Apple should convince Dr. Lisa Su (the CEO of AMD) to lead their chip division

[Retskrad]

I am surprised that Apple’s stock isn’t losing more value. Apple’s chip division was a big competitive advantage over the competition that division is sinking like Titanic now that they’ve lost most of their best chip designers. AMD, which has so much less money and resources, has already caught up in both battery life and performance and Qualcomm is getting closer too. They’re already ahead in the GPU department and the CPU single core is only 15-20% behind the A16. Remember, Qualcomm used to be 70% slower in single core just two years ago.

Maybe it’s time for Apple to take trucks of money to Dr Lisa Su’s door and convince her to replace Johny Srouji, who has done wonders but it might be wise to change leadership. AMD during Lisa Su‘s tenure has literally conquered both Intel and Apple. She has two championship rings.

 

[darngooddesign]

Relax chicken little, we're only on the second iteration of the first chip generation.

 

[Xiao_Xi]

Maybe it’s time for Apple to take trucks of money to Dr Lisa Su’s door and convince her to replace Johny Srouji, who has done wonders but it might be wise to change leadership.

Former Apple employee Mark Pappermaster would be a better fit.

Mark Papermaster - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[purplerainpurplerain]

Srouji’s team is much smarter than anyone at AMD.

 

[leman]

I am surprised that Apple’s stock isn’t losing more value. Apple’s chip division was a big competitive advantage over the competition that division is sinking like Titanic now that they’ve lost most of their best chip designers. AMD, which has so much less money and resources, has already caught up in both battery life and performance and Qualcomm is getting closer too. They’re already ahead in the GPU department and the CPU single core is only 15-20% behind the A16. Remember, Qualcomm used to be 70% slower in single core just two years ago.

You know, repeating marketing slogans doesn’t really make things real. No, AMD hasnt caught up with Apple in the metrics you mention (and they always offered higher multi-core performance at the expense of either using more cores or more power, this doesn’t change this generation either) - for example, their fastest, power hungriest, biggest baddest mobile CPU with the power draw of over 70watts can barely outperform Apples passively cooled M2 in single core, by AMDs own marketing claims . Qualcomm’s latest CPU features only one “fast” core which is still slower than the two years old A14 P-core (of which A14 has two btw). And Qualcomm did some great work in the GPU, which allowed them to match perf/watt of Apples two year old GPU architecture.

But none of these things spell doom and gloom for Apple Silicon division. Different companies work with different schedules. Apple is still effectively on a two year old architecture (with minor tweaks) and the competition was at best able to achieve parity in some domains utilizing newer designs.

Your entire opinion piece is based on the idea that Apple doesn’t have anything new in development and that A14 is the best they can do. That’s quite a conjecture.

 

[Zest28]

I am surprised that Apple’s stock isn’t losing more value. Apple’s chip division was a big competitive advantage over the competition that division is sinking like Titanic now that they’ve lost most of their best chip designers. AMD, which has so much less money and resources, has already caught up in both battery life and performance and Qualcomm is getting closer too. They’re already ahead in the GPU department and the CPU single core is only 15-20% behind the A16. Remember, Qualcomm used to be 70% slower in single core just two years ago.

Maybe it’s time for Apple to take trucks of money to Dr Lisa Su’s door and convince her to replace Johny Srouji, who has done wonders but it might be wise to change leadership. AMD during Lisa Su‘s tenure has literally conquered both Intel and Apple. She has two championship rings.

Let's get some facts here.
- iPhone 14 Pro (non-gaming phone) = 1900 single-core in Geekbench
- fastest android phone (big fat gaming phone) = 1200 single-core in Geekbench.

So where do you get this 20% figure from? Heck, the iPhone 14 Pro has a faster single-core performance than most computers even, even faster than the M1 and M2 Mac's. Looks like the Apple chip division is still doing an excellent job.

The Mac is just a side business of Apple, their main business is the iPhone to put things into perspective. So Apple is doing fine. AMD and Intel do whatever they want, Apple will not sink like the titanic like the way you put it.

 

[Retskrad]

Let's…

Seem like you have outdated information. The A16 and Snapdragon Gen 2 is way closer than people think.

Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic: Benchmark Comparison

In this Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic comparison, we examine the benchmark scores from Geekbench, AnTuTu, GFXBench, and 3DMark.

beebom.com

When Apple was ahead, people ran with the narrative that the performance of Apple Silicon left everyone else in the dust and Apple bragged about it during presentations. Now that the others have caught up, we can’t go and say performance doesn’t matter to Apple. That’s hypocritical.

 

[Zest28]

Seem like you have outdated information. The A16 and Snapdragon Gen 2 is way closer than people think.

Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic: Benchmark Comparison

In this Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic comparison, we examine the benchmark scores from Geekbench, AnTuTu, GFXBench, and 3DMark.

beebom.com

When Apple was ahead, people ran with the narrative that the performance of Apple Silicon left everyone else in the dust and Apple bragged about it during presentations. Now that the others have caught up, we can’t go and say performance doesn’t matter to Apple. That’s hypocritical.

This was my source, which are actual Android phones that exists.

Android Benchmarks - Geekbench

The 1500 score that you have, is not from a real device as it was just a test device provided by Qualcomm. So this is not legit.

edit: I just read that the Samsung Galaxy S23 Ultra might get this chip. So let's wait for those geekbench results when that phone launches and then we have official numbers.

 

[bobmans]

Marketing terms are just ... marketing terms.
They forget to mention that their "mobile" chip draws so much power that your laptop needs to be plugged in and needs the beefiest cooling it can get to perform. Meanwhile Apple's chips are mainly being passively cooled, draw almost no power, run just fine on battery power and are actually mobile chips instead of a desktop chips slapped into a mobile device.

 

[TracerAnalog]

I’m sure Apple is impressed by your analysis. I for one think Apple should buy Tesla, and make Windows laptops 😉

 

[leman]

Seem like you have outdated information. The A16 and Snapdragon Gen 2 is way closer than people think.

Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic: Benchmark Comparison

In this Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic comparison, we examine the benchmark scores from Geekbench, AnTuTu, GFXBench, and 3DMark.

beebom.com

When Apple was ahead, people ran with the narrative that the performance of Apple Silicon left everyone else in the dust and Apple bragged about it during presentations. Now that the others have caught up, we can’t go and say performance doesn’t matter to Apple. That’s hypocritical.

In the link you posted the Snapdragon Gen 2 has a GB5 single-core score of 1490. The iPhone 12 (A14) has a GB5 single-core of 1590. That's Qualcomm's latest and fastest failing to match Apple's two year old CPU core.

And sure, in multi-core it is very close to A16. Which it achieves by combining one very fast core with two slower core with two more slightly slower cores with three more efficiency cores (that's a lot of different types of cores). While A16 only uses two fast cores + four efficiency cores.

Anyway, what's the real-world value of this kind of CPU design? It really seems like Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 was primarily developed to excel at benchmarks. One very fast (and power hungry) core to get high scores in single-core benchmarks and four mid-performance cores to get good multi-core scores (similar to what Intel is doing recently). But what is the utility of any of this in an actual phone (not to mention that there were reports of some vendors disabling the fast core when running non-benchmark software to save battery life)? At least Apple's design makes practical sense.

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

I am surprised that Apple’s stock isn’t losing more value. Apple’s chip division was a big competitive advantage over the competition that division is sinking like Titanic now that they’ve lost most of their best chip designers. AMD, which has so much less money and resources, has already caught up in both battery life and performance and Qualcomm is getting closer too. They’re already ahead in the GPU department and the CPU single core is only 15-20% behind the A16. Remember, Qualcomm used to be 70% slower in single core just two years ago.

Ahead in the GPU department when Nvidia still leads in real life tests and market share. Even with EVGA gone and Nvidia's silliness, even the 30 series still leads in performance against AMD cards. All AMD GPUs have a lead on is price.

Maybe it’s time for Apple to take trucks of money to Dr Lisa Su’s door and convince her to replace Johny Srouji, who has done wonders but it might be wise to change leadership. AMD during Lisa Su‘s tenure has literally conquered both Intel and Apple. She has two championship rings.

Okay look I love Team Red too, but this comment is silly as hell. There's nothing wrong with the M Series chips that would warrant a change in leadership. They're still powerhouses even if they don't beat another chip in a Geekbench benchmark. These benchmark scores don't always reflect real world performance, which is way more important.

Plus a lot of this is software problems, not hardware. The hardware of the M Series chips is fantastic, but bogged down by software issues brought on by Apple due to draconian policies of forcing everyone to use the APIs they want, most notably forcing all graphics professionals on Metal.

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

I’m sure Apple is impressed by your analysis. I for one think Apple should buy Tesla, and make Windows laptops 😉

Don't forget a game console. Apple should make one just for Sony to claim another victim.

 

[progx]

AMD during Lisa Su‘s tenure has literally conquered both Intel and Apple. She has two championship rings.

As someone who uses (and is a fan of) their CPUs/GPUs, they make great products, but they are a minority in the Windows world. Most PCs employed in business are heavily Intel based. It doesn’t look like the Ryzen 7000 are making a big enough splash against Raptor Lake… so this generation of Ryzen isn’t off to the greatest start. Alder Lake spanked Ryzen 5000 sadly.

She’s done a great job turning AMD around and giving Intel a run for their money, but Apple…? I think you’re reaching quite far when AMD accounts for 23-30% of Windows based machines sold. According to Steam, Intel and NVIDIA are the top pairings on their launcher, AMD is barely 15-20% with NVIDIA or their own GPUs.

 

[Gudi]

Let’s not forget that chip design comes down to single individuals, not teams upon teams of experts working together. /s

 

[djcerla]

AMD hadn’t caught up with Apple Silicon, at all. The old package (CPU, GPU power + low heat/wattage) is still unmatched, and a new 3nm chip process is about to get released.

No wonder Macs are briskly increasing sales while all other PC makers are struggling.

 

[Jeven Stobs]

To hire (too many) big names from other brands right now would make the stock value even more unstable, if the „acquisition” would go through at all. Changing course or crews usually results in people being worried about Apples in house developments, no matter if technology or workspace wise.
That would be a hectic move followed by big headlines.
Like @darngooddesign said, chill. Don’t panic. It’s too early.
Also there isn’t much to worry about as of yet considering AMDs latest announcements. Apple is still leading.

 

[orionquest]

Waaaaa Apple isn't making enough cpu updates how I like it.. waaaaaa which I will never buy waaaaaa...
now Apple sucks waaaaaaa.....

 

[Pressure]

Seem like you have outdated information. The A16 and Snapdragon Gen 2 is way closer than people think.

Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic: Benchmark Comparison

In this Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 vs Apple A16 Bionic comparison, we examine the benchmark scores from Geekbench, AnTuTu, GFXBench, and 3DMark.

beebom.com

When Apple was ahead, people ran with the narrative that the performance of Apple Silicon left everyone else in the dust and Apple bragged about it during presentations. Now that the others have caught up, we can’t go and say performance doesn’t matter to Apple. That’s hypocritical.

Those are numbers from the reference Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 handset. Not an actual phone you can buy. Either way it's looking good as a preview for coming Android phones.

Here are the supplied numbers from Qualcomm.

	Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 reference design	A16 Bionic
Geekbench 5	Single-core: 1,485 - 1,495 Multi-core: 5,050 - 5,200	Single-core: 1,891 Multi-core: 5,469
Antutu	CPU: 270,867 GPU: 567,801 Memory: 239,879 UX: 198,202	CPU: 246,572 GPU: 408,723 Memory: 176,151 UX: 146,701
PCMark	18,500 - 18,900	-
Jetstream	167 - 170	283
Speedometer	144 - 146	359
WebXPRT3	219 - 220	292
GFXBench (Off-screen)	Manhattan 3.0: 329 - 332 T-Rex: 481 - 484 Manhattan 3.1: 224 - 226 Car Chase: 129 - 130 Aztec Ruins (Vulkan High Tier): 65 Aztec Ruins (OpenGL High Tier): 60 Aztec Ruins (Vulkan Normal Tier): 178	Manhattan 3.0: 291 T-Rex: 459 Manhattan 3.1: Car Chase: 106 Aztec Ruins (Vulkan High Tier): 57 Aztec Ruins (OpenGL High Tier): Aztec Ruins (Normal Tier): 133
3DMark	Wildlife Unlimited: 82 fps Wildlife Extreme Unlimited: 23 fps	Wildlife Unlimited: 74 fps Wildlife Extreme Unlimited: 20 fps

You should have in mind that Antutu is an aggregate score, so it makes more sense to post the individual sub scores. The benchmark as a whole is also highly reliant on memory speed. LPDDR5 is 33% slower than LPDDR5X.

 

[darkpaw]

Let’s not forget that chip design comes down to single individuals, not teams upon teams of experts working together. /s

That's utter trash. Everyone knows that just one person works on the single core stuff, and multiple people work on the multi-core stuff. That's science. /s

 

[Ethosik]

I am surprised that Apple’s stock isn’t losing more value. Apple’s chip division was a big competitive advantage over the competition that division is sinking like Titanic now that they’ve lost most of their best chip designers. AMD, which has so much less money and resources, has already caught up in both battery life and performance and Qualcomm is getting closer too. They’re already ahead in the GPU department and the CPU single core is only 15-20% behind the A16. Remember, Qualcomm used to be 70% slower in single core just two years ago.

Maybe it’s time for Apple to take trucks of money to Dr Lisa Su’s door and convince her to replace Johny Srouji, who has done wonders but it might be wise to change leadership. AMD during Lisa Su‘s tenure has literally conquered both Intel and Apple. She has two championship rings.

Wow. Pandemic, supply chain, chip shortages, Ukraine, etc. You know how many real world factors are going on right now and just recently? If this didn’t happen I guarantee you we would already have the M* Mac Pro and maybe a better M2.

 

[TechRunner]

I've always rooted for AMD to succeed because they keep the pressure on Intel to move forward and innovate. Now, Intel is that company for Apple, so they all have a part to play in the chip wars. But Apple is still currently king of the performance/efficiency hill at this moment, so I'm not sure of the value for Apple of poaching people from other chip companies.

 

[Ethosik]

Okay look I love Team Red too, but this comment is silly as hell. There's nothing wrong with the M Series chips that would warrant a change in leadership. They're still powerhouses even if they don't beat another chip in a Geekbench benchmark. These benchmark scores don't always reflect real world performance, which is way more important.

This is why I REALLY HATE Geekbench. My base M1 Mac Mini doesn’t hold up well against my 11th gen i9 Windows box. But it beats it in several of my workflows. So I used it until I got my hands on the Mac Studio.

How well do we know Geekbench performs with Apple Silicon? This test just shows how well a computer can run Geekbench. Is it properly coded for the M* chips? Clearly not as the GPU test doesn’t flex it enough so we get lower results than expected.

 

[TechRunner]

This is one man's opinion, but this from MacWorld (bold is mine):

Apple is living rent-free in PC chipmakers’ heads​

Apple didn’t unveil a new chip or a new laptop at WWDC, but you wouldn’t know that by listening to Intel and AMD. Intel announced its 13th Gen Intel Core mobile processor family by boasting it has the highest clock speed available for the laptop market. Meanwhile, AMD claimed its new Ryzen 7040 Series Mobile processors “outperform the Apple M2 CPU by up to 20 percent while being up to 50 percent more energy efficient” while the Ryzen 7040HS Series Mobile processors offer “up to 34 percent faster multithreaded performance” over an M1 Pro MacBook Pro with 32GB of RAM.

For two companies that should be fighting each other, they’re paying an awful lot of attention to Apple and its 15 percent market share. Apple has just two Mac chips and hasn’t unveiled its most powerful machine yet, and it’s already getting the biggest PC chipmakers to stand up and take notice. If that’s not a sign that Apple’s doing things right, I don’t know what is. - Michael Simon, Executive Editor, MacWorld.

 

[Chidoro]

To think that Dr. Su would take another opportunity that’s anything less than CEO of another company after successfully turning around AMD as CEO is just silly. Leading a division of another company is not the trajectory someone like that takes. It goes beyond simply offering a lot of money.