Need help with possible botched/hopeless iMac install

[retta283]

I was able to use a OS X Tiger Server 10.4.7 universal DMG on my early 2008 iMac, and to my surprise it installed. Boots into the OS fine, but there are some things that do not function.

There is no sound equipment detected, there is no Wi-Fi, and when I shut down it requires me to hold the power button to actually go off. I figured these were due to a lack of drivers, and so attempted to get to 10.4.11, hoping it would have at least some of the drivers. However, all Universal updates I've found do not work as intended. They will install, but the OS will refuse to boot once installed.

Anyone have ideas as to what to do to make this function, or is it a lost cause? I may be able to use Target Disk Mode to try and install a version of either regular Tiger or Server 10.4.11 on it, but it might not boot.

 

[eyoungren]

I was able to use a OS X Tiger Server 10.4.7 universal DMG on my early 2008 iMac, and to my surprise it installed. Boots into the OS fine, but there are some things that do not function.

There is no sound equipment detected, there is no Wi-Fi, and when I shut down it requires me to hold the power button to actually go off. I figured these were due to a lack of drivers, and so attempted to get to 10.4.11, hoping it would have at least some of the drivers. However, all Universal updates I've found do not work as intended. They will install, but the OS will refuse to boot once installed.

Anyone have ideas as to what to do to make this function, or is it a lost cause? I may be able to use Target Disk Mode to try and install a version of either regular Tiger or Server 10.4.11 on it, but it might not boot.

Install Leopard.

Unless you are mistaken and you have a late 2007 iMac, Mactracker says your minimum OS is 10.5.2.

 

[Amethyst1]

I was able to use a OS X Tiger Server 10.4.7 universal DMG on my early 2008 iMac, and to my surprise it installed. Boots into the OS fine, but there are some things that do not function.

Server 10.4.7 lacks the necessary drivers and updating to 10.4.11 (curiously) won't pull them in. Try an iMac7,1's 10.4.10 disc as base; that one has a higher chance of working on the iMac8,1. For instance, it includes the Radeon HD 2400/2600 drivers.

[doublepost=1567542737][/doublepost]

Unless you are mistaken and you have a late 2007 iMac, Mactracker says your minimum OS is 10.5.2.

Tiger will "unofficially" run on the 2008 iMac. But YMMV.

 

[retta283]

Install Leopard.

Unless you are mistaken and you have a late 2007 iMac, Mactracker says your minimum OS is 10.5.2.

It's an early 2008. It's got the Penryn chip, and was manufactured in early 2009. The minimum OS is wrong in multiple cases.

I can put the 10.5 retail disk in the machine and it works fine. I think it's more of a case of if drivers are available, if so it should boot. I also was able to use a 10.6 retail disc on a late 2009 iMac.
[doublepost=1567545551][/doublepost]

Server 10.4.7 lacks the necessary drivers and updating to 10.4.11 (curiously) won't pull them in. Try an iMac7,1's 10.4.10 disc as base; that one has a higher chance of working on the iMac8,1. For instance, it includes the Radeon HD 2400/2600 drivers.

[doublepost=1567542737][/doublepost]

Tiger will "unofficially" run on the 2008 iMac. But YMMV.

I have 10.4.6 discs for a Core Duo MacBook, would I be able to use those to install on the iMac's hard drive via target disk mode? I figure that once updated to 10.4.11 it should work. I know that you can't use the grey disks on another Mac, but I would be installing from the CD MacBook. If it would have the drivers, I'd hope it would work.

What I am wondering is what changed between the sound on the 07 and 08 iMacs. I really can't see what's different to make the sound not work.

 

[Amethyst1]

I have 10.4.6 discs for a Core Duo MacBook, would I be able to use those to install on the iMac's hard drive via target disk mode? I figure that once updated to 10.4.11 it should work. I know that you can't use the grey disks on another Mac, but I would be installing from the CD MacBook. If it would have the drivers, I'd hope it would work.

That is an even older baseline than 10.4.7 Server so will not have the drivers either. The 10.4.10 disc for the 2007 iMacs is the safest bet if you can get your hands on it (I have it but providing it somewhere isn't feasible due to my slow connection.)

If you use an older image, the Radeon HD 2400/2600 drivers for Tiger are contained in https://support.apple.com/kb/DL179. However, this is older than 10.4.11 and probably verifies you're using an iMac7,1, so I'd extract just the kexts/bundles using Pacifist and install them manually (after updating to 10.4.11).

• AppleVADriver.bundle
• ATINDRV.kext
• ATIRadeonX2000.kext
• ATIRadeonX2000GA.plugin
• ATIRadeonX2000GLDriver.bundle
• ATIRadeonX2000VADriver.bundle

I'd also install AirPort Extreme Update 2008-002 to see if this gets AirPort working (check the Network prefpane to see if the interfaces are recognised correctly).

As for sound not working, my guess is that the 2008 iMac uses a different sound chip than the 2007 and Tiger lacks the drivers.

 

[retta283]

Giving an update on this situation. I was able to use Target Disk mode to get it up to 10.4.11, and now everything works perfectly except for the sound. I'm trying to now just extract the drivers for my soundchip into Tiger, but I don't know what files I need to move over. Anybody have an idea?

 

[bobesch]

Why do you want to install Tiger on that iMac, if it's not supported and requires Leopard?
The only thing, that would make me going for Tiger is Classic-Mode (which doesn't work on intel-Macs) or faster performance on elder G3/G4-PPC (which wouldn't really matter on that intel-iMac ).
If it's about Server, there's also a Leopard-Server-version at MacintosGarden ...

 

[retta283]

Why do you want to install Tiger on that iMac, if it's not supported and requires Leopard?
The only thing, that would make me going for Tiger is Classic-Mode (which doesn't work on intel-Macs) or faster performance on elder G3/G4-PPC (which wouldn't really matter on that intel-iMac ).
If it's about Server, there's also a Leopard-Server-version at MacintosGarden ...

I don't get this... There are plenty of threads on here about installing versions older than the computer. It's a hobbyist thing. The whole PowerPC Macs forum is hobbyist...

Leopard is just as unusable as Tiger. Intel Tiger and Leopard are both completely irrelevant and unsupported.

 

[bobesch]

I don't get this... There are plenty of threads on here about installing versions older than the computer. It's a hobbyist thing. The whole PowerPC Macs forum is hobbyist...
Leopard is just as unusable as Tiger. Intel Tiger and Leopard are both completely irrelevant and unsupported.

Well, you've asked "or is it a lost cause?" I guess it is.
I wouldn'd say, the PPC-forum is only hobbist and Tiger/Leopard are irreleveant - at least not for a lot of participants here.
There are lots of reasons to rely on PPC:
os9: music-production; best OS for specific hardware; only-os9-applicatiions
OSX/PPC: graphic, office, PDF, fax, beamer-companion, sturdy hardware
I go back to os9 or OSX/Classic, if I need to run an os9 prog (well, as for me, it's mostly as a hobbyist)
I'd run PPC or OSX/Rosetta if I'd need stuff, that isn't supported by Lion.
Or run Fusion/virtual Leopard-Server to get my favorite fax-software/hardware running on a white intel-iMac 2008.
And I wished, Tiger-Server would also run virtually within Fusion (which unfortunately isn't working), because Tiger-Server would be slicker and faster compared to virtual Leopard-Server.
So my final solution is a mini-G4, running faceless as a fax-server ('cause we're here in "old" Europe).

So that's why I've asked: why Tiger on an unsupported intel-iMac? Classic wouldn't be an option. Speed wouldn't be an option (only for a virtual machine). Any mission-critical Apps?

I think, in this particular case, it is a hobbyist thing and it might be a lost cause, but there is always Leopard to fill the gap.

(and BTW: I like the idea to try out everything. Because we can. )

 

[retta283]

Well, you've asked "or is it a lost cause?" I guess it is.
I wouldn'd say, the PPC-forum is only hobbist - at least not for a lot of of the participants.
There are lots of reasons to rely on PPC:
os9: music-production; best OS for specific hardware
OSX/PPC: graphic, office, PDF, fax, beamer-companion, sturdy hardware
I go back to os9 or OSX/Classic, if I need to run an os9 prog (well, as for me, it's mostly as a hobbyist)
I'd run PPC or OSX/Rosetta if I'd need stuff, that isn't supported by Lion.
Or run Fusion/virtual Leopard-Server to get my favorite fax-software/hardware running on a white intel-iMac 2008.
And I wished, Tiger-Server would also run virtually within Fusion (which unfortunately isn't working), because Tiger-Server would be slicker and faster compared to virtual Leopard-Server.
So my final solution is a mini-G4, running faceless as a fax-server ('cause we're here in "old" Europe).

So that's why I've asked: why Tiger on an unsupported intel-iMac? Classic wouldn't be an option. Speed wouldn't be an option (only for a virtual machine). Any mission-critical Apps?
I think, in this particular case, it is a hobbyist thing and it might be a lost cause. (even though I like the idea to try out everything. Because we can. )

It's a extremely niche segment, and obviously these people have to have some passion for PPC to continue to attempt to use them instead of trying to find alternatives.

I do have sound programs that I use on Tiger that are custom-made, so I figured I could knock out my Tiger iMac from the desk by consolidating it to my 2008 iMac, after finding out it worked I searching for a solution to the sound issue. Unless you know about the driver situation, don't throw that in the towel.

 

[DearthnVader]

after finding out it worked I searching for a solution to the sound issue. Unless you know about the driver situation, don't throw that in the towel.

You may try and install the AppleHDA.kext( Audio ) from a working( sound ) Leopard install to Tiger.

 

[Amethyst1]

And I wished, Tiger-Server would also run virtually within Fusion (which unfortunately isn't working),

Tiger Server runs just fine in VMware Fusion here. You need to make a couple of adjustments to its VMX file to boot it on a Sandy Bridge (2011-era) or newer Mac but that's about it.

So that's why I've asked: why Tiger on an unsupported intel-iMac? Classic wouldn't be an option. Speed wouldn't be an option

My two cents: Because it's just drop-dead beautiful (I don't like Leopard's UI at all) and runs very fast. So, I could turn the question around: Why run Leopard?

 

[bobesch]

So that's why I've asked: why Tiger on an unsupported intel-iMac? Classic wouldn't be an option. Speed wouldn't be an option (only for a virtual machine). Any mission-critical Apps?

It's a extremely niche segment, and obviously these people have to have some passion for PPC to continue to attempt to use them instead of trying to find alternatives.
I do have sound programs that I use on Tiger that are custom-made, so I figured I could knock out my Tiger iMac from the desk by consolidating it to my 2008 iMac, after finding out it worked I searching for a solution to the sound issue.

Ah, understand. It's that mission critical app(s) and so unfortunately you're trapped in the niche too ...

My mission-critical app in a quite similar situation is an old-school fax app, but I''m lucky it would run on Tiger/Leopard/SL and I could use a Leopard/SL-VM to get it running on my white intel-iMacs. But what I finally did, because I hadn't been smart enough, to get Tiger-Server installed as a VM and Leopard-Server-VM is a bit cumbersome on a relatively underpowered white intel-iMac and I also wanted to save space on my desk ... I'm running a macminiG4/Tiger faceless (only ethernet/phone-line/powercord/ optional printer) as a fax-/print-server and it's sitting under the stand of the iMac.)

Anyway ... Good luck, to get Tiger-Server running properly!

 

[eyoungren]

My two cents: Because it's just drop-dead beautiful (I don't like Leopard's UI at all) and runs very fast. So, I could turn the question around: Why run Leopard?

When I ran Tiger, I used Shapeshifter to give me a dark theme. So, the argument that the Tiger UI is 'drop-dead beautiful' doesn't hold water for me.

As to why I run Leopard (I'm going to answer only for myself)?

Tiger is garbage in a mixed Mac/PC network. You have to disable so much security stuff just to get it to connect to Windows servers that you might as well not have any security. Tiger's version of Samba for SMB connections is trash. A major reason why DAVE and AdmitMac by Thursby was an actual product for so many years.

Tiger's printserver is primitive, flimsy and prone to not working. Finder is unstable in this environment.

Leopard of course supports much newer versions of software, a point always brought up during Tiger/Leopard conversations. For me, Tiger wouldn't be as bad if it could support QuarkXPress 8, Acrobat 9 Pro and Adobe CS4. But it can't. Leopard can. Tiger also can't run Office 2008, which I use on all my Leopard Macs. I believe you need the converter to use .DOCX on older versions of Word, which Tiger can only run.

Of course, I tend to be a minority. Most people don't need to use these old Macs for production work because they have something else. But in my case, CS4 and XPress 8 are pivotal versions of the software. The file types they create are still supported by the latest versions of the software so my work is still relevant. The older stuff you can only run on Tiger is not.

I will admit that Tiger is stable in a Mac only environment and that it performs well if you are simply using it for period software and not trying to network with PCs.

But that's my major problem. Tiger period software is too out of date for me. I don't need speed. I need compatibility. Speed is great, but I'm not using the OS just to play around with opening windows and clicking on folders.

 

[Raging Dufus]

When I ran Tiger, I used Shapeshifter to give me a dark theme. So, the argument that the Tiger UI is 'drop-dead beautiful' doesn't hold water for me.

As to why I run Leopard (I'm going to answer only for myself)?

Tiger is garbage in a mixed Mac/PC network. You have to disable so much security stuff just to get it to connect to Windows servers that you might as well not have any security. Tiger's version of Samba for SMB connections is trash. A major reason why DAVE and AdmitMac by Thursby was an actual product for so many years.

Tiger's printserver is primitive, flimsy and prone to not working. Finder is unstable in this environment.

Leopard of course supports much newer versions of software, a point always brought up during Tiger/Leopard conversations. For me, Tiger wouldn't be as bad if it could support QuarkXPress 8, Acrobat 9 Pro and Adobe CS4. But it can't. Leopard can. Tiger also can't run Office 2008, which I use on all my Leopard Macs. I believe you need the converter to use .DOCX on older versions of Word, which Tiger can only run.

Of course, I tend to be a minority. Most people don't need to use these old Macs for production work because they have something else. But in my case, CS4 and XPress 8 are pivotal versions of the software. The file types they create are still supported by the latest versions of the software so my work is still relevant. The older stuff you can only run on Tiger is not.

I will admit that Tiger is stable in a Mac only environment and that it performs well if you are simply using it for period software and not trying to network with PCs.

But that's my major problem. Tiger period software is too out of date for me. I don't need speed. I need compatibility. Speed is great, but I'm not using the OS just to play around with opening windows and clicking on folders.

Valid points all. But, I just wanted to point out:

Tiger also can't run Office 2008, which I use on all my Leopard Macs.

Yes it can. I'm currently running Office 2008 on my 1.33 GHz 12" PBG4, in Tiger. It's officially supported.

 

[eyoungren]

Yes it can. I'm currently running Office 2008 on my 1.33 GHz 12" PBG4, in Tiger. It's officially supported.

Ahh, thanks for that. It's been quite some time for me since installing Office.

 

[Amethyst1]

Ahh, thanks for that. It's been quite some time for me since installing Office.

Tiger can also run Adobe CS4. No idea about QuarkXPress 8 though. And my comments with regards to Tiger were of course entirely subjective and in full acknowledgement that others will have different needs and views.