How to capture real-time PPC / OS9 video onto another computer?

[mectojic]

On a previous thread, I mentioned how I have a vintage iRez Kritter USB webcam, and wanted to use it for a vintage video-calling experience. At present, despite people's efforts, I haven't seen any PowerPC software solution for this yet (other than iChat's Bonjour with an iSight). I have even lower hopes of getting my old webcam to work with it, since it only has Mac OS 9 drivers (and Macam etc don't support this model).

So I thought I'd cheat a little, by capturing the screen of my Mac's webcam in OS 9, and feeding that to a modern Mac, and telling that Mac that it's my webcam. I really just want to see this webcam in action – and was inspired by those people who hooked up a Gameboy camera to Super Gameboy, then fed the TV input onto a modern computer and used it for Zoom calls.

But I have no idea how to do this, and need some advice for the sort of hardware/software I'd need to accomplish this.

I suppose I need the following:
1) video capture card that takes a video input from PPC and allows me to direct it to another Mac. Is this meant to be a PCI card or something – or an S-video port out like I have on my G4 AGP?
2) modern Mac software that can accept 1) and read it as a "webcam" input.

Could anyone advise? Thank you!

 

[Amethyst1]

1) video capture card that takes a video input from PPC and allows me to direct it to another Mac. Is this meant to be a PCI card or something – or an S-video port out like I have on my G4 AGP?

There are grabbers that connect to the modern system via USB and accept VGA, HDMI or Composite/S-Video input. If your G4 has DVI, a passive adapter is enough to go to HDMI.

2) modern Mac software that can accept 1) and read it as a "webcam" input.

OBS sounds like it can do this (but I have no experience with it) so you "just" need a grabber that is compatible with it. I don't know if this allows using the pseudo-webcam with any software... or just OBS.

Another way might be to set up OS 9-compatible remote desktop software (such as Timbuktu) on the G4 and have the webcam feed displayed in full screen. Connect to the G4 from the modern system, display its desktop (the webcam feed) in a window using the remote desktop tool and then share this window in Zoom or whatever.

 

[mectojic]

There are grabbers that connect to the modern system via USB and accept VGA, HDMI or Composite/S-Video input. If your G4 has DVI, a passive adapter is enough to go to HDMI.

Could you provide a generic example of one of these, so I at least know what I'm looking for? It's been ages since I did something like this.

As for Timbuktu, neat, I'll have a look into it. But I suspected that a direct video-connection rather than remote desktop would give me a better framerate – true?

 

[Amethyst1]

Could you provide a generic example of one of these, so I at least know what I'm looking for? It's been ages since I did something like this.

Elgato Cam Link 4K
Elgato HD60 S+ (not HD60 S!)
Elgato HD60 X
Roland UVC-01

These are advertised to work as a "virtual" webcam on macOS (only UVC devices do on macOS).

As for Timbuktu, neat, I'll have a look into it. But I suspected that a direct video-connection rather than remote desktop would give me a better framerate – true?

The framerate of your webcam might not be that great to begin with. Timbuktu is *cough, cough* less pricey than current UVC grabbers.

 

[mectojic]

Elgato Cam Link 4K
Elgato HD60 S+ (not HD60 S!)
Elgato HD60 X
Roland UVC-01

These are advertised to work as a "virtual" webcam on macOS (only UVC devices do on macOS).


The framerate of your webcam might not be that great to begin with. Timbuktu is *cough, cough* less pricey than current UVC grabbers.

This is great knowledge, thanks for sharing it. I'm looking for something of a cheaper solution though, and I think this video is the path I'm going down: VGA splitter, VGA-HDMI scaler, USB 3 HDMI capture card.

As for working as a virtual webcam, apparently as of Jan 2021, OBS allows for the creation of virtual webcams. Thus as long as you can get the video input into any program on MacOS, OBS can take that app window and it can be your virtual webcam! Doesn't work with Facetime, but does support other platforms, i.e. Zoom.

 

[Amethyst1]

As for working as a virtual webcam, apparently as of Jan 2021, OBS allows for the creation of virtual webcams. Thus as long as you can get the video input into any program on MacOS, OBS can take that app window and it can be your virtual webcam! Doesn't work with Facetime, but does support other platforms, i.e. Zoom.

Thanks for the heads-up!

I've just tried this “the proper way”. I loaded a Gameboy Camera ROM in mGBA, told it to tap into my Mac's webcam and made OBS use its window as a virtual webcam. It initially worked in Photo Booth, Skype and Zoom but for some reason stopped working in Photo Booth and Skype.

I'm looking for something of a cheaper solution though, and I think this video is the path I'm going down: VGA splitter, VGA-HDMI scaler, USB 3 HDMI capture card.

Looks solid The video scaler is possibly expensive.

 

[TheShortTimer]

I loaded a Gameboy Camera ROM in mGBA...

Apologies for the brief off-topic divergence... There's a Gameboy Advance emulator for the Mac with current support?

Downloading it now!

(Thanks!)

 

[AYates]

Apologies for the brief off-topic divergence... There's a Gameboy Advance emulator for the Mac with current support?

Downloading it now!

(Thanks!)

Every GBA emulator I ever knew of still has current support.

mGBA as shown and Boycott Advance both have x86-64 and arm universal binaries where VisualBoyAdvance-M only has x86-64.

 

[juanstdio]

One of my projects from last year was to create a Twich channel and use one of my PBs to play games and stream using another Machine. The project is now on ice due to time issues
These was one of my first problems and I solved them using this simple "method":
Every G4 15" has a DVI output so I started using an DVI to VGA adaptor and "mirrored" the output of the main screen.
then using a VGA2HDMI Cheap converter I got the signal "converted",( I was able to achive 720p@85hz using that cheap adapter, totally recommended). Then I used a small capture device and hooked up to the streaming PC, with OBS I created a scene and used the signal from the USB capture card and displayed it with almost 0 Lag, totally recommeded.

Audio was captured by the VGA2HDMI adapter and included in the HDMI signal

The DVI to VGA adaptor is something like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/VisionTek-DVI-VGA-Adapter-900664/dp/B00P4HYCIA/ref=sr_1_16?crid=29GKL1N7OLTGM&keywords=DVI+to+VGA+adapter&qid=1676091471&sprefix=dvi+to+vga+adapt%2Caps%2C305&sr=8-16

The VGA2HDMI is a model similar to this one (my version is black):
https://www.amazon.com/Portable-Out...id=1676091134&sprefix=vga2hdmi,aps,415&sr=8-2

The HDMI Capture card is this exact one:
https://www.amazon.com/DIGITNOW-Cap...1078&sprefix=hdmi+to+usb+captu,aps,320&sr=8-3

 

[Amethyst1]

Every G4 15" has a DVI output so I started using an DVI to VGA adaptor and "mirrored" the output of the main screen.
then using a VGA2HDMI Cheap converter I got the signal "converted",( I was able to achive 720p@85hz using that cheap adapter, totally recommended).

Why didn't you use a passive DVI-to-HDMI adapter?

DVI and HDMI use the exact same video signals (but DVI doesn't include audio).

 

[mectojic]

Why didn't you use a passive DVI-to-HDMI adapter?

DVI and HDMI use the exact same video signals (but DVI doesn't include audio).

Mac84 seems to give a pretty reasonable answer why you'd use VGA instead of DVI, see 10:20 in the video:

I think you could try it, and I could try it, once the parts I've ordered have arrived.

 

[mectojic]

Well, for now I've been able to test and confirm that audio input works perfectly. I have a PlainTalk (translucent) headset microphone, which I have playing itself back in OS 9 software. I then was able to capture the audio into my modern Mac with a male-male audio jack, feeding into the mic jack of the modern Mac.

From there, I told Zoom to use my digital mic-in port, and it worked, in real time with no stutter. PlainTalk microphone "working" with a Mac with no PlainTalk.

 

[juanstdio]

Why didn't you use a passive DVI-to-HDMI adapter?

DVI and HDMI use the exact same video signals (but DVI doesn't include audio).

Because I didn't have one handy

here is the setup that I used with those components, note that the screen of the G4 15" was adapted to 16:9 ratio (and gave some extra FPS to some games!)

I have some plans to use it in future Twitch streams, but I'll need some time and due to work I can't do it now

 

[mectojic]

Ok, project update: success! I got my vintage OS 9 webcam and PlainTalk headset to both communicate with a Mac Pro 5,1, feeding an audio and video stream into OBS, which can then be used to make a recording, or to do a video call.

The setup was simpler than I originally anticipated:

1) Power Mac G4 with USB 1.1 webcam and Plaintalk headset microphone jack connected.
2) VGA cable from G4 to mini VGA2HDMI adapter (powered by USB)
3) HDMI cable from VGA2HDMI adapter to HDMI USB Capture card -> modern Mac, detected instantly as a USB video source by OBS
4) Male-Male audio jack from G4 into mic line-in of modern Mac.
5) headphone jack of Plaintalk headset plugged into modern Mac (so I can use the set for both the mic + earphones)
6) Load up OS 9 video software and tell it to playback microphone audio.

I didn't need to bother with a VGA splitter or scaler for this setup. Once configured, the HDMI USB capture card captures video so well that there's no need to keep track of it on another monitor. And, with the USB capture framerate at a snappy 60fps with no lag, if I need to adjust something on the G4, I can view its desktop screen within OBS.

Final step, since Zoom etc will output video in the standard HD aspect, I cropped the 4:3 video capture window and decorated the rest of the screen space with an OS 9 desktop.

Here's the live feed out the window, demonstrating the final video and audio output, and OBS. Final thing to do for a video call is click "Start Virtual Camera".

 

[ww2_1943]

Ok, project update: success! I got my vintage OS 9 webcam and PlainTalk headset to both communicate with a Mac Pro
3) HDMI cable from VGA2HDMI adapter to HDMI USB Capture card -> modern Mac, detected instantly as a USB video source by OBS
4) Male-Male audio jack from G4 into mic line-in of modern Mac.
5) headphone jack of Plaintalk headset plugged into modern Mac (so I can use the set for both the mic + earphones)
6) Load up OS 9 video software and tell it to playback microphone audio.

What is the modern Mac and what OS is it running?

This is a really neat project!

 

[Amethyst1]

2) VGA cable from G4 to mini VGA2HDMI adapter (powered by USB)

What resolution is the G4 outputting?

 

[mectojic]

What resolution is the G4 outputting?

It can output any resolution really. But because in this instance I'm only using it for the webcam (which is optimal at 320x240), I chose 800x600, and cropped the rest in OBS.

 

[mectojic]

What is the modern Mac and what OS is it running?

This is a really neat project!

Mac Pro 2010. Running 10.13 High Sierra, as that's the minimum requirement for OBS.

 

[Amethyst1]

It can output any resolution really

Show off WQUXGA then

 

[Amethyst1]

Live Streaming a Macintosh Plus