HDMI on a iMac

[Mohammed1]

Im looking for ways to play on my xbox on the iMac late 2013 but I have ruled these options:

BlackMagic Intensity -Doesn't have Full Screen mode

Easycap DC60/+ - Bad definition

Kanex XD - Not compatible

Elgato - Lag

Hauppage HD PVR - Lag

Does anyone have an answer or know a solution to the problems listed above because I know I'm not the only with this annoying issue after apple adopted the Thunderbolt instead of Mini Display Port.

 

[Chippy99]

Im looking for ways to play on my xbox on the iMac late 2013 but I have ruled these options:

BlackMagic Intensity -Doesn't have Full Screen mode

Easycap DC60/+ - Bad definition

Kanex XD - Not compatible

Elgato - Lag

Hauppage HD PVR - Lag

Does anyone have an answer or know a solution to the problems listed above because I know I'm not the only with this annoying issue after apple adopted the Thunderbolt instead of Mini Display Port.

There is no solution.

 

[PatriotInvasion]

Im looking for ways to play on my xbox on the iMac late 2013 but I have ruled these options:

BlackMagic Intensity -Doesn't have Full Screen mode

Easycap DC60/+ - Bad definition

Kanex XD - Not compatible

Elgato - Lag

Hauppage HD PVR - Lag

Does anyone have an answer or know a solution to the problems listed above because I know I'm not the only with this annoying issue after apple adopted the Thunderbolt instead of Mini Display Port.

Reasons I'm guessing Apple frustrates our ability to do this:

HDMI In on a computer requires additional licensing (I think)
HDMI In opens the doors to Windows laptops
Thunderbolt has more uses for Mac users using their Mac to be a Mac

 

[Chippy99]

Reasons I'm guessing Apple frustrates our ability to do this:

HDMI In on a computer requires additional licensing (I think)
HDMI In opens the doors to Windows laptops
Thunderbolt has more uses for Mac users using their Mac to be a Mac

I tend to agree with you. Why did Apple not continue to support Displayport input as they did on 2011 iMacs and earlier? Then a simple HDMI to Displayport adapter would enable people to do what they want. There is no technical or commercial reason why the dropped this capability and it definitely inconveniences people.

Apple have often taken decisions like this, to the detriment of the consumer. They genuinely seem more interested in maintaining and protecting their own ecosystem, even if that means not giving the consumers what they want or need.

For example, they were VERY late to introduce USB3 to Mac's and there can have been no technical nor commercial justification for this, when USB3 controller chips were costing $1 each or less. It was more to do with Apple wanting to try to prop up Thunderbolt, which has been a commercial flop and will likely go the way for Firewire imho.

 

[PatriotInvasion]

I tend to agree with you. Why did Apple not continue to support Displayport input as they did on 2011 iMacs and earlier? Then a simple HDMI to Displayport adapter would enable people to do what they want. There is no technical or commercial reason why the dropped this capability and it definitely inconveniences people.

Apple have often taken decisions like this, to the detriment of the consumer. They genuinely seem more interested in maintaining and protecting their own ecosystem, even if that means not giving the consumers what they want or need.

For example, they were VERY late to introduce USB3 to Mac's and there can have been no technical nor commercial justification for this, when USB3 controller chips were costing $1 each or less. It was more to do with Apple wanting to try to prop up Thunderbolt, which has been a commercial flop and will likely go the way for Firewire imho.

Well, Thunderbolt uses the DisplayPort interface for audio and video I believe. With that already built-in to a single port that would also allow for data transfers, Apple wanted to keep things simple as they usually do. It would be odd for them to have DisplayPorts next to identical Thunderbolt ports simply to support legacy Macs or allow people to hook up cable boxes and video game systems. It also helps nudge people into hardware upgrades rather than allowing them to stick with their old stuff.

As for Thunderbolt, it's still less than 3 years old and many Mac users are taking advantage of it's speed and flexibility through external drives and daisy-chaining features. It's more expensive because it's a superior connection to USB3, and it very well may remain a bit of a niche I/O port for years like FireWire, but Apple is committed to it and I think it will be benefitting Mac users for many years to come.

 

[Chippy99]

Well, Thunderbolt uses the DisplayPort interface for audio and video I believe. With that already built-in to a single port that would also allow for data transfers, Apple wanted to keep things simple as they usually do. It would be odd for them to have DisplayPorts next to identical Thunderbolt ports simply to support legacy Macs or allow people to hook up cable boxes and video games systems. It also helps nudge people into hardware upgrades rather than allowing them to stick with their old stuff.

Given the Thunderbolt port on Mac Mini's will output Displayport signals to a Displayport monitor (I don't know if iMac's would do that too?) then clearly the port can be dual function and I don't see why you would have needed extra ports as you describe.

Your final sentence is the reason they dropped it, imho. They want to sell you a Thunderbolt Display or a Macbook and are happy to inconvenience people with e.g. Xbox's along the way. Or indeed anyone with a Windows laptop who would like to use their iMac as a monitor.

I don't think it's very customer-friendly to be honest. I hope you aren't going to go all defensive and Apple fanboy on me. There's many things I like about Apple and my iMac, but they are not perfect. And dropping support for Target Display Mode for Displayport devices was not their finest hour.

 

[PatriotInvasion]

Given the Thunderbolt port on Mac Mini's will output Displayport signals to a Displayport monitor (I don't know if iMac's would do that too?) then clearly the port can be dual function and I don't see why you would have needed extra ports as you describe.

Your final sentence is the reason they dropped it, imho. They want to sell you a Thunderbolt Display or a Macbook and are happy to inconvenience people with e.g. Xbox's along the way. Or indeed anyone with a Windows laptop who would like to use their iMac as a monitor.

I don't think it's very customer-friendly to be honest. I hope you aren't going to go all defensive and Apple fanboy on me. There's many things I like about Apple and my iMac, but they are not perfect. And dropping support for Target Display Mode for Displayport devices was not their finest hour.

The spec of Thunderbolt as I understand it is that you can output a MiniDisplayPort signal from Thunderbolt into a MiniDisplayPort and it will work. It does not allow for you to output MiniDisplayPort from a non-Thunderbolt port into Thunderbolt. That leaves non-Thunderbolt equipped Macs out in the cold when trying to connect to anything that is Thunderbolt --- like the iMac or the Thunderbolt Display...which is why they still sold the Cinema Display for some time.

That said, Apple really only sold MiniDisplayPort-only devices for a relatively short period of time (late 2008-mid-2011) before moving the MiniDisplayPort technology into the Thunderbolt standard. If you fall into this bucket, you're out of luck for certain things, but Apple was willing to live with that I suppose.

As for making it easier to connect devices outside of the Apple ecosystem to an Apple display...be it an iMac or Thunderbolt Display or a MacBook Pro, Apple doesn't seem interested in allowing that to happen.

 

[Mohammed1]

I found the solution!!!! The black magic intensity shuttle thunderbolt edition doesn't lag and if you download tv viewer you can have hdmi on full screen!!!

 

[Chippy99]

I found the solution!!!! The black magic intensity shuttle thunderbolt edition doesn't lag and if you download tv viewer you can have hdmi on full screen!!!

It depends what you mean by lag, and what you mean by a solution. Doing HD video capture is a bit of a kludge really.

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The spec of Thunderbolt as I understand it is that you can output a MiniDisplayPort signal from Thunderbolt into a MiniDisplayPort and it will work. It does not allow for you to output MiniDisplayPort from a non-Thunderbolt port into Thunderbolt.

Well of course it doesn't work, or we wouldn't be having this conversation. But whether the spec allows it, who knows.

EDIT: The spec is bi-directional. So it would have been perfectly possible for Apple to support Displayport input into the Thunderbolt connector. They just dropped it.

 

[Mohammed1]

Well the elgato and the hauppage had delay until it got to the mac but black magic doesn't and with tv viewer you can use it in full screen.

 

[Chippy99]

Well the elgato and the hauppage had delay until it got to the mac but black magic doesn't and with tv viewer you can use it in full screen.

It does have delay (i.e. lag) mate. You can't encode video "instantly". My guess is it is at best a few frames behind. (Edit, it's 200ms, i.e about 5 frames) The question is whether the amount of lag is acceptable to you. Hardcore FPS gamers would not put up with it.

Then of course there's the image quality. It's encoded (i.e a lossy process) and then decoded on the Mac, so there is some image quality loss too.

Not to mention the price. For £150 you can buy a reasonable quality 1080p 27" monitor, so it would be cheaper to just buy a 27" monitor.

I'd call using the Black Magic Intensity, a barely acceptable workaround if someone is desperate.

 

[ppenn]

sounds like a waste of money (in extra hardware) and time, when you could just a a monitor.

 

[PatriotInvasion]

I'm trying to understand why I would even want to hook up my PS3 to my iMac. I mean, I have 2 other Sony BRAVIA HDTV's in the house that would probably provide a better experience than 720p or 1080p gaming on a 1440p IPS display.

I suppose it's just the love for the iMac that we all want to get even more out of it, even if Apple never intended it to be used in that way. That said, even if there were an HDMI-In port on my iMac, I feel like I may hook up PS3 to it for a few days and then say "meh, back to the Sony BRAVIA".

So - I will use the iMac as a beautiful desktop computing experience to explore the web, communicate with friends, and create. That's what it was built to do. Gaming will remain a living room experience.

PS - If you desire HDMI-In for a cable box, the Elgato EyeTV HD is an awesome device that utilizes component video inputs to provide in-window cable TV to your Mac with an excellent software package for recording and editing.