Mini-display port vs. Mini-DVI port - not the same thing right?

[bigbaby]

Hi all

Relevant newbie to the mac world. I have a MBP late 2009. I bought a third party Mini display port to HDMI converter so I can hook the MBP to my 46" Samsung screen.

This works fine, no major issues here. However the picture is not great. I compared watching a standard definition TV show through the MBP then burnt it onto a DVD. The DVD (using the PS3 as my DVD drive, connected via HDMI) had superior quality than through the MBP.

Also the picture does not quite fill the screen. There is a small black border running all the way around the screen. Does not sound significant but when doing the same comparison as above, you notice the difference when via DVD the movie fills the screen. I have played around with the resolution settings. Those that fill the screen chop bits of the mac desktop off, so thats no good either.

So I am wondering why this is? Is it because the mini display port is not a DVI port, hence I am not getting true HD quality picture? How can I overcome this if at all. I'm thinking of getting a mac mini as a media hub/HTPC but want to ensure I dont encounter the same problems.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

 

[DoFoT9]

Hi all

Relevant newbie to the mac world. I have a MBP late 2009. I bought a third party Mini display port to HDMI converter so I can hook the MBP to my 46" Samsung screen.

This works fine, no major issues here. However the picture is not great. I compared watching a standard definition TV show through the MBP then burnt it onto a DVD. The DVD (using the PS3 as my DVD drive, connected via HDMI) had superior quality than through the MBP.

it did? really.. that is very interesting. DVI OR HDMI should work identical! it must be a setting somewhere

Also the picture does not quite fill the screen. There is a small black border running all the way around the screen. Does not sound significant but when doing the same comparison as above, you notice the difference when via DVD the movie fills the screen. I have played around with the resolution settings. Those that fill the screen chop bits of the mac desktop off, so thats no good either.

resolution problems. go to System prefs->display->then ensure the res is the same size as the TV (im assuming 1920x1080?). in the 2nd tab of display, make sure that overscan is UNTICKED.

So I am wondering why this is? Is it because the mini display port is not a DVI port, hence I am not getting true HD quality picture? How can I overcome this if at all. I'm thinking of getting a mac mini as a media hub/HTPC but want to ensure I dont encounter the same problems.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

thats incorrect. it should work no matter what connection you are using. ensure that your plugs are working. i would check the actual DP->HDMI connector, maybe it is faulty?

 

[kny3twalker]

Hi all

Relevant newbie to the mac world. I have a MBP late 2009. I bought a third party Mini display port to HDMI converter so I can hook the MBP to my 46" Samsung screen.

This works fine, no major issues here. However the picture is not great. I compared watching a standard definition TV show through the MBP then burnt it onto a DVD. The DVD (using the PS3 as my DVD drive, connected via HDMI) had superior quality than through the MBP.

Also the picture does not quite fill the screen. There is a small black border running all the way around the screen. Does not sound significant but when doing the same comparison as above, you notice the difference when via DVD the movie fills the screen. I have played around with the resolution settings. Those that fill the screen chop bits of the mac desktop off, so thats no good either.

So I am wondering why this is? Is it because the mini display port is not a DVI port, hence I am not getting true HD quality picture? How can I overcome this if at all. I'm thinking of getting a mac mini as a media hub/HTPC but want to ensure I dont encounter the same problems.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

all your complaints are normal.

underscanning versus overscanning. by the way all stand alone boxes like cable boxes and ps3 overscan but the menus and such are designed not to have any issues with over-scanning.

Also the hardware decoder in the ps3 is more than likely superior to the software decoder on your macbook, you can waste a bunch playing with software that will post process the image in realtime to make it look better, but its a pain.
look up ffdshow if interested

Also as far as the image quality, the color space of "pcs" is different than HDTVs/TVs. TVs have a narrower color space (breadth of colors) so the wider color space of pcs gets crushed, resulting in images being too dark, too light, etc...
Also the type of render that the player is using can make a difference.

DVDs (production DVDs) do not have the same issues as TV generally because they mastered from very high quality originals, but still some exist.

If I were you, I would use your ps3 as a network media player for the files you want to watch.

Also DVI and displayport are pretty much the same thing; as a user there will be no difference.

 

[DoFoT9]

all your complaints are normal.

underscanning versus overscanning. by the way all stand alone boxes like cable boxes and ps3 overscan but the menus and such are designed not to have any issues because of this.

i guess maybe its some sort of resolution configuration too?

Also as far as the image quality, the color of "pcs" is different than HDTVs/TVs. TVs have a narrower color space (breadth of colors) so the wider color space of pcs gets crushed, resulting in images being too dark, too light, etc...
Also the type of render that the player is using can make a difference.

from personal experience i have to disagree there, i cant notice any difference. the type of player that i use (QT, VLC, Plex) doesnt make any difference to the visual look, it changes the playback performance though.

If I were you, I would still use your ps3 as a network media player for the files you want to watch.

PS3 Media Server

 

[kny3twalker]

i guess maybe its some sort of resolution configuration too?

Of course it can be adjusted to fit perfectly to the display, but then the TV show would use less area of the display when using the macbook than the ps3 because of over-scanning.

from personal experience i have to disagree there, i cant notice any difference. the type of player that i use (QT, VLC, Plex) doesnt make any difference to the visual look, it changes the playback performance though.

Well it is a fact that pcs and TVs use different color spaces. Although many modern video renders to use the narrower color space of TVs so this maybe why you have not noticed possibly. I am pretty new to mac, so I can only share my experiences from using windows.

PS3 Media Server

I believe the PS3 would be the client and the macbook would be the server. Nonetheless, I too like the idea.

 

[DoFoT9]

Of course it can be adjusted to fit perfectly to the display, but then the TV show would use less area of the display when using the macbook than the ps3 because of over-scanning.

you can turn off overscan but, my MBP fits perfectly to the TV screen. or am i missing something?

Well it is a fact that pcs and TVs use different color spaces. Although many modern video renders to use the narrower color space of TVs so this maybe why you have not noticed possibly. I am pretty new to mac, so I can only share my experiences from using windows.

true lol, im not disputing that. im just saying that they look very similar. ps3 and MBP almost look indentical when playing a streamed movie over the network.

I believe the PS3 would be the client and the macbook would be the server.

haha no no silly. PS3 Media Server is the name of a java based program that you install onto your computer. you can stream videos to the PS3 (PS3MS transcodes on the fly). its brilliant. i use it

 

[kny3twalker]

you can turn off overscan but, my MBP fits perfectly to the TV screen. or am i missing something?

Some Tvs have modes for pc input, where they can map pixel to pixel.
My older Sony CRT HDTV does not. I either have to live with overscan or have the video card adjust the outputted image to fit my display.

Meaning what is really sent to my HDTV is a image with a black border around it the same number of scanlines(pixels in the case of LCDs/Plasmas) as the overscan

true lol, im not disputing that. im just saying that they look very similar. ps3 and MBP almost look indentical when playing a streamed movie over the network.

Well the color space is not that different. I cannot find the numbers anymore to give you an exact answer now. computers just use a color space a little wider.

haha no no silly. PS3 Media Server is the name of a java based program that you install onto your computer. you can stream videos to the PS3 (PS3MS transcodes on the fly). its brilliant. i use it

what formats can the ps3 natively play? I thought it was quite a few.

 

[DoFoT9]

Some Tvs have modes for pc input, where they can map pixel to pixel.

thats true. on my TV i dont use that though, i just set it to HDMI3 (not the PC input, VGA, ick!).

My older Sony CRT HDTV does not. I either have to live with overscan or have the video card adjust the outputted image to fit my display.

my panasonic TV displays it fine. my friends pioneer TV suffers from bad overscan (1080i composite only). just depends on the TV and technology i guess!

Meaning what is really sent to my HDTV is a image with a black border around it the same number of scanlines(pixels in the case of LCDs/Plasmas) as the overscan

so the computer knows that it is sending the black bars? thats a bit silly. if i set the res to 1920x1080 (on a TV that can display 1920x1080), i want it to be a 1:1 ratio!

Well the color space is not that different. I cannot find the numbers anymore to give you an exact answer now. computer just use a color space a little wider.

ok ill trust you on that, its not a direct comparison im with ya

what formats can the ps3 natively play? I thought it was quite a few.

natively? mp4 (h264 and mp4). mpeg2, mpeg1. THATS IT. (source)

PS3 transcodes into mainly into h264 or mpeg2

 

[shadygrove]

What is the resolution that is being displayed?

I have a 17'' 2005 PowerBook (1.67Ghz) hooked up to a new 42'' 1080p TV from dvi > hdmi. I had some resolution issues at first and had to download a program to help. My resolution was going off the screen or looked like crap....until I dialed in the correct solution for my video card and tv (1008 X The other number I can't remember but could easily be figured out given the ratio).

The funny thing about it was it worked on an older version of 10.5.x but when updated to 10.5.8 the resolution went haywire. After some research it's a known bug in the update (amongst techies in forums anyway). Anyway, this is the program I used to fix my problem. Maybe it can help yours too.

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/15467

 

[kny3twalker]

thats true. on my TV i dont use that though, i just set it to HDMI3 (not the PC input, VGA, ick!).

I did not necessarily mean using VGA. Some TVs have technology to do 1:1 pixel mapping, but not all do. And sometimes its only on certain inputs like VGA or possibly HDMI like you are describing your TV.
Also overscanning is good, without it there is all kinds of junk that viewable near the edge of the picture of SDTV.
I believe Closed Caption data for SDTV is in the top couple of lines of resolution.
Also overscanning makes 1.85:1 ratio DVDs appear nearly the same as 16:9 which keeps many of the ignorant happy. (if you get what I am saying -> people that like pan and scan on their older 4x3 TVs).

my panasonic TV displays it fine. my friends pioneer TV suffers from bad overscan (1080i composite only). just depends on the TV and technology i guess!

I think you mean component 1080i, composite is 480i only.

so the computer knows that it is sending the black bars? thats a bit silly. if i set the res to 1920x1080 (on a TV that can display 1920x1080), i want it to be a 1:1 ratio!

Well the computer does not know, I have to manual just the the image size in the video card settings, but the video card is still outputting 1080i. The video card was basically doing some internal scaling though. My Sony like most HDTVs will only accept certain resolutions as input.

I normally just allowed the overscanning when connecting my pc, cause I used media applications. Therefore it was not an issue. Its not like 1080i is good for surfing the internet.