Hilarious dealings with Windows Vista

[Michael CM1]

I have finally conquered the beast that is Vista, and I must say it's not as bad as I thought it could be. Probably helps to have a brand new computer with a Core2Duo and 2GB of memory.

That said, it reminded me of reasons why I switched:

1) "Windows Easy File Transfer." That's a misnomer. I spent about an hour trying to transfer files using this method over a network, using CDs, and using a flash drive. None of it worked. People hilariously sell a "Windows Easy Transfer Cable" for about $20-25. I think it's basically a fancy USB cable. I don't recall if I used Migration Assistant or whatever Apple's version of this is, but it CAN'T BE MORE DIFFICULT.

2) Transferring e-mail & contacts. My mom's old computer used Outlook 2003 for all that stuff. I decided to get off that and use Windows Mail (basically a new name for Outlook Express). I found out that you can't export all that stuff into a personal file folder and then import it into Windows Mail. Nah, you gotta have Outlook on the new machine to do that. Luckily I already planned on adding it, but that was beyond hilarious. Even people at a Vista forum I found were like, "yeah, that's made a lot of users mad. Microsoft probably wants you to drop $100 for Outlook." I know Apple Mail is nowhere near as difficult to import stuff from.

3) I don't know why they bothered calling them "Gadgets." They're widgets for crying out loud. Just go with it.

4) I actually like the Gadgets on the right side of the screen. There's one that rotates photos, another that monitors stuff like iStat does. Could be worse.

5) But then again, when you install a monitoring app or gadget, you see how inefficient Windows is. With NOTHING RUNNING, about 40% of the memory was taken up (it was 49% another time). With 4 or 5 things running right now, just under half of my memory is being used (both have 2GB). Yes, the shared video takes up some of this, but c'mon Microsoft!

Overall not bad, but not OS X.

 

[KelchM]

5) But then again, when you install a monitoring app or gadget, you see how inefficient Windows is. With NOTHING RUNNING, about 40% of the memory was taken up (it was 49% another time). With 4 or 5 things running right now, just under half of my memory is being used (both have 2GB). Yes, the shared video takes up some of this, but c'mon Microsoft!

This is a common misconception about Vista... People see a bunch of memory being used and assume this is entirely due to bloat and inefficiency. The truth is that it is predicting what you are going to be using and preloading them in memory. How well this works in practice is debatable, but there you go. Pre-fetched items will be removed as physical memory is needed. If you run an app which demands a lot of physical mamory and kill it you will see your memory usage hovering around 400-600MB. So in no way are the core components of vista eating a gig of ram on thier own.

In my opinion people give Vista way to much crap. I've been using it since the week it was released and have loved it since day one. The catch is that you need good hardware. With 4 gigs of ram and a quad core processor Vista runs absolutely beautifully.

Contrary to popular belief driver support in Vista is outstanding. Honestly with any relatively new hardware (desktop or laptop) it will automatically install the proper chipset, network, sound and video drivers for you. It will even update your video drivers for you when a new WDM certified driver is available. The other day I installed XP on a laptop and I quickly remembered what a pain it was to manually install all the required drivers.

 

[Quillz]

I think Vista is better than Leopard. It boots faster on my iMac and it works better with the other computers on my home network. I do wish it worked like Mac OS X in a few ways, such as the way the latter handles screenshots, but beyond that, I just find that I'm more productive in Vista.

 

[Sijmen]

I like both Leopard and Vista, but have a preference for Leopard. I find Vista's UI to be extremely inconsistent across different applications. It also seems Micorosoft is struggling a bit finding their way to a set of somewhat higher-level interface concepts. Think about how an application is organised from a global perspective. For example, the source list in OS X. It's not just a UI component, but it's also a concept that dictates how a program generally works.

 

[nplima]

T.

2) Transferring e-mail & contacts. My mom's old computer used Outlook 2003 for all that stuff. I decided to get off that and use Windows Mail (basically a new name for Outlook Express). I found out that you can't export all that stuff into a personal file folder and then import it into Windows Mail. Nah, you gotta have Outlook on the new machine to do that. [...]

you're trying to transfer from Outlook to Outlook Express + Contacts, which is different from going from Outlook to Outlook. Inconvenient? yes. Caused by Vista? nope.

5) But then again, when you install a monitoring app or gadget, you see how inefficient Windows is. With NOTHING RUNNING, about 40% of the memory was taken up

aha! maybe your monitoring gadget is huge!

actually, I found more or less the same with an XP installation, idle, the PC would be using just under 50% or RAM after I removed some processes I disliked. There is just a lot of stuff running when "nothing is running". The bad part about that is just lack of control, because in fact it is interesting that the first time you run Media Centre, some album covers are already there and the names of artists/albums are mostly complete. I'm sure there's a lot of other things going on behind our user backs, some are useful, some we'll never know...

 

[Quillz]

I like both Leopard and Vista, but have a preference for Leopard. I find Vista's UI to be extremely inconsistent across different applications. It also seems Micorosoft is struggling a bit finding their way to a set of somewhat higher-level interface concepts. Think about how an application is organised from a global perspective. For example, the source list in OS X. It's not just a UI component, but it's also a concept that dictates how a program generally works.

I agree. Aero Glass is a very nice UI, as is Office 2007, but then other applications, such as OneNote 2007 and Windows Explorer, work and act differently. Some have toolbars and some don't. And most third party applications don't follow any HUD guidelines, either.

 

[muldul]

See this is why i made the switch

 

[donmei]

Vista does truly suck. The security patches have made it nearly unusable.

It took me 6 clicks (with 4 confirmation) to remove an item from the menu bar.

Also, because of the bloated security policies it is nearly impossible to share a vista machine's hard drive. Sure, you can read it from a mac. But try to write or change a vista's data and you run into untold nightmares.

(not to get too into it, the Mac user name must be identical to the vistas as must the passwords, you cant log into the mac as one and vista as another. Also the vistas user account must have a password. if theres no password set up, no remote access.

I got a Mac in April and a vista machine in May (scratch and dent $200 machine to plug into my TV. Windows Media Center IS FAR FAR superior to front row)

I've spent a total of 15 minutes administering the Mac. I've probably spent 3 hrs configuring and updating the PC.

Don

 

[drmacgeoff]

Not being one to pass up an opportunity to knock Windows Vista, I hereby join this forum just to post this story.

My housemate, having fallen in love with his iPod Touch and having been told explicitly by me to buy a Mac as his new computer decided that, sadly, he must have a PC in order to play games. As i work in a local computer shop I was able to obtain the parts for a fairly high spec machine (4GB RAM, 2.6GHz Quad Core etc...) along with, of course, the Vista software.

So we began installing it:

Issue 1

Unfortunately the Vista installer would randomly freeze after a totally unpredictable length of time and require a restart of the process, which took forever to get to the point where it could once again randomly freeze.

Solution: Turns out Vista was incompatible with the particular INTEL raid chipset on the motherboard so we switched over to the proprietary Gigabyte chipset and all was well (until later..)

Verdict: Maybe Vista's fault, but we'll give it a break - it's new.

Issue 2

After installing the RAID drivers off a USB key (handy feature, thanks MS) and selecting the RAID drive to install on, Windows not ONLY randomly decides it can't install on it "Error: No suitable drives were found to install, despite the fact one was listed 2 seconds ago and you clicked on it" but that after this message the installation must RESTART (this is around 40 minutes into the installation)

Solution: If the USB key is plugged in before the computer is switched on Vista Install assumes that, despite the fact it doesn't come up in the drive list and that you have explicitly chosen the RAID array to install on, you wish to install Vista on the 128MB stick and that there is no room.

Verdict: DEFINATELY Vista

Issue 3

Once vista was up and running it would randomly bluescreen and restart.

Solution: Don't really know, it seemed to be fixed after we updated the drivers.

Verdict: Drivers are a nightmare for anything (except my mac) and I'm sure XP (lovely, lovely XP, how I miss it), so we can't fully blame vista for this.

Issue 4

Randomly, every 2nd or 3rd time the computer is booted, it will bluescreen with an error about the registry being corrupt. However if you wait for it to loop round 10 or so times it will then inexplicably boot fine, with no problems.

Solution: Apparently if you have a Gigabyte RAID array (NB, the other RAID chipset wouldn't work AT ALL) AND 4 GB or RAM, Vista will bluescreen. No fix. Ever. Just live with it.

Verdict: Perhaps the motherboard's fault. But Vista is at least partially to blame.

Issue 5

Vista, having had so many issues with the USB stick during install, fails to be able to install drivers for any USB hard disk or stick. Windows asks to search the internet, can't find anything, then asks for the CD. As we all know, USB storage does NOT come with a CD. And this isn't fancy storage either, we tried 2 USB hard disks and 3 keys all with the same problem.

Solution: First point windows at it's own driver directory. It then FINDS the driver, but can't use it. For some unexplained reason. Copy this driver to the desktop and suddenly all is well. WHAT?

Verdict: This problem is not present on all installs of Vista, but it is on a significant number. DEFINATELY VISTA.

Issue 6 (My Favourite!)

After booting, several months after getting the computer "up and running" windows announces the discovery of some new hardware. Upon clicking "Next" windows announces (as always) that it can't find the drivers for this "Microsoft USB Mouse". At this point the mouse, which up to now worked perfectly, stops working. We then have to go about the circuitous procedure mentioned above to tell windows, like a young child, where it's own driver is and how to use it WITH NO MOUSE.

Add to this the fact that the computer is still pretty slow and has pitiful amounts of RAM available for use (I don't care if it's PREDICTING what I want to run, it doesn't KNOW that, it's Vista and therefore isn't on the same level as Skynet), the fact that for some reason the hard disks will start churning for no reason causing any game you're playing to drop to 1FPS (which, when you look in system performance, suddenly ceases, giving you no idea as to what app is doing it) and the fact that there is a SIXTY GIGABYTE folder that can't be accessed - "Despite being administrator, and having built this computer, you don't have access to this folder" - not to mention the various annoying security messages that prevent you from doing anything and other issues, and you wonder how everyone hasn't switched already.

 

[nep61]

(I don't care if it's PREDICTING what I want to run, it doesn't KNOW that, it's Vista and therefore isn't on the same level as Skynet)

Excellent Terminator reference, nice.

Oh yeah, and your story is, well, let's just say your housemate should have listened to you in the first place.

 

[LondonGooner]

on the plus side, it has no problems connecting to the internet, which leopard does.

 

[drmacgeoff]

on the plus side, it has no problems connecting to the internet, which leopard does.

Bah. The internet is over-rated, that's what I say...

Fortunately(?) I'm on Tiger, back in PPC world and can't say I've had any troubles... except the "Unknown iTunes error, your iPod must be restored in order to work" error, but that's to be expected, it was only an Apple product running on an Apple system... they can't plan for everything.

 

[bertpalmer]

I wouldn't say I have ever had any SERIOUS issues with vista - it works fairly well, if a little slow.

The interface is pretty horrible though, so much gloss and aero - it's like a gradient palette threw up on it.

Transfer times from HD to memory stick are sickeningly slow, in fact any file transfer is a pain because it takes soooooooooooooooo long.

What used to be a simple 'control panel' is now so convoluted and 'deep' with options you don't know where to find options to change them.

MS need to hire an information architect to redesign the control panel. It doesn't work well.

 

[thejadedmonkey]

I um... I've set up Vista on my Macbook Pro and on a Mac Mini, and I've never had a problem with it.

 

[elppa]

I have mixed views, there are some bits I like, but there are some bits I really hate.

The address/location bar in Explorer is awesome, it has really been done well. General stability has been good and I have had no driver problems (although they were all provided by Apple).

Microsoft really, really need to fix the notification box though, it's broken beyond belief. Every icon behaves in a different way, some you click, some you double click, some you right click, some open a little pop up window, some open a main applications, others just open a standard menu, whilst others open a custom looking menu. Some display different options if you right click or click, others operate the same for a right click and regular click. The icons are nearly always too small and I can rarely work out what each one does just by looking at it. They need conventions here.

 

[oacory]

on the plus side, it has no problems connecting to the internet, which leopard does.

I have actually had the opposite experience. I have a Vista laptop (about a year old) which decides whenever it wants to to drop the connection whenever it wants to and you can't connect again until the whole system is restarted. This has also occurred a few times on a Vista desktop that my dad bought less than a month ago.

I have had friends who have leopard and said that they have never had a problem but I can't speak for myself because I am using Tiger.

 

[heatmiser]

The window borders are even more wasteful in Vista than they were in XP. I don't know why they refuse to design thinner borders. On a 13" screen, I'd rather not lose one or two solid millimeters around each window for no particular reason. This is reason enough for me to use OS X over Vista. It's the only OS I've found that seems to understand the aesthetic of thinner (and not thicker) window borders.

 

[clevin]

5) But then again, when you install a monitoring app or gadget, you see how inefficient Windows is. With NOTHING RUNNING, about 40% of the memory was taken up (it was 49% another time). With 4 or 5 things running right now, just under half of my memory is being used (both have 2GB). Yes, the shared video takes up some of this, but c'mon Microsoft!

lol, its not like OSX doing any better in this case.

I called it normal, since all OSes do so.

The window borders are even more wasteful in Vista than they were in XP.

I think there is a concern about using too thin borders with aero might be unexpected ugly.
Plus, you can always go back to classic looks as win2k

 

[elppa]

Unlike XP, when you switch to the classic theme in Vista things look very wrong aesthetically.

When you put 2/3/4GB of RAM in a notebook, surely you want the OS to make best use of it? I'd rather not have computing resources I've paid for sitting their idly doing nothing.

 

[l'homme]

Hilarious... uhm... the inexplicable system slowdowns, the daily antivirus database updates (Windows fault since long time ago), and the constant system updates, it takes too much time to patch the system, though no way I get the performance boost it promises.

BTW, SP1 gave us a more mature and stable OS, yes, I find myself convinced that is better than XP, and a true contender to OS X and Linux.

I prefer the Leopard GUI 'cause the consistency and well located icons and menus, although I feel Segoe system font + the use of Calibri and Cambria in programs are really pleasant to read, also ClearType is really clean and nice.

 

[elppa]

Do you really need anti virus for Vista?

I've never run it.

 

[James17]

I never had any problems using Vista Ultimate on my old Acer laptop but I prefer XP. Saying that, I now have a MBP and prefer it over Windows but I don't go about saying Windows is rubbish, nothings perfect.

 

[clevin]

i really would like to see some useful report on active viruses on vista, so far, i didn't see any.

 

[donmei]

Vista like anything else (including OS X) should be run in a non-privileged account for daily use. Why? Because of trojans. If some human engineered email tricks your spouse into clicking "install" the most secure OS in the world isnt going to stop it from running.

 

[Riemann Zeta]

I run Vista (well, Windows 2008, but they use the same kernel) and really like it--it is the best Windows release to date. It is certainly pretty and flashy. But that said, it is neither as consistent nor as logical as Leopard; Mac OS feels "smoother." Some things take a million clicks, as they are still buried in esoteric old Windows NT4-era menus. But that's just Windows.