I hate HDR

[SDAVE]

Am I the only one that hates anything related to HDR?

I've started using Apple TV app lately to watch some shows and all of the shows have HDR. On my MacBook the screen is too bright and it takes me out of the story.

I understand it's a technical innovation to have brighter peaks etc., but it's truly a gimmick to me.

I constantly have to change my MacBook Pro's display from XDR > Apple Display to get rid of HDR.

I enjoy old movies without HDR much more.

 

[lostless]

I wouldn't say I hate HDR content, but the non uniform way it used and the lack of standards on how to use is what kills it for me. Basically they are taking the brightness range we can see and properly map it to the correct brightness (nits) on a screen. Up to the brightness your screen can do, sometimes up to 2000nits. But can keep the shadows too dark in a lit room as it’s not trying to boost any levels. While SDR is taking a portion of that brightness and stretching or compressing those levels to a range off 100nits. But then your backlight setting even stretches that out to 300-400 nit range. It’s not a gimmick and looks very good in a perfectly dark room with a calibrated screen. But SDR has a long history from photography, to film while HDR is the Wild West.

 

[maflynn]

Am I the only one that hates anything related to HDR?

You're not the only one. I'm not fan and I only watch TV on "SDR" and my monitor for my computer is also SDR

 

[SDAVE]

I wouldn't say I hate HDR content, but the non uniform way it used and the lack of standards on how to use is what kills it for me. Basically they are taking the brightness range we can see and properly map it to the correct brightness (nits) on a screen. Up to the brightness your screen can do, sometimes up to 2000nits. But can keep the shadows too dark in a lit room as it’s not trying to boost any levels. While SDR is taking a portion of that brightness and stretching or compressing those levels to a range off 100nits. But then your backlight setting even stretches that out to 300-400 nit range. It’s not a gimmick and looks very good in a perfectly dark room with a calibrated screen. But SDR has a long history from photography, to film while HDR is the Wild West.

I wonder if it'll get better, it's not like it's new. It's used as a gimmick marketing tool and they slap on HDR tag on devices that have 400 nits for peak

You're not the only one. I'm not fan and I only watch TV on "SDR" and my monitor for my computer is also SDR

100% glad I'm not the only one. I watch something and then out of nowhere BOOM a bright scene that burns my retinas.

I have HDR on my projector blasted on a 120" screen it works alright there, but then again my projector isn't very high end/not calibrated well to enjoy what it can do I guess.

 

[priitv8]

I think with MacBook problem #1 is sitting too close to the screen.
On a big screen the HDR is very enjoyable, IMHO.

 

[!!!]

The only time I experienced "HDR" was when I was trying out an iPhone 15 (I think) and I decided to test out some movie that had HDR. I picked some dark scene with some light flashes and it was not really a pleasant experience, it just felt like they were flashing the screen randomly.

HDR seems useful for photography to provide more accurate color ranges.

I ended up returning the phone because I get headaches due to the OLED PWM, so I have managed to avoid any HDR issues since then.

 

[priitv8]

HDR seems useful for photography to provide more accurate color ranges.

AFAIK in photography the HDR works in a completely different way to HDR on screen.
Photo HDR squeezes wider dynamic range into a smaller range of the media (originally paper). Whereas in video, they attempt to expand the brightness range of the media (display device).

 

[SDAVE]

The only time I experienced "HDR" was when I was trying out an iPhone 15 (I think) and I decided to test out some movie that had HDR. I picked some dark scene with some light flashes and it was not really a pleasant experience, it just felt like they were flashing the screen randomly.

HDR seems useful for photography to provide more accurate color ranges.

I ended up returning the phone because I get headaches due to the OLED PWM, so I have managed to avoid any HDR issues since then.

Photo HDR is truly a gimmick. If you shoot RAW, you already have giant dynamic range and can color correct properly.

I disable HDR in the Camera app which is on by default, it looks so cheesy.

 

[priitv8]

In photo, HDR is actually a compression technique, not expansion (like in video).

Is HDR the Same for Video and Photography?

Got a tech question for Sound & Vision? Email us at AskSandV@gmail.com A Does the metadata used to enhance video for high dynamic range TVs also work with still photographs? —George Yeoh / via e-mail

www.soundandvision.com

 

[bozzykid]

I'm confused as to why this was posted to the Apple TV section. You can disable HDR in the settings if you don't want HDR on an Apple TV.

 

[klasma]

One problem with HDR luminance is that it’s defined in terms of absolute brightness, whereas we watch content under different viewing conditions, in environments with different ambient lighting. HDR displays and software vary how they deal with the fact that people actually don’t want to watch stuff with a fixed absolute brightness. In many cases, it still results in content being displayed brighter than desired by the user, in particular in mixed contexts like a computer UI that is mostly SDR, but which may also be displaying HDR content in parts of it.

In addition, content may be misusing HDR by using higher luminance values than would be natural, just to emphasize that it’s HDR content. Proper use of the HDR brightness range would be rather subtle most of the time, and people wouldn’t typically notice a lot of difference from SDR (apart from orthogonal aspects like better color depth and wider color gamut).

 

[theluggage]

When color film/TV came out - everything was in garish, over-saturated color for a while, until producers got over the novelty.

You can tell you're watching a film shot in 3D because. at some point, something in a scene will fly towards you for no adequately explored reason other than to remind audiences of 20 years ago why they were wearing sunglasses in the cinema. I think people got over the novelty of 3D full stop, fortunately...

We're still waiting for producers to get over the fact that people have soundbars - so we have endless room-shaking explosions and can only look forward to. maybe, one day, going back to audible dialogue instead.

I'm sure there must have been some equally annoying trope back at the dawn of "talkies"...

Hopefully, at some stage, TV land will get used to the idea that HDR doesn't have to mean everything happening in near-darkness with occasional blasts of actinic light, and that some people like to watch TV with the lights on...

Positive note - the new Apple TV minus-the-plus ident no longer tries to flash-blind you like the old one did...

 

[iSayuSay]

Oh I love HDR so much so I upgraded all my TVs, monitor and devices to HDR display. Yeah I understand some HDR contents may seem a bit garish and too much. Color ca look awfully oversaturated, but that also happens on SDR with bad color-graded videos. When it's done right, HDR is night and day difference, I'd like to watch and rewatch most movies with HDR.

 

[Lumonaut]

You're not the only one. I'm not fan and I only watch TV on "SDR" and my monitor for my computer is also SDR

That's what you should do if you do not have an HDR capable device, as most people don't unless you go out of your way to get actually HDR-capable devices calibrated properly. Many cheap monitors and TVs advertised the capabilities but are not sufficient. But it's a game-changer if you do have them on say an OLED screen.

 

[Abydos]

oops, I misread HDR as HDDR. I (wondered) thought why is anyone using that technology, but after reading the available literature on HDR I can understand the issues and complications. Sounds like compatibility issues are surfacing

 

[cjsuk]

I will go all day on this one. I agree.

While I like the actual deep black of a proper HDR OLED/mini-LED screen I do not like the burned out eyeballs top end. It's actually very fatiguing to stare at it. Suprisingly perhaps I'd rather watch a film in 30fps SDR than 60fps HDR as well.

Also the photos you take on your iphone rendered in HDR look like absolute crap compared to a non HDR mirrorless camera due to the bonkers luminance range. It's different if you're outside, in relatively bright light but inside it just doesn't work at all.

 

[LionTeeth]

I will go all day on this one. I agree.

While I like the actual deep black of a proper HDR OLED/mini-LED screen I do not like the burned out eyeballs top end. It's actually very fatiguing to stare at it. Suprisingly perhaps I'd rather watch a film in 30fps SDR than 60fps HDR as well.

Also the photos you take on your iphone rendered in HDR look like absolute crap compared to a non HDR mirrorless camera due to the bonkers luminance range. It's different if you're outside, in relatively bright light but inside it just doesn't work at all.

I mostly agree. I miss the days of my calibrated plasma. True true white took getting used to, but once you got used to it the PQ was fantastic. And as for luminance, your eyes will adjust to your environment, when you have a display maxed out at 100 nits and are watching in a dark room, if they change to a beach scene or something it will be very bright to your eyes. Same as if it's at 1000 nits and a scene blows it up to 3000.

And I fully understand what HDR offers in terms of color variance and shading but sometimes it's just too much. Without getting too esoteric, I don't think films were ever "meant" to show you every single possible shade of color within physical limits.


NOW. That said. I still love the UHD format. Watch Casablanca in 4K the HDR is incredible. Puts the Blu-ray to shame. The neon lights somehow look neon despite the B&W picture. The variance in shadows is astounding.

But then on the other end watch LOTR. I don't know if outside scenes were meant to actually look like you're outside. Sometimes you crave that flattened image as you understand it takes place outside but it lets you suspend your disbelief as it looks different than real life.

 

[cjsuk]

I mostly agree. I miss the days of my calibrated plasma. True true white took getting used to, but once you got used to it the PQ was fantastic. And as for luminance, your eyes will adjust to your environment, when you have a display maxed out at 100 nits and are watching in a dark room, if they change to a beach scene or something it will be very bright to your eyes. Same as if it's at 1000 nits and a scene blows it up to 3000.

And I fully understand what HDR offers in terms of color variance and shading but sometimes it's just too much. Without getting too esoteric, I don't think films were ever "meant" to show you every single possible shade of color within physical limits.


NOW. That said. I still love the UHD format. Watch Casablanca in 4K the HDR is incredible. Puts the Blu-ray to shame. The neon lights somehow look neon despite the B&W picture. The variance in shadows is astounding.

But then on the other end watch LOTR. I don't know if outside scenes were meant to actually look like you're outside. Sometimes you crave that flattened image as you understand it takes place outside but it lets you suspend your disbelief as it looks different than real life.

Agree on all counts.

At the same time I'd rather watch something shot and projected on 35mm than digital.

 

[WU27f1xcCs]

When a HDR video shows up on YouTube I find it dazzlingly bright. It’s annoying.

 

[uacd]

OHH yes, MR needed that thread. And I hope we pump it to 1k responses so maybe these people at Apple come and notice that something is not right about their push for HDR.

First of all, it is blinding. Like, I have to use battery saving mode all the time on my iPhone, permanent battery saving mode on MacBook, so it will block HDR in YouTube and such.

Secondly it looks unnatural. Do they really think sky would glow that way in real life? I mean it looks awful.

Thirdly, it makes videos lose fine details: I focus on this flickering lights instead of actual video.

I understand it's a technical innovation to have brighter peaks etc., but it's truly a gimmick to me.

Honestly: I don’t🤣 As well as I don’t understand why Apple keeps pushing for this so-cal innovation. Probably that’s because other tech giants do that (Samsung, LG), so Apple simply parrots them as usual, although I don’t see the point.

I enjoy old movies without HDR much more.

Definitely. Because directors knew what they are doing and tested it on all gear possible so it would still look perfect 20-40 years after it would be shot (especially after digitizing film to 4k).

Kind of reminds me of this whole “vinyl remasters” topic when studios would ruin classics for the sake of more loudness. It had a huge backlash in music community, fans of classic rock and metal hated how compressor equalized all elements to the same loudness

 

[Seanm87]

Personally I disagree. I think it can give images so much more realism and depth. I would say it’s a game changer for movies, games, photos etc

The only time it annoys me is when I’m doom scrolling loads of SDR videos and then suddenly a HDR one comes out of nowhere and blinds me.

 

[cynics]

HDR is obviously brighter but higher dynamic ranges keeps whites from getting blown out and detail in the dark. It's better at being brighter and dark. However the color depth is why I like it so much.

I can't stress enough that your TV needs to be calibrated (even just copying settings yourself) for it to look good. Just turning on HDR at the source will generally make a worse image. Also calibration is done for the room and lighting conditions, something to keep in mind if its too bright.

 

[SDAVE]

I'm confused as to why this was posted to the Apple TV section. You can disable HDR in the settings if you don't want HDR on an Apple TV.

Because it's related to HDR on Apple TV specifically. Whether it's the macOS/iOS/iPad OS App or hardware.

I have all of them and disable HDR on Apple TV shows/movies.

 

[SDAVE]

HDR is obviously brighter but higher dynamic ranges keeps whites from getting blown out and detail in the dark. It's better at being brighter and dark. However the color depth is why I like it so much.

I can't stress enough that your TV needs to be calibrated (even just copying settings yourself) for it to look good. Just turning on HDR at the source will generally make a worse image. Also calibration is done for the room and lighting conditions, something to keep in mind if its too bright.

MacBook Pro has a factory calibrated display...

 

[victrolux]

Am I the only one that hates anything related to HDR?

I've started using Apple TV app lately to watch some shows and all of the shows have HDR. On my MacBook the screen is too bright and it takes me out of the story.

I understand it's a technical innovation to have brighter peaks etc., but it's truly a gimmick to me.

I constantly have to change my MacBook Pro's display from XDR > Apple Display to get rid of HDR.

I enjoy old movies without HDR much more.

Just give me old timey "contrast" and "brigthness" knobs!