Building A 16-Inch MacBook Pro M4 Max / Looking At Components

[Dutton P Body]

I'm building a 16-inch MacBook Pro, M4 Max Chip with 16-core CPU, 40-core GPU, 16-core Neural Engine, 2TB SSD, 64GB RAM.

I'm leaving my Mac Pro, 5,1 [Mid-2010] Desktop, which still produces Geek Bench scores comparable to the M4 Max MB Pro I'm building.

Fortunately, I have a brand new 4TB HGST [Hitachi] Enterprise grade SATA, a CCTV outlet sold years ago. I backed up my primary SSD drive to the 4TB HGST, using Carbon Copy Cloner. So I have a 4TB HD I can use to start my Mac Pro 5,1 in "Target Mode," which my M4 Max MBP will see as a hard drive. Migration Assistant will transfer my Mac Pro's data and settings to the M4 Max MBP. An ethernet cable and an Apple dongle will facilitate that transfer.

This 4TB Enterprise Grade hard drive was produced by Hitachi. If this hard drive had run 24/7 since before the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor, it would still have 200 thousand hours left until its: "Best Used By Date."

That leaves three types of peripheral components I need to integrate into the M4 Max MBP system, which are:

1] Two 32-inch 4K computer monitors. Who manufactures high end computer monitors, and which model would you buy? I don't play games, but my guess is game monitors must possess high resolution. I don't like Apple displays. I want to purchase two high resolution 4k monitors with 120Hz outputs, using the Apple tax. If high resolution on large monitors distorts images, and a 27-inch monitor doesn't, then the smaller monitors win.

2] External audio speakers, and the best cables for interfacing them with the M4 Max MBP. I'd like to think that for $500-750 one can buy the smallest, lightest, most powerful speakers produced. I'm looking for USB-C, Blue Tooth, 3.5mm analog, optical, fiber optics, Wi-Fi router, speaker wire, serial cable connectivity. I want to avoid RCA jacks if possible. I limit Wi-Fi use

3] The M4 Max MBP will have three Thunderbolt 5 ports, a USB-C port, HDMI port, SDXC card slot, headphone jack, and MagSafe 3 port. I would want a USB-C hub, and they make a multitude of them. Who manufactures the most versatile, high end hubs / docks, designed for taking advantage of the M4 Max MBP ports, listed above?

Any advice you can provide about how to configure peripheral components for the M4 Max MBP would be greatly appreciated. MacRumors forum members helped me migrate from a G4 Power Mac, to a Mac Pro 5,1 that has operated for 15 years. So I know MacRumor's forum members wield some expertise and technical prowess.

 

[benwiggy]

When you say "building an MBP", you mean "buying one, configured to order"? You're not actually making your own.. 😀

The most important thing to know is what will you be using this for? Video work? Audio? What peripherals are you going to add to the hub that you want?

I'm looking for USB-C, Blue Tooth, 3.5mm analog, optical, fiber optics, Wi-Fi router, speaker wire, serial cable connectivity.

That's literally every sort of audio connection! But then you say you don't want Wifi or RCA.

If high resolution on large monitors distorts images, and a 27-inch monitor doesn't, then the smaller monitors win.

The important thing with displays is not the physical dimensions, but the pixel density.
A 32-inch 4K display has a resolution of 138 pixels per inch. So everything is going to be tiny, but not small enough to scale. I'd strongly recommend getting a 5K 27-inch display. There are several others, apart from Apple's.

This 4TB Enterprise Grade hard drive was produced by Hitachi. If this hard drive had run 24/7 since before the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor, it would still have 200 thousand hours left until its: "Best Used By Date."

The important thing is 'redundancy'. Make sure that if any drive fails tomorrow, you don't lose data, because you've got at least one other copy.

I'm leaving my Mac Pro, 5,1 [Mid-2010] Desktop, which still produces Geek Bench scores comparable to the M4 Max MB Pro

Eh? A 2010 Mac Pro with 6 cores has a Geekbench score of 577 / 2621. The M4 Max scores 3881 / 25,552..!!! A base M1 is over 4 times faster!

 

[Dutton P Body]

When you say "building an MBP", you mean "buying one, configured to order"? You're not actually making your own.. 😀

Yes, my Mac Pro 5,1 has been acting real screwy. It developed some sort of fan racing syndrome that occurs when it streams video podcasts from YouTube or Rumble. It's started to do this at other times. There's constant throttling of the computer's fans. So last Monday, 8-days ago, I decided to buy a MBP. I never had a laptop so I don't know about connecting them, but it seems like a big challenge is going to be finding a versatile hub to connect peripheral devices.

The options for monitors and speakers have been giving me vertigo, so I figured if I could form an intelligent question for a MacRumors post, all of the Apple laptop experts in the world are on this site.

The most important thing to know is what will you be using this for? Video work? Audio? What peripherals are you going to add to the hub that you want?

I write, stream video, and record video segments here and there. I don't play games, but I have a cousin who does. I'll never get close to using this laptop's capacity for computing. But it seems like I would want at least a 4K monitor, that runs at 120Hz. Now it appears 5K to 8K monitors have been developed. I've been looking at BenQ monitors, based upon comments posters have made regarding them in the accessories posts here on MacRumors.

That's literally every sort of audio connection! But then you say you don't want Wifi or RCA.

I've watched the "smartphone" fad since it started, and averted getting one, but found I was having hassles logging into accounts so I finally bought an iPhone. The instant I connected that hockey puck to my wireless router it stripped every reminder I spent years assembling on my Mac Pro's iCalendar app, and sent them someplace.

It started to do the same thing with 20-years of email messages I had stored in my Thunderbird app. Everything in my study runs around an L-shaped desk that spans the room's width on cable supports fed by a power strip plugged into an outlet wired under my desk. That outlet is at my fingertips, so I pulled the plug, and I thought I'd like to show Tim Cook some tricks I learned in the USMC.

Apple didn't ask my permission to transfer anything from my Mac Pro, so it is clearly using iPhones as devices it can use for spy hacking computers it has sold to its customers. Otherwise, Apple would have required an administrative password before it used my iPhone to blatantly steal information out of my Mac Pro's desktop.

So there's a reason to hardwire peripheral devices for a computer, which is why I disabled Wi-Fi for everything except the iPhone, and I don't want my private information to be stored on Apple's iCloud. If I use Wi-Fi to run computers then my iPhone and any other "smartphone" in my house must be turned off.

I don't know what kind of sound I could get from running speakers with a Blue Tooth connection, opposed to a hard wired connection through the Thunderbolt 5 or USB-C ports on the MBP laptop. I haven't figured out the difference in types of data / output these ports facilitate yet. I'm sure I'll want a hub of some sort, but there's a prolific number of them.

I always regarded RCA connectors as being clunky with wires that are too big to tuck away neatly. However, I may need to use them anyway, if I need to hardwire new speakers with some sort of performance, which is what I want.

The important thing with displays is not the physical dimensions, but the pixel density.
A 32-inch 4K display has a resolution of 138 pixels per inch. So everything is going to be tiny, but not small enough to scale. I'd strongly recommend getting a 5K 27-inch display. There are several others, apart from Apple's.

This is good information to know. Your description of how pixel ratios affect displays is remarkably concise. It says a great deal about how pixel ratios work. I have run my Mac Pro using 27-inch ViewSonic monitors. I work with lots of MS Word documents, so sometimes I wish I had a larger screen, but not if this would make reading documents more difficult. I'll take your advice on this matter, so that decision has been made.

The important thing is 'redundancy'. Make sure that if any drive fails tomorrow, you don't lose data, because you've got at least one other copy.

Back in the G3 and G4 age, I got hooked on Hitachi's Ultra-star, Enterprise grade, hard drives. About the time HGST bought Hitachi, I was getting a CCTV system and this outlet had some 4TB Hitachi, Enterprise drives. It sure saved me a lot of trouble when I began to think about how to transfer data from my Mac Pro to the new MBP. Hitachi's Enterprise hard drives were designed to operate hundreds of thousands of hours 24/7. I forgot I had bought one.

An Apple tech told me I should back-up my working drive to this 4TB drive, start the Mac Pro in "Target Mode" and transfer its data and settings to the M4 Max MBP. Migration Assistant is a handy application, but I don't want to import fan throttling issues I'm having with the Mac Pro to the new MBP. I imported browser bookmarks from my G4 to Mac Pro using a different method, so I'm thinking I may drag and drop folders to my MBP when it is delivered.

Eh? A 2010 Mac Pro with 6 cores has a Geekbench score of 577 / 2621. The M4 Max scores 3881 / 25,552..!!! A base M1 is over 4 times faster!

Geek bench numbers always confused me. I've glanced at these numbers on EveryMac.com. These tests appear to be pending regarding the 16-inch M4 Max MBP, and based on a review I read numbers on the 16-inch model seem to be much higher than on 14-inch models, for reasons I don't understand.

I may use the 4TB Hitachi hard drive to feed data and settings back to my Mac Pro, after I install a new operating system on one of the SSD drives I use in it, to see if that cures the fan throttling issue I've been experiencing.

An article I read indicated this Mac Pro was the most versatile computer for upgrading ever produced. Other World Computing [OWC] had 'metal video cards' and M1 through M4 hard drive cards for Mac Pro PCIe slots until recently. OWC doesn't stock these components anymore. My Mac Pro has a 3.46 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon CPU, 48GB RAM, running OS 10.13.6 High Sierra. I will miss this Mac Pro, but not the wattage that it draws. It's a powerhouse.

I'll try to attach a screen shot of EveryMacs Geek Bench results to this post. I don't know how to make tiny ULRs.

 

[benwiggy]

Apple didn't ask my permission to transfer anything from my Mac Pro, so it is clearly using iPhones as devices it can use for spy hacking computers it has sold to its customers. Otherwise, Apple would have required an administrative password before it used my iPhone to blatantly steal information out of my Mac Pro's desktop

🤣 Apple isn't 'stealing' anything. This is called "iCloud". You have an account on Apple's servers where you can store data like Contacts, Calendars, Bookmarks, Passwords; enabling you to synchronise your data between your devices. The data is encrypted. (There have been some famous cases where the FBI has asked for access, but Apple has shown that they don't have the keys.)

You can choose not to store your data in iCloud, if you would prefer. Just change the preferences in Settings. You don't need to do whatever mad thing it is you're doing to prevent it.

Nearly all mail servers work in a similar way: your emails are stored on the email server, and your computers and phones synchronise with the server. That's how email works for everyone.

Pulling the plug on a running computer will do more harm than iCloud ever will.

Geek bench numbers always confused me.

Note that "Geekbench 3", Geekbench 4" and "Geekbench 5" are different test with different relative values. You can see that a computer scores a smaller number on a newer test. Otherwise, the numbers for M4s would in the millions, compared to computers 20 years ago.
Here's the latest results:

Mac Benchmarks - Geekbench

 

[Big_D]

I've been looking at BenQ monitors,

Funnily enough, I read a review of the new BenQ PD2730S, it seems like a solid monitor on the base of it, and, in Germany, 550€ cheaper than the Apple 27" display. In standard configuration, it doesn't reach the 2000 nits brightness, after talking to BenQ directly, "Mac and I" turned off Uniformity Compensation feature and used a manual configuration, which jumped the brightness from 637 nits to around 1,600 nits, but they then had to calibrate the monitor manually.

The review was generally good, but the summary was that, for a monitor at that price, aimed at video and photo professionals, such an error on the display, that the presets don't offer the full range, and if you need that, you have to turn off the presets and calibrate manually is unforgivable...

As to docks, I use a Ugreen Revo Dock Max 208 Thunderbolt 4 dock, which is nice and fills my needs (3 TB4/USB-C downstream and 3 USB-A, plus Ethernet. It works really well with my MacBook Pro M4 Pro and Air M4.

You can get TB5 docks, but they are still very expensive at the moment, and, again, for the tasks you have outlined, a TB5 dock would be a waste of money over a TB4 dock at around half the price...

I write, stream video, and record video segments here and there.

For that level, even a MacBook Air M4 would be fine, a MacBook Pro M4 Pro would be overkill for your use case, let alone going for the Max.

Apple didn't ask my permission to transfer anything from my Mac Pro, so it is clearly using iPhones as devices it can use for spy hacking computers it has sold to its customers. Otherwise, Apple would have required an administrative password before it used my iPhone to blatantly steal information out of my Mac Pro's desktop.

The iPhone isn't spying or changing things, especially if you use Thunderbird for email, I assume you aren't using an iCloud email address.

It could be that you set up the mail on the iPhone and accidentally moved some emails to another folder, for example, but Apple isn't using it to spy or steal information.

So there's a reason to hardwire peripheral devices for a computer, which is why I disabled Wi-Fi for everything except the iPhone, and I don't want my private information to be stored on Apple's iCloud. If I use Wi-Fi to run computers then my iPhone and any other "smartphone" in my house must be turned off.

If you use Wi-Fi on the Mac, the iPhone or other devices won't be able to read information off of the device, unless you actively give them permission to do so.

As to backups, using the external drive is fine, but I also use Backblaze (I used to use Carbonite, but it stopped working on my daughter's MBP a few years ago, so she swapped to Backblaze and when I got my new MBP, I started using it as well.

 

[Fishrrman]

OP:

You have a 2006 Mac Pro?

Get an m4 Mini (or m4pro Mini).
Properly equipped with at least 32gb of RAM and a 1tb SSD (or larger).
It will run circles around the old Mac Pro, and you can use your existing peripherals with it.

Things have changed a lot in 20 years.
Try the m4 Mini and you will see for yourself.

 

[Dutton P Body]

Get an m4 Mini (or m4pro Mini).
Properly equipped with at least 32gb of RAM and a 1tb SSD (or larger).
It will run circles around the old Mac Pro, and you can use your existing peripherals with it.

I wish I had examined how the M4 Max MBP's hard drive can become totally unassessable, which is depicted here:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/hard-data-on-mac-reliability.2458059/

Unlike the MBP, an m4pro Mini has a hard drive users can replace themselves. My new MBP is already being shipped, and if anything goes wrong with its hard drive only an Apple technician can replace it. So I definitely see the logic of people stating that hard drives in a MBP should be frequently backed up.

Also, a family member of mine had an accident just as I posted inquiries in this thread. Fortunately, a surgical team was able to keep this incident from being fatal, but my research for "Building a 16-Inch MBP" may suffer from my inability to attend this post for awhile. I will definitely read it, but I may have days when I cannot respond to it.

I have some questions about my habit of operating a computer 24/7, which I may need to pose at a later date. My theory is that electronic devices do not wear well if they are heated up and cooled down perpetually, so I'm going to be looking for a cradle. Hopefully that will incorporate a computer specific cooling system that I can monitor.

They actually make an HDMI to lighting adaptor and A / B switches, so I may be able to defer the subject of getting new monitors for awhile.

As to docks, I use a Ugreen Revo Dock Max 208 Thunderbolt 4 dock, which is nice and fills my needs (3 TB4/USB-C downstream and 3 USB-A, plus Ethernet. It works really well with my MacBook Pro M4 Pro and Air M4.

You can get TB5 docks, but they are still very expensive at the moment, and, again, for the tasks you have outlined, a TB5 dock would be a waste of money over a TB4 dock at around half the price...

I see what you are saying here Big_D, so I'm going to examine docks with a view towards comparing them with the model you employ for your system. Of course, it requires time develop devices that can take advantage of new technology. So it's a trade off between projecting devices a person may want to use in the future, and using devices that are backwards compatible, but may be overpriced, in the here and now. I think TB4 will facilitate my needs.

🤣 Apple isn't 'stealing' anything. This is called "iCloud". You have an account on Apple's servers where you can store data like Contacts, Calendars, Bookmarks, Passwords; enabling you to synchronise your data between your devices. The data is encrypted. (There have been some famous cases where the FBI has asked for access, but Apple has shown that they don't have the keys.)

This is a genuinely controversial subject. My Mac Pro frequently asks for "authentication" before it allows me to even empty the trash, but an iPhone strips all my iCalendar reminders and a third of my emails off my computer, without asking me to "Allow" or "Deny" this action, before the Apple Corporation implements these actions, as iPhone's must do before it installs applications.

I pay for Apple Care on my iPhone. Recently, I experienced low volume on the iPhone, so I called Apple to research how to fix this problem. I spent over 20 minutes on the phone, and the Apple tech didn't address the volume issue in the slightest. He was far more interested in having me provide Apple with another email account, and I had to access podcasts on YouTube to fix the iPhone's sound issues. My, my, my, I wonder why Apple technicians exhibit such a fixation regarding emails I send and receive, which are clearly none of Apple's business.

I'm in my mid-seventies, so I spent years assembling iCalendar reminders regarding doctor's appointments, and other routines, so I could easily examine them on my Mac Pro's 27-inch monitors. When I asked the Apple tech where these reminders went, and how I could get them back on my computer's monitor, he had no explanation whatsoever.

There's nothing 'user friendly' about that iPhone, so I simply switched off its calendar prompts, and have had to chose between restrictions of its Wi-Fi access or that of my computers, since Apple's iCloud stripped a third of my emails from my desktop's Thunderbird application, Without Authorization.

That brings me to issues I have with iCloud. I used an email account tied to my ISP account for years. The information there concerned purchases I made over the years; however, I've studied an array of historical accounts, and I write about socio-political issues that are tied to the Collective West's predilections for waging world conquest. My guess is that over 60% of Americans who appear to want a socialist government, wouldn't like this statement.

Suddenly, Karl Marx is their hero, while the warnings of Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, and the case of Marbury v. Madison mean nothing to them. It's starting to look like Joe McCarthy was correct about all the commies in America.

I'm aware that San Bernardino law enforcement tried to coerce Apple to unlock an iPhone, which officials were unable to compel in court; however, the UK government recently demanded that Apple provide it with access to all the data stored on their customers computers, including the iCloud, and Apple complied with that demand without a whimper.

Therefore, I can only conclude that unless Apple is willing to build their iCloud systems using "open sourced" applications, then there's absolutely nothing encrypted on Apple's iCloud; and I WILL NOT store my data on it.

When IT techs state that accounts are encrypted, at least I have something to reflect that my views are my views. Certainly, people have a right to ignore my views, but they do not have any right to suppress and censor my views, aside from expressions that are blatantly unlawful. That's why the Supreme Court established "checks and balances" that are suppose to govern America and various types of government in the U.S., according to Marbury v. Madison.

I read the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights cover to cover, and I don't see anything in those documents that says this federal government or any other government, state or local, can make warrantless searches and arrests in the middle of the night, because some apparatchik didn't like a citation I made from Friedrich Hayek's "Road to Serfdom," who Ronald Reagan stated was one of the most influential sources of information he ever encountered.

Given the fact that a member of our family has undergone a life threatening accident and a serious surgical situation, my ability to monitor this post may be limited for awhile, but if I can find a benign frequency like Blue Tooth or hard wired configuration for a speaker system, I do want to replace the one I'm using.

I thank you all for the advice you have provided to me, as I have always regarded MacRumors members as the most technically enlightened authorities regarding Apple computer systems. I live in awe of many MacRumors members.

Dutton

 

[thepyrate]

You will find that the M4 Max will absolutely run rings around that model of Mac Pro. My M1 Max matched or beat my iMac Pro 14 core, which was miles and miles ahead of my Mac Pro 5,1, and I used all of these machines in a professional setting and pushed them pretty hard. You would probably even find the Mac mini with the entry level M4 would be incredibly fast compared to that Mac Pro.

Displays are such a person/specific thing it's hard to recommend, and I'm guessing most people buy a display and then stick with it for years so they will have limited experience with ones outside their day to day monitor. I have a Samsung Odyssey 49" Ultrawide which does 120Hz, as well as a 17:9 DCI 4K display and an external video interface running into an OLED client display, but I'm honestly tempted to swap out the ultrawide for an LG C5 OLED TV and use that as a monitor. I know a few people doing with (with the 42" models) and they seem a fairly solid choice, and they will do up to 144Hz at UHD.

The one thing I would recommend is a Thunderbolt dock. I have three(!) and they're great. I have two OWC ones and a Belkin one. Honestly the Belkin one gives me a bit of grief. But really, they're very handy. You get a display output, a ton of USB ports, card slots etc and it'll power your computer. If you like to have a tidy desk it means you can have a single elegant cable connected to the computer itself.