Any chance that a new Apple TV will run games in 4K?

[TJ82]

I'm wondering what sort of hardware would be needed to run a game in 4K, must be quite a bit more powerful than simply playing back a 4K video. And then wondering if it's feasible that Apple would have one in a possible release this September.

Reason I'm asking is because I need a new Apple TV to run Zwift. I've had a 4K ATV before running Zwift on a 4K TV and it just runs it at 1080p. Looks fine, but I'd love to run it in more detail.

Should I just get the current 4K TV and stop hoping that maybe we'll get a decent processor in a new one which may not even come out?

 

[JaguarGod]

I will reply here with a caveat.... I do not have any experience with Zwift so you can also just ignore this post if you like.

But, I game exclusively on my Apple TV 4K and while I have had a few mixed outcomes (very rare in my experience) while playing on my 4K monitor with upscaling and some odd bugs, I can say that the games I have played such as Afterpulse, Shadowgun Legends, Real Racing 3, GearClub, F1 2016, Gods of Rome, Alliance Air War, etc. all upscale to 4K on my monitor when I play and even games such as Rush Rally 3 have 4K res modes when using a 4K TV. They look and run fantastic for the most part in my opinion and the 'crispness' of the video is noticeable.

I noticed that Alliance Air War and SGL have a bit of slowdown and I am forced to turn down some graphic features and Real Racing 3 has an issue where the UI elements shrink while in 4K, but for the most part, a fine experience.

Anyone else have any experience here?

 

[Menel]

I'm wondering what sort of hardware would be needed to run a game in 4K, must be quite a bit more powerful than simply playing back a 4K video. And then wondering if it's feasible that Apple would have one in a possible release this September.

Reason I'm asking is because I need a new Apple TV to run Zwift. I've had a 4K ATV before running Zwift on a 4K TV and it just runs it at 1080p. Looks fine, but I'd love to run it in more detail.

Should I just get the current 4K TV and stop hoping that maybe we'll get a decent processor in a new one which may not even come out?

neh, The A10 based cpu in the AppleTV 4K is end of life. With new streaming service, they hope to keep selling the set top boxes, but they don't want to keep making the old circa 2017 A10 CPU that no other product uses. Economy of scale. Heck, they might have even shut down production on the A10 and are projected to run out of stock so need to transition.

They are most likely just refreshing it as a cost savings, logistical reasons.

 

[JaguarGod]

I am a bit curious about the rumored announcement next week and I hope that it comes to fruition as I would love to see the Apple TV upgraded. Fits the cycle also. But I only use it for gaming really and upgrades can be giant when it comes to gaming on the device. The A10X in the current ATV4K was a great upgrade for gaming on the device from the previous processor in my opinion and is immediately noticeable in games like Morphite, Shadowgun Legends and many more.

@Menel
That sounds right. It would make sense to upgrade based on their current fabrication/production with current hardware. I am just curious as to your thoughts on whether a new Apple TV 4K would keep the same design as the current model. Thanks.

 

[NightStorm]

I'm wondering what sort of hardware would be needed to run a game in 4K, must be quite a bit more powerful than simply playing back a 4K video. And then wondering if it's feasible that Apple would have one in a possible release this September.

Reason I'm asking is because I need a new Apple TV to run Zwift. I've had a 4K ATV before running Zwift on a 4K TV and it just runs it at 1080p. Looks fine, but I'd love to run it in more detail.

Should I just get the current 4K TV and stop hoping that maybe we'll get a decent processor in a new one which may not even come out?

I’m not sure if the 1080p limitation isn’t just a dev issue at Zwift... they essentially just ported the iOS app “as is” to the AppleTV. While it works fine, I really wish they would spend a little bit more time refining it for the device (especially since I think there are a lot of Zwift users who use the AppleTV).

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

I’m not sure if the 1080p limitation isn’t just a dev issue at Zwift... they essentially just ported the iOS app “as is” to the AppleTV. While it works fine, I really wish they would spend a little bit more time refining it for the device (especially since I think there are a lot of Zwift users who use the AppleTV).

It might be worth getting in touch with Swift and asking them. Chances are that they would appreciate your feedback as a user and may consider your suggestions.

 

[cateye]

neh, The A10 based cpu in the AppleTV 4K is end of life. With new streaming service, they hope to keep selling the set top boxes, but they don't want to keep making the old circa 2017 A10 CPU that no other product uses.

The A10 is used in the just-announced 2019 10.2" iPad, and the previous 2018 iPad, and was used in the iPhone 7/7+ which was on sale until just a week ago. Apple has no choice but to support it. Yes, the AppleTV uses the A10X, which is a variant, but architecturally very similar to the A10.

And remember the HomePod is still on the A8; Apple could easily transition it to the A10 in order to consolidate processor lines.

A10 and its variants aren't going anywhere, nor do they need to.

 

[Macalicious2011]

Support for 4k Youtube would be a more meaningful improvement than a more powerful CPU.

Other than that, always on Siri would be excellent..........if Apple also improved Siri because it's embarassingly behind Google Assistant in understanding what people say or mean.

 

[Menel]

The A10 is used in the just-announced 2019 10.2" iPad, and the previous 2018 iPad, and was used in the iPhone 7/7+ which was on sale until just a week ago. Apple has no choice but to support it. Yes, the AppleTV uses the A10X, which is a variant, but architecturally very similar to the A10.

And remember the HomePod is still on the A8; Apple could easily transition it to the A10 in order to consolidate processor lines.

A10 and its variants aren't going anywhere, nor do they need to.

Yea, I was quite shocked they are keeping that old cpu around for the new ipad7. *shrug*
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Support for 4k Youtube would be a more meaningful improvement than a more powerful CPU.

Other than that, always on Siri would be excellent..........if Apple also improved Siri because it's embarassingly behind Google Assistant in understanding what people say or mean.

Costs silicone to add the VP9 codec that Google uses. It's not widely used... except for YouTube.

Apple joined the Open Media Alliance a year or so back, and are joining forced with Google and others for AV1 that outperforms VP9 by large margins. But surprisingly... no mention of it for the A13.

edit: watch for AV1 support in next year's super iPhone update. Gonna be a big year for iphone in 2020. New ID, 5G support, maybe new video codecs, touch ID in screen, etc etc.

"fixed-function hardware will take 12–18 months after bitstream freeze until chips are available, plus 6 months for products based on those chips to hit the market.[46] The bitstream was finally frozen on 28 March 2018, meaning chips could be available sometime between March and August 2019"
Probably too tight to qualify and bake into the SOC.

 

[gnomeisland]

neh, The A10 based cpu in the AppleTV 4K is end of life. With new streaming service, they hope to keep selling the set top boxes, but they don't want to keep making the old circa 2017 A10 CPU that no other product uses. Economy of scale. Heck, they might have even shut down production on the A10 and are projected to run out of stock so need to transition.

They are most likely just refreshing it as a cost savings, logistical reasons.

I think Apple is biding their time to see where Apple Arcade goes. They seems pretty committed to 4k and HDR as selling points but the current Apple TV hardware, while excellent IMO, is very niche. I think their quickness to put AppleTV+/AirPlay on almost any competing hardware that's interested speaks volumes about their non-rush to update the hardware.

IF Apple Arcade takes off then I could see a big upgrade coming that will focus on competing in console space (like that hoped would happen naturally after they dominated the mobile space). However, for that to happen, they need a GPU that can really push out 4K/HDR graphics. I believe they've got the foundation but even the current A13 doesn't come close to fast enough.