Bootcamp for M-Series Chips NOW!

[oharag]

I'm here to demand and champion Bootcamp for Mac Silicon. I figured it wasn't initially developed due to Windows for ARM wasn't really supported initially - now with Windows for ARM support increasing (with windows tablets using Snap Dragon and Arm) - and also being bundled with Parallels - why won't Apple update Bootcamp for Mac Silicon. I think Apple is king of virtualization and has the ability to trasnlate Windows video calls to Mac Silicon. Why Apple why haven't you released Bootcamp for Silicon yet?

Parallels - yearly subscription too expensive.

I see having Bootcamp running on Mac Silicon as a huge benefit for Apple and even Microsoft + Windows App Devs.

Just my thoughts

 

[Sheepish-Lord]

Always have to ask yourself, what would Apple get out of it? Additionally, do they even have support from MS anymore for bootcamp? People wanted bootcamp for x86 support but now you would just get Windows ARM which is supported less than macOS.

If you’re using Windows you’re probably not on ARM and if you’re on ARM you’re probably using a Mac.

 

[okkibs]

You can already attempt to boot alternative operating systems. There is even one that does boot, it's a flavor of linux. But they had to customize that OS and put in work to make it support Apple Silicon. Even so, it remains unfinished to this day as they can't 100% copy what macOS does. Without the help of Apple some internals remain hidden away.

So you'd need both Microsoft and Apple working together to make this a reality. Yet Microsoft doesn't make money from supporting the Mac and Apple doesn't either. If anything, Microsoft would rather sell you their own Surface hardware and Apple would prefer it if you remained entirely in their own ecosystem.

The only reason bootcamp ever worked was the fact that Intel Macs used the same chips as Windows computers hence Windows was able to boot on Mac. If they had used different chips like the PowerPC Macs that came before Intel then Windows would never have been able to boot up either.

As long as Apple keeps using their own silicon there won't be another bootcamp. Maybe one day Windows will again run on the same chips that Macs use but that time could be decades away.

 

[BigBlur]

Apple has said it's up to Microsoft to make it happen.

Craig Federighi: Native Windows on M1 Macs is 'Really up to Microsoft'

Following the release of the M1 Macs Apple executives have been doing interviews with a range of publications, and today, Ars Technica published another interview with software engineering chief Craig Federighi, hardware technologies lead Johny Srouji, and marketing VP Greg Joswiak.

www.macrumors.com

Also, remember that Windows 11 requires a TPM 2.0 chip (and other certain requirements), which Macs don't have. There's nothing Apple can do about that; Microsoft would need to change those requirements.

Is there really much of a demand for dual-booting these days? Computers are so fast now that virtualization is pretty much seamless. Parallels works great where I can run Mac and Windows apps side-by-side. Personally, I couldn't imagine having to go back to dual booting and be stuck in one OS at a time.

I don't like Parallel's subscription model either, but they do have good sales if you keep an eye out for them. They also have a one-time purchase option that gets discounted once in a while as well. There are, of course, other free alternatives out there such as VMware Fusion and UTM.

 

[avro707]

Is there really much of a demand for dual-booting these days? Computers are so fast now that virtualization is pretty much seamless

It is still necessary- and it cuts out those subscription based virtualisation apps.

I do use dual boot because some of the things I use Windows 11 (workstation version) just will not run properly unless native.

 

[maflynn]

I'm here to demand and champion Bootcamp for Mac Silicon.

Demand all you want, Apple and/or Microsoft are not going to acquiesce to your demands. One of the major impediments is windows 11 requirement is the TPM module, and Microsoft has shown zero interest in changing its position on this.

Parallels - yearly subscription too expensive.

Then use Vmware's fusion, VirtualBox or UTM all three are free.

see having Bootcamp running on Mac Silicon as a huge benefit for Apple and even Microsoft + Windows App Devs.

I don't think Apple sees any benefit, and why would they. Its in their best interest not let you use a competing operating system. Their hardware is a gateway to you using their paid services, with people running windows on a Mac, they're losing out on those services.

Its called a walled garden for a reason, apple wants to keep their customers using apple products, not competitors.

Edit: Tbh, I agree with this, especially given Microsoft's shenanigans with having the OS phoning home with all sorts of telemerty, the risk of malware and them forcing their consumers to use their accounts instead of local accounts. I see no good on having windows on my Mac.

 

[wyrdness]

I'm here to demand and champion Bootcamp for Mac Silicon. I figured it wasn't initially developed due to Windows for ARM wasn't really supported initially - now with Windows for ARM support increasing (with windows tablets using Snap Dragon and Arm) - and also being bundled with Parallels - why won't Apple update Bootcamp for Mac Silicon. I think Apple is king of virtualization and has the ability to trasnlate Windows video calls to Mac Silicon. Why Apple why haven't you released Bootcamp for Silicon yet?

Parallels - yearly subscription too expensive.

I see having Bootcamp running on Mac Silicon as a huge benefit for Apple and even Microsoft + Windows App Devs.

Just my thoughts

It's not going to happen. Never. There's no point in even raising this again.

So, theoretically, if Apple did release Bootcamp (which is just a bootloader) for Apple Silicon, then what?
Do you think that ARM Windows would somehow magically work? It won't.

The reason that Bootcamp was such a great idea on Intel Macs is because they were actually PC's. The early Intel Macs were almost a standard Intel PC, the later ones having a bit more Mac specific hardware. But it was really easy to boot Windows on one because it was a PC.

Apple Silicon Macs aren't PC's. They've evolved from phone chips and are nothing like Windows PCs.
In order to run Windows on them you'd need to write driver software for each component in the system. Which would require a large, dedicated development team, which would be expensive. Apple aren't going to do this as they want you to run Mac OS. Their view is that if you want to run Windows, you do it in a virtual machine. Microsoft aren't going to do this because it doesn't really benefit them either and they'd need to obtain the detailed technical specifications from Apple.

It's also 5 years since Apple Silicon launched and it's not happened and it never will. It's wouldn't be a simple boot loader like on Intel Macs, it would be a hugely expensive long-term project and no-one is interested in doing it. Companies just don't take on projects that provide very little benefit at huge cost.

Just use a virtual machine and stop asking for something you're never going to get.

 

[seggy]

I'm here to demand and champion Bootcamp for Mac Silicon. I figured it wasn't initially developed due to Windows for ARM wasn't really supported initially - now with Windows for ARM support increasing (with windows tablets using Snap Dragon and Arm) - and also being bundled with Parallels - why won't Apple update Bootcamp for Mac Silicon. I think Apple is king of virtualization and has the ability to trasnlate Windows video calls to Mac Silicon. Why Apple why haven't you released Bootcamp for Silicon yet?

Parallels - yearly subscription too expensive.

I see having Bootcamp running on Mac Silicon as a huge benefit for Apple and even Microsoft + Windows App Devs.

Just my thoughts

Apple doesn't need Boot Camp anymore. They've wreaked the damage they wanted on the Windows ecosystem - Boot Camp was always a mechanism to turn people and above all developers who needed Windows into people who love Macs, by making the Windows experience as poor as possible but still fully functional - i.e. a transitional step.

Apple never actually gave a rats ass about gaming and that was also never the actual point of Boot Camp.

Everything which was Windows exclusive that Apple cares about now exists for Macs or the web. It was truly inspired in the Machiavellian Jobs way that so many Apple things are, but now redundant.

 

[gank41]

Apple has said it's up to Microsoft to make it happen.

Craig Federighi: Native Windows on M1 Macs is 'Really up to Microsoft'

Following the release of the M1 Macs Apple executives have been doing interviews with a range of publications, and today, Ars Technica published another interview with software engineering chief Craig Federighi, hardware technologies lead Johny Srouji, and marketing VP Greg Joswiak.

www.macrumors.com

Also, remember that Windows 11 requires a TPM 2.0 chip (and other certain requirements), which Macs don't have. There's nothing Apple can do about that; Microsoft would need to change those requirements.

Is there really much of a demand for dual-booting these days? Computers are so fast now that virtualization is pretty much seamless. Parallels works great where I can run Mac and Windows apps side-by-side. Personally, I couldn't imagine having to go back to dual booting and be stuck in one OS at a time.

I don't like Parallel's subscription model either, but they do have good sales if you keep an eye out for them. They also have a one-time purchase option that gets discounted once in a while as well. There are, of course, other free alternatives out there such as VMware Fusion and UTM.

The Asahi team have been doing great things

 

[maflynn]

The Asahi team have been doing great things

Only for the M1 and M2 chips

 

[gank41]

Only for the M1 and M2 chips

...and it's better than anything Microsoft's done so far 😉

 

[startergo]

...and it's better than anything Microsoft's done so far 😉

Asahi is dead.

 

[gank41]

Asahi is dead.

Asahi Fedora works just fine on my M1 MBP. Project is still active and moving along.

 

[Daydog]

yes I miss Asahi Fedora now with my M4.was fast on my M2 looking forward for support for M4...