Any chance 10.5 will come before.. Vista?

[generik]

I just thought it'd be quite timely to pick up a mac then! With new intel(tm) processors and the new 10.5, it will be double the steal.

 

[jimthorn]

With 10.5 on target for late 2006/early 2007, I would expect it to hit before Vista. Microsoft is always running behind. But we really won't know anything until WWDC in a few months.

 

[angelneo]

I hardly think they would be able to come up with 10.5 before vista, unless Microsoft delay Vista release again which most probably will incur the wrath of every windows nerd.

 

[redAPPLE]

I hardly think they would be able to come up with 10.5 before vista, unless Microsoft delay Vista release again which most probably will incur the wrath of every windows nerd.

which by the way, would be a sight to see.

 

[Sogo]

I don't think 10.5 will come out before vista, on account that Microsoft wants to have a finnished product in August. But delays can happen, and maybe push it back a few more months. I'm willing to get 10.5 in about march ish of 2007, just to give Tiger some life and to give Apple time to get off a good product.

 

[OldCorpse]

I don't think 10.5 will come out before vista, on account that Microsoft wants to have a finnished product in August. But delays can happen, and maybe push it back a few more months. I'm willing to get 10.5 in about march ish of 2007, just to give Tiger some life and to give Apple time to get off a good product.

Yes. Also:

1)10.3 - achieved rough parity with XP
2)10.4 - was a leap ahead of XP
3)Vista - will catch up with 10.4 and even pull slightly ahead
4)Therefore, 10.5 has to again leap Vista

In order to leap Vista, Apple has to see what Vista finallly settles on - not an easy guess as features are constantly being pulled and put in (mostly pulled). So, it is best for Apple to see the finished product before getting out their next product to leap Vista. Let us remember, XP has been around for a long time, and Apple could examine it at leisure, and bombard it with 10.1, 10.2, 10.3. and 10.4. Right now, 10.5 is working in semi-darkness, as Vista is only beta. Once they see what they're dealing with in Vista, they can really make sure 10.5 really leaps ahead of Vista. And btw., let no one tell you that Vista is only catching up with Tiger... in some areas, like f.ex. the Vista answer to Spotlight, will be vastly superior to Spotlight (there was a very interesting article about that a few months ago on Anandtech). So, 10.5 has it's work cut out for it to leap Vista... definitely doable, but nonethless, it'll take time from the moment when Vista ships and Apple gets to a) take a good look at it and b) Apple takes the time to devise an answer. Bottom line, I can't imagine that 10.5 would come out before Vista ships. Plus, MS has delayed Vista to the limit - this time they have to stick to the deadline they gave everyone. Finally, Steve did peg 10.5 as end of 06 beginning of 07. Since Vista *must* ship in 06, that leaves 10.5 a few months wiggle room... so I agree, marchish 07 would be good... besides, you don't want Apple to rush 10.5 the way they rushed Tiger... Tiger has only been usable since about 10.4.3, before that it was frankly speaking beta quality.

 

[Chaszmyr]

I highly doubt 10.5 will come out in 2006, but I'm pretty sure Vista will. Apple will probably not even mention 10.5 until WWDC in late June, and it could still be a year away by that point. Microsoft, on the other hand, seems dead set to get Vista out in 2006, even if they have to drop 90% of the features to do it.

 

[daveL]

S.F. Next January (Ship date announced)

With maybe a beta to developers at WWDC. And I think Apple could care less about Vista. They certainly aren't going to drag their feet on 10.5 waiting to see what Vista looks like when it ships; that's nonsense. The 10.5 feature set will be cast in stone by the time Vista ships in the fall. Except for MS fanboys and new PC buyers, who won't have a choice, I don't think you'll see much uptake for Vista, especially corporations.

 

[shadowmoses]

I doubt we will see 10.5 until mid 2007, whereas Vista will come out this year for sure..Hopefully 10.5 will be a giant leap ahead of Vista which probably wont get updated for 5 years....

ShadoW

 

[Morn]

I heard that microsoft is determined to stick the release date, whether it's ready for release or not. In other words they might pull a 10.0

 

[Damien]

10.5 will be released around vista time. Likely at the paris expo with the annocment at WWDC for a event before. It will coincide with the last of the new intel computers. iBook and mac mini

 

[Blue Velvet]

Vista has no bearing on my Mac purchases at all — it is completely irrelevant.

The only thing about Vista that interests me is its uptake in the corporate world which is where I have to use Windows. And since my workplace is still plugging away on Win & Office2000, it'll probably be about 2010 before we see it rolled out across our network and by then, I'll probably be elsewhere.

 

[dops7107]

Out of curiosity... why should OS X follow the 10.x theme at all? It can't do so indefinitely. Where's OS XI? I wouldn't be surprised if Apple chucks the 10.x line once the Intel transition is complete, and a new generation of OS comes out (even if, effectively, it is just an iteration of OS X - they might as well cal it something different).

 

[mac-er]

If 10.5 follows in the footsteps of 10.4, it won't be out until Spring 2007. Steve isn't introducing it to developers until June 2006.

Logistically, it would be very difficult, if not impossible, at this point to get it out by the time Vista comes out.

No matter because this version of Windows is the most blatant copy of Mac OS since Windows 3.0....

Some things that I believe are blatant copies:
*Changing name of Outlook Express to Windows Mail (MS is trying to get more people to use the free mail thing).
*Including a calendar application
*Search
*Changing the Start button to a 'graphic' of the Windows logo (ie the Apple menu)
*Sidebar (lame attempt at Dashboard)
*new iPhoto-type application

 

[Morn]

Hasn't steve gone on and on about Leopard being out around the same time as vista? He said that at wwdc 05 I think. Spring 07 to me seems to be a lot later than that, and I don't think he meant he'd be demoing it around the time windows vista is launched.

 

[Sogo]

Hasn't steve gone on and on about Leopard being out around the same time as vista? He said that at wwdc 05 I think. Spring 07 to me seems to be a lot later than that, and I don't think he meant he'd be demoing it around the time windows vista is launched.

Well the issue is comming out before Vista, which at the momment is shecualed to be finnished by august. 10.5 may, MAY, come out in november or something but I doubt it. MWSF 2007 at the earliest; but thats just me. He did say that, but thats also when vista was schedualed for the 4Q of 2006. Vista has been pused into the 3Q of 2006. Now, these are the manufacturing copies of vista. Vista may not be up for sale untill sept or oct of 2006.

 

[jimthorn]

Out of curiosity... why should OS X follow the 10.x theme at all? It can't do so indefinitely. Where's OS XI? I wouldn't be surprised if Apple chucks the 10.x line once the Intel transition is complete, and a new generation of OS comes out (even if, effectively, it is just an iteration of OS X - they might as well cal it something different).

The term "Mac OS X" is Apple's name for their next generation OS that replaced the original Mac OS. The X is both a romal numeral for 10 and the "X" of NeXT, which is where the new OS was originally developed. So 10.4 is really Mac OS X version 4, not a point release of Mac OS X 10. And because of the quirky name, there will almost certainly never be an OS XI or OS 11.

 

[matd]

I think the first demos of 10.5 could be shown in Paris 2006 (remember, Tiger was presented almost a year before). Vista will be probably be out in October 2006 I bet ( like XP was in Oct. 2001) to prepare the "christmas" market.
But the answer to Vista IS Tiger . Having seen some Vista screenshots, I can't say that this OS is "beautiful". To my eyes it looks like a XP with a huge WindowsBlinds skins. It's dark, a touch of "let us inspirate from the Mac OS, and put some transparency"....

Look at this picture! It's horrible. Where is the usuability ? How do you recognize your documents in this kind of window?

Transparency and reflections are everywhere giving this kinda grotesque " should be like MacOs" feeling....

Windows Aero > Gosh that's very important to have a beautifull, transparent "close cross-button"
Live taskbar thumbnails > Your mac has it ( just put a quicktime movie in the dock, it will continue to play)
Windows Flip and Windows Flip 3D > Switch to another user, you'll get it too
Start search > Spotlight

I'm a PC and Mac user but for me the launch of Vista won't be an event and be sure MacOs is far much better than this new Windows.

 

[Sogo]

well, the icons are not set yet. If those end up being the final icon set, then you are correct in every way.

 

[beatle888]

thats the geekiest UI ive ever seen. look at the bottom green field. it shows a folder (on its side ) thats empty but the text says it contains seven items. call me stupid but wouldnt you display a folder icon thats drawn to look like it has some documents in it if in fact it did contain documents? why would you show an empty folder and display text that says it contains something? not intuitive at all.
also if that bottom green field is suppose to show you basic info of the folder your in, why doesnt it tell you the name of the folder? it shows an area for the size and location as well as the number of items in the folder but it doesnt tell you the name of the folder?

basically the UI has the sophistication of a fifteen year old.

 

[Marky_Mark]

I use a PC every day at work and I'm used to both various flavours of Windows and Mac OS's. I've never found XP's look to be an issue, but the screenshot up there is just nasty. It looks clunky - a real hodge-podge - I never liked the blue and green skins on XP either and I'm sure you'll be able to change this one, but even M$ should be able to do better than this - it's really asthetically offensive.

EDIT: By the way, looking at it again, it's pretty much the same as past versions of Windows isn't it? - Start button, system tray, program bar, clock etc etc - you would've thought after all this time, they might have come up with at least something as radical as the switch from Win3.1 to 95, when all this upside down Mac rubbish started. I'm not impressed at all, and if I was a committed Winfan I'd be totally gutted - what a letdown.

 

[Marky_Mark]

look at the bottom green field. it shows a folder (on its side ) thats empty but the text says it contains seven items.

Maybe the docs fell out of the upturned folder but you need to hit F5 before Windows notices!!

 

[Morn]

The important thing is that Vista has bascially the same feature list as tiger, and many windows users are going to be like, well why get os x then?

 

[ksgant]

The important thing is that Vista has basically the same feature list as tiger, and many windows users are going to be like, well why get os x then?

There are a couple of reasons, Vista will still have the same bugs/holes/problems as XP and every other Windows release in the past. Just having a "feature" doesn't equal usability. Apple may have a pretty face that everyone wants to copy, but underneath the pretty face is a well thought out UI. Viruses, spyware, security problems won't magically fade away with Vista either.

And though it won't really impress the average person, OSX is built on an OS that's very mature and proven and secure.

But who knows what's going to be actually IN Vista. MS keeps throwing things out here and there so they can actually ship the damn thing...pretty soon Vista will just be XP with a new UI theme and that's it! lol

 

[Daveway]

I don't see Apple releasing Leopard at the same time as Vista. From a marketing stand point, its stupid. Vista is the latest MS release in years and news of it is going to flood the newswire, good and bad. Releasing Leopard at this time is not good because the news of both OSs would be diluted instead of Leopard getting its own spotlight (no pun).

Unless Apple has a special developer event before June, Leopard will not be released before Vista. Leopard will have to have a much larger feature set than Tiger and all that takes time to develop. And with more features comes more time needed for developers.