Final Cut Pro 3 Question

[agreenster]

I've imported a series of frames (tiffs) with an alpha channel and want to export a quicktime movie. Is it possible to keep the alpha channel, and if so, how do I do this??? Im new to FCP, obviously.

TIA

agreenster

 

[Mr. Anderson]

I've upgraded to 4 - but it should be simillar - select the alpha type under the modify menu and see what happens

D

 

[agreenster]

I see that menu, but I guess I dont know what it means. I know it sounds confusing, but here's what I am doing:

Ive animated a character to comp over a DV movie. I have two passes, a hero pass (the character) and a shadow pass. Problem is, they look too clean for the plate. (no compression) So, I want to import the animation frames, (which Ive done) export them as a quicktime movie with DV compression and an alpha channel, then import that QT movie back in and comp it over the plate.

EDIT

The reason I dont want to just comp them in and just export a DV QT movie is because then I will be compressing the BG twice, once on original taping and once on the export. I'd like to compress the character (hero) pass and import, and then do no compression on the second export.

 

[LethalWolfe]

If I understand what you are wanting to do, export you animation from FCP 3 as DV so it won't look as "clean" and then re-import it back into FCP 3 for compositing, then I think the answer is "no." I don't work w/alpha channels very much so I could be wrong, but AFAIK video is "flat", it has no layers. What you could do is place your animation on a pure white, black, or green background. Then when you re-import the footage you would just have to key out the white/black/green background.

What about on the program you made the animation with? Does it have any export settings you could play with?


Lethal

 

[agreenster]

Well, Ive been doing some playing and it seems that FCP wont export a QT movie with alpha. I know it sounds like bogus, but I know QT can support an alpha channel because I used to export them all the time from Flash. (I was making a short movie with an animated character over a filmed BG, and would animate in flash and export it to QT to import into Premiere---which was about 4 years ago. Sheesh)

Anyway, using the "green key" approach is a great suggestion. I might end up doing that.

The animation software is Maya, but Im not sure what other settings to dink with in order to get what I want. I could render out a pure alpha render and use it to mask the compressed hero pass, but then the edges would still be crisp when I comp it.

Although, when I use the "black" alpha setting, it does look pretty good, even without compression. (soft, 2-3 pixels egde, which is nice)

Anyway....back to playing....

 

[Mr. Anderson]

Well, if qt supports it, what about creating a sequence of files (32 bit, that have an alpha) import that into quicktime and save it out in DV compression - then take that movie and comp it in FCP?

D

 

[Laslo Panaflex]

If you have the means, I would use shake to layer the image over the plate and make the composite shot. With shake you could degrade the maya animation and add film grain and such to make it look like it fits the scene.

But, since you probably don't have 5 grand laying around, you might want to look into different plugin filters that might give you the same effect as shake nodes. Joes filters would be great place to start, I have never used any of these filters however because I use shake for all my compositing. FCP is a NLE not a compositor, but you might be able to hack your way through it in FCP and get decent results. It might also be easier to do the composite work in AE, it should do better job than FCP.

 

[LethalWolfe]

Originally posted by agreenster
Well, Ive been doing some playing and it seems that FCP wont export a QT movie with alpha. I know it sounds like bogus, but I know QT can support an alpha channel because I used to export them all the time from Flash. (I was making a short movie with an animated character over a filmed BG, and would animate in flash and export it to QT to import into Premiere---which was about 4 years ago. Sheesh)

Anyway, using the "green key" approach is a great suggestion. I might end up doing that.

The animation software is Maya, but Im not sure what other settings to dink with in order to get what I want. I could render out a pure alpha render and use it to mask the compressed hero pass, but then the edges would still be crisp when I comp it.

Although, when I use the "black" alpha setting, it does look pretty good, even without compression. (soft, 2-3 pixels egde, which is nice)

Anyway....back to playing....

You have to keep in mind that QuickTime is just a wrapper. You can have a variety of formats and codecs end in .mov. I think the problem you are running into is that DV does not support an alpha channel. I'm sure there are QT codecs/formats that do but DV, AFAIK, is not one of them.

As another poster suggested you might have more luck applying a filter to your animation to scuff it up a bit. Or even apply the same filter to your animation and BG to blend them together better.


Lethal

 

[agreenster]

Thanks for your imput fellas (fella-ettes?)

Anyway, the only QT codec that supports alpha (that Ive found so far) is the Animation compressor. I dont want to add film grain or anything because I want it to look like it was shot with DV (because thats the original format)

Anway, I know that FCP is just an editor, and shake isnt in my budget but it is seeming to work pretty good, especially since my final output is only going to be to VHS anyway, where everything looks like crap. I tested the simple comp on my output monitor, and you cant even tell the hero has been comped in, and both BG and hero have a similar enough amount of noise to make it believable.

So yeah, this is just for my demo reel, which is focused on animation anyway, not compositing or texture mapping or anything. I'll get it on a website hopefully soon so yall can check it out.

 

[Laslo Panaflex]

Originally posted by agreenster
Anyway, the only QT codec that supports alpha (that Ive found so far) is the Animation compressor.

Here are a list of codecs in quicktime that support alpha channels, you can try them out an see which ones you like:

Animation, Photoshop, Targa, TIFF, and AVI.

 

[bajpaiabhinav]

Chroma tricks

Well render the sequence by giving it 'I' & 'O' & then take it to motion . cut the chroma in motion using upper fields & lower fields having de- interlaced . & then you may have the better quality of chroma . appart from that you may also use spill suppresser filter to refine your chroma if shooted badly.

Abhinav Bajpai

 

[Cromulent]

Well render the sequence by giving it 'I' & 'O' & then take it to motion . cut the chroma in motion using upper fields & lower fields having de- interlaced . & then you may have the better quality of chroma . appart from that you may also use spill suppresser filter to refine your chroma if shooted badly.

Abhinav Bajpai

Nice . Just bumped a 4 year old thread.