Anybody going for laptops with Panther Lake?

[hajime]

Hi, I heard that the 2026 generation with Panther Lake is quieter than the previous generations. If they are dead silent and available within the next two weeks, I may perhaps just forget about buying a new MacBook Pro. The waiting is just too long.

I checked the DELL website. XPS with the latest processors will be delivered in April. Why so late?

 

[maflynn]

I checked the DELL website. XPS with the latest processors will be delivered in April. Why so late?

I went to dell.com and I didn't see an April delivery date, I didn't look too in-depth. What I did see is them forcing a office 365 and MacAfee subscription on me - not really liking that.

If they are dead silent

No one truly knows until companies start shipping Panther Lake laptops

 

[pshufd]

Why so late?

The only conclusion I can come to with Intel being so coy is poor 18A yields.

From what I've seen, Panther Lake may be a really great chip.

If they can make enough of them. We don't really know when they can supply enough to the OEMs and I don't know if Intel knows either.

 

[maflynn]

From what I've seen, Panther Lake may be a really great chip.

I like what Dave2D had to say ( I shared this in the flop/flop thread) but its appropriate and on topic here.

The intel hardware is great but its being saddled by an OS that is increasingly alienating its user base. While I really like what Panther Lake offers in terms of features, performance, and power consumption, its hard to justify buying one with the state of windows.

 

[pshufd]

I like what Dave2D had to say ( I shared this in the flop/flop thread) but its appropriate and on topic here.

The intel hardware is great but its being saddled by an OS that is increasingly alienating its user base. While I really like what Panther Lake offers in terms of features, performance, and power consumption, its hard to justify buying one with the state of windows.

I've not had any issues with Windows 11 that I couldn't fix, often with help from this board. And I move from Windows to macOS mostly seamlessly.

What's important is common programs or interfaces and that things don't break. And they haven't.

It's possible that Lenovo Vantage and Intel's updaters are doing a really good job. I've seen a lot of complaints about Realtek and other components but Lunar Lake is mostly Intel and they've done a fantastic job on drivers. I don't know if it's the particular model I have or it's the hardware but it's a Mac-like experience.

I run into lots of other Lenovo users that have all kinds of hardware, driver and Windows problems.

I'm also on Sequoia as I've seen problem reports on two of the programs I use and I'd want those fixed before upgrading.

 

[maflynn]

I've not had any issues with Windows 11 that I couldn't fix, often with help from this board. And I move from Windows to macOS mostly seamlessly.

My issues fall into two camps
MS' poor update history, as mentioned in the windows 11 thread where patch tuesday can and often causes more issues then it solves. This latest go around is an example of how the quality of updates has decreased.

Second issue, is the direction of Windows, with more of my data being harvested, decryption keys being stored online and MS handing them over to the authorities when asked. Advertisements, Recall, copilot being added everywhere to a degree where it degrades my overall experience and enjoyment.

macos isn't perfect and they may be following in Ms' footsteps with AI, but for now I much prefer the trajectory and user experience with macos.

 

[hajime]

I like what Dave2D had to say ( I shared this in the flop/flop thread) but its appropriate and on topic here.

The intel hardware is great but its being saddled by an OS that is increasingly alienating its user base. While I really like what Panther Lake offers in terms of features, performance, and power consumption, its hard to justify buying one with the state of windows.

Thanks for the video. Dave2D is a great guy. Few days ago that Co-Pilot thing showed up all the time. I uninstalled it and never gets bothered by it again. Don't know if there are stuffs going on behind my back in the OS though.

If I buy a Panther Lake laptop, I would make it dual boot to run Liunx and Windows. After using Windows PC as the main machine for almost 10 years, I found that it has improved a lot. However, there are certain things that are easier and perhaps more secure to do on the Mac.

I checked Dell's website. XPS with Panther Lake will be delivered mid or end of April. So long wait. By that time, M5 Pro Macbook Pro might have released and the redesign could be just few months away.

Although the M5 is still faster than Panther Lake, I wonder if running Windows apps natively on Panther Lake is still faster than running them on M5 Mac via Parallels. Any idea?

 

[pshufd]

My issues fall into two camps
MS' poor update history, as mentioned in the windows 11 thread where patch tuesday can and often causes more issues then it solves. This latest go around is an example of how the quality of updates has decreased.

Second issue, is the direction of Windows, with more of my data being harvested, decryption keys being stored online and MS handing them over to the authorities when asked. Advertisements, Recall, copilot being added everywhere to a degree where it degrades my overall experience and enjoyment.

macos isn't perfect and they may be following in Ms' footsteps with AI, but for now I much prefer the trajectory and user experience with macos.

You can delay updates for up to five weeks now which I discovered when looking into the reported bad update related to Outlook and nVidia GPUs. I'm fine setting them to the default setting.

I think that everyone has these issues. It was a change in software engineering QA philosophy back around 2015-2017 by management and it affected us at Oracle too. Every vulnerability in Windows gets reported widely because so many people use it and it's a popular target for attack. But macOS has arrived there too.

Recall wasn't turned on by default and I think that you had to turn it on. It's one of the things that I checked. It was widely reported and so users could educate if they wanted to.

Harvesting data is an issue but there's a lot of that that you can't prevent. Oracle had a division which vacuumed up your credit card transactions and made the data available for sale. Stuff that I want private is on a macOS desktop and encrypted. Or on Linux. Or on an airgapped system.

You can always run macOS on a Windows PC, at least for another year or two. The idea of a 2 pound 14 inch laptop is attractive to me for now.

 

[pshufd]

Although the M5 is still faster than Panther Lake, I wonder if running Windows apps natively on Panther Lake is still faster than running them on M5 Mac via Parallels. Any idea?

I asked someone to run Active Trader Pro on an M4 Mac and it was 10% slower than my i7-10700 desktop from 2020. M5 would probably put the performance as equal. Panther Lake is a lot faster than my i7-10700 system. It's not only that the program runs better on x86, but it runs more efficiently as running it hits battery life pretty hard on my M1 Pro MacBook Pro.

It depends on the program though. ATP runs through WINE and Rosetta 2. I've tried running it in a Windows ARM virtual machine but there's UI lag which is undesirable for trading. You are also running two operating systems on the same machine and there's CPU and RAM overhead for that. But it ultimately depends on the particular characteristics of your program.

In general, I'm a fan of running experiments for testing. For me, that means either asking someone that has the hardware to run a test for me or buying a system to test out and returning it. I've actually never done that as I don't like inflicting the return cost on the retailer. One other option would be to test it in the store but that's not something I ever do as it's unsecure access to financial accounts which I don't do. If it were another program where I can run an easy testcase, sure.

 

[hajime]

Another problem running Windows on Parallels is that it is recommended to add more RAM and to assign I think more than 16GB, we need to pay for the subscription for the Pro version.

 

[hajime]

You can delay updates for up to five weeks now which I discovered when looking into the reported bad update related to Outlook and nVidia GPUs. I'm fine setting them to the default setting.

I think that everyone has these issues. It was a change in software engineering QA philosophy back around 2015-2017 by management and it affected us at Oracle too. Every vulnerability in Windows gets reported widely because so many people use it and it's a popular target for attack. But macOS has arrived there too.

Recall wasn't turned on by default and I think that you had to turn it on. It's one of the things that I checked. It was widely reported and so users could educate if they wanted to.

Harvesting data is an issue but there's a lot of that that you can't prevent. Oracle had a division which vacuumed up your credit card transactions and made the data available for sale. Stuff that I want private is on a macOS desktop and encrypted. Or on Linux. Or on an airgapped system.

You can always run macOS on a Windows PC, at least for another year or two. The idea of a 2 pound 14 inch laptop is attractive to me for now.

Apple is going to release a cheap MacBook to increase the number of users which in turns increases hackers’ interest on attacking Mac.

 

[maflynn]

Apple is going to release a cheap MacBook to increase the number of users which in turns increases hackers’ interest on attacking Mac.

Even if that were true, macOS would still be more secure then windows.

 

[pshufd]

Another problem running Windows on Parallels is that it is recommended to add more RAM and to assign I think more than 16GB, we need to pay for the subscription for the Pro version.

It depends on what you are doing.

If you just need a small conversion program for small documents, or a program to decompress files, then 4 GB of RAM might work. If you're doing moderate stuff, then 8 GB may be fine. Some thing require more RAM of course. I generally size at 8 GB which works for me. Running the VM has additional RAM overhead, sometimes by as much as 2 GB.

 

[pshufd]

Apple is going to release a cheap MacBook to increase the number of users which in turns increases hackers’ interest on attacking Mac.

The number of devices is definitely a factor though I think that the number of attacks on iOS are probably through the roof because there are so many of them out there. I received a notification for an update to my iPhone 7 + this past week. The security fix must be pretty important to update a phone that is ten years ago.

I either have an iPhone 6 or 6S in a drawer and Apple just released a security update for that phone.

Safari seems to get regular security updates too. I use Firefox as primary on PCs and Brave as secondary. On iOS and iPadOS, I use Brave. I haven't used Safari in ages as it seems like it's more of an attack vector compared to Firefox and Brave, mainly because Firefox and Brave have very small marketshare. Security by obscurity.

I've not had any kind of infection for at least the past decade and maybe even the past fifteen years. I think that a lot of the malware has moved to social engineering in combination with actual malware as social engineering seems more effective in scamming people out of money.

 

[MBAir2010]

What's important is common programs or interfaces and that things don't break. And they haven't.

on Windows11 or Sequoia?

this reply is not a challenge or cornering this statement, I am just interested in a windows 11 switch this year.
thank you.

 

[pshufd]

on Windows11 or Sequoia?

this reply is not a challenge or cornering this statement, I am just interested in a windows 11 switch this year.
thank you.

Both. I have my laptops set up similarly with the same programs where possible.

I use iCloud applications on both - using the web version on Windows 11 and the native versions on macOS.

I use Thunderbird on Windows and Apple Mail on macOS but I set up Thunderbird to look and operate as closely as I could.

It takes some planning, some effort and I had a lot of tips from this board to make the experience as close as possible.

One thing that helped on the Windows 11 side is a program that gives you three-finger drag on Windows 11, just like on macOS.

I had to use a complete replacement for some programs but I can live with that.

 

[hajime]

Even if that were true, macOS would still be more secure then windows.

But Apple does not release M5 Pro MacBook Pro and I have been holding off some tasks because of that. Looks like I also cannot get Panther Lake laptop the next few days.

​

 

[MBAir2010]

this post might be unorthodox verbally to the forum,
uneducated, too vocal, mundane, amateur tech-wise and eye rolling,
but I am tired of fighting systems data on my Mac m1s as 20 gb should not be there.


therefore (ah that dreaded word) Panther Lake seems more suited for my computing future.
I read many marvels on Panther Lake as heat, quietness and longevity battery wise is better.
better than other processors, I don't know no one really stated better than brand X.

now how do I know a laptop has Panther lake intel processor?
most laptops manufactures state: Powered by Intel® Core™ Ultra processors (Series 2)
what i should look for is: Intel® Core™ Ultra series 3 processors which go on sale in January 2026.
correct?

not that i'm purchasing anything until this summer and autumn.
by then Panther Lake will be in full launch mode, we hope.

thanks for reading this!

 

[maflynn]

But Apple does not release M5 Pro MacBook Pro and I have been holding off some tasks because of that. Looks like I also cannot get Panther Lake laptop the next few days.

​

What do you mean apple does not release a M5 Pro, of course they'll be releasing a M5 Pro.

Both Panther Lake based laptops and M5 Pro MBPs will be available in 2026.

 

[pshufd]

Even if that were true, macOS would still be more secure then windows.

I think that it depends more on the operator than the hardware or operating system.

 

[pshufd]

this post might be unorthodox verbally to the forum,
uneducated, too vocal, mundane, amateur tech-wise and eye rolling,
but I am tired of fighting systems data on my Mac m1s as 20 gb should not be there.


therefore (ah that dreaded word) Panther Lake seems more suited for my computing future.
I read many marvels on Panther Lake as heat, quietness and longevity battery wise is better.
better than other processors, I don't know no one really stated better than brand X.

now how do I know a laptop has Panther lake intel processor?
most laptops manufactures state: Powered by Intel® Core™ Ultra processors (Series 2)
what i should look for is: Intel® Core™ Ultra series 3 processors which go on sale in January 2026.
correct?

not that i'm purchasing anything until this summer and autumn.
by then Panther Lake will be in full launch mode, we hope.

thanks for reading this!

I have not looked into what causes this but sizing machines at 1 TB or using an external SSD is a way around it. I think that it has something to do with Time Machine backup caching but I haven't had the issue in years.

Panther Lake is Core Ultra Series 3. Core Ultra Series 2 can be Arrow Lake or Lunar Lake. Lunar Lake is their low-power CPU for thin and light laptops and it is really great. It is hard for me to imagine that Panther Lake is a lot better but I'm prepared to be amazed.

I don't think that you can get Panther Lake until March at the earliest. I've heard that it's supposed to be able for preorder late January or early Feburary but I haven't found a place to pre-order it.

If you need something right now, and you need great battery life but don't do heavy gaming or need heavy CPU, I'd recommend taking a look at Lunar Lake laptops with the 258V processor.

 

[pshufd]

What do you mean apple does not release a M5 Pro, of course they'll be releasing a M5 Pro.

Both Panther Lake based laptops and M5 Pro MBPs will be available in 2026.

I'm personally waiting for an M6 Pro because of the redesign. There is still a possibility that it's released in 2026 too.

 

[hajime]

What do you mean apple does not release a M5 Pro, of course they'll be releasing a M5 Pro.

Both Panther Lake based laptops and M5 Pro MBPs will be available in 2026.

I meant not releasing last Fall, not releasing this week, etc.

 

[maflynn]

I meant not releasing last Fall, not releasing this week, etc.

Ahh I see

It’s in the works, I think most of the rumors in 2025 pointed to a 1st Qtr 26 release

 

[TSE]

A ton of reviewers are saying Panther Lake is the greatest thing Intel has done in awhile.

I am skeptical as I've been burned by PC promises for so long. If it isn't intel releasing subpar products, it's OEMs ruining good hardware with busted BIOSes, and if it's not OEMs ruining things it's Microsoft.

I wish there were good alternatives... I've tried PC several times. But I'd rather just get a $800 MacBook Air and have peace of mind.