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Mpeg2 vs mpeg4?

S

Soura2112

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 26, 2008
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I'm looking to buy a consumer camera and have loomed this question up on the net, moeg2 vs mpeg4? Sounds like mpeg2 is the way to go except no article was specific for FC ( or iMovie which I rarely use but nice to have since it's there). Plus best picture quality, I will take picture quality over editing speed. Plus I if the FC comes out on the 12th I need to make sure the cameras I'm looking at work well with the new FC, if the FC is worth it of course.
I'm mainly an amateur videographer maybe 30% pro, pro being paid. Though I hope my new camera helps make that % go up a bit with a better cam, cause I have no HD to sell at the moment.

Can I get some pros and cons on my mpeg options with FC in mind? Sorry if this is an old topic, been out of the new video camera game for a bit. Before I buy a camera I would like to know what is best for me. I already posted other things I plan to do with the camcorder, just not this question.

Thanks.
 
MPEG-2 is older an not as space efficient as MPEG-4, which is also more qualitative.
Anyway, for use with FCP or FCE or iMovie, or any other good editing application, you will need to transcode the footage to the best container (.mov - QuickTime) using the best codec (Apple Intermediate Codec (AIC) for iMovie and FCE, Pro Res for FCP) available.
You will be able to play back MPEG-2 or MPEG-4 footage inside FCE or FCP, but it will require rendering in the timeline and every change you make will need additional renders. Thus you should always use the best editing codec available, as MPEG-4 and MPEG-2 are NOT meant for editing, only for distribution.
 
MP4 h264 (AVHCD) is the way to go now. But do not use the old AIC intermediate codec but either a prores codec (available with FCP, not FCE).
 
simsaladimbamba said:
MPEG-2 is older an not as space efficient as MPEG-4, which is also more qualitative.
Anyway, for use with FCP or FCE or iMovie, or any other good editing application, you will need to transcode the footage to the best container (.mov - QuickTime) using the best codec (Apple Intermediate Codec (AIC) for iMovie and FCE, Pro Res for FCP) available.
You will be able to play back MPEG-2 or MPEG-4 footage inside FCE or FCP, but it will require rendering in the timeline and every change you make will need additional renders. Thus you should always use the best editing codec available, as MPEG-4 and MPEG-2 are NOT meant for editing, only for distribution.
Click to expand...

This. You really should not be recording in a lossy format like MPEG2/4 for any professional work.
 
thanks

Thanks for the info.

My budget for this camera is about $1,000 (before tax).
I would like quality shooting for sports, such as golf, hockey, football, who knows I may end up doing baseball games too.
Not limited to sports, I just want to make sure sports are shot well, for sports is my pro area, pro just meaning I get paid.

Also looking for quality lowlight situations for fun projects. Such as when my dogs play, if I go over to add more light for my shot they stop doing their funny stuff. Of course Lowlight situations may come in handy in many other situations when filming simple family stuff.

I asked on another forum about 5.1 and camcorders in this price range, such as the Sony HDR-CX560V. Curious if the 5.1 mics really have good quality in this price range.

Just trying to do all my research before I take the plunge because I have other hardware to buy. Typically keep up with technology just fallen behind on video cameras.

Thanks again.
 
howardnow said:
I'v been looking at the Panasonic HDC-Tm700 (last years model) for around $900. It shoots 1080 at 60p in an unusual higher end format. I would need the clipwrap program to make into a prores.

You might want to look at this:
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Panasonic-HDC-TM700-Camcorder-Review-37681.htm

Camcorder info is a very good site to compare camcorders.
Click to expand...
You seem not to have followed your own link. The linked review clearly states that the Panasonic HDC-TM700 records in 1080/60p AVCHD. This [apparently proprietary] format can only be edited using Panasonic's proprietary software and is incompatible with standard editing applications. Then there is the issue of playing the edited video. HDTVs and HD monitors can play 1080/60i, 1080/30p, and 1080/24p. Only specialized monitors will play 1080/60p. Presumably, Panasonic's software has the ability to transcode its proprietary-format video into a standard editable format.
 
AdrianK said:
This. You really should not be recording in a lossy format like MPEG2/4 for any professional work.
Click to expand...
I don't see this being the case in the professional world. i'll give you mpeg2, but there is a ton of work done that's h.264 in origin.
 
mpeg2 nightmares Question RE: G5 and editing

Hello, I am a long time Mac user, but after yesterday am seriously considering going to PC for good. I have a dual G4 1.3 2gig ram and a single G4 1.2 2 gigs of ram linked with a KVM switch and hard drives where the zip used to be..as well as a G5 with 6gigs of ram.

I had 9 hours of hell with mpeg2, dvd studio pro 1.5, and FCExpress. Even with Quicktime 'pro' I could not create, adapt, import, or find mpeg2. I ended up uninstalling everything and accepted that I will be editing with imovie and idvd from now on unless some miracle of compatibility occurs by accident on the part of mac engineers. I even tried 2 other programs that do nothing but convert files and useless DVD studio 'pro' (in name only) could not recognize anything.

My question is: Before I switch to completely doing in-camera edits only,
and/or sell my macs for scrap metal and go PC...is there any remote possibility that a G5 dual 2.5 with 6 gigs of ram MIGHT be able to handle SOME kind of editing software that the out-of-touch with users engineers at Mac created?

I suspect I could use Final Cut Studio with FCP5 and DVD stupid pro 4,
but am now so highly suspicious and overwhelmingly disappointed in this junk
that I might never recover. There are so many derivations of FCP, studio, etc, that it's nearly impossible to an answer other than: "Dude, just spend more money on our untested junk, mac wants your money."

Any ideas?


:mad:
 
PPC sloth

Yes mate a G4 with 2 gigs of ram will crawl at encoding even a G5 will not really be acceptable. With my old G5 i used an elgato turbo .264 to speed things up. Unfortunately video encoding is cpu intensive and the older machines struggle.
 

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mhh said:
Hello, I am a long time Mac user, but after yesterday am seriously considering going to PC for good. ...
Click to expand...
Are you serious? Your computer is either eight or nine years old. You mean to come to this forum and b!tch and moan about an [officially] obsolete computer? Your experience with this long past its due computer is so bad that it is driving you back to Windows? Really? If you go back, then you and I both know that you won't be using a 2002-2003 vintage Windows PC. If you do, then you are in for a major surprise.
 
mhh said:
Hello, I am a long time Mac user, but after yesterday am seriously considering going to PC for good.
Click to expand...
You haven't really said what you want to do. What is the source of the footage, what are its properties and so on.
 
mhh said:
Hello, I am a long time Mac user, but after yesterday am seriously considering going to PC for good.... is there any remote possibility that a G5 dual 2.5 with 6 gigs of ram MIGHT be able to handle SOME kind of editing software that the out-of-touch with users engineers at Mac created...


:mad:
Click to expand...

MisterMe said:
Are you serious? Your computer is either eight or nine years old. You mean to come to this forum and b!tch and moan about an [officially] obsolete computer? Your experience with this long past its due computer is so bad that it is driving you back to Windows? Really? If you go back, then you and I both know that you won't be using a 2002-2003 vintage Windows PC. If you do, then you are in for a major surprise.
Click to expand...

Actually - your G5 should work fine with as late as FCS2 (so theres something wrong with your mac - maybe just tired). Try Premiere Pro on a 8 year old PC and see what happens....!
 
Last edited:
mhh said:
Hello, I am a long time Mac user, but after yesterday am seriously considering going to PC for good.:
Click to expand...
OMG what a whiny post. As soon as I read 'I am seriously going to PC' I can't help but think of a little whiny kid who shouldn't be allowed on the web unaccompanied.
Seriously, no-one cares what you use. We are digital video artists of various stripes who use macs to make our stuff. Threatening to buy a PC isn't exactly a threat to us. Our macs, and the software we use, are merely tools we use. You threatening to buy another tool to use doesn't really bother us because we are not the toolmakers or the tool sellers, just a bunch of people from all over the world who meet here to help each other.

And what about that gripe that (you think) the only advice you'll receive is to buy a new Mac (which seems to be out of the question)... And then threaten (again) to buy a whole new PC, new software and learn the new system from scratch as if that is a reasonable alternative.

If you ever recover from the trauma of this whole experience, perhaps you could rephrase your question as an actual question and not a spray.
 
Fyi

Just so you all know I'm working on a Mac Pro 8 core, why I'm hoping FCP goes 64bit, though that's for another topic. I may have to do small projects on my 2008 MacBook Pro also, except it would be minimum work. I understand not doing pro work on these formats I'm talking about except I'm not filming movies or television commercials ( when I have worked on commercials they use my friends cam). The videos I do are simply for someone's local hockey game or to film someone's golf swing to anylize. If I could afford and get enough use from a$3,000 camera I would get one, that would be a lot of hockey games to pay off a cam like that though, especially in this money era, I want to get a real pro cam one day until then I know people that can loan me one and where to rent. Portability is extremely important too, for this camera will be used 70% as a typical family cam (best way I can describe it).
Thankfully I am getting 64bit from Adobe at the moment, except I do photography with adobe, I prefer FC for editing.
(this really got off topic, hope everyone vented enough)
 
Soura2112 said:
The videos I do are simply for someone's local hockey game
Click to expand...
I think that when videoing a hockey game, the choice of format is the least of your problems. Being in the right spot, getting in close enough to see what's happening but far enough away to follow it, audio; these are the biggies. A $1000 camera's fine, I think PPro will do the simple cuts you need and do it natively, which translates to quickly and with small file sizes. Even Premiere Elements will edit AVCHD natively. Spend money on a good tripod because you want solid support and a fluid head.

A friend just bought a Panasonic TM900 and thinks it's the duck's nuts (around the forums, there's some concern/confusion about using the 60p shooting setting, but 30p is fine). Since it will be on a tripod, consider a hard drive version so you get mega storage. Personally, I have a Canon HFS10 at home and think it gives a great image.

I just checked Panasonic's site, and "iFrame" appears to be a format it shoots in. Interesting.
 
thanks

Thanks MartinX

I have been looking at the Panasonic TM900 also.

I have read on other threads about the 60p confusion, and yes it is confusing me in terms of how it will work with FC.

I am also looking at the sony hdr-cx560v in my price range and about the same as the Panasonic. I would like to be able to get everything out of the camera when I bring it into the FC such as the 60 problem, will I need it? Most likely not, except if I pay for an option that makes the camera more expensive then I want to be able to use it.

At the moment I have an okay Tri Pod for my current camera, though I will be updating the tri pod when I make my plunge.

For editing I really want to stick with FC, it's simply the tool I have used since I learned video editing in college.
My videos are a little different then shooting just the hockey games, its more personalized to a specific player (Some are just games too). Same goes with High School football games, etc. Allowing players to have a nice highlight reel. Helps make a little more money too. I stick to only sports I have played since I know what to look for. For example I never played organized soccer nor Basketball so I say no to those unless its only shooting the game.

I really like to use Garageband for my music, took awhile but now I have some great loops. GB works well for me since 4 macs in the house already have it allowing me to spend on other needs.
 
Soura2112 said:
My videos are a little different then shooting just the hockey games, its more personalized to a specific player (Some are just games too). Same goes with High School football games, etc. Allowing players to have a nice highlight reel. Helps make a little more money too.
Click to expand...

I recently organised for a freelancer to shoot for an event at work I couldn't do and his website shows he also shoots sports player highlight reels using a Canon HDV tape-based camera and edits on a 24" iMac. Sometimes it doesn't take much to make the magic :)
 
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