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ToddH

macrumors 68040
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Jul 5, 2010
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I’m an iPhone photographer and currently have the 13 pro max. I read that fairly significant updates were coming to the camera in iOS 16. Can this be verified and has anyone noticed? Is the quality better in general and with night mode? I’m hoping that the 14 pro max will be great. Thanks..
I’m hoping night mode has improved so I can get cleaner astrophotos. These aren’t bad, but I’d like to see better results

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it’s a small sensor with ai manipulating your photo too look good viewing the image full not pixel peeping or any of the sort ; what you should do is figure what is the native iso for iphone 13 pro max to get the best image possible with least amount of noise. I do photography with sony alpha cameras and have used samsung phones in the past with moment lenses. To get best photo find native iso and use other apps that allow you to change all settings manually . I believe if the app still exist the moment app could let you do everything manually without ai manipulation
 
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it’s a small sensor with ai manipulating your photo too look good viewing the image full not pixel peeping or any of the sort ; what you should do is figure what is the native iso for iphone 13 pro max to get the best image possible with least amount of noise. I do photography with sony alpha cameras and have used samsung phones in the past with moment lenses. To get best photo find native iso and use other apps that allow you to change all settings manually . I believe if the app still exist the moment app could let you do everything manually without ai manipulation
As a long time photographer, I know how to get the best image quality from the iPhone during the day, I shoot ProRaw exclusively and edit in Lightroom mobile on my iPhone or iPad pro. I can’t change the iso for night mode though because that’s automatically set. I still use ProRAW for night mode shots.

I do have the moment app, it’s one of my favorites to use. The Moment lenses do not perform as well on my 13 pro max so I switched over to BeastCam / Beastgrip lenses and mounts. They are designed for the larger optics and sensors in the current iPhone models. They are super nice! The BeastCam app is also very good.

Anyway my main concern or interest was wanting to know if night mode has improved by either less noise or exposures longer than 30 seconds. I wish the iPhone could be set for a straight forward 30” exposure with my choice of iso like Samsung galaxy phones allow you to do. I also use the Even Longer app to stack raw images (tripod required) to get the best quality as well, that’s the app I used to blur the water in my shot shown above. Even Longer is the best app on the App Store for giving us the highest quality images by far. But, at night, Apple only allows a 1 second exposure maximum time for that app and any other app. I wish Apple would allow app developers to be given longer exposure times to apps for astronomy. I have the Sony A7 RIII camera and sigma lenses for my serious astrophotography when I’m in a dark enough area…. Thanks for the reply.
 
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Can’t say a lot about improvements in the night mode. Haven’t used it so often with iOS 15 and wouldn’t have good comparisons now with iOS 16 public beta 3.
What is definitely improved are the Portrait Fotos (background blur is way more precise) and videos with the cinema mode. The blur looks far less artificial and as well more precise around objects and especially humans :)
Makes fun to use. Recorded a clip in the park this weekend and I’m very happy with the result. Facial recognition worked also very well.
 
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Can’t say a lot about improvements in the night mode. Haven’t used it so often with iOS 15 and wouldn’t have good comparisons now with iOS 16 public beta 3.
What is definitely improved are the Portrait Fotos (background blur is way more precise) and videos with the cinema mode. The blur looks far less artificial and as well more precise around objects and especially humans :)
Makes fun to use. Recorded a clip in the park this weekend and I’m very happy with the result. Facial recognition worked also very well.
Good to know, I haven't taken much videos lately but I'll start using Cinematic Mode a lot more. I am on iOS 16 so I can't really compare it to iOS 15 since I didn't use it at all back then.

Just wished they'd allow 4K 24fps or 60fps instead of just 1080p @ 30fps.
 
Good to know, I haven't taken much videos lately but I'll start using Cinematic Mode a lot more. I am on iOS 16 so I can't really compare it to iOS 15 since I didn't use it at all back then.

Just wished they'd allow 4K 24fps or 60fps instead of just 1080p @ 30fps.
I’d like to see better night mode image quality and longer exposure times. I’m sure the iPhone 14 pro max will have 4K in cinematic mode. I also wish that Apple would allow us to have longer than 1 second of exposure times with other apps, Samsung will let you set the exposure to 30” and a selected iso instead of automatically choosing those settings for us. I’ll test it out when 16 is available.
 
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I’d like to see better night mode image quality and longer exposure times. I’m sure the iPhone 14 pro max will have 4K in cinematic mode. I also wish that Apple would allow us to have longer than 1 second of exposure times with other apps, Samsung will let you set the exposure to 30” and a selected iso instead of automatically choosing those settings for us. I’ll test it out when 16 is available.
Yeah, I don't use Night Mode enough to warrant any improvements right now, at least for me. Definitely understand some of you use it quite often.

I just want 4K 24fps and 60fps options for Cinematic mode along with better Smart HDR photos. I love how pictures turn out on the Pixel 6 line, I had a 6 Pro and man the pictures always blew me away. Everything was perfect majority of the time, there were times where there was too much HDR which made the picture look bad but other than that the photos on the Pixel 6 Pro blew my 13 Pro out of the water 80% of the time.
 
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Yeah, I don't use Night Mode enough to warrant any improvements right now, at least for me. Definitely understand some of you use it quite often.

I just want 4K 24fps and 60fps options for Cinematic mode along with better Smart HDR photos. I love how pictures turn out on the Pixel 6 line, I had a 6 Pro and man the pictures always blew me away. Everything was perfect majority of the time, there were times where there was too much HDR which made the picture look bad but other than that the photos on the Pixel 6 Pro blew my 13 Pro out of the water 80% of the time.
Interesting details regarding the pixel 6. So we’re these photos that you say were so good out of the camera jpeg images? What about raw? I shoot raw exclusively on my 13 pro max iPhone and edit them in Lightroom mobile on the iPhone or iPad Pro. I know if you would get better results using ProRAW over jpeg, then compare to pixel 6. Anyway, I’m hoping for better results from iOS 16. I’ll probably pay off one of my iPhone 13 pro max iPhones to upgrade to the 14 pro max.

I’ve been reading news about the 14 pro max and it possibly being delayed or released in late October or early November. Also read that the 48mp camera will give you a full 48mp image in well lit locations, but only delivers a 12mp image at night as the pixels on the new sensor will not absorb as much light since they are much smaller and introduce a lot more noise than the 13 pro max. They call it pixel binning which creates an image from the 48mp sensor and produces a high enough quality image at 12mp in low light. As a photographer, I’d like all 48mp all the time.
 
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Interesting details regarding the pixel 6. So we’re these photos that you say were so good out of the camera jpeg images? What about raw? I shoot raw exclusively on my 13 pro max iPhone and edit them in Lightroom mobile on the iPhone or iPad Pro. I know if you would get better results using ProRAW over jpeg, then compare to pixel 6. Anyway, I’m hoping for better results from iOS 16. I’ll probably pay off one of my iPhone 13 pro max iPhones to upgrade to the 14 pro max.

I’ve been reading news about the 14 pro max and it possibly being delayed or released in late October or early November. Also read that the 48mp camera will give you a full 48mp image in well lit locations, but only delivers a 12mp image at night as the pixels on the new sensor will not absorb as much light since they are much smaller and introduce a lot more noise than the 13 pro max. They call it pixel binning which creates an image from the 48mp sensor and produces a high enough quality image at 12mp in low light. As a photographer, I’d like all 48mp all the time.
Well, basically the the Pixel 6 Pro was superior when it came to the following: skin tones, shadows (in most cases), highlights and natural sharpness. When I compared images side by side the photos coming from the Pixel 6 Pro just looked more true to life and less artificial if that makes sense.

Of course, video is superior on the iPhone 13 line and with iOS 16 the Cinematic mode looks simply superb.
 
I had not seen this thread, and I find everything you comment interesting. I also take the opportunity to comment on the same thing that I already did in the general thread, and that is that I notice that the telephoto camera, since beta 5 at least, is used in far fewer situations. And it shows in the quality of the photos and videos, where the result is very poor, even in situations with good light, a lot of detail is lost. in the photos there is even the watercolor effect instead of textures in many shots. I have a 13 pro and until now I was delighted with the camera, but since the last betas, something has changed and the quality has decreased. even the best it had, which was almost identical white balance between the three sensors, is no longer the case. I notice the drop in quality because I compare shots I took in iOS 15 and I can recreate in iOS 16, and the change in some aspects is very evident.
 
I had not seen this thread, and I find everything you comment interesting. I also take the opportunity to comment on the same thing that I already did in the general thread, and that is that I notice that the telephoto camera, since beta 5 at least, is used in far fewer situations. And it shows in the quality of the photos and videos, where the result is very poor, even in situations with good light, a lot of detail is lost. in the photos there is even the watercolor effect instead of textures in many shots. I have a 13 pro and until now I was delighted with the camera, but since the last betas, something has changed and the quality has decreased. even the best it had, which was almost identical white balance between the three sensors, is no longer the case. I notice the drop in quality because I compare shots I took in iOS 15 and I can recreate in iOS 16, and the change in some aspects is very evident.
Well that’s not good news. Of Course it doesn’t surprise me, I guess probably Apple‘s way of decreasing the iPhone 13 Pro line camera quality to force people to upgrade to the 14 pro? Anyway I hope that’s not the case. i’ve read where most people don’t like the quality of the JPEG images that the 13 Pro series produces. It’s probably because of the size of the pixels on the sensor. They’re quite large letting in a lot of light but suffer on resolution on distant small objects like leaves on trees, grass etc. I shoot mostly ProRAW anyway, that way I find that the camera quality is always top notch when shot in raw. Hopefully you guys (beet testers) are able to relay that information over to Apple before they release a final public release of this software so that they can make good on the camera quality.
 
Love the photos (assuming these are both the night sky ones) but can’t download as both stating cannot be found. I’ve the iPhone 11 so prob can’t take photos to this level. Are these full res or compressed ?
I uploaded full resolution but they get compressed on this forum to 3mp in size I believe. You can message me an email and I’ll send them to you…if you wish. Here are some others from the first of the year and the latest shots. The iPhone 11 won’t get you these results. I’m hoping the iPhone 14 pro max does better than the 13 pro max with night mode. But unless the 14 pro can expose for longer than 30 seconds, it won’t be much better. I wish Apple would give us more control over the camera settings so developers can use their apps more effectively. Apps like Even Longer! If I could get 10-15 seconds exposure time per shot with that app at night instead of 1 second, my astrophotography would look so much better. But that’s a pipe dream I suppose. 30 seconds of exposure time at high ISO doesn’t yield very good results because of the noise. Maybe if the optics came down to f/1.2 then that would let a lot of light in and probably at the expense of corner distortion because of the fast optics. If we got 4 minutes with low iso, that would be fantastic!

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Didnt like Halide at all for astro. Quality is not near proraw from the built in app.
Yes Halide will not work in night mode. Daylight and indoor shots only. The app mostly gives you full control over the camera. The only app at this time that does very well with night time shots, especially in raw, is Even Longer. It even works great at high resolution high quality studio work as well, mainly product shots. Examples:


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I uploaded full resolution but they get compressed on this forum to 3mp in size I believe. You can message me an email and I’ll send them to you…if you wish. Here are some others from the first of the year and the latest shots. The iPhone 11 won’t get you these results. I’m hoping the iPhone 14 pro max does better than the 13 pro max with night mode. But unless the 14 pro can expose for longer than 30 seconds, it won’t be much better. I wish Apple would give us more control over the camera settings so developers can use their apps more effectively. Apps like Even Longer! If I could get 10-15 seconds exposure time per shot with that app at night instead of 1 second, my astrophotography would look so much better. But that’s a pipe dream I suppose. 30 seconds of exposure time at high ISO doesn’t yield very good results because of the noise. Maybe if the optics came down to f/1.2 then that would let a lot of light in and probably at the expense of corner distortion because of the fast optics. If we got 4 minutes with low iso, that would be
May I ask why use Even Longer at night when the built in app can take Photos with 30 s exposure?
 
May I ask why use Even Longer at night when the built in app can take Photos with 30 s exposure?
Yeah the even longer app allows up to 24 hours of exposure time during the night for star trails, light trails (cars headlights on hwy etc). It does not behave like night mode and its maximum single exposure time is one second where night mode on an iPhone mounted on a tripod will take three 10 second exposures and combined them into one to help reduce noise because it shoots at high ISO. They even longer app will use the lowest ISO possible for the nighttime shots. It has three modes, frame averaging mode, light trails mode, and star trails mode and each one of these modes uses a higher ISO than the other etc. and long exposures during the day to blur moving clouds and to blur water like with waterfalls or the ocean to get that smooth look. Here is an example of blurred water: this was 40” I think.

So if you wanted a shot of the circular pattern of the stars as the earth rotates, then you could expose for 10 hours if you wanted. The star trail shot I posted was for 20 minutes. Night mode can’t do that.

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Thanks for the tip. I just tried taking one photo with even longer for 1 min and 10 seconds and one with the built in app.
This is the normal camera app, jpeg:
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This is even longer, jpg since I have not payed yet:
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Look at the bright parts, total blown out. If I focus on some place on screen it wont measure light there.
 
Thanks for the tip. I just tried taking one photo with even longer for 1 min and 10 seconds and one with the built in app.
This is the normal camera app, jpeg:
IMG_4778.jpg


This is even longer, jpg since I have not payed yet:
EL_20220827_130616.JPG


Look at the bright parts, total blown out. If I focus on some place on screen it wont measure light there.
Hi Kave, Thanks for the samples. The even longer app does not use smart HDR or any HDR, it’s like a DSLR. The focus just focuses without affecting the exposure of the scene, you’ll have to adjust that yourself. You’ll have to use the exposure compensation tool to adjust the brightness to control the highlights in the scene. This is why I shoot in RAW for this app. It’s still a fantastic app for stacking images in jpeg but much better in RAW. You just have to expose for the highlights and lift the shadows in post. If you have a DSLR and know how that works then this app isn’t much different, it’s just data with no HDR or computational photography built in. I’ll usually set a -1EV for daytime shots and adjust from there and I’ll just take a 10-15 second exposure to see how the highlights look. The app doesn’t add light to the exposure during the day or night as the photo is being taken, you’ll have to get it exposed the way you like it first then shoot away. Since there are so many shots stacked, you can stretch (lift shadows) a lot because there is no noise especially with raw. I’m paying the yearly subscription at the moment because I wanted to test the app. The developer is a smart guy! There are a couple of YouTube videos featuring even longer made by a user of the app, he’s English and talks a little slow, but very detailed. Link, it’s a year old. There are others as well: Shayne Mostyn is a good guy to watch also. The video is very helpful in understanding the app, hopefully you’ll watch it.




Below is an example of a -2ev shot I took on a cloudy day in Colorado, I exposed for the highlights & lifted the shadows in Lightroom mobile. The under exposed image is a screenshot of the raw file. Jpeg isn’t as forgiving as a raw file which is why I don’t use jpeg much. You just have to watch the highlights just like you would when shooting jpeg with a DSLR. My goal was to blur the water during a 40” exposure. I used the frame averaging mode (FA) for the shot. This app is designed to do only a couple of things: blur water and clouds for that silky look during the day and produce stunning star trails of the night sky when in star trails mode (ST) and take those cool cityscape shots with cars passing on the highway when using Light Trails mode (LT). With so may stacked images, the final image is so clean. Take in mind that with any long exposure on any device, wind blown trees will be blurred. There are a lot of Even Longer examples on Instagram, search #shotwithevenlonger to see. If you are familiar with a neutral density filter for a DSLR that photographers use to take 30” exposures in the daytime to blur water and clouds, then this app accomplishes the same thing much faster and easier with up to 24 hours of exposure time. It just takes some getting used to. The user is in full control when using this app.

It’s a specific app and it’s not for everyone, just for those who like long exposures and working at getting the best image possible. You’ll get Fantastic results when you’ve mastered the app and know how it works. I’ve used this app for practicing product photography by using the 3x camera and 1-3 minutes exposure in the house for incredibly sharp detailed images. I included a screenshot of my settings. Anyway I hope this helps… excuse the long winded post…

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LUNAR ECLIPSE STAR TRAIL

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Data

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I JUST TOOK AND ADDED THESE.

The flower arrangement was a 40” exposure at -1ev because the 0.0ev was too bright. So starting off with a -1 ev is a good start with jpeg or raw. These were raw. Since the image was so clean and clear, I can easily resize the image to 25 or 33mp equivalent for printing. The image holds very well to resizing.

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This app is fun to use! It’s capable of so much.
 
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First try with raw and stacking. Works quite well. Ff
Oh yeah good shot. It’s a fabulous app, the stacking of raw files works just like stacking them when using a DSLR for Astro photography. Most people will stack 20-30 five minute exposures with a DSLR as the raw noise cancels itself out as they stack. If you did watch that video then you’ll know what I’m talking about. Hopefully I’ll see more of your work. Cool shot. Next you can try a star trails shot while we have a new moon so it won’t blow out the sky. So far I’ve only taken a 30 minute star trails shot. I’ve seen others that have been done for 10 hours. Remarkably it doesn’t use all of the memory on the phone stacking that many photos nor does it drain your battery that quickly either.
 
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Thank you, it was your photo of the SLR that really got to me. So clean :)
Yes, I will try thank you, and thank you for the tip. On a side note, its remarkable how limiting iOS/iPad apps are, lightroom can’t do HDR merge like the desktop app, but Android is even worse, no Photoshop on Android tablets.
 
Thank you, it was your photo of the SLR that really got to me. So clean :)
Yes, I will try thank you, and thank you for the tip. On a side note, its remarkable how limiting iOS/iPad apps are, lightroom can’t do HDR merge like the desktop app, but Android is even worse, no Photoshop on Android tablets.
Yes you’re quite welcome. I’m glad that you were able to find a good app to produce super clean images even in the house where you normally wouldn’t stack that many photos for product shot or still life. The app developer was impressed how clean that DSLR image was as well. I asked the developer if he could get in touch with Apple to see if he can get more than a one second exposure time from the camera because for some reason Apple only allows one second which I find fairly lame. I wish we had more control over how long our exposures can be. hopefully in the future apple will allow developers more control over the camera with their photographic apps. I could really get some fantastic night shots with the Even Longer app if I had the ability to stack individual 10 second exposures over a 20 minute period. The photo of my camera was taken with the 3X camera on the iPhone for several minutes and edit it in Lightroom. Thanks for the feedback.
Here’s another clean product shot that I was just playing with
Todd

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