Cannot Boot from Install CD (Jaguar)

[<-new_media->]

Usually after the completion of a semester of classes I perform a "clean install" of my os (currently osX 10.2.8) and I re-install all of my applcations and so fourth. I tend to accumulate lots of crashes over time and what not, what I consider normal wear and tear of the Operating system.

Unfortunately my powerbook G4 (12" titanium 867) was forced to go for the duration of 2 full semesters just now because I was graduating and didnt have sufficient time between semesters to back up and blah blah....

So heres the issue.

I cannot re-format my drive. I cannot boot from the install disks. I have restarted and held down "C", I have booted in safe mode, I have changed my startup disk to the cd in the drive, I have searched far and wide through many useless answers at APPLE help....

anyone have any insight.... I would like to figure this out without taking the Powerbook in to the apple store genius bar... I have Apple Care and so fourth but... you know how it is. When you screw something up and want an answer as to what you did and how not to do it again, they are not always the fullest of answers or freindly when you pick up you machine that was in absolute disarray when they got it.....

blah blah blah....

thanks

 

[MisterMe]

Usually after the completion of a semester of classes I perform a "clean install" of my os (currently osX 10.2.8) and I re-install all of my applcations and so fourth. I tend to accumulate lots of crashes over time and what not, what I consider normal wear and tear of the Operating system.

Unfortunately my powerbook G4 (12" titanium 867) was forced to go for the duration of 2 full semesters just now because I was graduating and didnt have sufficient time between semesters to back up and blah blah....

So heres the issue.

I cannot re-format my drive. I cannot boot from the install disks. I have restarted and held down "C", I have booted in safe mode, I have changed my startup disk to the cd in the drive, I have searched far and wide through many useless answers at APPLE help....

anyone have any insight.... I would like to figure this out without taking the Powerbook in to the apple store genius bar... I have Apple Care and so fourth but... you know how it is. When you screw something up and want an answer as to what you did and how not to do it again, they are not always the fullest of answers or freindly when you pick up you machine that was in absolute disarray when they got it.....

blah blah blah....

thanks

What you are describing is not "normal wear and tear." OS updates and similar actions require restarts. Clean installs are not necessary unless there is a problem with your current installation. The only thing that should require the things you do is a hardware failure. As for the problems that you are having with your bootable CDs sound like you are using incorrectly copied CDs rather than originals.

 

[jared_kipe]

Try holding down option while chiming, to see if it even sees the cd drive.

 

[Horrortaxi]

Not normal. If you just reinstall the OS because you are incredibly fastidious then try to learn to relax and leave it alone. Watch more TV or something. If it's crashing and doing other bad things and you can't figure out why by normal troubleshooting then you probably have a physical problem with the computer.

Have you heard the expression "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?" The OS rarely ever needs to be reinstalled.

 

[rand()]

A couple options...

Have you heard the expression "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?" The OS rarely ever needs to be reinstalled.

Listen to this guy. You're not on windows anymore. The only reason to reinstall OS X (or even 9) is because of disk corruption, or system file corruption; neither of which will happen under normal (or even intensive) use with good hardware.

So here's some options:

1) reset the PROM. I'm guessing you've already done this, but if you haven't, do it. I've seen a reset PROM mysteriously fix broken Firewire ports, and do other strange hardware things, where it seems like the PROM should have no business mucking them up in the first place.

2) Open her up, and check for loose cabling. IDE devices are strange and can "sorta-work" (i.e. work when booted, but not for booting) when half plugged in. Don't ask me how or why they do it, those connectors should be foolproof, but sometimes it happens.

3) Use Carbon Copy Cloner and copy your OS X install disk 1 to an external Firewire drive, and try booting from that. If you get this far, and it works, see if there's a Firmware update you can run on the disk. That may help things too.

4) If all else fails, short of any other suggestions here, use that AppleCare. You paid for it, after all!

That's all I got for ya. Good luck!
-rand()

 

[oldfart]

So heres the issue.

I cannot re-format my drive. I cannot boot from the install disks. I have restarted and held down "C", I have booted in safe mode, I have changed my startup disk to the cd in the drive, I have searched far and wide through many useless answers at APPLE help....

Here's my 2 cents;
Sounds like you can still boot to the OS.
Not sure why you'd want to go through a "Clean Install" on a Mac unless it's a bad habit from using Windows.My guess is that when you perform these installs, you aren't running any of the maintainance scripts. What I do, especially if you're using 10.2.8, is run Disk Utility and repair permissions AFTER EACH installation. In other words, after you install 10.2.8, repair permissions and restart immediately. Install other software or Apps, repair permissions, restart immediately.

If you can't do that(Run Disk Utility) from your start up disk for whatever reason, download "Cocktail" and run it. Click on the "Pilot" icon. Leave it at the default settings and click "Run". Make sure your laptop energy settings are NOT set to sleep when you do this.

Are the Boot CD's originals or copies??

 

[jared_kipe]

He said he does this all the time, why would we assume he isn't using the same CDs that he used to use?

 

[oldfart]

...are you there ? ? ? ? ?

Usually after the completion of a semester of classes I perform a "clean install" of my os (currently osX 10.2.8) and I re-install all of my applcations and so fourth. I tend to accumulate lots of crashes over time and what not, what I consider normal wear and tear of the Operating system.

Unfortunately my powerbook G4 (12" titanium 867) was forced to go for the duration of 2 full semesters just now because I was graduating and didnt have sufficient time between semesters to back up and blah blah....

So heres the issue.

I cannot re-format my drive. I cannot boot from the install disks. I have restarted and held down "C", I have booted in safe mode, I have changed my startup disk to the cd in the drive, I have searched far and wide through many useless answers at APPLE help....

anyone have any insight.... I would like to figure this out without taking the Powerbook in to the apple store genius bar... I have Apple Care and so fourth but... you know how it is. When you screw something up and want an answer as to what you did and how not to do it again, they are not always the fullest of answers or freindly when you pick up you machine that was in absolute disarray when they got it.....

blah blah blah....

thanks

.....sooooooo what's your situation there young fella???

 

[King Cobra]

Have you heard the expression "if it ain't broke, don't fix it?" The OS rarely ever needs to be reinstalled.

Listen to this guy. You're not on windows anymore. The only reason to reinstall OS X (or even 9) is because of disk corruption, or system file corruption; neither of which will happen under normal (or even intensive) use with good hardware.

Completely disagree. I've been using Macs for 12 years (never having to switch, either). Reinstalling the OS means getting rid of a whole bunch of excess software/useless data that you won't ever use (again), much less, bugs from beta or 3rd-party software that could give you problems in the future. Hell, I refresh my Hard Drive at most every 6 or 7 months, because [1] I like to keep my system running with as few or little problems/useless junk/bugs from other software as possible, and [2] Appleworks develops some stuttering problem for me about 3 months after a refresh. There's no reason to not keep refreshing your Hard Drive every 6 months, or even every 3 months, or more often, unless you have time-contraints, or don't have the hardware, or the effort to back everything up. I'm overwhelmed that Mac users on these forums refresh their Hard Drive once every year or two, or even never at all! Given that you have backed up all the data you need, refreshing your Hard Drive with fresh OS installs often can be nothing but helpful to your computer. So unless you do it every day/week, you can't reinstall OS X "too often." Additionally, there are more reasons to reinstall OS X than disk corruptions, as I have already explained.

 

[Horrortaxi]

But you're like 18 and still have time in your life to reinstall and tweak whenever you want to. That's fine if it's what you want to do, and it won't hurt anything to do it, but us old guys just want to use the computers and don't care about hypothetical speed increases. You're also at an age when you'll be adventerous and install crap on the machine that might mess up the system. You might need to reinstall more often. I'm using stable software and I never have serious problems.

Most problems I see posted on these forums are really basic, yet people reinstall software or the OS to fix them. Taking 30 seconds to trash a preference might have done the same thing. You don't have to shoot the dog just because he barks. Of course that will get him to be quiet.

 

[King Cobra]

Uugh, no more meaningless clichés...and I'm 19 now. Also, I know how to do a lot of troubleshooting, like trashing a preference file, or updating to the latest version, or repairing permissions, or using fsck -y, tcfix, reset-all, etc. But eventually problems build up in which I have never found a resolve for (and neither has anyone else), and because I have such a big pet peeve about searching (will probably be reduced come Tiger time), if such a problem gets annoying, then I refresh my machine. Always works.

About the unstable software part: Yes, I'm well aware that programs with bugs/memory leaks/etc. can quickly screw up your system. But every refresh, I become increasingly more cautious about what software I use. In fact, my willingness to launch a P2P application has been reduced to almost zero because of that alone (and the legal issues). (Scary, huh?) So I find (better) alternatives to such whenever I can. Example: mldonkey command-line client with web interface.

But now that I have a big enough OWC Neptune external Hard Drive with a bright glowing blue light, backing up my data is also fun.

Err, anyways... new_media, try other CDs, like another OS disk, as well as a bootable software disk from something like Norton. If you can boot off the Norton disk but not the OS disks, then you should see if you can get the original disks. There was a similar problem posted earlier in the week (don't make me search for the thread), and that happened to be the case, as well.

 

[wrldwzrd89]

Uugh, no more meaningless clichés...and I'm 19 now. Also, I know how to do a lot of troubleshooting, like trashing a preference file, or updating to the latest version, or repairing permissions, or using fsck -y, tcfix, reset-all, etc. But eventually problems build up in which I have never found a resolve for (and neither has anyone else), and because I have such a big pet peeve about searching (will probably be reduced come Tiger time), if such a problem gets annoying, then I refresh my machine. Always works.

About the unstable software part: Yes, I'm well aware that programs with bugs/memory leaks/etc. can quickly screw up your system. But every refresh, I become increasingly more cautious about what software I use. In fact, my willingness to launch a P2P application has been reduced to almost zero because of that alone (and the legal issues). (Scary, huh?) So I find (better) alternatives to such whenever I can. Example: mldonkey command-line client with web interface.

But now that I have a big enough OWC Neptune external Hard Drive with a bright glowing blue light, backing up my data is also fun.

Err, anyways... new_media, try other CDs, like another OS disk, as well as a bootable software disk from something like Norton. If you can boot off the Norton disk but not the OS disks, then you should see if you can get the original disks. There was a similar problem posted earlier in the week (don't make me search for the thread), and that happened to be the case, as well.

I agree with King Cobra - you probably have a bad CD.
The only reason I refresh my system is to get rid of command-line applications that I don't know how to get rid of.

 

[rand()]

backatcha

Completely disagree. I've been using Macs for 12 years (never having to switch, either).

Disagree backatcha. But I don't completely disagree with you.

19-12 - you were 7? (notice the math skills ) Impresive. You've been with the Mac quite a while... buuuut.... I gotcha beat. Good ol' 1988 for me. Coincidentally, I was 7 also.

Anyways, why I disagree. I should say, I spend quite a bit of time reinstalling during the summer on 14 eMacs/iMacs/PowerMacs we run iMovie, Final Cut Pro, and Photoshop on at the High School/Public Access TV station where I work. But that's once a year, and for the reason you stated; clearing out the junk. It's much easier to format and start fresh than to track down Student's files to no end. But that reinstall is the easy way out - it is not performance related whatsoever.

(I wasn't aware of an Appleworks stuterring problem, but that's probably because I've never used Appleworks for more than 3 minutes in 6 monthes... I'm a big fan of Org myself.)

Anyways, back almost-on-topic. My personal Mac I wouldn't reinstall the OS on unless something catastrophic happened. THAT'S NOT TO SAY I DON'T BACKUP MY DATA!!! I'm just as paranoid as the next geek. But there's only one user on my personal Mac, and I keep a very close eye on him. And I have never - on any Mac of mine - noticed the slow deterioration of performance that has plagued Windows machines since 1.0. The only time I'll format and start over is with a new version. I'm scheduling my next format for the first quarter of '05, thanks.

Now, after I install Gentoo's new OS X enabled Portage system on my Mac, it'll probably be a different story.

And I agree with you as well on the CD - try another. And for cripes sake, would you respond, new_media? It's so annoying when you try to help out somebody and then they never come back to tell you if things worked out or not! Am I right guys?

All in good fun, King Cobra. Always great to talk to other Mac fans - even if they're a bit compulsive about re-installing

-rand()

 

[King Cobra]

19-12 - you were 7? (notice the math skills ) Impresive. You've been with the Mac quite a while... buuuut.... I gotcha beat. Good ol' 1988 for me. Coincidentally, I was 7 also.

Actually, I was 6 at the time, but I'm not sure if it was 6.2, or 6.5, or 6.7, etc., so I'm being "nice" about the 12 year mark. It's actually more like 12.5 years of using a Mac. Also, I wasn't born in the same year as you were...well, I don't think so, at least. Your profile doesn't say, and your website isn't loading past "Connecting to...."

 

[rand()]

Actually, I was 6 at the time, but I'm not sure if it was 6.2, or 6.5, or 6.7, etc., so I'm being "nice" about the 12 year mark. It's actually more like 12.5 years of using a Mac. Also, I wasn't born in the same year as you were...well, I don't think so, at least. Your profile doesn't say, and your website isn't loading past "Connecting to...."

If I was 7 in 1988 then... oh, nevermind. I'm 23. 2004-1988 = 16 years of using the Mac.

Thanks for letting me know about my site. I'll see if it's something on my end or my ISP.

Keep rockin!
-rand()

edit: website - Darnit! I had a record uptime going! Oh well. It's an 8 year old intel box... what can you do?

 

[King Cobra]

Give a literal meaning to kicking its ass...

 

[rand()]

Nah. I think I'll just get more old PC's and cluster them. he he ..... nothing like polishing a terd with more terds.

 

[King Cobra]

Nothing like it at all... especially once you start washing one turd out from where it came from.

Of course, you could always do a hands-on experiment and polish the turd with TP and Lysol.

Then, when you're done with that, you can start cleaning out the insides with Ajax to prevent excess build-up of odors.

Afterwards, just repeat for the other turds you want to connect together. And when you're finished, you can spray the turd with Orange-Glo to give it back its natural color.

 

[Horrortaxi]

I just checked with my wife and in the last 18 years of using Macs she's had to reinstall the OS 3 times.

When I was 6 we didn't have computers yet. But we had bell bottoms, disco, and a gas crisis. I had to wait until I was about 11 to get my hands on an Apple II-C. I can't remember making it do anything useful though.