICE machine with not all the goodies, and wait a few months and get those goodies. Trust me on this one, you will be happy if you dont get the dualie...;)

I bought a G4 733 instead of the 800 for the same reason. I realized speed is better than the extra cash for the little add-ons. I have seen the rendering times on a dual compared to a single, and trust me, you can tell the difference.
 
cmoney is right.

When working with FCP, RAM and screen real estate are the most important things to be able to work efficiently. If you are comfortable installing it, or know someone who is, minimize the RAM from Apple and get third party to max out the system - much cheaper and guaranteed.

When you're in school, it is usually difficult to move projects around between your gear and the school's studio. So check out using a firewire portable unless you have high speed LAN between you and the studio equipment.

If you are running, FCP3 on OS X, you can render real time with an 867. So use the $ left in your budget to get the fastest CPU you can afford.
 
4 letters: DUAL

I agree with Lemon and Classic. Go with the dual and steer clear of the "bargain" priced dual 800's. there is such a difference between the two chips that the money you "save" just doesnt make any sense. I don't know about you other FCP users but when i work in FCP I'm usually working in severl other programs as well at the same time ( Cinema, Commotion) and in this case the dual processor shines through the murk of doubt. All 3 apps i mentioned are out for osx and all 3 take advantage of the dual processors better than most. You can always add another monitor later but you can't say "hey apple I'm ready for an upgrade. How about swaping my 933 for that sweet dual board, eh?" If it were my money i would buy the dual with the ati card (better card by the way, i forget where the tests are but they are there) and buy educational for about 2700. add on a refurb 15 inch display and hook up your existing monitor (im assuming you already have a computer) when you need it. And considering you are only shooting dv the stock harddrive should hold you over for a while.
Bottom line: buy what can't be upgraded now and add on later.
 
OK... now where's the best RAM source?

Thanks for all the feedback and opinions. I'm looking now at the following DUAL machine:
ATI video card
speakers
zip drive
512 Ram
80 G HD
educational discount for individuals = $2,873

The 80 gig drive will satiate me for a few projects but I'd love more RAM and affordable screen real estate (I have a 17" ViewSonic GT775).
What's the best source for RAM?

Or then again... The 933 machine (w/ ATI, speakers, zip) = $2,215. I could tack on a 17" Apple Display with the $300 rebate is the same price at $2,874

I'm torn.

How much will 3rd party RAM run me? This newbie needs recomendations.

Oh, and how is the Mitsubishi Diamond Plus 73 (17" CRT)? Is it ADC or VGA? Is it worth $250?

So many questions...
 
i too have been looking for ram but im not sure ive found the best prices yet. so far transintl has the best price. they are quoting a price of $119 for a 512mb chip sdram @ 133mhz (3-3-3) or $149 for a 512mb chip sdram @ 133mhz (2-2-2). ive purchased from this vendor before and found them to be good. and after a stupid tech fried my hard drive that i bought from transintl they replaced it for free (i didnt even have to pay for shipping) no questions asked. they even let me remove the controller card from the new hard drive place it on the old one to recover my data without voiding the warranty.

if anyone can find a ram vendor with better prices than transintl then i would be very interested. ive been reluctant to buy since ram prices increased. i keep hoping they will go back down but i kinda doubt they will go back to the old prices any time soon.
 
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