Do Vinyl Records Degrade After a Few Plays/Uses?

[HappyDude20]

I heard that after two dozen play through a of a vinyl record that this actually degraded the sound where it’ll never sound as crisp and clear as initially during the first few times played.

I heard that after a hundred times you’ve played through a vinyl record that you may as well listen to the CD version since they’re pretty much indistinguishable.

I bring this up because I’m wanting to purchase a few vinyls of my favorite band but considering I listen to at least two of their albums per day I’m wondering if it would even be worth it.

I’ve never owned vinyls or a record player but would love to listen to music in that super amazing quality.

 

[casperes1996]

Without wanting to go into comparing digital and analogue and creating another audiophile war, God bless the should of the casualties of the last great audio wars of 96+KHz audio. - Well, as long as you treat your records well, don't let your needs carry dust, debris and such across the surface, clean them properly and so on, it shouldn't harm them to be played, no. Mishandling of the record will damage it, but treat it properly and I'm 99% certain you won't be able to tell the difference from a brand new print and 1000 plays.
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Just want to add that I have, probably, around 100 vinyl records all in all. For convenience I mostly listen to Apple Music, but I love vinyl, and have some really great classics. I can recommend getting a proper vinyl cleaning brush.

 

[HappyDude20]

Without wanting to go into comparing digital and analogue and creating another audiophile war, God bless the should of the casualties of the last great audio wars of 96+KHz audio. - Well, as long as you treat your records well, don't let your needs carry dust, debris and such across the surface, clean them properly and so on, it shouldn't harm them to be played, no. Mishandling of the record will damage it, but treat it properly and I'm 99% certain you won't be able to tell the difference from a brand new print and 1000 plays.
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Just want to add that I have, probably, around 100 vinyl records all in all. For convenience I mostly listen to Apple Music, but I love vinyl, and have some really great classics. I can recommend getting a proper vinyl cleaning brush.

Good advice, thank you.

I recall a few years ago I wanted to get into vinyl. Many stores such as Target and Walmart were selling these plastic record players that were portable, could play vinyls and had built in weak speakers, and a USB port for less than $80. A buddy of mine say that if I could find a usable record player from a thrift shop that the thrift shop find would probably be better than a new plastic version sold from Walmart.

Then I heard some of these new 'cheap' plastic record players have the usb functionality so you can import the music onto your computer. I personally wouldn't mind buying the vinyl and CD version of each album.

When you mention careful cleaning and proper handling, I don't know if you're saying to go all out and even wear lint free gloves while changing vinyls but maybe you are. As for keep the vinyls and record player and needles clean, im guessing there are sprays and perhaps alcohol solutions to give a quick wipe after daily use?

I tend to visit thrift shops at least once a month and the amount of vinyls for under a dollar is staggering. I wouldn't mind owning even random Bing Crosby classics.

Personally, I'm thinking about finding a record player for around $100 and finding speakers... but admittedly right now I have a great surround sound speaker from LogiTech, that I'm hoping I can just connect to the new record player. As much as I love a simple AUX cable, I'm guessing for the best sound it would be best to go with the classic red/yellow/white cable (don't know what that's called).

These are the speakers I have. The subwoofer is heavy and overall this is currently connected to my 50 inch TV and the sound is crazy loud and pretty damn good:

Logitech Z906 5.1 Surround Sound Speaker System - THX, Dolby Digital and DTS Digital Certified - Black

Logitech Surround Sound Speaker System Z906. Hear every detail, all around you in theater quality 5.1 sound.

www.amazon.com

Edit: Just saw this in the LogiTech description (including picture) that they connect via either AUX headphone jack, which is what im currently using to connect to me HDTV and they sound pretty damn good, but also RCA (which im guessing is the white/red/yellow cables), six channel direct, coaxial inout or optical input.

One of those options has to be the best and one the worst right?

 

[MacUser2525]

Good advice, thank you.

I recall a few years ago I wanted to get into vinyl. Many stores such as Target and Walmart were selling these plastic record players that were portable, could play vinyls and had built in weak speakers, and a USB port for less than $80. A buddy of mine say that if I could find a usable record player from a thrift shop that the thrift shop find would probably be better than a new plastic version sold from Walmart.

Then I heard some of these new 'cheap' plastic record players have the usb functionality so you can import the music onto your computer. I personally wouldn't mind buying the vinyl and CD version of each album.

When you mention careful cleaning and proper handling, I don't know if you're saying to go all out and even wear lint free gloves while changing vinyls but maybe you are. As for keep the vinyls and record player and needles clean, im guessing there are sprays and perhaps alcohol solutions to give a quick wipe after daily use?

I tend to visit thrift shops at least once a month and the amount of vinyls for under a dollar is staggering. I wouldn't mind owning even random Bing Crosby classics.

Personally, I'm thinking about finding a record player for around $100 and finding speakers... but admittedly right now I have a great surround sound speaker from LogiTech, that I'm hoping I can just connect to the new record player. As much as I love a simple AUX cable, I'm guessing for the best sound it would be best to go with the classic red/yellow/white cable (don't know what that's called).

These are the speakers I have. The subwoofer is heavy and overall this is currently connected to my 50 inch TV and the sound is crazy loud and pretty damn good:

Logitech Z906 5.1 Surround Sound Speaker System - THX, Dolby Digital and DTS Digital Certified - Black

Logitech Surround Sound Speaker System Z906. Hear every detail, all around you in theater quality 5.1 sound.

www.amazon.com

Edit: Just saw this in the LogiTech description (including picture) that they connect via either AUX headphone jack, which is what im currently using to connect to me HDTV and they sound pretty damn good, but also RCA (which im guessing is the white/red/yellow cables), six channel direct, coaxial inout or optical input.

One of those options has to be the best and one the worst right?

The only option you have is stereo sound from a record player, anything that tells you different is lying. When I was young ages ago it seems now, there was nothing but records. If you take care of them then they should last forever. By taking care I mean keep them clean and protected in their sleeve. The needle can always use a little cleaning every once and a while too. I do not know how many times the idiocy of these "audiophiles" has been repeated, people do not have the level of hearing to make out any difference whether played one or a hundred times unless there has been major damage to the vinyl surface of the record. If you want the best results you have to do it old school and forget all the electronic stuff, it needs to have tubes that is a difference you can hear the sound is entirely different. Good luck finding that equipment now it is all electronic junk. Go with something reasonable priced not cheap all in ones deals you see, an amplifier, turntable and good speakers. That should do you for what you need.

 

[BrianBaughn]

It was always my belief that a crappy stylus could damage a vinyl record. It would seem that somewhere between (1) the finest stylus set at the perfect pressure and (2) a rusty nail, damage will happen.

 

[dwig]

It was always my belief that a crappy stylus could damage a vinyl record. It would seem that somewhere between (1) the finest stylus set at the perfect pressure and (2) a rusty nail, damage will happen.

Correct.
Vinyl is relatively soft and can be damaged. The old stiff, breakable records were very easily damaged. In general, modern inexpensive "record players" tend more towards "(2) a rusty nail" while the audiophile equipment from late in the previous century tend more toward "(1)", provided the stylus pressure and anti-skate adjustments are properly made.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

No.

As many have already helpfully noted (and I have a large vinyl collection), if you look after your records, and your needle (and ensure that the needle is a good quality needle), your records should still last a long time.

I have some LPs my parents bought in the 50s and 60s, (in their respective sleeves) and they still sound as good as they are meant to.

 

[BrianBaughn]

No.

As many have already helpfully noted (and I have a large vinyl collection), if you look after your records, and your needle (and ensure that the needle is a good quality needle), your records should still last a long time.

I have some LPs my parents bought in the 50s and 60s, (in their respective sleeves) and they still sound as good as they are meant to.

In my experience, LPs from the 50s and (early) 60s were made better and sound better than the ones put out in the 70s.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

In my experience, LPs from the 50s and (early) 60s were made better and sound better than the ones put out in the 70s.

Yes, they were; some of these superb albums (mostly classical, but some light operetta and jazz as well) date from the time my parents were dating in the 50s, and were mostly gifts to one another. At the time, they would have been quite expensive, as they were the best recordings of the day (Deutsche Gramophone, etc).

 

[BrianBaughn]

Yes, they were; some of these superb albums (mostly classical, but some light operetta and jazz as well) date from the time my parents were dating in the 50s, and were mostly gifts to one another. At the time, they would have been quite expensive, as they were the best recordings of the day (Deutsche Gramophone, etc).

True! Even country albums sounded excellent back then. My understanding is that in the 70s they stopped using virgin vinyl for the most part and went cheap on manufacturing and quality in general…brand new records would come out of the sleeve warped…the spindle hole off center…or both.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

True! Even country albums sounded excellent back then. My understanding is that in the 70s they stopped using virgin vinyl for the most part and went cheap on manufacturing and quality in general…brand new records would come out of the sleeve warped…the spindle hole off center…or both.

True, but, while by the 1970s, some labels remains uniformly excellent (and correspondingly expensive - Deutsche Grammophon are the obvious example) many labels had a "premium" version, which may have been marketed under a different name, which was both better quality in terms of materials and resources used, and - obviously - more expensive.

This principle applied even in the old Soviet Union; there, you had one recording company, the state-owned Melodiya. However, the labels on Melodiya, while identical in terms of logo, differed in colour. These colours represented the different categories (and quality) of recordings made, and one of them (I think it may have been the black coloured label) was reserved for quality recordings of classical music and ballet and opera, at which the Soviet Union excelled, which was also export quality.

 

[Roller]

Almost all turntables require physical contact between the stylus and vinyl record to reproduce sound, which inevitably causes some degradation over time. I say "almost" because specialized turntables can pick up the undulations in the grooves using lasers, avoiding this limitation. They're not inexpensive, however.

With appropriate attention to detail (use of high-quality cartridges & tonearms, proper force settings, periodic cleaning of the stylus and record, and so on), though, vinyl records should maintain sound quality for many years.

 

[flygbuss]

Have a look at the pro-ject stuff. It’s an Austrian company and they have solid record players and preamplifiers / amplifiers quite reasonably priced.

Pro-Ject Audio Systems – Turntables and hifi stereo components since 1991 | Handmade in Europe

www.project-audio.com

One thing most less vinyl experienced people have problems with in the beginning is the way how you listen to it. It’s much more of an active listening experience. You have to turn the record after 15 or 25 minutes. So it’s not like listening to a playlist on Spotify or Apple Music at all. You actually have to handle a recording medium and it’s a great experience!

Most of the newer releases come in 180g but that’s not necessarily a proof or sign for better sound. I have some really old vinyls from Deutsche Grammophon and Amiga and they are much thinner and sound splendid.

Get a good brush and protective covers for your records and everything is gonna be alright!

One more thing, because of the impedance good cables also matter when it comes to vinyl. I’m not talking about the voodoo cables for thousands of dollars, just some solid studio grade cables will do the trick.

Good luck!

 

[casperes1996]

I recall a few years ago I wanted to get into vinyl. Many stores such as Target and Walmart were selling these plastic record players that were portable, could play vinyls and had built in weak speakers, and a USB port for less than $80. A buddy of mine say that if I could find a usable record player from a thrift shop that the thrift shop find would probably be better than a new plastic version sold from Walmart.

I wouldn't recommend going that cheap on a turntable. Quality costs, but quality lasts. The one I use was my dad's and it's still in excellent shape, though it has been slightly refurbished over the years. Besides, this is an analogue medium. The quality of the equipment has a significant impact on the final audio produced. It's not like a digital audio file where any computer will process the same file the same way (given similar conditions and DAC).

When you mention careful cleaning and proper handling, I don't know if you're saying to go all out and even wear lint free gloves while changing vinyls but maybe you are. As for keep the vinyls and record player and needles clean, im guessing there are sprays and perhaps alcohol solutions to give a quick wipe after daily use?

Oh I don't go that far myself. I just make sure the needle is clean, give the record a quick brush and lookover before putting it on and that's about it. You don't need to go all out super-saiyajin about it.

I tend to visit thrift shops at least once a month and the amount of vinyls for under a dollar is staggering. I wouldn't mind owning even random Bing Crosby classics.

Got a lot of records that way as well. Simon and Garfunkel, Van Halen, Neil Young - good stuff can be found for not a lot that way.

Personally, I'm thinking about finding a record player for around $100 and finding speakers... but admittedly right now I have a great surround sound speaker from LogiTech, that I'm hoping I can just connect to the new record player. As much as I love a simple AUX cable, I'm guessing for the best sound it would be best to go with the classic red/yellow/white cable (don't know what that's called).

I will add that the type of connector is not as important as the quality of the cable. I play guitar, and between two 6.3mm jack cables you can tell the difference. The connectors are both 6.3mm jacks, but the difference in the level of noice between them can be huge. Now I assume those Logitech-thingies are active speakers. Get a pre-amp, connect the turntable to that, and work with what the pre-amp has got. If they are passive, of course you need an amp as well. But $100 really isn't a lot to get into vinyl for I'm afraid. The initial investment for good gear can take a bit, but with the right stuff, could last a lifetime or two.

These are the speakers I have. The subwoofer is heavy and overall this is currently connected to my 50 inch TV and the sound is crazy loud and pretty damn good:

Now I may just be acting an audiophile snob, but I've never looked at Logitech as an audio company. They make tech. Computer peripherals and gimmicks. But again that's properly just audiophile snobbery. Just don't think I've ever heard proper hi-fi from Logitech.

The only option you have is stereo sound from a record player, anything that tells you different is lying. When I was young ages ago it seems now, there was nothing but records. If you take care of them then they should last forever. By taking care I mean keep them clean and protected in their sleeve. The needle can always use a little cleaning every once and a while too. I do not know how many times the idiocy of these "audiophiles" has been repeated, people do not have the level of hearing to make out any difference whether played one or a hundred times unless there has been major damage to the vinyl surface of the record. If you want the best results you have to do it old school and forget all the electronic stuff, it needs to have tubes that is a difference you can hear the sound is entirely different. Good luck finding that equipment now it is all electronic junk. Go with something reasonable priced not cheap all in ones deals you see, an amplifier, turntable and good speakers. That should do you for what you need.

Whilst generally true, there was actually an exception. The Star Wars soundtrack has been released in surround sound on vinyl. They did a bunch of clever things to achieve it, though the outcome is that without a signal splitting box, it still sounds, sort of right in stereo, but not at all as good as the proper stereo version, because the signal is scratched in quite differently to allow for the splitting. I don't know of any other record ever scratched for surround, so needless to say it's not so common to have such channel-splitting boxes. Also, if you shun a laser onto the centre of the record as it spun, a hologram would show up spinning around with the disc. Techmoan has a video on it

 

[Roller]

Have a look at the pro-ject stuff. It’s an Austrian company and they have solid record players and preamplifiers / amplifiers quite reasonably priced.

Pro-Ject Audio Systems – Turntables and hifi stereo components since 1991 | Handmade in Europe

www.project-audio.com

One thing most less vinyl experienced people have problems with in the beginning is the way how you listen to it. It’s much more of an active listening experience. You have to turn the record after 15 or 25 minutes. So it’s not like listening to a playlist on Spotify or Apple Music at all. You actually have to handle a recording medium and it’s a great experience!

This is an excellent point. In at least one case, the activity was formally prompted by the lyrics. The final phrase in the Electric Light Orchestra's Mr. Blue Sky advises the listener to "please turn me over," albeit in a highly processed form that may have caused some to miss it. Jeff Lynne still includes it in live performances, though I suspect those who have never used vinyl records don't quite understand what it means.

 

[MacNut]

It's all the way you store it, Don't keep them in cold or hot places. Keep them out of moisture. Records will warp if not taken care of. As said, the needle is where the sound comes from, keep it clean and don't pull the arm across the record.

 

[casperes1996]

and don't pull the arm across the record.

Ob God, please tell me nobody has done that... Lift before moving... My body hurts just thinking of that.

 

[MacUser2525]

Whilst generally true, there was actually an exception. The Star Wars soundtrack has been released in surround sound on vinyl. They did a bunch of clever things to achieve it, though the outcome is that without a signal splitting box, it still sounds, sort of right in stereo, but not at all as good as the proper stereo version, because the signal is scratched in quite differently to allow for the splitting. I don't know of any other record ever scratched for surround, so needless to say it's not so common to have such channel-splitting boxes. Also, if you shun a laser onto the centre of the record as it spun, a hologram would show up spinning around with the disc. Techmoan has a video on it

Well you do indeed learn something new every day , never thought that was possible with a record or every heard of that possibility until now. Even googled to make sure you were not full of it, apparently not accornding to one hit at least I have just read..

 

[DakotaGuy]

Vinyl records will last a very long time and keep excellent sound quality as long as you handle them with care and keep them clean. You don’t have to go overboard with it. Just use common sense and store them right. A better quality turntable will be easier on them and at minimum you should use a table with a magnetic cartridge and diamond stylus. Most cheap all-in-one record players have a ceramic cartridge and track at a quite high force. Many also come stock with a low quality sapphire stylus. These are all things that not only increase record wear, but will give you poor sound quality. You can find a nice vintage turntable, however sometimes if your just getting into records your better off starting out with a new entry to mid level proper turntable. Take a look at the Audio Technica line. They offer some decent entry level turntables that have good reviews and good sound quality.

The only other advice I can give to you is the plural of vinyl is vinyl. If you want to add an “s” you can say vinyl records or just records. Now I personally don’t really care what people call them, but I know plenty of vinyl enthusiasts that will give you a really hard time for saying vinyls. At least you called it a record player and not a vinyl player. That really drives them crazy! Good luck and I think you should give it a try. It’s a fun hobby.

 

[konqerror]

Well you do indeed learn something new every day , never thought that was possible with a record or every heard of that possibility until now. Even googled to make sure you were not full of it, apparently not accornding to one hit at least I have just read..

Yes, there were analog ways of getting quadraphonic sound into two channels. The main method was by changing the phase of the rear channels and mixing it in with the front.

Stereo Quadraphonic - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

This idea, called matrix surround, keeps being reused. In analog video, the most popular was Dolby Surround/Pro Logic, which was used to get surround sound over stereo TV broadcasts. People still turn on Pro Logic on 2-channel sources, even online videos, to get simulated surround sound. Even in the digital world, we had Dolby Digital EX and DTS ES which was a way of cramming 6.1 surround on a 5.1 DVD soundtrack.

There were also methods of getting 4 discrete channels into a phonograph record, by modulating the second channels at high frequency.

Compatible Discrete 4 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Eventually, systems were demonstrated with enough bandwidth to get video on mechanical phonographs, though they were just not reliable and died.

Television Electronic Disc - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[retta283]

As others have said, try to get some high quality equipment, the cheap stuff usually isn't very good. I have an old one I got in 74-75 that has been working great, I paid a premium for it back then.

Just make sure no matter what do not stack the records on each other, they will bend down and warp on each other. Easy way to destroy a whole collection.

 

[ThisBougieLife]

They can degrade over time, yes, but I agree that if you take care of them and play them with a properly aligned cartridge, you're unlikely to notice any damage you might cause through regular use. The only damaged records I've heard were old ones I picked up thrift stores that had obviously been played with a badly-aligned cartridge, especially considering the worst distortion was around the inner grooves (IGD is not inevitable, despite what some might say; if records are in good shape and you have an advanced enough stylus, you shouldn't hear any).

 

[Roller]

It's all the way you store it, Don't keep them in cold or hot places. Keep them out of moisture. Records will warp if not taken care of. As said, the needle is where the sound comes from, keep it clean and don't pull the arm across the record.

Funny you should say "needle." When I was a kid, we had a record player that used a very short, sharp metal stylus that was held in place by a screw — a true needle. I bet those things gouged the heck out of vinyl, but the records were thicker and heavier than they are today. I still have one that only was recorded on one side, as well as a few 78 RPM platters.

My sister got a cheap portable turntable when she was a teenager. I remember putting a coin or two on the tonearm when the stylus skipped, which I'm sure did a lot of harm.

 

[MacNut]

Funny you should say "needle." When I was a kid, we had a record player that used a very short, sharp metal stylus that was held in place by a screw — a true needle. I bet those things gouged the heck out of vinyl, but the records were thicker and heavier than they are today. I still have one that only was recorded on one side, as well as a few 78 RPM platters.

My sister got a cheap portable turntable when she was a teenager. I remember putting a coin or two on the tonearm when the stylus skipped, which I'm sure did a lot of harm.

Growing up my parents had the stackable turntable. You could load 5 records and they would drop down.

 

[flygbuss]

Yes, there were analog ways of getting quadraphonic sound into two channels. The main method was by changing the phase of the rear channels and mixing it in with the front.

Stereo Quadraphonic - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

This idea, called matrix surround, keeps being reused. In analog video, the most popular was Dolby Surround/Pro Logic, which was used to get surround sound over stereo TV broadcasts. People still turn on Pro Logic on 2-channel sources, even online videos, to get simulated surround sound. Even in the digital world, we had Dolby Digital EX and DTS ES which was a way of cramming 6.1 surround on a 5.1 DVD soundtrack.

There is also Dolby SVA or Dolby Analog with 4 discrete channels (left, center, right, mono surround) which is encoded via Dolby encoder to LtRt (left total, right total).
That kinda works as a pure stereo signal too although it tends to negative phase correlation (compared to LoRo) as soon as you have higher sound levels in the encoded rear channel.

Dolby Analog is still added to Dolby feature film copies as a backup in case the digital stream fails.

Since it was pretty easy to include two (encoded) analog audio tracks to VHS or other two track systems it became very popular on a consumer and brodacaster level.

Side note: The term 'LtRt' is also used for encoded Pro Logic (I, II) though it's technically not the same.
I might be wrong but I think Pro Logic II supports up to 8 channels (7.1) encoded in only two channels.

Sorry in case this is too off topic.