Fit to screen button poll for Mac / Windows users

[kirkbross]

C'mon Apple... I know you don't like copying Microsoft and I don't either... but you gotta lose the green + toggle for windows and add a fit to screen button. This is no longer funny. Your only excuse is if there is a copyright, TM or patent issue, but somehow I think it's pure stubborness and you think the green toggle is useful.

For those of you who have never owned or used a PC, this poll is not for you. For people who have used both, how many of you would like to see a "Fit To Screen" toggle button instead of a green + for OS windows?

 

[Tallest Skil]

Nope. That's not the way things work in the Mac OS. Get used to it or don't use it. You're not supposed to full screen things in OS X. It's a multitasking OS.

In switching, you've made concessions in other fields. Make one more.

 

[mrkgoo]

I find i do not need a maximise as much as I thought I did. In the programs that I do need it, there is often a fullscreen button.

 

[Aea]

Shift + Green = Full Screen?

Could work, my problem with the toggle is that it doesn't even work as intended. Half the time instead of "fitting" to the contents, it decides to resize to an unusable size and lop off half of what I want to see. This bugs me so much I even have a bookmarklet:

javascript:self.moveTo(0,0);self.resizeTo(screen.availWidth,screen.availHeight);

to full screen Safari. Beyond annoying, but I think most of the resizing logic takes place in application code so there isn't too much apple can do about it without adding the full screen option.

P.S. And make windows far in the background transparent, without resizing manually to fit the whole window or minimizing or hiding the appearance of OSX is more like a stack of windows, not helpful at all.

 

[Aea]

Nope. That's not the way things work in the Mac OS. Get used to it or don't use it. You're not supposed to full screen things in OS X. It's a multitasking OS.

In switching, you've made concessions in other fields. Make one more.

I hate to doubt post, but .

That's fine that it was "designed" like that, the problem is the design is flawed because there are many times when the resize doesn't work properly, and when you have a lot of windows "multitasking" they only contribute to the clutter.

I for instance have multiple displays and prefer to have one program running in one window, if I want to stack windows, I have the choice, but sometimes I don't. I'd love to have a universal full screen shortcut, it'll make me more production because I wouldn't need to resize windows all the time.

There are many things with OSX that aren't intuitive or simply features that are missing, in switching to OSX you're switching to a better OS (subjective), and there's nothing bad about wanting features that you see as being missing.

Also, I would really love to be able to set my dock as a virtual barrier and keep windows from moving below or into it, that's just plain annoying as suddenly the visibility of icons on your dock is dramatically decreased, especially in leopard where it's practically transparent.

 

[belvdr]

You're not supposed to full screen things in OS X. It's a multitasking OS.

In switching, you've made concessions in other fields. Make one more.

Why set the bar low? I like to use my full screen with my applications. At the very least, they could add another button to fully maximize.

Multitasking has nothing to do with maximizing a window. You can run multiple applications with them all fullscreen, even in Windows or Linux. And it's easy to switch with Alt-Tab.

I agree, the green button is a dumb idea and something should change.

 

[portent]

And it's easy to switch with Alt-Tab.

"I'm used to it" is not the same thing as "it's easy."

People naturally lay things out side-by-side and one on top of the other. That's easy: it requires no training.

Do people normally stretch things so that they block out everything else? Do people normally stack things up so that the frontmost object hides everything else in view? Look around yourself. The world isn't like that. You don't live like that, except on your computer.

You've gotten used to a particular tool that does things in a particular, non-natural way.

 

[kirkbross]

I didn't realize that shift+ green button does fit to screen. Oh well, I still would like a dedicated button since I never use the green toggle button at all. I also didn't realize that the post goes up even before the poll is finished being created... which it is now.

 

[belvdr]

"I'm used to it" is not the same thing as "it's easy."

People naturally lay things out side-by-side and one on top of the other. That's easy: it requires no training.

Do people normally stretch things so that they block out everything else? Do people normally stack things up so that the frontmost object hides everything else in view? Look around yourself. The world isn't like that. You don't live like that, except on your computer.

You've gotten used to a particular tool that does things in a particular, non-natural way.

You contradicted yourself. You just said people lay things out on top of the other, then just said people don't stack things up so the front object hides other things.

If you're going through a stack of papers that don't necessarily correlate to each other, do you lay them all out next to each other? No, you lay them in a stack and pull them off one by one. See, the world does work that way.

So, if I'm using a web browser, and also have Word running in the background, do I need to see Word? No, because I know it is there. I'm not typing while I'm browsing, and if there's a picture or an article I want to read full screen, it makes it even easier.

I didn't say "I'm used to it". I said "It's easy", because, well it is easy. Because you don't believe so doesn't make it unnatural or wrong.

 

[portent]

You contradicted yourself. You just said people lay things out on top of the other, then just said people don't stack things up so the front object hides other things.

Spoken like someone who's been using alt-tab too often. These two things are not contradictory at all. I live in a world of three whole dimenstions. I can put things from front to back, side to side, up and down. Not just front to back.

If you're going through a stack of papers that don't necessarily correlate to each other, do you lay them all out next to each other? No, you lay them in a stack and pull them off one by one. See, the world does work that way.

In my world, not everything is in a single stack.

So, if I'm using a web browser, and also have Word running in the background, do I need to see Word? No, because I know it is there.

Fine. But do you really have to stretch the browser to hide Word? Is Word really that disturbing to you? I admit it's not pretty, but if you have a Word phobia, you could try Pages...

I'm not typing while I'm browsing, and if there's a picture or an article I want to read full screen, it makes it even easier.

How, exactly? Does it make the text bigger? The background whiter? The letters bolder? How does hiding Word away make it easier to read this page?

Oh, right, you have some sort of Word phobia.

I didn't say "I'm used to it". I said "It's easy", because, well it is easy. Because you don't believe so doesn't make it unnatural or wrong.

It is unnatural, and illogical, and factually incorrect. (I wouldn't say "wrong." I'm not a moralist.)

 

[belvdr]

Spoken like someone who's been using alt-tab too often.

And I could easily say you are speaking like someone who believes everything Apple does is the correct way. What does this prove?

These two things are not contradictory at all. I live in a world of three whole dimenstions. I can put things from front to back, side to side, up and down. Not just front to back.

In my world, not everything is in a single stack.

So do I, but the computer screen is 2D, so 3D rules need not apply. I can see how if you are using two apps, in which you need to look at one and work in the other or flip back and forth very quickly, it could be worthwhile. But, I'd rather use all of the available screen real estate as possible. If that means half the screen so I can glance at one while typing in another, I do that too. Still, when I want to maximize something, I want it full screen.

Fine. But do you really have to stretch the browser to hide Word? Is Word really that disturbing to you? I admit it's not pretty, but if you have a Word phobia, you could try Pages...

No, it's not disturbing. I prefer things full screen.

How, exactly? Does it make the text bigger? The background whiter? The letters bolder? How does hiding Word away make it easier to read this page?

Because you can fit more text on the screen, which means I'm not scrolling as much. How is that hard to understand? Resize your window down to 10 x 10 pixels, then resize it to 500 x 500 pixels. See the difference?

Oh, right, you have some sort of Word phobia.

Nice childish statement to determine I have some sort of "issue". That doesn't help your argument one bit; in fact, it detracts from it.

It is unnatural, and illogical, and factually incorrect. (I wouldn't say "wrong." I'm not a moralist.)

According to you, because that's your opinion. And my opinion differs, so what?

 

[statik13]

The maximize button was great back in the 90s when everybody was running 800*600. With today's wide screen 20, 24 and 30 I don't see it as an issue any more.

In fact, I find it annoying when a screen fills up my entire monitor to display a postage size stamp bit of information.

 

[belvdr]

The maximize button was great back in the 90s when everybody was running 800*600. With today's wide screen 20, 24 and 30 I don't see it as an issue any more.

In fact, I find it annoying when a screen fills up my entire monitor to display a postage size stamp bit of information.

That's a good point; however, I use my laptop screen mostly, which is 1280x800. It's great for that. However, when I hook up to my 32" display, I never maximize, as it's just not needed.

 

[portent]

And your computer screen is 2D, so 3D rules need not apply

But a 3D, real-world metaphor helps us to use our primitive brains to grasp abstract concepts like "programs" and "files." Spatial arrangement helps us to use our instincts to locate things, without thinking about things like, "Which program is in active memory with UI focus?"

No, it's not disturbing. I prefer things full screen.

Bingo! You prefer it, because you're accustomed to it. We're making progress.

Because you can fit more text on the screen. How is that hard to understand? Resize your window down to 10 x 10 pixels, then resize it to 100 x 100 pixels. See the difference?

That's irrelevant. The zoom button resizes the window to the size needed to display the contents. The point is, it doesn't need to be any larger than the contents (eg. the whole screen.)

Nice childish statement to determine I have some sort of "issue". That doesn't help your argument one bit; in fact, it detracts from it.

Ouch. Okay, I will refrain from any further attempts at humor. Please accept my apology for any implied slight regarding your mental state.

According to you, because that's your opinion. And my opinion differs, so what?

No. Not opinion. Facts about human perception. Your opinion differs because you have a poor understanding.

 

[Aea]

No. Not opinion. Facts about human perception. Your opinion differs because you have a poor understanding.

No, his opinion differs because his opinion is wrong, except that it's just his opinion and he has a right to it.

The expansion to the "proper size" doesn't always work. Maybe everybody has a different way of viewing at things.

When I'm working at a desk I want only one thing in front of me, I don't create stacks of papers or books unless I explicitly need them side by side. When I don't need something it gets moved. That's how I like my machine, one window taking up the whole space unless I explicitly want it otherwise.

To me it's distracting to have other windows underneath and sticking out the sides of the window of interest if I don't want them.

There should be an option to full screen natively, to accommodate users with different styles and perceptions. Just like there's an option between alt-tabbing, using the dock, or expose to switch between programs. There are different users with different styles, I never use alt-tab, I always use expose unless the program is hidden. And also because I use expose I prefer to minimize applications not in use, it makes it very simple to find the specific window I want.

Options are not evil. (P.S. One Call at 25 for FULLSCREEN )

 

[Passive101]

Shift + does not full screen. I have a 20" iMac and just tried opening a 1080P trailer in quick time. I made the window smaller and then Shift Clicked the green + sign. It makes the window much bigger then full screen and I can't see it all.

 

[cawesjmu]

I personally never use full screen, even in windows. With multiple open windows, I find it easier to click on the specific window to bring it forward than ctrl+tab since the first tab is always the last window you had up front, and I don't want to tab several times to get to the right app. I think there should be a full screen button though just to give people the option. It's obviously personal preference and no one is going to convince anther to change their ways. Options are good (that's why there's Mac AND Windows). Different people like different things. Another easy, (but learned) function is apple (command) + F for several applications, Quicktime comes to mind first. I personally find that easier than trying to click a little green dot.

 

[kasakka]

When I was still running Hackintosh (became too inconvenient to switch between Vista and OSX so I just went with Vista) I had to learn to use non-maximized windows. Now I no longer maximize anything in Windows either.

Still, all this stems from the fact that the green plus button just doesn't work well. It often resizes very unexpectedly, like on a high resolution (1920x1200) screen it turns a window into the size of this forum's reply box (probably around 500x250).

Not that Windows doesn't have similar issues, only there the default window sizes for many things are an archaic 640x480 or 800x600. For Windows I use a program called Sizer that lets you define custom window sizes and easily adjust the size and position with that. I wish there was something similar for OSX because the bottom right corner resize is inconvenient.

 

[Cerebrus' Maw]

Personally (note that word there), I dont full size any windows at all. Since coming to OSX, I dont even use full size on a windows box.

However, I do feel that the green button needs a bit of tweaking. It's a bit of an adventure when you click, cause you never quite sure what's going to happen.

BUT, I would not like to see a full screen button. As stated above, with our higher resolutions and ever increasing screen size, having full sized windows seems... pointless for the majority of Apps. I can understand it with certain things, like Movies, Photos, Animation, but let the developers in build it to their App, rather then Apple putting on top of every window.

I wonder if a full sized button came out, would you see a direct correlation in the massive increase of Spaces use