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bill-p

macrumors 68030
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Jul 23, 2011
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I got the new 16" MacBook with M1 Max in to test for last week. I really liked the new 16" real estate, but the extra heft and bulk really gave me pause. Yes, I know the 16" isn't really that much heavier or bigger than my old 15" 2015 MacBook. But... the fact is: it's still heavier and bulkier than a past MacBook from 5 years ago. So I exchanged the 16" for one of the new 14" with M1 Pro last Friday and got the weekend to play with it.

It's Monday now and I can finally say... I think I am ready to move on from the 13" Pro M1. Please allow me to explain.

Here are the things the 13" Pro M1 does better in a nutshell:

1. Battery life
2. It's still the sleeker, thinner and lighter device
3. It's still fairly fast for most casual use

And personally, here are the things I have gained going to the 14" device:

1. It's much faster for my "professional" tasks. 3D modeling with AutoCAD Fusion 360 is much smoother, photo editing/exporting is twice as fast, and compiling large coding projects is anywhere between 50% to 100% faster.
2. That screen. Even at the same 500 nits brightness, it's more color-accurate, with faster (seemingly?) response and the contrast ratio is just amazing. Also HDR is amazing!
3. Speakers!
4. Headphone port is far more powerful now so I no longer need to lug along a portable audio player or a DAC/amp. The MacBook can handle all of my headphones by itself, including my Sennheiser HD800!
5. No Touch Bar and massive Esc + Touch ID keys!
6. More screen real estate and text sharpness overall, even at the same zoom level as the 13" (13" @ 1280x800 vs 14" @ 1352x878). The 14" really does split the difference and feels closer to the old 15" than it is to the 13".
7. Fast charge! 13" couldn't fast charge and I had to wait while the battery slowly charged up to... whatever amount. 14" can fast charge to 50% within 30 minutes with a 100W charger.
8. Better webcam

Do I strictly "need" the 14"? Nope. But then the same thing could be said for the 13": I didn't need it. I could have kept using the 2015 15" just fine. These are more like... luxury devices that I can afford.

The thing is, all of the things I get with the 14" are things that actually help me work better at all of my usual computing tasks, and then it's just a more enjoyable device overall. I'm getting basically 1.5 - 2x better performance, but at about maybe like a 20% loss in battery life. That is a good trade in my opinions. Performance/watt is much higher with the M1 Pro vs M1 to me.

The 14" in general is still a cool-running M1 device to me. Fan almost never turns on, and even when it does, I can barely hear it, pretty much just like the 13" Pro that it's replacing.

The 16" with M1 Max was nice as well, but the fan came on a bit more than what I was used to (probably due to the extra demand from Fusion 360 and Capture One Pro?). Plus I honestly could not forgive the added bulk/weight even over my old 2015 15". Again, it honestly... wasn't that much, but it just felt very... beastly. It was as if I was holding an old MacBook from before 2011. Some may be okay with that, but... I wasn't.

The 14" to me doesn't seem like it's losing out on CPU performance, but it's also much more portable. It's also not much of a loss to battery life since I'm still easily getting over 10 hours on a single charge, and in fact, I think I'm getting slightly more battery life than the 16" with M1 Max with my workflow, even!

Also I have to mention the 14" can be fast charged with any of its USB-C ports, on both sides. I have a very compact Aukey Omnia 100W USB-C charger brick that works perfectly fine with the 14" and it makes my bag that much... happier compared to if I was lugging the 16" around with the massive 140W brick.

14" is also the superior docking setup for me because my monitor, the LG 34WK95U, can only deliver 85W through the single Thunderbolt 3 cable. It couldn't get the 16" to charge at all! Or if it did, it was very slowly. I had to plug an extra cable (either MagSafe 3 or a 100W USB-C charger) to the 16" to get it to play nice with the monitor. With the 14", I only needed the one cable, and done. Both the 14" and 16" also natively support higher retina scaled resolutions with the monitor, whereas the 13" M1 seems to need 3rd-party solution to support those higher resolutions. And also, I could tell the 13" M1 was struggling with Fusion 360 at 5K-ish resolution.

So yeah, no comparison. 14" all the way for me. It ticks all of the right boxes for most everything. I can complain about the notch but I think everyone has said all they needed to say. I use TopNotch to make it stand out less, and the rest has been history.
 
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Bill-P... it sounds like you did the right thing for you. Myself... I don't need that kind of horsepower these days and the new 14-inch MBP starts at two grand. So I just pulled the trigger on a 13-inch M1 MBP that Amazon was discounting by $200. Add the $100 Amazon gift card I had laying around and I got it for $999. I've been getting by with a 2019 iMac and a 2020 iPad Pro, which both work fine. This will be my first Apple laptop and should hold me until the brand-new generation coming out now eventually goes on fire sale.
 
Bill-P... it sounds like you did the right thing for you. Myself... I don't need that kind of horsepower these days and the new 14-inch MBP starts at two grand. So I just pulled the trigger on a 13-inch M1 MBP that Amazon was discounting by $200. Add the $100 Amazon gift card I had laying around and I got it for $999. I've been getting by with a 2019 iMac and a 2020 iPad Pro, which both work fine. This will be my first Apple laptop and should hold me until the brand-new generation coming out now eventually goes on fire sale.

Yeah, I'm just very happy to be able to get this much performance in a package this small. But honestly, it's just because I could afford it (thanks to bonus at work!), not because this is strictly something I needed. I think the 13" Pro is still a very nice device, and I would be happy to keep it around had the 14" not come out. But since the 14" is out now, and it is indeed the best fit for my setup, I can't just pass up on it.
 
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I got the new 16" MacBook with M1 Max in to test for last week. I really liked the new 16" real estate, but the extra heft and bulk really gave me pause. Yes, I know the 16" isn't really that much heavier or bigger than my old 15" 2015 MacBook. But... the fact is: it's still heavier and bulkier than a past MacBook from 5 years ago. So I exchanged the 16" for one of the new 14" with M1 Pro last Friday and got the weekend to play with it.

It's Monday now and I can finally say... I think I am ready to move on from the 13" Pro M1. Please allow me to explain.

Here are the things the 13" Pro M1 does better in a nutshell:

1. Battery life
2. It's still the sleeker, thinner and lighter device
3. It's still fairly fast for most casual use

And personally, here are the things I have gained going to the 14" device:

1. It's much faster for my "professional" tasks. 3D modeling with AutoCAD Fusion 360 is much smoother, photo editing/exporting is twice as fast, and compiling large coding projects is anywhere between 50% to 100% faster.
2. That screen. Even at the same 500 nits brightness, it's more color-accurate, with faster (seemingly?) response and the contrast ratio is just amazing. Also HDR is amazing!
3. Speakers!
4. Headphone port is far more powerful now so I no longer need to lug along a portable audio player or a DAC/amp. The MacBook can handle all of my headphones by itself, including my Sennheiser HD800!
5. No Touch Bar and massive Esc + Touch ID keys!
6. More screen real estate and text sharpness overall, even at the same zoom level as the 13" (13" @ 1280x800 vs 14" @ 1352x878). The 14" really does split the difference and feels closer to the old 15" than it is to the 13".
7. Fast charge! 13" couldn't fast charge and I had to wait while the battery slowly charged up to... whatever amount. 14" can fast charge to 50% within 30 minutes with a 100W charger.
8. Better webcam

Do I strictly "need" the 14"? Nope. But then the same thing could be said for the 13": I didn't need it. I could have kept using the 2015 15" just fine. These are more like... luxury devices that I can afford.

The thing is, all of the things I get with the 14" are things that actually help me work better at all of my usual computing tasks, and then it's just a more enjoyable device overall. I'm getting basically 1.5 - 2x better performance, but at about maybe like a 20% loss in battery life. That is a good trade in my opinions. Performance/watt is much higher with the M1 Pro vs M1 to me.

The 14" in general is still a cool-running M1 device to me. Fan almost never turns on, and even when it does, I can barely hear it, pretty much just like the 13" Pro that it's replacing.

The 16" with M1 Max was nice as well, but the fan came on a bit more than what I was used to (probably due to the extra demand from Fusion 360 and Capture One Pro?). Plus I honestly could not forgive the added bulk/weight even over my old 2015 15". Again, it honestly... wasn't that much, but it just felt very... beastly. It was as if I was holding an old MacBook from before 2011. Some may be okay with that, but... I wasn't.

The 14" to me doesn't seem like it's losing out on CPU performance, but it's also much more portable. It's also not much of a loss to battery life since I'm still easily getting over 10 hours on a single charge, and in fact, I think I'm getting slightly more battery life than the 16" with M1 Max with my workflow, even!

Also I have to mention the 14" can be fast charged with any of its USB-C ports, on both sides. I have a very compact Aukey Omnia 100W USB-C charger brick that works perfectly fine with the 14" and it makes my bag that much... happier compared to if I was lugging the 16" around with the massive 140W brick.

14" is also the superior docking setup for me because my monitor, the LG 34WK95U, can only deliver 85W through the single Thunderbolt 3 cable. It couldn't get the 16" to charge at all! Or if it did, it was very slowly. I had to plug an extra cable (either MagSafe 3 or a 100W USB-C charger) to the 16" to get it to play nice with the monitor. With the 14", I only needed the one cable, and done. Both the 14" and 16" also natively support higher retina scaled resolutions with the monitor, whereas the 13" M1 seems to need 3rd-party solution to support those higher resolutions. And also, I could tell the 13" M1 was struggling with Fusion 360 at 5K-ish resolution.

So yeah, no comparison. 14" all the way for me. It ticks all of the right boxes for most everything. I can complain about the notch but I think everyone has said all they needed to say. I use TopNotch to make it stand out less, and the rest has been history.
One thing: Fast charging works only with MagSafe, not the Thunderbolt ports. Apart from that I totally agree with you. The 16" is just too big and I could only buy it if it were also a replacement for a desktop computer, docked in most of the time. The 14" is portable, not heavy and the battery life is very good. The display is just amazing and having a proper Retina resolution with no scaling is great. And yes, I think the display is brighter somehow even if I know it goes up to 500nits with SDR content.
 
One thing: Fast charging works only with MagSafe, not the Thunderbolt ports. Apart from that I totally agree with you. The 16" is just too big and I could only buy it if it were also a replacement for a desktop computer, docked in most of the time. The 14" is portable, not heavy and the battery life is very good. The display is just amazing and having a proper Retina resolution with no scaling is great. And yes, I think the display is brighter somehow even if I know it goes up to 500nits with SDR content.

The 14inch fast charges at ~100W, so it can fast charge over USB-C. The fast charging is defined by Apple as basically a certain amount of percentage charge over time, so smaller batteries like the one in the 14 inch can achieve it with less wattage. The 16 inch requires 140W (which is only provided via magsafe) to increase its battery percentage as quickly as the 14.
 
14" is also the superior docking setup for me because my monitor, the LG 34WK95U, can only deliver 85W through the single Thunderbolt 3 cable. It couldn't get the 16" to charge at all! Or if it did, it was very slowly. I had to plug an extra cable (either MagSafe 3 or a 100W USB-C charger) to the 16" to get it to play nice with the monitor. With the 14", I only needed the one cable, and done. Both the 14" and 16" also natively support higher retina scaled resolutions with the monitor, whereas the 13" M1 seems to need 3rd-party solution to support those higher resolutions. And also, I could tell the 13" M1 was struggling with Fusion 360 at 5K-ish resolution.

So yeah, no comparison. 14" all the way for me. It ticks all of the right boxes for most everything. I can complain about the notch but I think everyone has said all they needed to say. I use TopNotch to make it stand out less, and the rest has been history.
Thinking of getting a 14 and sometimes hooking it up to a LG monitor (maybe the 32” ultrafine). Any thoughts about how the thermals are on the 14 when connected to your monitor?
I would shy away in the past from getting a laptop to do this but it seems we’re finally at a point where it’s ok to do so without the laptop spinning up.
 
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Thinking of getting a 14 and sometimes hooking it up to a LG monitor (maybe the 32” ultrafine). Any thoughts about how the thermals are on the 14 when connected to your monitor?
I would shy away in the past from getting a laptop to do this but it seems we’re finally at a point where it’s ok to do so without the laptop spinning up.

Thermals on the 14" are great either when the thing is open or when it's closed! I honestly can barely hear the fan, even when the machine is in clamshell with the lid closed, with all CPU cores and GPU stressed to the max. I don't think anyone has to worry about noise or heat here.

There may be scenarios that can push the fan to even... louder heights? But in normal usage, I honestly can't even get the fan past 2400RPM, which is to say, it's completely not audible at all, not even when I'm forcing the machine to render 3D to a 5K screen.
 
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very jelly bill-p. still waiting for mine to ship. been sending telephathetic good vibes to apple but no luck so far.

ive been on my 13" m1 mbp since jan and very spoiled by the portability and battery life. hopefully i won't feel the bulk too much like you.
 
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I got the new 16" MacBook with M1 Max in to test for last week. I really liked the new 16" real estate, but the extra heft and bulk really gave me pause. Yes, I know the 16" isn't really that much heavier or bigger than my old 15" 2015 MacBook. But... the fact is: it's still heavier and bulkier than a past MacBook from 5 years ago. So I exchanged the 16" for one of the new 14" with M1 Pro last Friday and got the weekend to play with it.

It's Monday now and I can finally say... I think I am ready to move on from the 13" Pro M1. Please allow me to explain.

Here are the things the 13" Pro M1 does better in a nutshell:

1. Battery life
2. It's still the sleeker, thinner and lighter device
3. It's still fairly fast for most casual use

And personally, here are the things I have gained going to the 14" device:

1. It's much faster for my "professional" tasks. 3D modeling with AutoCAD Fusion 360 is much smoother, photo editing/exporting is twice as fast, and compiling large coding projects is anywhere between 50% to 100% faster.
2. That screen. Even at the same 500 nits brightness, it's more color-accurate, with faster (seemingly?) response and the contrast ratio is just amazing. Also HDR is amazing!
3. Speakers!
4. Headphone port is far more powerful now so I no longer need to lug along a portable audio player or a DAC/amp. The MacBook can handle all of my headphones by itself, including my Sennheiser HD800!
5. No Touch Bar and massive Esc + Touch ID keys!
6. More screen real estate and text sharpness overall, even at the same zoom level as the 13" (13" @ 1280x800 vs 14" @ 1352x878). The 14" really does split the difference and feels closer to the old 15" than it is to the 13".
7. Fast charge! 13" couldn't fast charge and I had to wait while the battery slowly charged up to... whatever amount. 14" can fast charge to 50% within 30 minutes with a 100W charger.
8. Better webcam

Do I strictly "need" the 14"? Nope. But then the same thing could be said for the 13": I didn't need it. I could have kept using the 2015 15" just fine. These are more like... luxury devices that I can afford.

The thing is, all of the things I get with the 14" are things that actually help me work better at all of my usual computing tasks, and then it's just a more enjoyable device overall. I'm getting basically 1.5 - 2x better performance, but at about maybe like a 20% loss in battery life. That is a good trade in my opinions. Performance/watt is much higher with the M1 Pro vs M1 to me.

The 14" in general is still a cool-running M1 device to me. Fan almost never turns on, and even when it does, I can barely hear it, pretty much just like the 13" Pro that it's replacing.

The 16" with M1 Max was nice as well, but the fan came on a bit more than what I was used to (probably due to the extra demand from Fusion 360 and Capture One Pro?). Plus I honestly could not forgive the added bulk/weight even over my old 2015 15". Again, it honestly... wasn't that much, but it just felt very... beastly. It was as if I was holding an old MacBook from before 2011. Some may be okay with that, but... I wasn't.

The 14" to me doesn't seem like it's losing out on CPU performance, but it's also much more portable. It's also not much of a loss to battery life since I'm still easily getting over 10 hours on a single charge, and in fact, I think I'm getting slightly more battery life than the 16" with M1 Max with my workflow, even!

Also I have to mention the 14" can be fast charged with any of its USB-C ports, on both sides. I have a very compact Aukey Omnia 100W USB-C charger brick that works perfectly fine with the 14" and it makes my bag that much... happier compared to if I was lugging the 16" around with the massive 140W brick.

14" is also the superior docking setup for me because my monitor, the LG 34WK95U, can only deliver 85W through the single Thunderbolt 3 cable. It couldn't get the 16" to charge at all! Or if it did, it was very slowly. I had to plug an extra cable (either MagSafe 3 or a 100W USB-C charger) to the 16" to get it to play nice with the monitor. With the 14", I only needed the one cable, and done. Both the 14" and 16" also natively support higher retina scaled resolutions with the monitor, whereas the 13" M1 seems to need 3rd-party solution to support those higher resolutions. And also, I could tell the 13" M1 was struggling with Fusion 360 at 5K-ish resolution.

So yeah, no comparison. 14" all the way for me. It ticks all of the right boxes for most everything. I can complain about the notch but I think everyone has said all they needed to say. I use TopNotch to make it stand out less, and the rest has been history.
I believe a TB3 dock can supply enough charge to your 16, that was my setup. For me, the 14 is still too small and doesn’t feel like a worthy upgrade from the M1 13.
 
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I believe a TB3 dock can supply enough charge to your 16, that was my setup. For me, the 14 is still too small and doesn’t feel like a worthy upgrade from the M1 13.

I couldn't find a dock that can supply both >100W charging + Thunderbolt 3 connection pass-through to the display back when I purchased it. I'd bet there are some now, but it'd be like... I'm trying to build around the 16" MacBook Pro. The 14" can just connect directly to the display and my setup without me having to add anything else, and the display itself also has 2 extra USB-A ports as well, so it's already kind of a hub.

I wouldn't agree that the 14" is not a worthy upgrade over the 13". There is quite a bit more screen real estate, and yet it doesn't weigh significantly more than the 13". The weight difference versus my 2015 15" is still very substantial.
 
I couldn't find a dock that can supply both >100W charging + Thunderbolt 3 connection pass-through to the display back when I purchased it. I'd bet there are some now, but it'd be like... I'm trying to build around the 16" MacBook Pro. The 14" can just connect directly to the display and my setup without me having to add anything else, and the display itself also has 2 extra USB-A ports as well, so it's already kind of a hub.

I wouldn't agree that the 14" is not a worthy upgrade over the 13". There is quite a bit more screen real estate, and yet it doesn't weigh significantly more than the 13". The weight difference versus my 2015 15" is still very substantial.
Has the battery drop off only been 20%? That was my biggest issue with the 14 -- not enough battery!
 
Has the battery drop off only been 20%? That was my biggest issue with the 14 -- not enough battery!

Here you go. It is really only 20% to me. With my normal usage, I'm getting anywhere between 9 - 12 hours. Also found out yesterday that switching from the 1600 nits XDR display profile to 500 nits XDR display profile (still with HDR enabled) made a huge difference to normal battery life... for some weird reason.

Screen Shot 2021-11-01 at 4.49.33 PM.png
 
Good choice but the two machines overlap too much, I would sell or trade in the old one.
 
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Here you go. It is really only 20% to me. With my normal usage, I'm getting anywhere between 9 - 12 hours. Also found out yesterday that switching from the 1600 nits XDR display profile to 500 nits XDR display profile (still with HDR enabled) made a huge difference to normal battery life... for some weird reason.

View attachment 1900103
Interesting. Thanks for sharing. 9-12 is not terrible. Any other adjustments or optimizations we can make to extend the 14 battery life?
 
Good choice but the two machines overlap too much, I would sell or trade in the old one.

Yeah, I'm selling the 13" Pro. Would have kept it around for my wife but she prefers the 12.9" iPad Pro more. And in fact, I guess... the 13" Pro is much too close to the iPad Pro for its own good. The new 14" is... appreciably bigger (and somewhat better) than the iPad Pro.

Interesting. Thanks for sharing. 9-12 is not terrible. Any other adjustments or optimizations we can make to extend the 14 battery life?

Yeah, aside from that, I haven't seen anything else. I also briefly tried Low Power Mode and 60Hz but decided to not bother with either one since they mess with the perception/feel of the device too much. Safari in particular became very juddery when Low Power Mode was engaged. Likely because it's still acting like it's on an M1 rather than M1 Pro/Max device.
 
Yeah, I'm selling the 13" Pro. Would have kept it around for my wife but she prefers the 12.9" iPad Pro more. And in fact, I guess... the 13" Pro is much too close to the iPad Pro for its own good. The new 14" is... appreciably bigger (and somewhat better) than the iPad Pro.



Yeah, aside from that, I haven't seen anything else. I also briefly tried Low Power Mode and 60Hz but decided to not bother with either one since they mess with the perception/feel of the device too much. Safari in particular became very juddery when Low Power Mode was engaged. Likely because it's still acting like it's on an M1 rather than M1 Pro/Max device.
did you wrists press against the sharp front edge of the 16? I encountered this problem and thought the typing experience was better on the 14. proper ergonomics did not fix this issue I had with the 16.
 
did you wrists press against the sharp front edge of the 16? I encountered this problem and thought the typing experience was better on the 14. proper ergonomics did not fix this issue I had with the 16.

Well, kind of. I think my typical typing position is much taller than the MacBook, so I don't end up rubbing my wrists against the edges. Also the edges on the 14" don't seem as sharp as the 13" Pro to me.
 
Yeah, I'm selling the 13" Pro. Would have kept it around for my wife but she prefers the 12.9" iPad Pro more. And in fact, I guess... the 13" Pro is much too close to the iPad Pro for its own good. The new 14" is... appreciably bigger (and somewhat better) than the iPad Pro.



Yeah, aside from that, I haven't seen anything else. I also briefly tried Low Power Mode and 60Hz but decided to not bother with either one since they mess with the perception/feel of the device too much. Safari in particular became very juddery when Low Power Mode was engaged. Likely because it's still acting like it's on an M1 rather than M1 Pro/Max device.
The 14” is a really solid machine that can support my workflow for several years. I just got the M1 Pro and this thing flies threw everything I throw at it in typical usage. I liked my M1 MBA, but it still feels like a bit of a compromise, especially the screen, and the port situation.
 
Well, kind of. I think my typical typing position is much taller than the MacBook, so I don't end up rubbing my wrists against the edges. Also the edges on the 14" don't seem as sharp as the 13" Pro to me.
will order and try again, this time, with a new chair and a deeper desk to accommodate the 16 inch footprint
 
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