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[Challenge]Express your logic without heated debate.

P

Personalrumor

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 8, 2011
1
0
First off, this community is full of intelligent and well rounded users which makes the topic I'm introducing possible. Before linking threads similar to this lets please assume somewhere things became heated and everyone put up their mental walls on certain ideas.

If you choose to participate please:

  • Do not flame or argue against the person above you
  • Keep the idea of your response clear as well as to the point, (short as possible)
  • Indicate which question(s) you're answering to, example below
  • If your idea is positive to the question/topic, text color your comment green, negative to the question/topic, red.

Example:​

>1> The functionality of apple products has kept me a life time user
Click to expand...

1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?
​

Feel free to PM me suggestions or additional topics, thanks and looking forward to reading!
 
1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?
Click to expand...

How can a macbook (or anything else for that matter) perform outside it's limitations more efficiently? I guess I don't understand.

Steve Ballmer... you're a hoot. Do you know what day this is? Why aren't you with your mother? :D
 
Prodo123 said:
Seconded.
Click to expand...

Motion to abolish green as a color used in this poll, especially against a gray background. Do you dislike readability, or you want to try and make it impossible for any color blind person to participate? This color has raised my ire!
 
1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?
Click to expand...
I don't understand the question.

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?
Click to expand...
our lives our poor, nasty, brutish, and short. i prefer to spend my time working with stuff i enjoy, and the mac has already helped me get more done, so the price is justified in terms of pleasure and productivity.

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?
Click to expand...
i don't understand the question. what does it mean to get your "entire payments worth"? as for apple's marketing, i have no complaints. in fact, they are the only company i know that updates their products with new software throughout the product life cycle (in the case of ipods and ipads). thanks to the OS updates to my ipod1, i feel like i get a new device every few months. knowing about their commitment to after sale support, i bought the ipad1, and i will surely purchase another ipod in the future. i am not even considering any of the honeycomb swarms until i hear from someone that they intend to provide the same level of support.
 
palpatine said:
In fact, they are the only company i know that updates their products with new software throughout the product life cycle (in the case of ipods and ipads). thanks to the OS updates to my ipod1, i feel like i get a new device every few months. knowing about their commitment to after sale support, i bought the ipad1, and i will surely purchase another ipod in the future. i am not even considering any of the honeycomb swarms until i hear from someone that they intend to provide the same level of support.
Click to expand...

2. I second this!
The reason why i buy Apple products is because they give frequent updates to your products' operating system. Another thing is that they update their generations yearly as opposed to other brands that updates in ~6 months which renders their previous products obsolete quite fast. (eg. the Samsung Galaxy S, HTC)
So therefore i buy from Apple because of the way they retain its customers so well.
 
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1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?

I assume you're referring to any application not developed by Apple. My answer to that is yes. Adobe products are a good starting example, I could elaborate on others, if necessary.

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?

I would have to say that most PC manufacturers give you more frequent updates to product lines. I think that there are several reasons that the price of a Mac is justified. Personally, the OS and trackpad (MacBook Pros) make up for most of the price differential.

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?

Do you think it's their intent to try to get present Mac users to upgrade with every refresh?
 
ender land said:
That green is painful to read.
Click to expand...

Agreed.

I don't really see the point of this debate other than to start a flame war. I prefer Mac's over PC's due to my involvement in the IT field over 10 years, it's a personal preference. Yes I feel they are more reliable but it comes down to what you are using them for.

I unfortunately need win7 on my MBP due to a few programs used at work that have not developed software compatible with apple.
 
1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?

Well in this sense I think it depends on the specs of the system. The major difference (I believe) between Macs and PCs is obviously the OS. I love the OS X, so much more than Windows, because of how... finely tuned it is to help me be more efficient. It seems as if, compared to Windows, it's made to be very easy and simple to use and pick up, however to us more experienced users it is very, very efficient and allows you to do whatever you need in amazing time.

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?

The high price of the Macs? The overall experience. The build quality is amazing. After having my Blackbook for about 2 months now, I still sit back from time to time and marvel at its beauty. The trackpad is amazing, the keys are perfectly spaced apart, the display is great, and the battery life is great as well.
The experience is the best around too, if something were to go wrong. Opposed to other computers made by other companies, you have the luxury and ability to go to an actual Apple store where you can get the computer fixed somewhat quicker than if you took it to Best Buy or something where they had to order the part and fix it over some length of time.

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?

Overall, I think they make their products very appealing and I see many people buying newer products while still owning very powerful, somewhat new past products.
Personally I'd never really just buy the new thing because I just don't feel that it's rational to do taking money into account. I'm a college student so I don't have money to burn. I scored my Mac online at a great price and love it that much more because of this. I plan on keeping mine until it breaks and then will think about upgrading.
 
First off, this community is full of intelligent and well rounded users which makes the topic I'm introducing possible. Before linking threads similar to this lets please assume somewhere things became heated and everyone put up their mental walls on certain ideas.

If you choose to participate please:

Do not flame or argue against the person above you
Keep the idea of your response clear as well as to the point, (short as possible)
Indicate which question(s) you're answering to, example below
If your idea is positive to the question/topic, text color your comment green, negative to the question/topic, red.
Click to expand...

Honestly you people don't listen. Read the context which was provided in the base post. Keep your responses clear and to the point...I don't think discussing how the green color is to light and it strains your poor, non-aknoledgable eyes. And if you don't like the main questions, make your own and answer them. EXAMPLE:

I don't want to answer any of these questions, so let me ask you this. Do you beleive Snow Leopard has improved compared to Leopard? Yes, I do beleive the advancements have surely improved with the release of Snow Leopard. Though there are situations where Snow Leopard was not the best, but it still pulls through it's deprived ability. Obviously I love the wallpaper, too :)

All this from a 14 year old.
 
1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?
I don't understand the question. But generally speaking, the more powerful the computer, the more efficiently it will do anything.

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?
I don't understand this either. Whether buying a Mac or an iOS device, they will last you 4-6 years easily. Upgrading is a matter of choice. It's not like the older devices stop working.

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?
Very few people upgrade their computers at that kind of interval. Personally, I work from my computer, so if upgrades are worth the price of admission, I'll sell my computer and buy a new one. Those kinds of upgrades are pretty rare. Something like an IPS or Adobe RGB display would get me to upgrade from my current MBP. Very few other things could make me want to upgrade anytime soon.
 
1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?​

I think Macbook Pro's perform excellent at what they do, and other outside apps.

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?

When you buy a Mac, you know your probably not getting the best hardware out there , but you know your getting the best OS out there , which comes backed up by Apple's Support Team. To me , that makes my purchase justified and I don't feel I have to jump on the next big product to come out because I know the product I bought will last me for a long time, as quality of the product is good and durable.

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?
​


I don't understand this question, sorry.
 
KazeKrazy said:
Honestly you people don't listen. Read the context which was provided in the base post. Keep your responses clear and to the point...I don't think discussing how the green color is to light and it strains your poor, non-aknoledgable eyes. And if you don't like the main questions, make your own and answer them. EXAMPLE:

I don't want to answer any of these questions, so let me ask you this. Do you beleive Snow Leopard has improved compared to Leopard? Yes, I do beleive the advancements have surely improved with the release of Snow Leopard. Though there are situations where Snow Leopard was not the best, but it still pulls through it's deprived ability. Obviously I love the wallpaper, too :)

All this from a 14 year old.
Click to expand...

I am mesmerized by the largeness of your font. The typos look magnificent in that size. I am also impressed by the vigorous waving of your age banner.

I think that Mozart wrote his first symphony at 8, so ranting in big letters with typos and insulting our eyes doesn't seem like that big of an accomplishment for a 14 year old.


To answer the OP's questions:

1. Yeah, my machine runs all of my apps well. Aside from utilities, I don't use any actual Apple applications.

2. Good stuff costs more.

3. How do you quantify the value of the "entire payment's worth"? Unless you're using 3 year depreciation as a fixed asset for your business I don't know how that would work.
 
johnnj said:
I am mesmerized by the largeness of your font. The typos look magnificent in that size. I am also impressed by the vigorous waving of your age banner.

I think that Mozart wrote his first symphony at 8, so ranting in big letters with typos and insulting our eyes doesn't seem like that big of an accomplishment for a 14 year old.
Click to expand...

I agree with you but I don't think he was implying he was a prodigy, as was Mozart. It does hurt his argument that there is an over abundance of typos throughout his rant.
 
acedickson said:
I agree with you but I don't think he was implying he was a prodigy, as was Mozart. It does hurt his argument that there is an over abundance of typos throughout his rant.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know, but he states his age either as an excuse or as evidence of wisdom beyond his years in his various postings.
 
Personalrumor said:
First off, this community is full of intelligent and well rounded users which makes the topic I'm introducing possible. Before linking threads similar to this lets please assume somewhere things became heated and everyone put up their mental walls on certain ideas.

If you choose to participate please:

  • Do not flame or argue against the person above you
  • Keep the idea of your response clear as well as to the point, (short as possible)
  • Indicate which question(s) you're answering to, example below
  • If your idea is positive to the question/topic, text color your comment green, negative to the question/topic, red.

Example:​



1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?

3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?
​

Feel free to PM me suggestions or additional topics, thanks and looking forward to reading!
Click to expand...

i'll bite, except i'm modifying your color code scheme. Black is neutral. Red is good. Green is bad. For context, I'm a grad student.

1. The answer is no. It has the same intel + nvidia/amd components that any pc has. There is no logical reason why those components would run any faster than a pc from a pure power standpoint with the same parts.
2. Well, you're paying for a few more things than the typical pc. First, apple has really really good customer service. I can go to any apple store in the world and they can fix most hardware problems while I wait. Second, according to consumer report's statistics, apples have some of the lowest failure rates according to their statistics, so there is better component testing involved to ensure less problems down the road. Next, the case of the computer is really well put together. Rather than the usual plastic of PCs, the macbook pros are made of a metal composite of some sort. In addition, apples are generally a bit lighter than their PC counterparts and have better battery life compared to similarly speced PCs. Also the apple keyboards and trackpads, in my opinion, are far superior to their pc counterparts. The lack of esata and usb 3, though, are unfortunate. Firewire 800 is good, but needlessly expensive for an external hard drive compared to esata. Also, esata is faster anyway.

Finally, many people on this forum will probably say that OSX is superior to windows 7. Perhaps that alone is a good enough reason to pay the premium. Perhaps not. That is completely subjective. Personally, I own a windows 7 desktop and a macbook pro. I find both osx and windows 7 to be pretty good. Windows 7 has a few annoyances like the way the taskbar works..if you have more than one thing open for a program, you have to click the icon and then click up to the correct window. In osx, you save a second or so because clicking defaults to the last used window of that application. Holding and then clicking the window switches windows. This is a much more efficient solution, as I am usually just using the same window of an application over and over again. That's just one example, but there are definitely a few usability improvements in OSX. At the same time, windows microsoft office is better and has more programs than OSX. The lack of onenote, in particular, in osx is a big disappointment. As someone who is pretty much consistently using some MS office program at all times, that's a big decision factor alone. So, software-wise, the answer is completely subjective based on usage patterns and personal taste.

3. This question makes no sense the way you wrote it. Assuming you're asking if I would just go out and buy a refreshed apple product without doing research...generally I would do research on any electronic product that I buy before purchase, and I only buy something electronic if I actually need it. So, I wouldn't just go out any buy a new macbook pro unless 1) the reviews are generally favorable 2) I go and look at it at an apple store 3) I actually need to for some reason.
 
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1. Do you believe high end portable computers, Macbook pros specifically can perform tasks outside operating system limitations (meaning not apple applications) dramatically more efficiently?

I believe high end portable such as MBP will continue to evade where the current desktop is. The Sandy Bridge is a good example of this, and we will continue to see that in Ivy Bridge with 3D transistor migration.

I doubt it'll ever evade the server market, but for a desktop usage? I totally think so..

2. While cosmetically appealing, high production quality apparent and enforced; what to you justifies the high price on an item which (compared to other materialistic wants/needs) has a short life time before upgrades are implemented?

I actually don't. I'd not pay nearly $3000 on the MBP that I currently use if I were to purchase it myself. This is bought from my work, and I find it very difficult to justify the 2x cost compare to other vendors. Aside from cosmetic and other quality issues (but then, I also think Apple's QA has gotten worse over time as well), of course.



3. Do you feel that Apple markets efficiently enough for you to buy a refreshed product before you have seen your entire payments worth?

They definitely do, and I fell for that.. But then, I am starting to think that Apple has its own set of issues, instead of fixing all the issues in Windows or Linux world.
 
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